Re: [EVDL] Tesla & M-T ???
What EV is better than a Tesla? One person I know that has a Tesla has owned cars of all types, many of them luxury ones. He says that his Tesla is the best car he has *ever* owned. So what do you think is better? Sent from my iPhone > On Jun 3, 2015, at 2:41 PM, EVDL Administrator via EV > wrote: > >> On 3 Jun 2015 at 17:07, Electric Blue auto convertions via EV wrote: >> >> Theres no comparing them, the Model T is far the better car, You can still >> work on them ... > > Now that's what I'd call a deliberately provocative statement. > > Some might even call it trolling. Not that I would. ;-) > > I'll take the bait anyway. ;-) > > I know which car I'd rather be driving when your big old pickup truck is > hurtling toward me at 70mph. I'd have a far better chance of getting out of > your way; and if I didn't manage to, I'd have a far better chance of > surviving the crash. > > Understand, given the current choice in EVs (and vehicles in general), I > would NOT buy a Tesla, even if I were wealthy enough to afford one. > However, if I had to choose between a Tesla and a Model T, I'd take the > Tesla, even at its much higher price. > > By all accounts Ts were stinky gross polluters. They were unreliable, > cranky (literally), a chore to drive, uncomfortable (especially in cold > weather), and outright hazardous. Their brakes and steering were worse than > a Citicar's. > > I too resent the fact that all automakers (not just Tesla) are trying to > monopolize repair work by making their products impossible for normal people > to fix. But I'm not so focused on that one issue that I exclude everything > else. No way am I going to give up 100 years of automotive development (or > even 50) just on that one issue. > > David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA > EVDL Administrator > > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not > reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my > email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ . > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > > > ___ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA > (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: Utilities seek larger part in charging station rollout
http://www.eenews.net/stories/1060019101
ELECTRIC VEHICLES: Utilities seek larger part in charging station rollout
Jeffrey Tomich, E&E reporter
EnergyWire: Tuesday, May 26, 2015
It's unsurprising that electric utilities stand to benefit from the sale of
plug-in vehicles, providing a bump -- even a small one -- for flat-lining
sales.
Utilities throughout the country that are looking for authority to spend
millions of dollars building out charging networks say their customers will
benefit, too -- even those who don't own EVs.
Just in the past six months, the state of Washington passed legislation
allowing utilities to put EV charging infrastructure in their rate base. In
California, Pacific Gas & Electric and Southern California Edison are
proposing huge investments in EV charging infrastructure (ClimateWire, Feb.
10). In the Southeast, Southern Co.'s Georgia Power subsidiary is spending
$12 million on a pilot program to install as many as 50 public EV charging
stations by the end of 2016 (EnergyWire, March 5).
The proposals are surfacing in the Midwest, too. In Illinois, Commonwealth
Edison is lobbying for a bill that would allow it to build 5,000 charging
stations. And Kansas City Power & Light is asking utility regulators in
Missouri and Kansas to recover costs for a 1,000-station EV charging network
(EnergyWire, Jan. 28).
The proposals follow the release of a white paper by the Edison Electric
Institute a year ago, calling electrification of the transportation sector
essential to the long-term health of the industry.
While the Kansas City area has relatively few plug-in vehicles on the road
today, KCP&L's $20 million Clean Charge Network proposal is being closely
watched by the industry as an important test case.
[© eenews.net]
For EVLN posts use:
http://evdl.org/evln/
{brucedp.150m.com}
--
View this message in context:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-Utilities-seek-larger-part-in-charging-station-rollout-tp4676011.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
Nabble.com.
___
UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: LG Chem says 300 mile electric car battery is available
http://ecomento.com/2015/06/02/lg-chem-300-mile-ev-battery-is-available/
LG Chem says 300 mile electric car battery is available
June 2, 2015 |
[image
http://cdn.ecomento.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/LG-TL-CHem-elctric-car-battery-300-miles-740x425.jpg
LG Chem 300 mile battery
]
There are two questions every electric and plug in hybrid customer wants to
know: how far can the car go on electric power and how long does it take to
recharge? For the moment, Tesla rules the roost when it comes to battery
size with the 85 kWh battery it offers in its Model S. That same battery may
be available in the upcoming Model X as well.
LG Chem announced at the Electric Vehicle Symposium in South Korea, earlier
this month that it now has a 300 mile battery available for car makers. Its
new lithium ion battery packs are between 80 and 120 kWh in size. That’s
enough to outdo the Tesla Model S in range.
LG Chem is already the supplier for many short range plug in vehicles such
as the Chevrolet Spark EV, Renault Zoe, Ford Focus EV, Volvo V60/XC90 T8,
Chevrolet Volt, and Renault Twizy.
LG Chem will also supply next generation batteries for the 200 mile Chevy
Bolt when it arrives in 2017. But considering the small size of the Bolt,
which is about the same dimensions as the Chevy Sonic, that car will
probably only need a 50 kWh battery to get the range Chevy expects.
Volkswagen Group is a LG Chem customer, which may explain why it has been
announcing several new models it has in the works that will have better than
250 mile range. In particular, Audi has just revealed that its new Q6 E-Tron
SUV is expected to go as much as 310 miles on a fully charged battery. That
car is expected in showrooms sometime in 2018. There is also talk of a
Porsche sedan with 265 miles of range coming in 2017 or 2018.
The battery parameter that not many manufacturers talk about publicly is
cost. That may not be of primary importance to Porsche and Audi customers,
but it is vitally important to whether and when electric cars will go
mainstream. Tesla is committed to driving down the cost of lithium ion
batteries, but LG Chem didn’t have much to say on that subject.
[© ecomento.com]
For EVLN posts use:
http://evdl.org/evln/
http://ecowatch.com/2015/05/28/ben-jerrys-tesla-climate-change/
Ben&Jerry's Save Our Swirled tour Teams Up With Tesla
http://www.shalomlife.com/business/29231/new-ben-and-jerrys-flavour-to-tackle-climate-change/
http://reneweconomy.com.au/2015/lithium-ion-battery-costs-tipped-to-fall-to-us172kwh-90283
Lithium-ion battery costs tipped to fall to $US172/kWh
http://www.electropages.com/2015/06/powergenix-nickel-zinc-battery-passes-critical-testing-12v-automotive/
PowerGenix – Ni-zn battery passes critical testing 4auto-use
http://powergenix.com/powergenix-nickel-zinc-battery-passes-critical-testing-for-12v-automotive-use/
http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2015/05/jet-charge-makes-buying-an-electric-car-easy-for-apartment-owners/
jetcharge.com.au installing HPWC EVSE at Apartments
+
EVLN: 10 Tesla-S EV things to know (v)
{brucedp.150m.com}
--
View this message in context:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-LG-Chem-says-300-mile-electric-car-battery-is-available-tp4676012.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
Nabble.com.
___
UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: 10 Tesla-S things to know (v)
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2015/05/10-things-you-didnt-know-about-the-tesla-model-s/index.htm 10 things you didn't know about the Tesla Model S May 28, 2015 Eric Evarts [image http://static2.consumerreportscdn.org/content/dam/cro/news_articles/cars/2015-Tesla-P85D-on-track-598.jpg video http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/video-hub/4262360710001/ ] From advanced safety features to software Easter eggs, the Model S is full of surprises By now you’ve surely heard of the Insane Mode acceleration in the high-performance Tesla Model S P85D electric car. Beyond that go-fast button, we’ve found a ton of other features in the few weeks we’ve owned our P85D that you might not have heard of. Here’s what has stood out so far: 1. Active cruise control accelerates to pass Many luxury cars these days have active cruise control that will automatically slow down when approaching a slower car a few car lengths ahead. Some drivers love it—especially the drivers of other cars. The Type As among us have found that these systems will keep slowing down and slowing down to allow more and more cars to cut in front. To prevent being routinely cut off in most of these cars, you have to override the cruise control. Not in the Model S. Just turn on the left turn signal, and the Model S accelerates back to the set speed so you can dart into an open hole in traffic in the lane to your left. If you can’t get there, it will still hit the brakes in time to avoid running into the car ahead. 2. It has a full Web browser in the dashboard That leads to one of the biggest convenience breakthroughs of the Tesla: full Google maps with live navigation and traffic, on a large screen that can be pinched to zoom in or swiped to move in real time, just like a smartphone. There’s no quicker way to spot traffic ahead and find an alternate route than than combination of real-time information and intuitive controls. Plus, the full 17-inch screen provides a nice big view. Beyond that, the mobile Internet connection allows you to stream radio as you drive. Of course the temptation to browse is there, but think of it as a convenience for your passenger only. Otherwise, the driving distraction is significant. 3. You can open the sunroof with the steering wheel controls—sometimes by accident. There is no conventional button to open the sunroof. You can either select “Controls,” then “Sunroof” on the center control screen—which gives you a giant image of the Tesla’s roof—and drag the sunroof open on the image (to any position you want). Or, you can press the right-hand scroll wheel on the steering wheel, dial it down to Sunroof, press it, then dial it open to your desired setting. If you leave the setting on Sunroof, it’s easy to bump it open by accident. 4. The manual is embedded in the controls With all of the advanced features in the Model S—on top of a whole new control paradigm—it’s not always obvious how to do things. For example, on my first drive, I went a dozen miles before deciding I just couldn’t find the blind-spot indicators. So it’s handy that the car’s whole owner’s manual is programmed into the center screen. I just pulled over, and I was able to look it up. We definitely don’t recommend doing this while driving! 5. The parking sensor displays in inches Increasingly popular, parking sensors that beep as you approach obstacles to indicate distance to an obstacle can be found in all vehicle classes. Many also display green, yellow, or red indicators on the rear camera screen that signal an approaching obstacle when backing up. The Model S takes that one step farther and displays the number of inches you have to go before you reach the obstacle, whether you’re creeping forward or backing up. We think that’s much clearer. 6. It has no starter button (and you never have to touch the key) Just get in, sit down, and close the door behind you, and the car turns on. (It’s indicated by the battery charge dial flipping over to show the speedometer.) Turning the car off works the same way, which is a little more disconcerting. Press the Park button on the steering column stalk, lift your weight off the seat, and the car turns off and the speedometer disappears again. 7. Blind-spot warning shows only by speedometer Most blind-spot warning systems show a yellow light either in the outside mirror or on the windshield pillar next to it when there’s a car next to you, likely obscured from view at the rear flanks. The Tesla only shows little hash marks next to the lower corners of the speedometer when a car is there. Some of our drivers find it’s hard to notice the indicators when their head is turned looking in the mirror. 8. Slip Mode We’ve frequently touted electronic stability control (ESC) as the most statistically effective automotive safety feature since seat belts. Yet most cars have a button on the dashboard labeled “ESC off.” Why would you want to turn off a key safety feature? Because ESC is designed to keep your wheel
[EVDL] EVent: EVs @georgiancollege.ca Auto Show $ 6/7 Ontario.ca
http://barrie.ctvnews.ca/events-from-june-1-to-june-7-1.1361670
Events from June 1 to June 7 ...
Georgian College Auto Show
Friday June 5 to Sunday June 7 - Barrie – Georgian College
This year’s show will be the best to date with a full complement of
manufacturers, an enhanced performance area and activities to keep the
family entertained. Make sure to stop by our Culinary Village featuring
local fare prepared by Georgian culinary students. Highlights include:
Batman and the Batmobile, the Electric Vehicle Experience, Grand Touring
Automobiles exotic car display, Pfaff Autocross Track, and so much more.
2015 Georgian College Auto Show: Accelerating to be the best show ever! ...
[© barrie.ctvnews.ca]
...
http://www.georgiancollege.ca/news-events/all-events/auto-show/
Auto Show
[images]
Sunday, June 7, 2015 [10 a.m. to 6 p.m.]
We are excited to bring you ...
Electric Vehicle Experience ...
Special online admission is $5. Kids under 12 are free, for a limited time
only. Purchase your tickets here [
http://bit.ly/1sU9mJK
] ...
Sunday, June 7: 10 a.m. to 6 p.m.
ADMISSION
Daily: $7 [at the door, cheaper if purchased online above] ...
Kids under 12 are free.
[© 2015 Georgian College]
...
http://www.georgiancollege.ca/about-georgian/
One Georgian Drive Barrie, ON L4M 3X9 705.728.1968 (map)
https://goo.gl/maps/zlP9x
For EVLN posts use:
http://evdl.org/evln/
{brucedp.150m.com}
--
View this message in context:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVent-EVs-georgiancollege-ca-Auto-Show-6-7-Ontario-ca-tp4676014.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
Nabble.com.
___
UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Success!
Sent from my iPhone > On Jun 3, 2015, at 11:27 PM, David Nelson wrote: > >> On Wed, Jun 3, 2015 at 10:50 AM, Paul Dove via EV wrote: >> Yes I suppose this is confusing. Let them ion batteries are charged >> according to a procedure. Let's take lithium iron phosphate for example. >> According to the procedures you charge to 3.65 V constant current. Then you >> hold the voltage at 3.65 and taper the current to C/20. > > Remember that that procedure was developed to reduce time to charge and the > chance that the batteries get overcharged while still reaching 100%SOC or > nearly so. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Success!
Sorry about that my dog hit my arm and hit send by accident. Sure one can develop their own procedure however, these procedures were developed in a laboratory and the batteries dissected afterwards to see the effect. My point was anything over 3.38 V is charging the cell Sent from my iPhone > On Jun 4, 2015, at 7:16 AM, Paul Dove via EV wrote: > > > > Sent from my iPhone > >>> On Jun 3, 2015, at 11:27 PM, David Nelson wrote: >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 3, 2015 at 10:50 AM, Paul Dove via EV wrote: >>> Yes I suppose this is confusing. Let them ion batteries are charged >>> according to a procedure. Let's take lithium iron phosphate for example. >>> According to the procedures you charge to 3.65 V constant current. Then you >>> hold the voltage at 3.65 and taper the current to C/20. >> >> Remember that that procedure was developed to reduce time to charge and the >> chance that the batteries get overcharged while still reaching 100%SOC or >> nearly so. > ___ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA > (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] Tesla Vs Model T
Things get taken too literal here, what I was trying to say, in more simple ways The "T" was a very simple car, easily fixed, Yes the steering was bad, no heat, hardly no brakes, But all the cars of them days were about the same. How many millions of lines of code are in a Tesla s software., The "T" had none, hell radios were new back then, Yes they polluted but no one ever saw a tree hugger back then . If they did it was a member of a family no one ever talked about . even today, simple always wins over complexity , which is the mother of all screw ups. Sooner or later that high tech car will have a high tech bill that goes with any type of service . The statement was to show what is in the automotive world today Vs yesteryear , right now I conciser my self 90% hi tech gadget free, no cell phone, smart phone, tablet, MP3 player I dought I would ever waste the money on a new car, seeing I work on this crap every day, the newest car/truck I own is a 83, then a 76, Now ask your self, after looking out the window of your new HiTech car "does this thing need more software than the Lunar lander" ??? -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150604/4dc592f3/attachment.htm> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Success!
The spec for CALB cells is CC to 3.6V per cell then CV to C/20. When I do a full charge I charge my 180 Ah CALB SE cells at CC to 3.53V per cell average, or about 127V pack voltage, then the charger holds a pack V of about 126V to C/20, or 9A, and terminates. After several hours at rest the pack V is 120.4V to 120.5V, or about 3.34V - 3.35V per cell. Been charging that way for over 1 1/2 years and the voltage is always in that range. The SoC of the pack at 3.6V per cell is of course a function of charge current due to voltage drops across cell internal resistance. Jack R. demonstrated a few years ago that if you charge at 1C you can exceed the 3.6V spec somewhat (think he went to around 4.1V), not do immediate damage to the cell (no info about long term effect on his test cell), and rest voltage will be quite a bit lower than if you charged to 3.6V per cell at say 40A. Of course if cells are driven too high in voltage the electrolyte solvent starts to break down regardless of SoC of the cell. Whitacre said this occurs at 4.3 to 4.4V per cell, but I would guess it depends on cell chemistry, additives, solvents used...so who knows for a specific cell manufacturer. I think that is why charge time on "DC fast chargers" is spec'ed to 80% SoC. They likely charge to similar V per cell as when charging at lower currents, which at that current level gets you to around 80% SoC, then start the CV phase. David N. pointed out the opposite issue years ago - charging at very low current to the 3.6V (or whatever for given cell type) spec. The cell voltage will be lower at a given SoC at low charge current so you may overcharge the cell by say charging at 0.5A to the 3.6V spec. I don't know if anyone ever actually demonstrated damage. -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Success-tp4675905p4676021.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Trickle Charging a Nissan?
/"I was shocked when I heard that was in the manual. Then by fortune one day on a plane trip the guy sitting next to me noticed all my EV magazines etc, and admitted he was a battery engineer for Nissan."/ Nice to know. -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Re-Trickle-Charging-a-Nissan-tp4675989p4676022.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Tesla Vs Model T
I still own and maintain a 1989 Toyota PU. W/o AC, w/o Fuel injections. One complication is an electric choke, and a 2 barrel that is encumbered with some emission reduction duties. One nice thing is an electronic distributor. I can carry a useful puich of tools and to a lot of work on it. But best of all, I never have to work on it - because is is very well made, using modern manufacturing techniques, good design and QC methodologies. Perhaps a truck like this is a better comparison to make the point. However, it gets low 20's mpg, and I am pretty certain is sub-par on emissions (though legal). "The man" will probably make me park it someday. I am happy to have whatever advancement in transportation technology if it makes people less necessary for driving and decision making, and if it lets our race foul the nest less egregiously. Mike On Thu, Jun 4, 2015 at 9:45 AM, Electric Blue auto convertions via EV < ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: > Things get taken too literal here, what I was trying to say, in more > simple ways The "T" was a very simple car, easily fixed, Yes the > steering was bad, no heat, hardly no brakes, > But all the cars of them days were about the same. How many millions of > lines of code are in a Tesla s software., The "T" had none, hell radios > were new back then, Yes they polluted > but no one ever saw a tree hugger back then . If they did it was a member > of a family no one ever talked about . > even today, simple always wins over complexity , which is the mother of > all screw ups. Sooner or later that high tech car will have a high tech > bill that goes with any type of service . > > The statement was to show what is in the automotive world today Vs > yesteryear , right now I conciser my self 90% hi tech gadget free, no cell > phone, smart phone, tablet, MP3 player > I dought I would ever waste the money on a new car, seeing I work on this > crap every day, the newest car/truck I own is a 83, then a 76, Now ask your > self, after looking out the window of your new HiTech car "does this > thing need more software than the Lunar lander" ??? > -- next part -- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150604/4dc592f3/attachment.htm > > > ___ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison <http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html> A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 <https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones> Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150604/d9deb290/attachment.htm> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Tesla Vs Model T
> On Jun 4, 2015, at 6:45 AM, Electric Blue auto convertions via EV > wrote: > > Things get taken too literal here, what I was trying to say, in more simple > ways The "T" was a very simple car, easily fixed, Yes the steering was > bad, no heat, hardly no brakes, > But all the cars of them days were about the same. How many millions of lines > of code are in a Tesla s software., The "T" had none, hell radios were new > back then, Yes they polluted > but no one ever saw a tree hugger back then . If they did it was a member of > a family no one ever talked about . > even today, simple always wins over complexity , which is the mother of all > screw ups. Sooner or later that high tech car will have a high tech bill that > goes with any type of service . > > The statement was to show what is in the automotive world today Vs yesteryear > , right now I conciser my self 90% hi tech gadget free, no cell phone, smart > phone, tablet, MP3 player > I dought I would ever waste the money on a new car, seeing I work on this > crap every day, the newest car/truck I own is a 83, then a 76, Now ask your > self, after looking out the window of your new HiTech car “does this > thing need more software than the Lunar lander" ??? You are claiming that software is a problem. Software can be well built or poorly built; just like anything else. corbin ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Success!
At room temperature the cells may be fine at high SOC. Since so much traditional cycle testing is done at room temps, they never spend much time at the condition that actually causes problems. This testing is not much value when trying to compare cells ability to last a long time. Mike On Thu, Jun 4, 2015 at 9:54 AM, tomw via EV wrote: > The spec for CALB cells is CC to 3.6V per cell then CV to C/20. When I do > a > full charge I charge my 180 Ah CALB SE cells at CC to 3.53V per cell > average, or about 127V pack voltage, then the charger holds a pack V of > about 126V to C/20, or 9A, and terminates. After several hours at rest the > pack V is 120.4V to 120.5V, or about 3.34V - 3.35V per cell. Been charging > that way for over 1 1/2 years and the voltage is always in that range. > > The SoC of the pack at 3.6V per cell is of course a function of charge > current due to voltage drops across cell internal resistance. Jack R. > demonstrated a few years ago that if you charge at 1C you can exceed the > 3.6V spec somewhat (think he went to around 4.1V), not do immediate damage > to the cell (no info about long term effect on his test cell), and rest > voltage will be quite a bit lower than if you charged to 3.6V per cell at > say 40A. Of course if cells are driven too high in voltage the electrolyte > solvent starts to break down regardless of SoC of the cell. Whitacre said > this occurs at 4.3 to 4.4V per cell, but I would guess it depends on cell > chemistry, additives, solvents used...so who knows for a specific cell > manufacturer. > > I think that is why charge time on "DC fast chargers" is spec'ed to 80% > SoC. > They likely charge to similar V per cell as when charging at lower > currents, > which at that current level gets you to around 80% SoC, then start the CV > phase. > > David N. pointed out the opposite issue years ago - charging at very low > current to the 3.6V (or whatever for given cell type) spec. The cell > voltage will be lower at a given SoC at low charge current so you may > overcharge the cell by say charging at 0.5A to the 3.6V spec. I don't know > if anyone ever actually demonstrated damage. > > > > -- > View this message in context: > http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Success-tp4675905p4676021.html > Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at > Nabble.com. > ___ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison <http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html> A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 <https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones> Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150604/5a4a7714/attachment.htm> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Tesla Vs Model T
"We breath the foul air" .Yes they polluted but no one ever saw a tree hugger back then perhaps you are incorrect. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Tesla & M-T ???
On Jun 3, 2015, at 10:23 PM, Mark Abramowitz via EV wrote: > What EV is better than a Tesla? One person I know that has a Tesla has owned > cars of all types, many of them luxury ones. He says that his Tesla is the > best car he has *ever* owned. > > So what do you think is better? Better..._for_what_purpose?_ A Tesla would be pretty useless for hauling a ton of manure to the back 40. Probably not so great at towing a yacht to the lake. Definitely sucks for taking the marching band to Disneyland. Likely the last vehicle you'd want to drive through Somalia regardless of what you were making the drive for. Probably get you killed trying to drive all the way across Siberia in the winter. Teslas are very good at being four-door luxury passenger vehicles. But there're lots of settings where the very things that make them so good at that make them awful for other purposes. Personally...the whole automatic over-the-air update thing, neat as it is and as much as so many people love it...well, it alone would be close to a deal-breaker for me. Maybe it's irrational paranoia on my part, but I want to own and be in control of my car, not some faceless lawyer telling some schmuck of a coder what to do to the car. And, really. It's a car. An horseless carriage. Its job isn't to entertain me, to pamper me; it's to get me from here to there. ...and that's long before we get into the whole Big Brother thing b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150604/b43b6ce8/attachment.pgp> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Tesla Vs Model T
I am not sure what precipitated that comment, but there is a Malthusian effect that is fundamentally more at play now than some time ago - before there was a need for people who like a clean nest. 18th century stuff. There were certainly people lamenting the conditions of London, Birmingham, Pittsburgh and so on after 1800. They simply had different pejoratives to describe them. On Thu, Jun 4, 2015 at 1:12 PM, robert winfield via EV wrote: > "We breath the foul air" > > .Yes they polluted but no one ever saw a tree hugger back then > perhaps you are incorrect. > ___ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison <http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html> A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 <https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones> Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150604/631f7bb5/attachment.htm> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] It’s Time for a U.S.-Canada Electric Vehicle Pact
http://www.policyinnovations.org/ideas/commentary/data/00355 It’s Time for a U.S.-Canada Electric Auto Pact By Jim Burpee, John Haffner | May 28, 2015 [images http://i1376.photobucket.com/albums/ah18/ipedruelo/electric-cars1_zpscqzcrna1.jpg http://i1376.photobucket.com/albums/ah18/ipedruelo/electric-cars2_zps5e5xvqmk.jpg ] Oil has served us well. There is no denying how it has powered so many extraordinary advances in human civilization. But as a former oil minister for Saudi Arabia observed in 2000, "The Stone Age came to an end, not because we had a lack of stones, and the oil age will come to an end not because we have a lack of oil." It's time for governments—particularly the U.S. and Canadian governments—to get behind electric vehicles (EVs). The Canada-U.S. auto pact of 1965 was a major milestone, setting the stage for free trade in the 1980s and later the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA). Fifty years later, it is time for a renewed vision for Canada-U.S. automotive cooperation. Below we offer three arguments in favor of EVs and a U.S.-Canada Electric Auto Pact, followed by three actions governments should take to support accelerated deployment of EVs. Four Benefits First, electric drive motors are far more efficient than internal combustion engines (ICEs). The second law of thermodynamics tells us that that some energy will be lost in any energy conversion process. By dividing the energy output from the energy input for each of electric drive motors and internal combustion engines, we can calculate their respective efficiencies. And the contrast is dramatic: electric motors powered by batteries tend to be 85 percent efficient, whereas internal combustion engines are about 30 percent (the energy loss is almost all heat). And that is not the whole story. Internal combustion engines run at 30 percent efficiency while driving, but are 0 percent efficient when idling, whereas the electric drive never idles—it turns off. Conventional hybrid vehicles improve efficiency by almost eliminating idling through regenerative breaking and by using electric drive at low speeds, but their maximum efficiency is still capped by the limits of ICEs. Second, EVs can help support optimization of the electricity grid. Whether through batteries or fuel cells (fuel cells combine hydrogen and oxygen to produce electricity), EVs can act as storage for electricity that is produced but not needed at the time of production (often at night), and then bid resources back into the grid when required (often in the daytime). Their added storage capacity will help smooth the integration of intermittent resources like wind and solar, and enhance the use of wires that are usually loaded at less than their peak capacity. A California utility, San Diego Gas & Electric, now has a promising pilot underway along these lines. As the Canadian Electricity Association points out in its paper Vision 2050: The Future of Canada's Electricity System: A family could plug in their electric car to the grid to charge overnight, and then during the day, deliver solar power (from a home installation) back to the grid . . . The utility company could even potentially access the power available in their idle electric car (if the customer grants this option in advance) to meet peak demand under certain conditions, so that the vehicle also acts as a form of electricity storage. Together these represent a completely different way to think about electricity flows. Third, optimized grids, as supported in part by electric vehicles, offer one other benefit: they will help strengthen grid reliability and resilience. In the Northeastern United States, as a result of Hurricane Sandy, micro-grids—grids that can operate autonomously—are being developed to ensure that core emergency response services will be available even in the event of catastrophic loss of the grid. Lastly, If we are to have any hope of mitigating climate change, we will need to accelerate dramatic reductions in carbon emissions. Since electric vehicles will reduce overall energy consumption in our economy as well as replace high-emitting sources with lower ones, electric vehicles could make a significant contribution to this effort. In the North American context, the average Canadian electron is cleaner than the average U.S. one. In the United States, roughly 67 percent of electricity is generated from fossil fuels (coal, natural gas, and petroleum); in Canada, by contrast, 79 percent of electricity is from non-emitting electricity sources—"one of the highest percentages in the world"—including more than 63 percent from hydroelectricity. For both the United States and Canada, the carbon intensity of the electricity sector is likely to decrease over time as older, less efficient fossil resources are retired and replaced with lower-emitting resources. Yet carbon reductions from transportation can be made much easier if additional Canadian electricity, especially from abund
Re: [EVDL] How is a Tesla S like a Model T?
In my little town of Occidental in West Sonoma County (1200 folks in the entire area), I have seen Tesla's in white, black, red, blue, and brown driving through. Also I have seen RAV4-EV's (first and second generation), Spark's, Volt's, Smart Car's, Leaf's, and nearly every other EV currently or recently available. Some are locals and others must be just passing through. Still no public charger in the area. John --- John G. Blair Studio Occidental, California (about an hour north of the Bay Area) http://www.jgblairphoto.com - general photography http://www.johngblairstudio.com - commercial and stock photography http://www.johngblair.com - author website On Jun 3, 2015, at 9:31 PM, Mike Beem via EV wrote: > I'm sorry to have started this thread...maybe it comes from living in a > small town, it could actually be me seeing the same model S in very widely > different places in Sonoma & Marin counties where I do 95% of all of my > driving. Or maybe it's the only color available North of the Golden Gate. > It just struck me as funny when I saw 1 outside my anachronistic store (a > used book store=a really endangered species!) and thought of Henry's quote. > I need to get out more [?] > Michael B -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150604/c0e5b326/attachment.htm> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Utilities seek larger part in charging station rollout
> In the Southeast, Southern Co.'s Georgia Power subsidiary is spending > $12 million on a pilot program to install as many as 50 public EV charging > stations by the end of 2016 (EnergyWire, March 5). That's $240,000 per station. Hopefully they will be installed where they are truly needed... Tom Keenan -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150604/3051213b/attachment.htm> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
