Re: Does (did) 1980 exist?
On 09-08-2019 19:09, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List wrote: On 8/8/2019 10:33 PM, smitra wrote: I remember the year 1980, but what I remember is due to brain processes that exist right now. I can only ever probe the present moment, there is no way to prove that 1980 physically exists or existed (whatever the past tense is supposed to mean). So, if 1980 exists (existed) it must be considered to be a parallel world where the people in our memory of that time really exist (existed). The time evolution operator from that time to the present can be expanded in a basis where complete sets of commuting local observables are diagonal. One of the simultaneous eigenstates is the present world we find ourselves in. So, if we assume that 1980 is indeed real and the present world which is one particular component of that same 1980 state written in a different basis, then it's plausible that all the other MWI parallel worlds of 2019 are equally real. Or to recap. There's a world which we believe is real because we remember it and find consistent evidence of it today. Therefore we should believe in the existence of worlds for which we have no evidence or memories. We have today's world |now_125463445372> we have good evidence of 1980's existence and we also know that there exist coefficients c_j and states |now_j> such that |1980> = Exp[i H t/hbar][sum_j of c_j |now_j>] Saibal -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/587076d6608e6d518df3606eef1923d1%40zonnet.nl.
Re: Does (did) 1980 exist?
On 09-08-2019 11:59, Jason Resch wrote: On Friday, August 9, 2019, smitra wrote: I remember the year 1980, but what I remember is due to brain processes that exist right now. I can only ever probe the present moment, there is no way to prove that 1980 physically exists or existed (whatever the past tense is supposed to mean). So, if 1980 exists (existed) it must be considered to be a parallel world where the people in our memory of that time really exist (existed). The time evolution operator from that time to the present can be expanded in a basis where complete sets of commuting local observables are diagonal. One of the simultaneous eigenstates is the present world we find ourselves in. So, if we assume that 1980 is indeed real and the present world which is one particular component of that same 1980 state written in a different basis, then it's plausible that all the other MWI parallel worlds of 2019 are equally real. This sounds similar to Wei Dai's "really simple interpretation of quantum mechanics": http://www.weidai.com/qm-interpretation.txt [1] Yes, and if one represents an observer as an algorithm, then that would require computing probabilities by summing over all the states where some particular algorithm corresponding to some particular observation is instantiated. Algorithms can be represented as entangled states without having to invoke time evolution. You just have to write down the effect of different inputs leading to different outputs as an entanglement existing at moment in time. So, quantum mechanics makes it possible to define observer moments. A given observation will come with a resolution, what is below the resolution we can perceive still exists physically, counterfactuals at that level will exist in the relative state of the observer that makes that observation in the form of entanglement. This entanglement then makes the algorithm rendering the observation well defined. Regarding the reality of other points in time, while we can't disprove the theory that the universe was created 5 seconds ago in it's current state, it is an implication of special relativity that all points in time are real as this paper describes: http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/2408/1/Petkov-BlockUniverse.pdf [2] Thanks, I'll read that paper! Saibal Jason -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CA%2BBCJUi5xX5L3LDtiOyLq8hcuA3df4dzEvLwQt%2BAXUp2c4yW0w%40mail.gmail.com [3]. Links: -- [1] http://www.weidai.com/qm-interpretation.txt [2] http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/2408/1/Petkov-BlockUniverse.pdf [3] https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CA%2BBCJUi5xX5L3LDtiOyLq8hcuA3df4dzEvLwQt%2BAXUp2c4yW0w%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/72127c1b3c9823e6c08c54606d8d0716%40zonnet.nl.
Re: Does (did) 1980 exist?
So, in other words, we can only know the fragment of reality as transmitted through our senses into our perceived memories - which may explain why everyone has a different perspective about reality - they only know their piece of the mosaic - the whole picture of reality only becomes clearer as we begin to share and piece together our fragments On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 4:21 PM J O wrote: > perhaps 1980 still exists - but only as a fragmented ‘state’ - where all > the fragmented perspectives of everyone who lived then reside in a > separated state of reality in each persons memory. A mosaic of time > > On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 1:09 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < > everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On 8/8/2019 10:33 PM, smitra wrote: >> > I remember the year 1980, but what I remember is due to brain >> > processes that exist right now. I can only ever probe the present >> > moment, there is no way to prove that 1980 physically exists or >> > existed (whatever the past tense is supposed to mean). So, if 1980 >> > exists (existed) it must be considered to be a parallel world where >> > the people in our memory of that time really exist (existed). The time >> > evolution operator from that time to the present can be expanded in a >> > basis where complete sets of commuting local observables are diagonal. >> > One of the simultaneous eigenstates is the present world we find >> > ourselves in. So, if we assume that 1980 is indeed real and the >> > present world which is one particular component of that same 1980 >> > state written in a different basis, then it's plausible that all the >> > other MWI parallel worlds of 2019 are equally real. >> >> Or to recap. There's a world which we believe is real because we >> remember it and find consistent evidence of it today. Therefore we >> should believe in the existence of worlds for which we have no evidence >> or memories. >> >> Brent >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/3e40cede-c108-402c-7d3f-cd25c8f8a29d%40verizon.net >> . >> > -- > Jennifer O'Bryon > 70 North Main Street > Bryant Pond, Maine 04219 > 207-418-2496 > > -- Jennifer O'Bryon 70 North Main Street Bryant Pond, Maine 04219 207-418-2496 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAAgt4%2BE1qryFf%3DOWoVGaQ8XvsJW9muKEPtnuj_Lk5ACMST4i5Q%40mail.gmail.com.
Re: Does (did) 1980 exist?
perhaps 1980 still exists - but only as a fragmented ‘state’ - where all the fragmented perspectives of everyone who lived then reside in a separated state of reality in each persons memory. A mosaic of time On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 1:09 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > > On 8/8/2019 10:33 PM, smitra wrote: > > I remember the year 1980, but what I remember is due to brain > > processes that exist right now. I can only ever probe the present > > moment, there is no way to prove that 1980 physically exists or > > existed (whatever the past tense is supposed to mean). So, if 1980 > > exists (existed) it must be considered to be a parallel world where > > the people in our memory of that time really exist (existed). The time > > evolution operator from that time to the present can be expanded in a > > basis where complete sets of commuting local observables are diagonal. > > One of the simultaneous eigenstates is the present world we find > > ourselves in. So, if we assume that 1980 is indeed real and the > > present world which is one particular component of that same 1980 > > state written in a different basis, then it's plausible that all the > > other MWI parallel worlds of 2019 are equally real. > > Or to recap. There's a world which we believe is real because we > remember it and find consistent evidence of it today. Therefore we > should believe in the existence of worlds for which we have no evidence > or memories. > > Brent > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/3e40cede-c108-402c-7d3f-cd25c8f8a29d%40verizon.net > . > -- Jennifer O'Bryon 70 North Main Street Bryant Pond, Maine 04219 207-418-2496 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAAgt4%2BGrW-v%3DkXB-4Y8s-w4z-55WqJZEhyGxcrROn1w%2BKWJnLg%40mail.gmail.com.
Re: Does (did) 1980 exist?
On 8/8/2019 10:33 PM, smitra wrote: I remember the year 1980, but what I remember is due to brain processes that exist right now. I can only ever probe the present moment, there is no way to prove that 1980 physically exists or existed (whatever the past tense is supposed to mean). So, if 1980 exists (existed) it must be considered to be a parallel world where the people in our memory of that time really exist (existed). The time evolution operator from that time to the present can be expanded in a basis where complete sets of commuting local observables are diagonal. One of the simultaneous eigenstates is the present world we find ourselves in. So, if we assume that 1980 is indeed real and the present world which is one particular component of that same 1980 state written in a different basis, then it's plausible that all the other MWI parallel worlds of 2019 are equally real. Or to recap. There's a world which we believe is real because we remember it and find consistent evidence of it today. Therefore we should believe in the existence of worlds for which we have no evidence or memories. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/3e40cede-c108-402c-7d3f-cd25c8f8a29d%40verizon.net.
Re: Does (did) 1980 exist?
On Friday, August 9, 2019, smitra wrote: > I remember the year 1980, but what I remember is due to brain processes > that exist right now. I can only ever probe the present moment, there is no > way to prove that 1980 physically exists or existed (whatever the past > tense is supposed to mean). So, if 1980 exists (existed) it must be > considered to be a parallel world where the people in our memory of that > time really exist (existed). The time evolution operator from that time to > the present can be expanded in a basis where complete sets of commuting > local observables are diagonal. One of the simultaneous eigenstates is the > present world we find ourselves in. So, if we assume that 1980 is indeed > real and the present world which is one particular component of that same > 1980 state written in a different basis, then it's plausible that all the > other MWI parallel worlds of 2019 are equally real. > > This sounds similar to Wei Dai's "really simple interpretation of quantum mechanics": http://www.weidai.com/qm-interpretation.txt Regarding the reality of other points in time, while we can't disprove the theory that the universe was created 5 seconds ago in it's current state, it is an implication of special relativity that all points in time are real as this paper describes: http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/2408/1/Petkov-BlockUniverse.pdf Jason -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CA%2BBCJUi5xX5L3LDtiOyLq8hcuA3df4dzEvLwQt%2BAXUp2c4yW0w%40mail.gmail.com.
Does (did) 1980 exist?
I remember the year 1980, but what I remember is due to brain processes that exist right now. I can only ever probe the present moment, there is no way to prove that 1980 physically exists or existed (whatever the past tense is supposed to mean). So, if 1980 exists (existed) it must be considered to be a parallel world where the people in our memory of that time really exist (existed). The time evolution operator from that time to the present can be expanded in a basis where complete sets of commuting local observables are diagonal. One of the simultaneous eigenstates is the present world we find ourselves in. So, if we assume that 1980 is indeed real and the present world which is one particular component of that same 1980 state written in a different basis, then it's plausible that all the other MWI parallel worlds of 2019 are equally real. Saibal -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/5d346145add7e48f4d42c67028f3c7be%40zonnet.nl.
