Re: [Evolution] Reply-To: field on the evolution list
On Oct 12, 2009, at 10:39 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan p...@usb.ve wrote: Apparently it doesn't support bottom-posting either. IPhone =3.0, yes. Blackberry, no. -- Art Alexion Sent unsigned from iPod ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Reply-To: field on the evolution list
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 05:30 -0400, Art Alexion wrote: On Oct 12, 2009, at 10:39 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan p...@usb.ve wrote: Apparently it doesn't support bottom-posting either. IPhone =3.0, yes. Blackberry, no. I found this hard to credit so I checked on my daughter's BB. It's true that the email app strongly encourages you to top-post, but it is possible to work around it: 1) Copy the quoted text 2) Select the option to not quote 3) Paste the quoted text and continue at the end. The quoted text is not set off by indentation or leading marks so you'd need to insert a boundary line. I acknowledge that this is laborious, but for mailing lists I also think bottom-posting is important. Of course you could also use your BB for work-related and one-to-one mail, and use your desktop for list traffic. poc ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
[Evolution] BB MUA [Was: field on the evolution list]
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 08:02 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 05:30 -0400, Art Alexion wrote: On Oct 12, 2009, at 10:39 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan p...@usb.ve wrote: Apparently it doesn't support bottom-posting either. IPhone =3.0, yes. Blackberry, no. I found this hard to credit so I checked on my daughter's BB. It's true that the email app strongly encourages you to top-post, but it is possible to work around it: 1) Copy the quoted text 2) Select the option to not quote 3) Paste the quoted text and continue at the end. The quoted text is not set off by indentation or leading marks so you'd need to insert a boundary line. I acknowledge that this is laborious, but for mailing lists I also think bottom-posting is important. Of course you could also use your BB for work-related and one-to-one mail, and use your desktop for list traffic. Are there (is it even possible?) alternate MUAs for the BB? I'm curious, I have BB users, some of whom are quite clueful. ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] BB MUA [Was: field on the evolution list]
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 13:56 +0100, Pete Biggs wrote: On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 08:37 -0400, Adam Tauno Williams wrote: On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 08:02 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 05:30 -0400, Art Alexion wrote: On Oct 12, 2009, at 10:39 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan p...@usb.ve wrote: Apparently it doesn't support bottom-posting either. IPhone =3.0, yes. Blackberry, no. I found this hard to credit so I checked on my daughter's BB. It's true that the email app strongly encourages you to top-post, but it is possible to work around it: 1) Copy the quoted text 2) Select the option to not quote 3) Paste the quoted text and continue at the end. The quoted text is not set off by indentation or leading marks so you'd need to insert a boundary line. I acknowledge that this is laborious, but for mailing lists I also think bottom-posting is important. Of course you could also use your BB for work-related and one-to-one mail, and use your desktop for list traffic. Are there (is it even possible?) alternate MUAs for the BB? I'm curious, I have BB users, some of whom are quite clueful. It's not easy - you can use Googlemail on it since there is a specific Google mobile app for BB. But it's just as bad as the built-in MUA when it comes to quoting (it doesn't even show the quoted email when composing, it just adds it to the end when you send the mail!) I don't think it's really possible to use a proper client on a BB - all the traffic from the BB goes via either a BES or a BIS and as such is totally under the control of the provider (whether that be your company or the telco). With a BIS your BB doesn't do the IMAP side of things, that's done by the server which then pushes the email to the BB. With a BES it pushes the email directly from (usually) the exchange store. So if you can't do IMAP or POP, then I don't think it's possible to have a different MUA. Google found a few, e.g. http://www.logicprobe.org/proj/logicmail is free and is a real IMAP client (no idea whether it supports bottom-posting though). There are also some commercial products. e.g. http://crackberry.com/tiggit-mail-blackberry-email-alternative. poc ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Reply-To: field on the evolution list
On Mon, 2009-10-12 at 06:00 -0400, Adam Tauno Williams wrote: I think the project, and the application, is doing great. Compared to the Evolution of old this app rocks (and compared to every other Open Source e-mail/calendar client - Evo is leaps and bounds ahead of anything else, it is hard to even consider them in the same category). I like Kontact. I use it for personal mail. Each has its advantages and disadvantages. Kontact excels at customizability and user control. It seems to have fewer bugs than Evo and does gmail IMAP better than evo or thunderbird. Evo excels at Exchange connectivity and HTML rendering and editing. I think the Evo developers are extremely responsive, and often hold them out as an example of why Open Source is so good. (and incidentally, so is Ingo Klöcker the kmail developer.) -- Art Alexion Resources for Human Development, Inc. 215-951-0300 x3075 4700 Wissahickon Ave. a...@rhd.org Philadelphia, PA 19144 267-615-3172 ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Reply-To: field on the evolution list
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 12:40 -0400, Art Alexion wrote: On Mon, 2009-10-12 at 06:00 -0400, Adam Tauno Williams wrote: I think the project, and the application, is doing great. Compared to the Evolution of old this app rocks (and compared to every other Open Source e-mail/calendar client - Evo is leaps and bounds ahead of anything else, it is hard to even consider them in the same category). I like Kontact. I use it for personal mail. Each has its advantages and disadvantages. Kontact excels at customizability and user control. It seems to have fewer bugs than Evo and does gmail IMAP better than evo or thunderbird. Evo excels at Exchange connectivity and HTML rendering and editing. I think the Evo developers are extremely responsive, and often hold them out as an example of why Open Source is so good. (and incidentally, so is Ingo Klöcker the kmail developer.) I agree with Adam. I used Kontact for quite a while and prefer Evo. And for what's it's worth I use 2.26.3 on Debian w/XFCE4 and it has yet to crash, ever. Cheers, Phil ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Reply-To: field on the evolution list
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 12:15 -0400, Art Alexion wrote: On Mon, 2009-10-12 at 05:57 -0400, Adam Tauno Williams wrote: Then I wouldn't have to edit an XML file to eliminate that *@^(@* stupid and useless Junk button positioned inconveniently next to the delete button. Ugh. Ah, but I use the Junk/Not Junk buttons. I have server side filtering (SIEVE) so Junk just gets annoying when accidentally clicked. I haven't found a use for the Cancel button, Because it doesn't work! :) I imagine it is for long running [or failed?] IMAP or SMTP transactions, but it doesn't seem to actually cancel very effectively. and I think the current Previous/Next buttons are useless, and wish they were Prev Unread/Next Unread. They are only useful if you enable the preview pane, then you can rapidly scroll through messages; but with the advent of larger screen I usually just open a message and next-next-next away. On smaller screen (something netbook-ish) the preview pane is very useful. ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Reply-To: field on the evolution list
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 13:01 -0400, Adam Tauno Williams wrote: and I think the current Previous/Next buttons are useless, and wish they were Prev Unread/Next Unread. They are only useful if you enable the preview pane, then you can rapidly scroll through messages; but with the advent of larger screen I usually just open a message and next-next-next away. On smaller screen (something netbook-ish) the preview pane is very useful. I have a decent screen (1440x990 19inch) and use Preview anyway. I *never* use the Previous and Next buttons, just , and . (which do implement Prev/Next Unread) or direct selection with the mouse. poc ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] BB MUA [Was: field on the evolution list]
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 08:37 -0400, Adam Tauno Williams wrote: Are there (is it even possible?) alternate MUAs for the BB? I'm curious, I have BB users, some of whom are quite clueful. There is a gmail app, but of course, it only works with gmail accounts. It is also among the lamest of google products I have tried, but it does work and does allow bottom posting. Again, for gmail accounts only. -- Art Alexion Resources for Human Development, Inc. 215-951-0300 x3075 4700 Wissahickon Ave. a...@rhd.org Philadelphia, PA 19144 267-615-3172 ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Reply-To: field on the evolution list
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 08:32 -0400, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 05:30 -0400, Art Alexion wrote: On Oct 12, 2009, at 10:39 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan p...@usb.ve wrote: Apparently it doesn't support bottom-posting either. IPhone =3.0, yes. Blackberry, no. I found this hard to credit so I checked on my daughter's BB. It's true that the email app strongly encourages you to top-post, but it is possible to work around it: 1) Copy the quoted text 2) Select the option to not quote 3) Paste the quoted text and continue at the end. The quoted text is not set off by indentation or leading marks so you'd need to insert a boundary line. I acknowledge that this is laborious, but for mailing lists I also think bottom-posting is important. Of course you could also use your BB for work-related and one-to-one mail, and use your desktop for list traffic. Laborious and not particularly effective since the quote is not deliniated. There is no paste as quotation option. By the way, I see this list as work related as I only use Evo at work for my work account. -- Art Alexion Resources for Human Development, Inc. 215-951-0300 x3075 4700 Wissahickon Ave. a...@rhd.org Philadelphia, PA 19144 267-615-3172 ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] BB MUA [Was: field on the evolution list]
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 08:48 -0400, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: AFAIK the BB is a very closed system, but that's basically the end of my knowledge about the subject. And it can be even more closed if the blackberry is connected to the server via BES. As BB administrator for my company, I can control which apps users can install, which icons appear on its screen, whether they go through the company firewall or not, which hours they receive mail, and so on. I generally don't, but I can. -- Art Alexion MIS ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] BB MUA [Was: field on the evolution list]
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 09:50 -0400, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: Google found a few, e.g. http://www.logicprobe.org/proj/logicmail is free and is a real IMAP client (no idea whether it supports bottom-posting though). I like the sound of this one and will give it a try. -- Art Alexion MIS ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Reply-To: field on the evolution list
On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 13:01 -0400, Adam Tauno Williams wrote: and I think the current Previous/Next buttons are useless, and wish they were Prev Unread/Next Unread. They are only useful if you enable the preview pane, then you can rapidly scroll through messages; but with the advent of larger screen I usually just open a message and next-next-next away. On smaller screen (something netbook-ish) the preview pane is very useful. I use the preview pane all of the time and still don't find them useful. I am an inbox abuser and allow mine to get very large. I use threaded view. I sort chronologically and not reverse chron. I use the [ ] keys all of the time, but often wish I could use my mouse. -- Art Alexion Resources for Human Development, Inc. 215-951-0300 x3075 4700 Wissahickon Ave. a...@rhd.org Philadelphia, PA 19144 267-615-3172 ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
[Evolution] Feature-Debate [Was: Reply-To: field on the evolution list]
I. On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 12:28 -0400, Art Alexion wrote: On Sun, 2009-10-11 at 22:17 -0400, B. Joshua Rosen wrote: I think it's a terrible mistake to be adding any new features to Evolution until the bugs have been fixed. Maybe. This is much more complicated issue than that. Sometimes bugs are quite difficult whereas a feature implementation might be trivial. Yep. Nobody cares about customizable toolbars or keyboard shortcuts, those things can wait. I care. It would be nice for me, but not really a killer-feature. I'd be very happy just to have toggle on/off even if the icons remained but where disabled. Evolution is in a terrible state at the moment. It crashes all of the time, it should never crash. It loses the ability to talk to pop server after 24 hours (at least it loses the ability to talk to Comcast's servers) which necessitates restarting the app. 2.26.1 in Ubuntu never crashes for me. Perhaps your instability issue is related to something else. No crashes on openSUSE 11.1 I have constant problems with message counts, and occasional problems with missing messages that I solve with a script that deletes the indices. This is annoying, but not a deal breaker for me. It is a deal breaker as far as deploying Evolution to non-technical users. Hmmm, I've never seen that one. We should never expect that our preferences are universal and apply to others. I haven't used virtual folders since it was Ximian Evolution I haven't used them since the advent of Beagle. Now if I want anything I just search - and there everything is. Although now it looks like I have to switch to using Tracker as Beagle is unmaintained. ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Top Post - Bottom Post [ was Re: stability/Jewett ]
Dear Matthias, I see the closed source BB is not welcome on this list. But can I still use my open source Android here? It's built in MTA still support top posting only. I understand that you don't like top posting (neither do I), but is that indeed _so much of a hassle_ for you that you feel entitled to advise people rather not to post if they can only do top posting? And/or advise them to change their cell phone (btw. to an otherwise much worse one) just because of this top posting issue? Regards, Alpar On Tue, 2009-10-13 at 05:47 +0200, Matthias Apitz wrote: El día Monday, October 12, 2009 a las 08:30:21PM -0400, Art Alexion escribió: I use a Blackberry because it is the phone my employer requires me to use. We use Blackberries because we use Exchange, which incidentally, is the same reason I use Evolution. You say you would never use it? Perhaps jobs are so plentiful for you that you can pick one based on the cell phone you prefer to use. I understand and I can imagine that an employer requires me to use a BB for business too. But your employe can not request you to use a BB to communicate in your spare time or to post to OpsenSource mailing list. For my work I have to use Evo and Exchange too, but for this mail I'm typing it into the vim and the MUA (thanks for your correction) is mutt and the MTA is sendmail. This is even true, when I travel. Then I have a small EeePC 900 and my cellphone is a Linux based Openmoko Freerunner. Top-posting not only violates the Netiquette, but violates what we human beeings normaly do on read: we read from top to down. It is an affront to me and normaly I tend to just delete such mails. HIH matthias ___ Evolution-list mailing list Evolution-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
