RE: how to hide things in OWA

2011-06-02 Thread Sharp, Kevin
I realize segmentation is the answer (should have mentioned that)I'm not 
clear which setting (if any) can hide the account editing piece.  City, 
Address, Phone number

Thanks

Kevin

From: Michael B. Smith [mailto:mich...@smithcons.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 5:32 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: how to hide things in OWA

OWA Segmentation.

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com

From: Sharp, Kevin [mailto:kevin.sh...@usask.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 7:26 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: how to hide things in OWA

If I wanted to hide the Account editing components in OWA 2010...what is the 
easiest way to do this?

Thanks

Kevin

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RE: Send on Behalf error

2011-06-02 Thread PRamatowski
Yeah, I just don't remember if the autocomplete business helped or not.

...I can say without a doubt you will be much happier when you have finished. 
 --  QFT:)

Paul

From: Matt Moore [mailto:mattmoore...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 11:27 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

In my roundabout way I guess that was the main thrust of what I was saying.  
Get everyone on same side, shared mailboxes too.  We seem to have the most 
problems like that when there are 2 versions at play.

It does help a lot!

M

From: pramatow...@mediageneral.com [mailto:pramatow...@mediageneral.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 6:17 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

Apologize, because we don't have many send on behalf of's the migration was a 
while back and still have memories of a snakebite or two-
What happens if they
[1]delete the boss's name from autocomplete and send a message (which should 
work)
[2] with autocomplete repopulated, what happens?

Don't know if it would matter but are boss and send on behalf people all on the 
same V of Exchange? FWIW we moved groups like that to try and mitigate 
problems, I like to think it helped a little.

From: Matt Moore [mailto:mattmoore...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 6:53 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

That's pretty typical behavior during a migration.  I've run into that and an 
awful lot of others and they're all different.  My first response would be 
apologize up and down for the inconvenience and get that migration done as soon 
as possible.  Nothing causes friction like a migration, we've had a number of 
clients run into this same scenario and put the brakes on the migration 
temporarily, thinking the problem would follow into 2010.  All have felt the 
pinch of that decision.   Well, hind sight being 20/20 I can say without a 
doubt you will be much happier when you have finished.  I think our smoothest 
migration to date was for 80,000+ users all done in one weekend.  Sure there 
were a few issues but they were all taken care very quickly in comparison.
I guess that wasn't really how to fix it, sorry about that, more looking at the 
bigger picture.  Get it done then track down the problems when you don't have a 
basket of snakes, venomous ones.

M

From: Thiessen, Matt [mailto:mthies...@gprc.ab.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 3:17 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Send on Behalf error

Hello,

I have run into and interesting problem when using outlook 2010 with exchange 
2003. The user has permission to send on behalf of their boss. When they go 
into the from field and look up their boss the email gets sent fine. When they 
select the same from email address using the dropdown where it remembers the 
name the message does not go through. They get a NDR with the following:

Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.

  Subject:test
  Sent: 5/24/2011 1:50 PM

The following recipient(s) cannot be reached:

  Lastname, Firstname on 5/24/2011 1:50 PM
You do not have permission to send to this recipient.  For 
assistance, contact your system administrator.
MSEXCH:MSExchangeIS:/DC=ca/DC=ab/DC=gprc:servername

I will mention as well that they are running in cache exchange mode on the 
client, it is happening to more than just 1 person as well. We are running in a 
mixed mode environment with users being migrated over to 2010.

Any ideas will be appreciated.

Thank you,

Matt Thiessen
IT Systems Manager
Grande Prairie Regional College
780-539-2852


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RE: Send on Behalf error

2011-06-02 Thread Kennedy, Jim
This sure sounds exactly like the issue you see when you delete someone, they 
get rehired and you recreate and auto-complete comes back and bites you. I 
would delete that name from the drop down box. Then manually do a send and then 
retry the new drop down.

From: Thiessen, Matt [mailto:mthies...@gprc.ab.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 6:17 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Send on Behalf error

Hello,

I have run into and interesting problem when using outlook 2010 with exchange 
2003. The user has permission to send on behalf of their boss. When they go 
into the from field and look up their boss the email gets sent fine. When they 
select the same from email address using the dropdown where it remembers the 
name the message does not go through. They get a NDR with the following:

Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.

  Subject:test
  Sent: 5/24/2011 1:50 PM

The following recipient(s) cannot be reached:

  Lastname, Firstname on 5/24/2011 1:50 PM
You do not have permission to send to this recipient.  For 
assistance, contact your system administrator.
MSEXCH:MSExchangeIS:/DC=ca/DC=ab/DC=gprc:servername

I will mention as well that they are running in cache exchange mode on the 
client, it is happening to more than just 1 person as well. We are running in a 
mixed mode environment with users being migrated over to 2010.

Any ideas will be appreciated.

Thank you,

Matt Thiessen
IT Systems Manager
Grande Prairie Regional College
780-539-2852


---
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RE: Send on Behalf error

2011-06-02 Thread Thiessen, Matt
Thanks for all the responses. I suppose it is possible that the mixed mode is 
causing problems. I would expect that if we had moved one and not the other. We 
tend to move people to the new server in batches, especially when they have 
permission to each other mailboxes. In this case both are still on exchange 
2003.

I have tried deleting the name out of outlooks quick complete dropdown at the 
from field. I don't think I have tried yet purging all the autocomplete data. 
Would doing that help? I believe that if the profile is deleted and recreated 
it works for a while before breaking again.

Thanks,
Matt

From: pramatow...@mediageneral.com [mailto:pramatow...@mediageneral.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 5:29 AM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

Yeah, I just don't remember if the autocomplete business helped or not.

...I can say without a doubt you will be much happier when you have finished. 
 --  QFT:)

Paul

From: Matt Moore [mailto:mattmoore...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 11:27 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

In my roundabout way I guess that was the main thrust of what I was saying.  
Get everyone on same side, shared mailboxes too.  We seem to have the most 
problems like that when there are 2 versions at play.

It does help a lot!

M

From: pramatow...@mediageneral.com [mailto:pramatow...@mediageneral.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 6:17 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

Apologize, because we don't have many send on behalf of's the migration was a 
while back and still have memories of a snakebite or two-
What happens if they
[1]delete the boss's name from autocomplete and send a message (which should 
work)
[2] with autocomplete repopulated, what happens?

Don't know if it would matter but are boss and send on behalf people all on the 
same V of Exchange? FWIW we moved groups like that to try and mitigate 
problems, I like to think it helped a little.

From: Matt Moore [mailto:mattmoore...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 6:53 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

That's pretty typical behavior during a migration.  I've run into that and an 
awful lot of others and they're all different.  My first response would be 
apologize up and down for the inconvenience and get that migration done as soon 
as possible.  Nothing causes friction like a migration, we've had a number of 
clients run into this same scenario and put the brakes on the migration 
temporarily, thinking the problem would follow into 2010.  All have felt the 
pinch of that decision.   Well, hind sight being 20/20 I can say without a 
doubt you will be much happier when you have finished.  I think our smoothest 
migration to date was for 80,000+ users all done in one weekend.  Sure there 
were a few issues but they were all taken care very quickly in comparison.
I guess that wasn't really how to fix it, sorry about that, more looking at the 
bigger picture.  Get it done then track down the problems when you don't have a 
basket of snakes, venomous ones.

M

From: Thiessen, Matt [mailto:mthies...@gprc.ab.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 3:17 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Send on Behalf error

Hello,

I have run into and interesting problem when using outlook 2010 with exchange 
2003. The user has permission to send on behalf of their boss. When they go 
into the from field and look up their boss the email gets sent fine. When they 
select the same from email address using the dropdown where it remembers the 
name the message does not go through. They get a NDR with the following:

Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.

  Subject:test
  Sent: 5/24/2011 1:50 PM

The following recipient(s) cannot be reached:

  Lastname, Firstname on 5/24/2011 1:50 PM
You do not have permission to send to this recipient.  For 
assistance, contact your system administrator.
MSEXCH:MSExchangeIS:/DC=ca/DC=ab/DC=gprc:servername

I will mention as well that they are running in cache exchange mode on the 
client, it is happening to more than just 1 person as well. We are running in a 
mixed mode environment with users being migrated over to 2010.

Any ideas will be appreciated.

Thank you,

Matt Thiessen
IT Systems Manager
Grande Prairie Regional College
780-539-2852


---
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RE: Send on Behalf error

2011-06-02 Thread PRamatowski
Don't think deleting other names would help.
Don't think cached mode would make a difference, seems the OAB address works 
it's just the dropdown...

What about the recipients? Any difference in sending to 2003 vs 2010 recipients?
/reaching

From: Thiessen, Matt [mailto:mthies...@gprc.ab.ca]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 10:18 AM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

Thanks for all the responses. I suppose it is possible that the mixed mode is 
causing problems. I would expect that if we had moved one and not the other. We 
tend to move people to the new server in batches, especially when they have 
permission to each other mailboxes. In this case both are still on exchange 
2003.

I have tried deleting the name out of outlooks quick complete dropdown at the 
from field. I don't think I have tried yet purging all the autocomplete data. 
Would doing that help? I believe that if the profile is deleted and recreated 
it works for a while before breaking again.

Thanks,
Matt

From: pramatow...@mediageneral.com [mailto:pramatow...@mediageneral.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 5:29 AM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

Yeah, I just don't remember if the autocomplete business helped or not.

...I can say without a doubt you will be much happier when you have finished. 
 --  QFT:)

Paul

From: Matt Moore [mailto:mattmoore...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 11:27 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

In my roundabout way I guess that was the main thrust of what I was saying.  
Get everyone on same side, shared mailboxes too.  We seem to have the most 
problems like that when there are 2 versions at play.

It does help a lot!

M

From: pramatow...@mediageneral.com [mailto:pramatow...@mediageneral.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 6:17 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

Apologize, because we don't have many send on behalf of's the migration was a 
while back and still have memories of a snakebite or two-
What happens if they
[1]delete the boss's name from autocomplete and send a message (which should 
work)
[2] with autocomplete repopulated, what happens?

Don't know if it would matter but are boss and send on behalf people all on the 
same V of Exchange? FWIW we moved groups like that to try and mitigate 
problems, I like to think it helped a little.

From: Matt Moore [mailto:mattmoore...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 6:53 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Send on Behalf error

That's pretty typical behavior during a migration.  I've run into that and an 
awful lot of others and they're all different.  My first response would be 
apologize up and down for the inconvenience and get that migration done as soon 
as possible.  Nothing causes friction like a migration, we've had a number of 
clients run into this same scenario and put the brakes on the migration 
temporarily, thinking the problem would follow into 2010.  All have felt the 
pinch of that decision.   Well, hind sight being 20/20 I can say without a 
doubt you will be much happier when you have finished.  I think our smoothest 
migration to date was for 80,000+ users all done in one weekend.  Sure there 
were a few issues but they were all taken care very quickly in comparison.
I guess that wasn't really how to fix it, sorry about that, more looking at the 
bigger picture.  Get it done then track down the problems when you don't have a 
basket of snakes, venomous ones.

M

From: Thiessen, Matt [mailto:mthies...@gprc.ab.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 3:17 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Send on Behalf error

Hello,

I have run into and interesting problem when using outlook 2010 with exchange 
2003. The user has permission to send on behalf of their boss. When they go 
into the from field and look up their boss the email gets sent fine. When they 
select the same from email address using the dropdown where it remembers the 
name the message does not go through. They get a NDR with the following:

Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.

  Subject:test
  Sent: 5/24/2011 1:50 PM

The following recipient(s) cannot be reached:

  Lastname, Firstname on 5/24/2011 1:50 PM
You do not have permission to send to this recipient.  For 
assistance, contact your system administrator.
MSEXCH:MSExchangeIS:/DC=ca/DC=ab/DC=gprc:servername

I will mention as well that they are running in cache exchange mode on the 
client, it is happening to more than just 1 person as well. We are running in a 
mixed mode environment with users being migrated over to 2010.

Any ideas will be appreciated.

Thank you,

Matt Thiessen
IT Systems Manager
Grande Prairie Regional College
780-539-2852

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Re: Securing Mobile Devices

2011-06-02 Thread messagel...@gmail.com
Zenprise is located in Fremont and I really liked the original team when I 
interviewed with them a few years ago.  Not sure of their newer products, but 
they did compete with one of my vendors for BB monitoring quite well when I was 
at Wells Fargo.

Kat Aylward


On Jun 2, 2011, at 8:18 AM, Martin Blackstone mblackst...@gmail.com wrote:

 There seems to be a quite a market for mobile device security growing these 
 days!
 
 I’m curious what you guys are looking at in the market. What applications how 
 you found that really float your boat.
 
 We are currently looking at a couple. MobileIron, Zenprise, etc. But have any 
 of you guys deployed one of these and what do you think about them?
 
 Discuss….
 
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Exchange mailstore size question

2011-06-02 Thread Todd Lemmiksoo
Is there another way to shrink the size of a mailstore other than taking it
off-line and esutil it?
I am in the process of decommission'g a server but not ready to delete the
mailstore that houses the System Attend mailbox. Getting pressure to return
the SAN storage. Need to reduce the size of the EDB file to move it to local
disk, all mailboxes have been moved off of the mailstore to another server.
Would creating a new storage group and moving the mailstore to it reduce the
actual size? Current size is 190 GB plus 89 GB for the STM.

-- 
T. Todd Lemmiksoo

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RE: Exchange mailstore size question

2011-06-02 Thread PRamatowski
Eseutil/d is amazingly quick on an empty store. Ymmv  but I recall times of 10 
minutes or less (15K drives, RAID 10) with similar DB files.
.
Rather than messing around with a SA mailbox, I'd vote for the Eseutil every 
time.
I don't think moving a mail store wouldn't make it smaller you'd have to move 
the mailbox to a different store.


From: Todd Lemmiksoo [mailto:tlemmik...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 12:20 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Exchange mailstore size question

Is there another way to shrink the size of a mailstore other than taking it 
off-line and esutil it?
I am in the process of decommission'g a server but not ready to delete the 
mailstore that houses the System Attend mailbox. Getting pressure to return the 
SAN storage. Need to reduce the size of the EDB file to move it to local disk, 
all mailboxes have been moved off of the mailstore to another server.
Would creating a new storage group and moving the mailstore to it reduce the 
actual size? Current size is 190 GB plus 89 GB for the STM.

--
T. Todd Lemmiksoo

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RE: how to hide things in OWA

2011-06-02 Thread Sharp, Kevin
If anyone else if looking for this option, it is located in Default Role 
Assignment Policy.  This will allow you to disable editing account information 
via OWA.  So some things for OWA are controlled there, others via the OWA 
segmentation option.

Kevin

From: Sharp, Kevin [mailto:kevin.sh...@usask.ca]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 12:01 AM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: how to hide things in OWA

I realize segmentation is the answer (should have mentioned that)I'm not 
clear which setting (if any) can hide the account editing piece.  City, 
Address, Phone number

Thanks

Kevin

From: Michael B. Smith [mailto:mich...@smithcons.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 5:32 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: how to hide things in OWA

OWA Segmentation.

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com

From: Sharp, Kevin [mailto:kevin.sh...@usask.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 7:26 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: how to hide things in OWA

If I wanted to hide the Account editing components in OWA 2010...what is the 
easiest way to do this?

Thanks

Kevin

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RE: how to hide things in OWA

2011-06-02 Thread Michael B. Smith
I apologize for leading you in the wrong direction! :(

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com

From: Sharp, Kevin [mailto:kevin.sh...@usask.ca]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 2:57 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: how to hide things in OWA

If anyone else if looking for this option, it is located in Default Role 
Assignment Policy.  This will allow you to disable editing account information 
via OWA.  So some things for OWA are controlled there, others via the OWA 
segmentation option.

Kevin

From: Sharp, Kevin [mailto:kevin.sh...@usask.ca]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 12:01 AM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: how to hide things in OWA

I realize segmentation is the answer (should have mentioned that)I'm not 
clear which setting (if any) can hide the account editing piece.  City, 
Address, Phone number

Thanks

Kevin

From: Michael B. Smith [mailto:mich...@smithcons.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 5:32 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: how to hide things in OWA

OWA Segmentation.

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com

From: Sharp, Kevin [mailto:kevin.sh...@usask.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 7:26 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: how to hide things in OWA

If I wanted to hide the Account editing components in OWA 2010...what is the 
easiest way to do this?

Thanks

Kevin

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Guyer, Don
A lot of companies do this.

 

No opinion either way, myself. Bigger fish to fry.

 

Don Guyer

Windows Systems Engineer

RIM Operations Engineering Distributed - A Team, Tier 2

Enterprise Technology Group

Fiserv

don.gu...@fiserv.com

Office: 1-800-523-7282 x 1673

Fax: 610-233-0404

www.fiserv.com http://www.fiserv.com/ 

 

From: Joseph L. Casale [mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:08 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Standardizing Signatures

 

So,

A new QA person has decided we need to standardize on sigs. I don't like
using a sig at all, some  people here have their own, etc.

Any opinions on this? My personal pref would be not to micro manage and
leave it alone, but...

 

jlc

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Joseph L. Casale
I suppose, it just becomes another thing I have to manage now.
I have to now setup a GPO to force removal of all existing sigs (and hear it 
from the users that have them), then worry about populating fields in AD so a 
transport rule can mine the data out, sigh...
It's a pita for me, not the QA person who thinks it matters, ffs... Bah.

From: Guyer, Don [mailto:don.gu...@fiserv.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 2:18 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

A lot of companies do this.

No opinion either way, myself. Bigger fish to fry.

Don Guyer
Windows Systems Engineer
RIM Operations Engineering Distributed - A Team, Tier 2
Enterprise Technology Group
Fiserv
don.gu...@fiserv.commailto:don.gu...@fiserv.com
Office: 1-800-523-7282 x 1673
Fax: 610-233-0404
www.fiserv.comhttp://www.fiserv.com/

From: Joseph L. Casale [mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:08 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Standardizing Signatures

So,
A new QA person has decided we need to standardize on sigs. I don't like using 
a sig at all, some  people here have their own, etc.
Any opinions on this? My personal pref would be not to micro manage and leave 
it alone, but...

jlc

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Steve Hart
We've had that same nightmare and I lost the battle.

Ugh.


Steve Hart
Network Administrator
503.491.4343 -Direct | 503.492.8160 - Fax

From: Joseph L. Casale [mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 1:08 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Standardizing Signatures

So,
A new QA person has decided we need to standardize on sigs. I don't like using 
a sig at all, some  people here have their own, etc.
Any opinions on this? My personal pref would be not to micro manage and leave 
it alone, but...

jlc

---
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Re: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Steven Peck
Our company created a document with some rules and templates.
They then created some instructions on an internal website and and emailed
the instructions and links to everyone.  It is now a managment problem.

The links are on the 'employee resource' site for future reference.

On Thu, Jun 2, 2011 at 1:31 PM, Steve Hart sh...@wrightbg.com wrote:

  We’ve had that same nightmare and I lost the battle.



 Ugh.





 *Steve Hart***

 Network Administrator

 503.491.4343 -Direct | 503.492.8160 - Fax
   --

 *From:* Joseph L. Casale [mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com]
 *Sent:* Thursday, June 02, 2011 1:08 PM
 *To:* MS-Exchange Admin Issues
 *Subject:* Standardizing Signatures



 So,

 A new QA person has decided we need to standardize on sigs. I don’t like
 using a sig at all, some  people here have their own, etc.

 Any opinions on this? My personal pref would be not to micro manage and
 leave it alone, but…



 jlc

 ---
 To manage subscriptions click here:
 http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
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 with the body: unsubscribe exchangelist

 ---
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Re: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread John Cook
Our powers that be came up with this kind of plan even going so far as to 
designate a font. Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people 
have. I've decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain 
non compliant.
John W. Cook
Systems Administrator
Partnership for Strong Families


From: Steven Peck sep...@gmail.com
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:14:24 2011
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

Our company created a document with some rules and templates.
They then created some instructions on an internal website and and emailed the 
instructions and links to everyone.  It is now a managment problem.

The links are on the 'employee resource' site for future reference.

On Thu, Jun 2, 2011 at 1:31 PM, Steve Hart 
sh...@wrightbg.commailto:sh...@wrightbg.com wrote:
We’ve had that same nightmare and I lost the battle.

Ugh.


Steve Hart
Network Administrator
503.491.4343tel:503.491.4343 -Direct | 503.492.8160tel:503.492.8160 - Fax

From: Joseph L. Casale 
[mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.commailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 1:08 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Standardizing Signatures

So,
A new QA person has decided we need to standardize on sigs. I don’t like using 
a sig at all, some  people here have their own, etc.
Any opinions on this? My personal pref would be not to micro manage and leave 
it alone, but…

jlc

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Joseph L. Casale
 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant. 

That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.
What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread David Lum
+1
BTDT. Changed my sig to conform. Pick yer battles.

David Lum
Systems Engineer // NWEATM
Office 503.548.5229 // Mobile 503.267.9764

From: Guyer, Don [mailto:don.gu...@fiserv.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 1:18 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

A lot of companies do this.

No opinion either way, myself. Bigger fish to fry.

Don Guyer
Windows Systems Engineer
RIM Operations Engineering Distributed - A Team, Tier 2
Enterprise Technology Group
Fiserv
don.gu...@fiserv.com
Office: 1-800-523-7282 x 1673
Fax: 610-233-0404
www.fiserv.comhttp://www.fiserv.com/

From: Joseph L. Casale [mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:08 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Standardizing Signatures

So,
A new QA person has decided we need to standardize on sigs. I don't like using 
a sig at all, some  people here have their own, etc.
Any opinions on this? My personal pref would be not to micro manage and leave 
it alone, but...

jlc

---
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Re: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread John Cook
You nailed it. These are the same PR people that wanted us to introduce a Mac 
into our environment because a Windows computer wasn't capable of doing the 
work. Needless to say there are still no Macs on my network.
John W. Cook
Systems Administrator
Partnership for Strong Families

- Original Message -
From: Joseph L. Casale jcas...@activenetwerx.com
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:37:12 2011
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant.

That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.
What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...

---
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CONFIDENTIALITY STATEMENT: The information transmitted, or contained or 
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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Campbell, Rob
There's nothing so screwed up it can't be made worse by Marketing getting 
involved.

-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:58 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

You nailed it. These are the same PR people that wanted us to introduce a Mac 
into our environment because a Windows computer wasn't capable of doing the 
work. Needless to say there are still no Macs on my network.
John W. Cook
Systems Administrator
Partnership for Strong Families

- Original Message -
From: Joseph L. Casale jcas...@activenetwerx.com
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:37:12 2011
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant.

That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.
What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...

---
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Re: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Rankin, James R
Our marketing have decided that every email must go out in 14 point Arial for 
the visually impaired. For someone long-sighted, this is hell.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Campbell, Rob rob_campb...@centraltechnology.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:01:19 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

There's nothing so screwed up it can't be made worse by Marketing getting 
involved.

-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:58 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

You nailed it. These are the same PR people that wanted us to introduce a Mac 
into our environment because a Windows computer wasn't capable of doing the 
work. Needless to say there are still no Macs on my network.
John W. Cook
Systems Administrator
Partnership for Strong Families

- Original Message -
From: Joseph L. Casale jcas...@activenetwerx.com
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:37:12 2011
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant.

That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.
What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Michael B. Smith
What?

Are you serious?

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com


-Original Message-
From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 6:15 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

Our marketing have decided that every email must go out in 14 point Arial for 
the visually impaired. For someone long-sighted, this is hell.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Campbell, Rob rob_campb...@centraltechnology.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:01:19 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

There's nothing so screwed up it can't be made worse by Marketing getting 
involved.

-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:58 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

You nailed it. These are the same PR people that wanted us to introduce a Mac 
into our environment because a Windows computer wasn't capable of doing the 
work. Needless to say there are still no Macs on my network.
John W. Cook
Systems Administrator
Partnership for Strong Families

- Original Message -
From: Joseph L. Casale jcas...@activenetwerx.com
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:37:12 2011
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant.

That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.
What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Greg Olson
No way!

That’s quite funny!



-Original Message-
From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 3:15 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures



Our marketing have decided that every email must go out in 14 point Arial for 
the visually impaired. For someone long-sighted, this is hell.



Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device



-Original Message-

From: Campbell, Rob rob_campb...@centraltechnology.net

Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:01:19

To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com

Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures



There's nothing so screwed up it can't be made worse by Marketing getting 
involved.



-Original Message-

From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org]

Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:58 PM

To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues

Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures



You nailed it. These are the same PR people that wanted us to introduce a Mac 
into our environment because a Windows computer wasn't capable of doing the 
work. Needless to say there are still no Macs on my network.

John W. Cook

Systems Administrator

Partnership for Strong Families



- Original Message -

From: Joseph L. Casale jcas...@activenetwerx.com

To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com

Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:37:12 2011

Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures



 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant.



That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.

What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...



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listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.commailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com

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CONFIDENTIALITY STATEMENT: The information transmitted, or contained or 
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(HIPAA), and other Federal and Florida laws. Improper or unauthorized use or 
disclosure of this information could result in civil and/or criminal penalties.

Consider the environment. Please don't print this e-mail unless you really need 
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Re: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Rankin, James R
I wish I wasn't. Can't believe the head of IT went for it.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Michael B. Smith mich...@smithcons.com
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:16:25 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

What?

Are you serious?

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com


-Original Message-
From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 6:15 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

Our marketing have decided that every email must go out in 14 point Arial for 
the visually impaired. For someone long-sighted, this is hell.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Campbell, Rob rob_campb...@centraltechnology.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:01:19 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

There's nothing so screwed up it can't be made worse by Marketing getting 
involved.

-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:58 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

You nailed it. These are the same PR people that wanted us to introduce a Mac 
into our environment because a Windows computer wasn't capable of doing the 
work. Needless to say there are still no Macs on my network.
John W. Cook
Systems Administrator
Partnership for Strong Families

- Original Message -
From: Joseph L. Casale jcas...@activenetwerx.com
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:37:12 2011
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant.

That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.
What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Don Andrews
We sort of had the same solution here, thank god.

From: Steven Peck [mailto:sep...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 2:14 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

Our company created a document with some rules and templates.
They then created some instructions on an internal website and and emailed the 
instructions and links to everyone.  It is now a managment problem.

The links are on the 'employee resource' site for future reference.
On Thu, Jun 2, 2011 at 1:31 PM, Steve Hart 
sh...@wrightbg.commailto:sh...@wrightbg.com wrote:
We've had that same nightmare and I lost the battle.

Ugh.


Steve Hart
Network Administrator
503.491.4343tel:503.491.4343 -Direct | 503.492.8160tel:503.492.8160 - Fax

From: Joseph L. Casale 
[mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.commailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 1:08 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Standardizing Signatures

So,
A new QA person has decided we need to standardize on sigs. I don't like using 
a sig at all, some  people here have their own, etc.
Any opinions on this? My personal pref would be not to micro manage and leave 
it alone, but...

jlc

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Steve Hart
That's how we solved it too.

Of course, we still have a font that is non-standard and color options that 
aren't available on all the versions of Outlook we run. Throw in text formatted 
emails and general user cluelessness...

This issue actually accounts for over half the support calls we get in the 
User training classification.


Steve Hart
Network Administrator
503.491.4343 -Direct | 503.492.8160 - Fax

From: Don Andrews [mailto:don.andr...@safeway.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 3:37 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

We sort of had the same solution here, thank god.

From: Steven Peck [mailto:sep...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 2:14 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

Our company created a document with some rules and templates.
They then created some instructions on an internal website and and emailed the 
instructions and links to everyone.  It is now a managment problem.

The links are on the 'employee resource' site for future reference.
On Thu, Jun 2, 2011 at 1:31 PM, Steve Hart 
sh...@wrightbg.commailto:sh...@wrightbg.com wrote:
We've had that same nightmare and I lost the battle.

Ugh.


Steve Hart
Network Administrator
503.491.4343tel:503.491.4343 -Direct | 503.492.8160tel:503.492.8160 - Fax

From: Joseph L. Casale 
[mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.commailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 1:08 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Standardizing Signatures

So,
A new QA person has decided we need to standardize on sigs. I don't like using 
a sig at all, some  people here have their own, etc.
Any opinions on this? My personal pref would be not to micro manage and leave 
it alone, but...

jlc

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RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Don Andrews
This whole conversation is hilarious - am gonna file in my PHB folder.

-Original Message-
From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 3:33 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

I wish I wasn't. Can't believe the head of IT went for it.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Michael B. Smith mich...@smithcons.com
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:16:25 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

What?

Are you serious?

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com


-Original Message-
From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 6:15 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

Our marketing have decided that every email must go out in 14 point Arial for 
the visually impaired. For someone long-sighted, this is hell.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Campbell, Rob rob_campb...@centraltechnology.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:01:19 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

There's nothing so screwed up it can't be made worse by Marketing getting 
involved.

-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:58 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

You nailed it. These are the same PR people that wanted us to introduce a Mac 
into our environment because a Windows computer wasn't capable of doing the 
work. Needless to say there are still no Macs on my network.
John W. Cook
Systems Administrator
Partnership for Strong Families

- Original Message -
From: Joseph L. Casale jcas...@activenetwerx.com
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:37:12 2011
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant.

That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.
What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...

---
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Re: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Rankin, James R
It gets better. We are still piloting our XenApp 6 farm - but we can't load 
test it, because we aren't allowed downtime on it, because the first set of 
users migrated on to it were our VIPs.

Our head of IT should be shot, to be fair.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Don Andrews don.andr...@safeway.com
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 16:47:03 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

This whole conversation is hilarious - am gonna file in my PHB folder.

-Original Message-
From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 3:33 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

I wish I wasn't. Can't believe the head of IT went for it.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Michael B. Smith mich...@smithcons.com
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:16:25 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

What?

Are you serious?

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com


-Original Message-
From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 6:15 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

Our marketing have decided that every email must go out in 14 point Arial for 
the visually impaired. For someone long-sighted, this is hell.

Typed frustratingly slowly on my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Campbell, Rob rob_campb...@centraltechnology.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 22:01:19 
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issuesexchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Reply-To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues 
exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.comSubject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

There's nothing so screwed up it can't be made worse by Marketing getting 
involved.

-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:58 PM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures

You nailed it. These are the same PR people that wanted us to introduce a Mac 
into our environment because a Windows computer wasn't capable of doing the 
work. Needless to say there are still no Macs on my network.
John W. Cook
Systems Administrator
Partnership for Strong Families

- Original Message -
From: Joseph L. Casale jcas...@activenetwerx.com
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues exchangelist@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
Sent: Thu Jun 02 17:37:12 2011
Subject: RE: Standardizing Signatures

 Problem is it's a non standard font that only our PR people have. I've 
 decided it's not my place to show them their ignorance and I remain non 
 compliant.

That's just fscking priceless. Smart enough to mandate a standard, but not 
smart enough to mandate one that’s technically possibly.
What would be better is that font needing a $2000.00 copy of Adobe CS to 
legally be enforced, rotflmao...

---
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which it is addressed and may contain Protected Health Information (PHI), 
confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, transmission, 
dissemination, or other use of, and taking any action in reliance upon this 
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 Consider the environment. Please don't print this e-mail unless you really 
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have received this communication in 

RE: Standardizing Signatures

2011-06-02 Thread Webster
I am truly sorry boss but our Citrix consultant in TN said we could reboot the 
servers without effecting our connected users.  He said XA6 supported Session 
Portability.  D@mn Southerners and Aussies always getting the Brits in trouble!

http://www.brianmadden.com/blogs/brianmadden/archive/2008/03/31/wow-ts-session-to-vm-portability-from-aussie-startup-luflogix.aspx


Webster

 -Original Message-
 From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com]
 Subject: Re: Standardizing Signatures
 
 It gets better. We are still piloting our XenApp 6 farm - but we can't load
 test it, because we aren't allowed downtime on it, because the first set of
 users migrated on to it were our VIPs.


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RE: BES Express 5.03 and moving BES to Exchange 2010

2011-06-02 Thread Michael B. Smith
Follow the URL you quote and it all should be good to go.

Regards,

Michael B. Smith
Consultant and Exchange MVP
http://TheEssentialExchange.com

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 8:39 AM
To: MS-Exchange Admin Issues
Subject: BES Express 5.03 and moving BES to Exchange 2010

So I just came to look on the Blackberry website to see what I'd need to do to 
get our BES Express 5.0.2 MR1 box configured to work with a new Exchange 2010 
server (we're currently on 2003).

I see 5.0.3 is now out so I'm just downloading it.

A couple of questions I guess, firstly is anyone using 5.0.3 Express and is 
there any feedback on it?

Second, obviously when I setup our BES Express I followed the Blackberry 
tutorial videos to configure it with Exchange 2003.  Now we have an Exchange 
2010 box I'm assuming I simply run the command/processes listed for Exchange 
2010 here 
http://www.blackberry.com/btsc/search.do?cmd=displayKCdocType=kcexternalId=KB22601
 and I should be good to go?

Any feedback would be grand prior to diving in.

Thanks,
Paul

MIRA Ltd

Watling Street, Nuneaton, Warwickshire, CV10 0TU, England
Registered in England and Wales No. 402570
VAT Registration  GB 100 1464 84

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