Re: [expert] cron confusion - rant

2000-04-29 Thread Ron Johnson

Gavin Clark wrote:
> 
> >From: "Christopher Cox" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> 
> >> There's too much (un|poorly|obscurely) documented stuff in
> >> Unix/Linix.  THAT makes the transition from newbie to expert
> >> take longer than it should.  College students have the time
> >> to poke around in it 20 hours per day, but the rest of us have
> >> day jobs & kids...
> >> 
> > 
> > I find it unbelievable that a computer user expects to know how to use 300+
> > programs by just walking up to a machine.
> > If this where a Windows or DOS
> > machine, would they really expect how to use all the programs on a store
> > shelves without cracking a manual.
> > 
> 
> You CAN do that with a Mac. If you need the maunal to figure it out it's a
> bad program.  But I think what he means is not that there is so much to
> learn but that there's no clear way to learn it. You don't even know that
> these tools are there, you discover them when someone on a mailing list
> says:
> 'try # fghd -fh'
> You have to learn just about everything slowly by stumbling across it. I'd
> compare it to playing 'Myst' or learning how to drive by studying the
> engineer's notes.

You understood exactly.  I'm a VMS programmer, *NO* OS
has more documentation (except _maybe_ IBM's MVS).  The
phrase "The Big (Blue|Orange|Grey) Wall" (color depends
on major version number) acurately describes the VMS doc 
set.  Fortunately, there is a 2 volume index and descriptions
on the binders and well layed out contents.  Plus, the
online help mirrors the hard copy in orgnization.
Those huge license fees pay for *something* usefull...

> Now there's a lot of stuff to document and it's all decentralized so no one
> person or company can just write a manual that covers everything. We'll
> probly end up with a distributed documentation and tutorial system, a cross
> between a search engine, an faq-o-matic, and a hand holding help system like
> on a mac or windows.
> 
> luckily half the world's working on it.

It can't get here a minute too soon, IMO.

Ron
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Re: [expert] cron confusion - rant

2000-04-29 Thread Gavin Clark


>From: "Christopher Cox" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> 
>> There's too much (un|poorly|obscurely) documented stuff in
>> Unix/Linix.  THAT makes the transition from newbie to expert
>> take longer than it should.  College students have the time
>> to poke around in it 20 hours per day, but the rest of us have
>> day jobs & kids...
>> 
> 
> I find it unbelievable that a computer user expects to know how to use 300+
> programs by just walking up to a machine.
> If this where a Windows or DOS
> machine, would they really expect how to use all the programs on a store
> shelves without cracking a manual.
> 


You CAN do that with a Mac. If you need the maunal to figure it out it's a
bad program.  But I think what he means is not that there is so much to
learn but that there's no clear way to learn it. You don't even know that
these tools are there, you discover them when someone on a mailing list
says:
'try # fghd -fh'
You have to learn just about everything slowly by stumbling across it. I'd
compare it to playing 'Myst' or learning how to drive by studying the
engineer's notes.

Now there's a lot of stuff to document and it's all decentralized so no one
person or company can just write a manual that covers everything. We'll
probly end up with a distributed documentation and tutorial system, a cross
between a search engine, an faq-o-matic, and a hand holding help system like
on a mac or windows.

luckily half the world's working on it.

Gavin