Re: [expert] Western Digital drives and error correction (ECC)
On Saturday June 28 2003 10:20 pm, Brian Parish wrote: > I've seen a few recommendations for WD drives recently. Can > anyone say anything definitive about the error correction issue > that apparently applied to WD drives? There was a series of > threads on the Mandrake groups - probably a year back now - in > which some people including Civileme talked about WD drives > relying on W$ drivers to implement ECC and therefore being > subject to corruption when used with linux. > > If this has been fixed, or was a hideous slur on WD, or whatever, > it would be great to know. As it stands I am reluctant to use > them, but maybe I'm missing out on a great product. As I answered before, it's still an issue. For your own take search recent lkml archives. I've seen various posts about WD's lack of proper CRC checking in just the last week, even with the latest kernels. -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [expert] Western Digital drives and error correction (ECC)
On Tue, 2003-07-01 at 00:51, Albert Charron wrote: > I have 3 computers running Linux on WD HardDrives: 2 comps on 40gigs (1 > UDMA3 because the MB doesn't support above this and the other at UDMA5) > and 1 comp on 80gigs (UDMA5)without a problem. For now, they are the > only drives that I didn't go through problems... Got a lot of problems > with Maxtor and IBM HD... Don't know if I'm only lucky with WD or if > I'm not with the other :P > > Albert > > __ It may well be that this is no longer a problem, although anecdotal evidence as quoted earlier suggests that there are still "issues" with "some WD drives". This thread is also running in parallel on the Linux Users Victoria group. Chris Samuels posted as follows: - The nub of the matter is explained in this kernel-traffic posting from 2000 at: http://kt.zork.net/kernel-traffic/kt2214_54.html#2 to quote: # WDC drives blow off the CRC check of UDMA.This is BAD and STUPID. # Several of the OEM chipset makers have allowed this crap to exist. ATA-2 # (style) can not handle ATA-3/4 transfer rates without the CRC checks, you # end up continuing the DMA writing regardless if you lost data that would # have been saved if the UDMA CRC was intact. # # This is a pure hardware issueI do not know yet if there is a way to # check/recover with out death to DMAing for all WDC products. The best case # at the moment is to consider blocking all WDC products from using the ATA-3 # and newere standard. - Again though, this is old info and may no longer apply. In the absence of specific information to the contrary though, I will continue to avoid them, while recognizing that this could well be punishment for past sins. Brian Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [expert] Western Digital drives and error correction (ECC)
I have 3 computers running Linux on WD HardDrives: 2 comps on 40gigs (1 UDMA3 because the MB doesn't support above this and the other at UDMA5) and 1 comp on 80gigs (UDMA5)without a problem. For now, they are the only drives that I didn't go through problems... Got a lot of problems with Maxtor and IBM HD... Don't know if I'm only lucky with WD or if I'm not with the other :P Albert -Original Message- From: Brian Parish [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 11:20 PM To: expert Subject: [expert] Western Digital drives and error correction (ECC) I've seen a few recommendations for WD drives recently. Can anyone say anything definitive about the error correction issue that apparently applied to WD drives? There was a series of threads on the Mandrake groups - probably a year back now - in which some people including Civileme talked about WD drives relying on W$ drivers to implement ECC and therefore being subject to corruption when used with linux. If this has been fixed, or was a hideous slur on WD, or whatever, it would be great to know. As it stands I am reluctant to use them, but maybe I'm missing out on a great product. TIA Brian Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] Western Digital drives and error correction (ECC)
On Mon, 2003-06-30 at 07:45, Tom Brinkman wrote: > On Monday June 30 2003 04:37 am, James Sparenberg wrote: > > On Sat, 2003-06-28 at 20:20, Brian Parish wrote: > > > I've seen a few recommendations for WD drives recently. Can > > > anyone say anything definitive about the error correction issue > > > that apparently applied to WD drives? There was a series of > > > threads on the Mandrake groups - probably a year back now - in > > > which some people including Civileme talked about WD drives > > > relying on W$ drivers to implement ECC > > CRC (Cyclic Redundancy Check), not ECC > > > > and therefore being > > > subject to corruption when used with linux. > > > > > > If this has been fixed, or was a hideous slur on WD, or > > > whatever, it would be great to know. As it stands I am > > > reluctant to use them, but maybe I'm missing out on a great > > > product. > > > > > > TIA > > > Brian > > > > Not only is it not fixed... I personally feel it's gotten worse. > > I was forced to install during a recent install fest on a number > > of WD drives and to be honest not a one of them worked worth a > > dang. I could never get one to work reliably above UDMA2 (nor > > could winders, which is how we got them for free.) If all of > > those drives hadn't been donated I personally wouldn't have done > > anything but trash them. > > > > James > > Brian, better than taking anecdotal opinions from various > Mandrake lists (BTW, I believe James' opinion is valid), a better > source than even civileme is the lkml (linux-kernel ml). WD's still > continue to be reported as problem drives due to lack of proper CRC > checking. Used with Linux the usual kernel guru's advice is to > never use them above udma2 (ata/33), or disable udma altogether for > WD drives. This will not alleviate the data corruption problems > WD's inflict when placed on the same ide channel with certain other > brand drives tho. Tom, There is a reason why they are the cheap drives. I've not got hard evidence on this but indications that the Winders solution to the WD problem is to do the crc's in software rather than in firmware. Which to me means a greater CPU load and lowered performance IMHO. I believe Tom's Hardware has also done some benchmarking on Drives in the last year that might add data to the pile. James Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] Western Digital drives and error correction (ECC)
On Monday June 30 2003 04:37 am, James Sparenberg wrote: > On Sat, 2003-06-28 at 20:20, Brian Parish wrote: > > I've seen a few recommendations for WD drives recently. Can > > anyone say anything definitive about the error correction issue > > that apparently applied to WD drives? There was a series of > > threads on the Mandrake groups - probably a year back now - in > > which some people including Civileme talked about WD drives > > relying on W$ drivers to implement ECC CRC (Cyclic Redundancy Check), not ECC > > and therefore being > > subject to corruption when used with linux. > > > > If this has been fixed, or was a hideous slur on WD, or > > whatever, it would be great to know. As it stands I am > > reluctant to use them, but maybe I'm missing out on a great > > product. > > > > TIA > > Brian > > Not only is it not fixed... I personally feel it's gotten worse. > I was forced to install during a recent install fest on a number > of WD drives and to be honest not a one of them worked worth a > dang. I could never get one to work reliably above UDMA2 (nor > could winders, which is how we got them for free.) If all of > those drives hadn't been donated I personally wouldn't have done > anything but trash them. > > James Brian, better than taking anecdotal opinions from various Mandrake lists (BTW, I believe James' opinion is valid), a better source than even civileme is the lkml (linux-kernel ml). WD's still continue to be reported as problem drives due to lack of proper CRC checking. Used with Linux the usual kernel guru's advice is to never use them above udma2 (ata/33), or disable udma altogether for WD drives. This will not alleviate the data corruption problems WD's inflict when placed on the same ide channel with certain other brand drives tho. -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] Western Digital drives and error correction (ECC)
On Sat, 2003-06-28 at 20:20, Brian Parish wrote: > I've seen a few recommendations for WD drives recently. Can anyone say > anything definitive about the error correction issue that apparently > applied to WD drives? There was a series of threads on the Mandrake > groups - probably a year back now - in which some people including > Civileme talked about WD drives relying on W$ drivers to implement ECC > and therefore being subject to corruption when used with linux. > > If this has been fixed, or was a hideous slur on WD, or whatever, it > would be great to know. As it stands I am reluctant to use them, but > maybe I'm missing out on a great product. > > TIA > Brian Not only is it not fixed... I personally feel it's gotten worse. I was forced to install during a recent install fest on a number of WD drives and to be honest not a one of them worked worth a dang. I could never get one to work reliably above UDMA2 (nor could winders, which is how we got them for free.) If all of those drives hadn't been donated I personally wouldn't have done anything but trash them. James > > > > __ > Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? > Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
