Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
On Tue, Jan 21, 2003 at 08:30:30AM +0100, Martin Fahrendorf wrote: Content-Description: signed data Am Dienstag, 21. Januar 2003 02:58 schrieb bascule: i've been doing some reading with the intention of setting up a box to collect all my mail so that i can use imap to look at mail from any box and any os but i just thought of what for me could be a showstopper, i use the multiple identities feature of kmail a lot, mail is sorted into folders and identities associated, now maybe i could set up all my linux installs with kmailset up individualy but this seems to be missing the point, plus on win what? i have been assuming that fetchmail would be fetching mail from my isps, procmail would put it into mail folders on the server and some imap server would server them out to the lan, assuming i have this right is there a way to avoid find a client for each machine that supports the features of kmail and having to configure it seperately, is the only way to run kmail locally in an x session on the server and use vnc or something over the lan? bascule Forget K-Mail. It won't filter into imap folders. Go with either Mozilla Mail, or Evolution. Either one does an excelent job of filtering into imapp folders. I use this set up myself, so that I can always get to my mail, from any client, anywhere, and ALL my mail is there. I got tired of the POP thing a long time ago, when all my mail was on myh home desktop, and I was traveling with a laptop. IMAP is the way to go. Ric Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
Am Dienstag, 21. Januar 2003 14:37 schrieb Ric Tibbetts: On Tue, Jan 21, 2003 at 08:30:30AM +0100, Martin Fahrendorf wrote: Content-Description: signed data Am Dienstag, 21. Januar 2003 02:58 schrieb bascule: i've been doing some reading with the intention of setting up a box to collect all my mail so that i can use imap to look at mail from any box and any os but i just thought of what for me could be a showstopper, i use the multiple identities feature of kmail a lot, mail is sorted into folders and identities associated, now maybe i could set up all my linux installs with kmailset up individualy but this seems to be missing the point, plus on win what? i have been assuming that fetchmail would be fetching mail from my isps, procmail would put it into mail folders on the server and some imap server would server them out to the lan, assuming i have this right is there a way to avoid find a client for each machine that supports the features of kmail and having to configure it seperately, is the only way to run kmail locally in an x session on the server and use vnc or something over the lan? bascule Forget K-Mail. It won't filter into imap folders. Go with either Mozilla Mail, or Evolution. Either one does an excelent job of filtering into imapp folders. I use this set up myself, so that I can always get to my mail, from any client, anywhere, and ALL my mail is there. I got tired of the POP thing a long time ago, when all my mail was on myh home desktop, and I was traveling with a laptop. IMAP is the way to go. Ric To state it clear, it is not the job of a E-Mail client to filter something on a imap-server. You can contact with a lot of different clients an it is not a funny job to configure it always to the same filter. so use the filter, the imap server offers to you and your mail will be filtert regardles of the ability of your mailclient. So you can use sylpheed or mutt on a remote connection and mozilla, kmail or evolution on your local Unix connection and (for those who realy want) Outlook on a Windows system. Thas what IMAP is for. Martin PS: If your IMAP server doe not support filter, drop it and use either courier or cyrus. -- H E L I X Gesellschaft für Software Engineering mbH Hanauer Landstrasse 52 Telefon (069) 4789 35-30 60314 Frankfurt am Main Telefax (069) 4789 35-44 http://www.helix-gmbh.net[EMAIL PROTECTED] msg64720/pgp0.pgp Description: signature
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
Forget K-Mail. It won't filter into imap folders. Go with either Mozilla Mail, or Evolution. Either one does an excelent job of filtering into imapp folders. I use this set up myself, so that I can always get to my mail, from any client, anywhere, and ALL my mail is there. I got tired of the POP thing a long time ago, when all my mail was on myh home desktop, and I was traveling with a laptop. IMAP is the way to go. Ric To state it clear, it is not the job of a E-Mail client to filter something on a imap-server. You can contact with a lot of different clients an it is not a funny job to configure it always to the same filter. so use the filter, the imap server offers to you and your mail will be filtert regardles of the ability of your mailclient. So you can use sylpheed or mutt on a remote connection and mozilla, kmail or evolution on your local Unix connection and (for those who realy want) Outlook on a Windows system. Thas what IMAP is for. Martin PS: If your IMAP server doe not support filter, drop it and use either courier or cyrus. You can't possibly be suggesting to add filters directly into imap, for every user... If you had a system with 1000 users, and they had 20 filters each... That's hardly practical. That is why it *IS* the job of the client to do it's filtering. If it cannot do it properly, find a client that will, there are plenty out there. Alternativly, fetchmail will do the job, if you have the access to the server. But not everyone does. I do, but I run my own server. But for people getting their mail from their ISP, expecting imap on the server end to do your filtering is not reasonable. Ric Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
On Tue, January 21 2003 9:26 am, Tibbetts, Ric wrote: *snip* You can't possibly be suggesting to add filters directly into imap, for every user... If you had a system with 1000 users, and they had 20 filters each... That's hardly practical. That is why it *IS* the job of the client to do it's filtering. If it cannot do it properly, find a client that will, there are plenty out there. *snip* That's exactly what he is saying, and it is quite feasible. If your users want their mail filtered, they can set up their personal procmail settings in their own home directory, if they dont, then they dont have to. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---==--- Involvement with people is always a very delicate thing -- it requires real maturity to become involved and not get all messed up. -- Bernard Cooke Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
On Tue, Jan 21, 2003 at 09:44:52AM -0600, Chuck Burns wrote: On Tue, January 21 2003 9:26 am, Tibbetts, Ric wrote: *snip* You can't possibly be suggesting to add filters directly into imap, for every user... If you had a system with 1000 users, and they had 20 filters each... That's hardly practical. That is why it *IS* the job of the client to do it's filtering. If it cannot do it properly, find a client that will, there are plenty out there. *snip* That's exactly what he is saying, and it is quite feasible. If your users want their mail filtered, they can set up their personal procmail settings in their own home directory, if they dont, then they dont have to. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Agreed. They can. IF they have 1) the access, and 2) the ability. Not everyone does. If I were to use the e-Mail address from my ISP for example, I would not be able to do that. I do not have access. I'd have to set up fetch mail on my Linux box, and get the mail from them, and filter it locally. That would only work for one box. What if I had 3 or 4 different laptops that I might carry around. Plus, need to access my mail from nearly any i-net attached client. I'd need to depend on the client to do the filtering. And indeed, many do it right. Mozilla Mail, Netscape Mail, Evolution, etc. If they can't I don't use them. It's that simple. If someone want's me to use their e-Mail client, it needs to properly support IMAP filtering. All the rest is just techno-geek toys. I, and my users, just want to read our mail. I'm not going to go to excessive measures on the servers make that happen. IMAP does the job exceedingly well, and it serves to any client, be it Linux, Mac, or Windows. I can check my mail from any client, anywhere in the world. As long as it properly supports IMAP filtering. People like to diss Netscape. But what other client is out there that properly supports IMAP filtering and will run on ANY OS?!? All that other stuff is just more stuff to go wrong, and more stuff to maintain. A straight up, out of the box IMAP server will exactly what I need it to do, with minimum fuss, and muss. Isn't that how this stuff is supposed to work? Ric ---==--- Involvement with people is always a very delicate thing -- it requires real maturity to become involved and not get all messed up. -- Bernard Cooke Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
Am Dienstag, 21. Januar 2003 17:08 schrieb Ric Tibbetts: On Tue, Jan 21, 2003 at 09:44:52AM -0600, Chuck Burns wrote: On Tue, January 21 2003 9:26 am, Tibbetts, Ric wrote: *snip* You can't possibly be suggesting to add filters directly into imap, for every user... If you had a system with 1000 users, and they had 20 filters each... That's hardly practical. That is why it *IS* the job of the client to do it's filtering. If it cannot do it properly, find a client that will, there are plenty out there. *snip* That's exactly what he is saying, and it is quite feasible. If your users want their mail filtered, they can set up their personal procmail settings in their own home directory, if they dont, then they dont have to. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Agreed. They can. IF they have 1) the access, and 2) the ability. Not everyone does. If I were to use the e-Mail address from my ISP for example, I would not be able to do that. I do not have access. I'd have to set up fetch mail on my Linux box, and get the mail from them, and filter it locally. That would only work for one box. What if I had 3 or 4 different laptops that I might carry around. Plus, need to access my mail from nearly any i-net attached client. I'd need to depend on the client to do the filtering. And indeed, many do it right. Mozilla Mail, Netscape Mail, Evolution, etc. If they can't I don't use them. It's that simple. If someone want's me to use their e-Mail client, it needs to properly support IMAP filtering. All the rest is just techno-geek toys. I, and my users, just want to read our mail. I'm not going to go to excessive measures on the servers make that happen. IMAP does the job exceedingly well, and it serves to any client, be it Linux, Mac, or Windows. I can check my mail from any client, anywhere in the world. As long as it properly supports IMAP filtering. People like to diss Netscape. But what other client is out there that properly supports IMAP filtering and will run on ANY OS?!? All that other stuff is just more stuff to go wrong, and more stuff to maintain. A straight up, out of the box IMAP server will exactly what I need it to do, with minimum fuss, and muss. Isn't that how this stuff is supposed to work? Ric Hi Ric, think a little bit different. Naturally, you can and should be able to use the filter from your mozilla, netscape and others. But think of users who want to use their web-Mail frontend sometimes and don't want to have all the Mails for the mailinglists. Yes, of course, this is only usefull, if the user has acces to the filter (with procmail you have to get a real accout, with cyrus you can use sieve (build in) and with courier you can use the filter build in maildrop). The best is to get both. Martin ---==--- Involvement with people is always a very delicate thing -- it requires real maturity to become involved and not get all messed up. -- Bernard Cooke Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- H E L I X Gesellschaft für Software Engineering mbH Hanauer Landstrasse 52 Telefon (069) 4789 35-30 60314 Frankfurt am Main Telefax (069) 4789 35-44 http://www.helix-gmbh.net[EMAIL PROTECTED] msg64726/pgp0.pgp Description: signature
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
On Tue, Jan 21, 2003 at 05:44:38PM +0100, Martin Fahrendorf wrote: Content-Description: signed data Am Dienstag, 21. Januar 2003 17:08 schrieb Ric Tibbetts: On Tue, Jan 21, 2003 at 09:44:52AM -0600, Chuck Burns wrote: On Tue, January 21 2003 9:26 am, Tibbetts, Ric wrote: *snip* You can't possibly be suggesting to add filters directly into imap, for every user... If you had a system with 1000 users, and they had 20 filters each... That's hardly practical. That is why it *IS* the job of the client to do it's filtering. If it cannot do it properly, find a client that will, there are plenty out there. *snip* That's exactly what he is saying, and it is quite feasible. If your users want their mail filtered, they can set up their personal procmail settings in their own home directory, if they dont, then they dont have to. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Agreed. They can. IF they have 1) the access, and 2) the ability. Not everyone does. If I were to use the e-Mail address from my ISP for example, I would not be able to do that. I do not have access. I'd have to set up fetch mail on my Linux box, and get the mail from them, and filter it locally. That would only work for one box. What if I had 3 or 4 different laptops that I might carry around. Plus, need to access my mail from nearly any i-net attached client. I'd need to depend on the client to do the filtering. And indeed, many do it right. Mozilla Mail, Netscape Mail, Evolution, etc. If they can't I don't use them. It's that simple. If someone want's me to use their e-Mail client, it needs to properly support IMAP filtering. All the rest is just techno-geek toys. I, and my users, just want to read our mail. I'm not going to go to excessive measures on the servers make that happen. IMAP does the job exceedingly well, and it serves to any client, be it Linux, Mac, or Windows. I can check my mail from any client, anywhere in the world. As long as it properly supports IMAP filtering. People like to diss Netscape. But what other client is out there that properly supports IMAP filtering and will run on ANY OS?!? All that other stuff is just more stuff to go wrong, and more stuff to maintain. A straight up, out of the box IMAP server will exactly what I need it to do, with minimum fuss, and muss. Isn't that how this stuff is supposed to work? Ric Hi Ric, think a little bit different. Naturally, you can and should be able to use the filter from your mozilla, netscape and others. But think of users who want to use their web-Mail frontend sometimes and don't want to have all the Mails for the mailinglists. Yes, of course, this is only usefull, if the user has acces to the filter (with procmail you have to get a real accout, with cyrus you can use sieve (build in) and with courier you can use the filter build in maildrop). The best is to get both. Martin And thus brings us to the greatest strength of any *nix. There's always more than one way to get a job done. So you can taylor the solution to the requirement. ;) It's really up to the individual to know their requirement, and then find the solution that's right for them. Cheers Ric Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
hardware requirements for mail server, was: Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
well ric has it right:) what i want is to not lose the geek toy that kmail ( and one assumes, other clients) gives me which is mail identities and associating posting addresses with folders, as my original post indicated i'm aware of procmail and server filtering which, large setups aside, would be fine for myself, my daughter and a few boxes, my question was a shot in the dark really,wondering whether there was some way other than a remote session to avoid the individual client configuration so as to provide the 'geek-toys':) as i have never actually used imap and/or fetchmail with procmail and all the googling i did told me how to install them but little about what they 'couldn't do' i thought it worth asking. configuring only a few mail clients might not seem a big deal bit i won't have learnt anything new,plus there still remains the question of access from outside, vnc i think, here i come, which begs the question what is the minimum hardware to run a box that runs a vnc server and email client and precious little else? i'm hoping its not very much 'cos that's all i got! ideally i will be accessing from other machines - say, my mothers, over the net in which case i can install vnc on it, but of course i may have to install some web client for this if i want to get my mail from a mates box, features aside, what woud that do to hardware requirements? bascule On Tuesday 21 Jan 2003 5:12 pm, Ric Tibbetts wrote: All the rest is just techno-geek toys. I, and my users, just want to read our mail. I'm not going to go to excessive measures on the servers make that happen. IMAP does the job exceedingly well, and it serves to any client, be it Linux, Mac, or Windows. I can check my mail from any client, anywhere in the world. As long as it properly supports IMAP filtering. -- There are *no* inconsistencies in the Discworld books; ocassionally, however, there are alternate pasts. (alt.fan.pratchett) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
On Mon, January 20 2003 7:58 pm, bascule wrote: i've been doing some reading with the intention of setting up a box to *snipped stuff about multi accounts and imap* Set up your imap server, set up fetchmail to grab mail from ALL your accounts, voila! it's done. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---==--- Having a wonderful wine, wish you were beer. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
On Mon, January 20 2003 7:58 pm, bascule wrote: *snip* isps, procmail would put it into mail folders on the server and some imap server would server them out to the lan, assuming i have this right is there a way to avoid find a client for each machine that supports the features of kmail and having to configure it seperately, *snip* Also, if you want certain mails into certain folders, use procmail to deliver it to different mailboxes. The IMAP server reads your local ~/mbox files, and anything in your ~/mail folder (assuming its mbox format) I used to have one of my boxes doing that for me, and I had procmail filtering all my mailing lists into their respective folders. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---==--- There are three things men can do with women: love them, suffer for them, or turn them into literature. -- Stephen Stills Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
chuck, it's not about multiple accounts its about using multiple addresses depending on whom i'm writing to, for instance posts to mailing lists come from 'bascule [EMAIL PROTECTED]' mail to friends comes from ' somethingelse' but messages to both these addresses go to the same isp and are collected from the same account, kmail filters them into folders so that when i reply to you from my 'mandrake;expert' folder the correct 'from' address is filled in, i find this a very useful feature, i can set up something on the server to do the filtering i'm sure but i will still need to set each client up to associate the correct 'from' address to each folder ot acceses via imap, unless there is a solution i'm missing bascule On Tuesday 21 Jan 2003 2:07 am, Chuck Burns wrote: On Mon, January 20 2003 7:58 pm, bascule wrote: i've been doing some reading with the intention of setting up a box to *snipped stuff about multi accounts and imap* Set up your imap server, set up fetchmail to grab mail from ALL your accounts, voila! it's done. -- DROP THE SCYTHE, AND TURN AROUND SLOWLY. -- Dirty Death (Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
On Mon, January 20 2003 8:16 pm, bascule wrote: chuck, it's not about multiple accounts its about using multiple addresses depending on whom i'm writing to, for instance posts to mailing lists come from 'bascule [EMAIL PROTECTED]' mail to friends comes from ' somethingelse' but messages to both these addresses go to the same isp and are collected from the same account, kmail filters them into folders so that when i reply to you from my 'mandrake;expert' folder the correct 'from' address is filled in, i find this a very useful feature, i can set up something on the server to do the filtering i'm sure but i will still need to set each client up to associate the correct 'from' address to each folder ot acceses via imap, unless there is a solution i'm missing Read my other response. Since it was (to me anyone) two questions, I gave two answers. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---==--- Blessed are they who Go Around in Circles, for they Shall be Known as Wheels. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] imap server and kmail features
Am Dienstag, 21. Januar 2003 02:58 schrieb bascule: i've been doing some reading with the intention of setting up a box to collect all my mail so that i can use imap to look at mail from any box and any os but i just thought of what for me could be a showstopper, i use the multiple identities feature of kmail a lot, mail is sorted into folders and identities associated, now maybe i could set up all my linux installs with kmailset up individualy but this seems to be missing the point, plus on win what? i have been assuming that fetchmail would be fetching mail from my isps, procmail would put it into mail folders on the server and some imap server would server them out to the lan, assuming i have this right is there a way to avoid find a client for each machine that supports the features of kmail and having to configure it seperately, is the only way to run kmail locally in an x session on the server and use vnc or something over the lan? bascule Hi bascule, kmail is currently not able to filter into imap folders. so you have to filter in the imap or something else (postfix, sieve... depends on your imap server). the other thing: you either can use nfs to share your home-account over the network, so you only need the settings once, or you have to configure it on every host you use. But you can simply copy the neccessary files to all hosts you want to use. Martin -- H E L I X Gesellschaft für Software Engineering mbH Hanauer Landstrasse 52 Telefon (069) 4789 35-30 60314 Frankfurt am Main Telefax (069) 4789 35-44 http://www.helix-gmbh.net[EMAIL PROTECTED] msg64705/pgp0.pgp Description: signature
