[FairfieldLife] For Judy--from a lurker

[anonybliss_ff]

>From a lurker--I posted a while back (anonymously, for which I have my
reasons, whether Barry likes that or not--but that won't matter cause
he will never read this, nor think it has any value, which is neither
here not there) regarding the "feud" between you and Barry, expressing
that I thought you were both obsessed and also pointing out my
incredulity at the vitriol of some of Barry's expressed opinions.

A number of people besides me during that "feud" thread called Barry
on his behavior and actions. While he met the criticisms with bravado
and is defintiely still Barry, he also seems to have modified his
bahavior substantially. (I'm not positing a causal relationship
between forum members expressing their dissatisfaction with the feud
and his changing his behavior, but it's a pleasant correlation ;)--or
is that a pissant correlation? I get mixed up)

But Judy, like so many others who have commented recently, I think it
it is you who need learn something from this one. Most people here
like you, and when people who like you are telling you that your
behavior is out of line and needs to be examined, maybe it's time to
listen to them. Shemp's "statutue of limitations" comment pretty well
sums it up, I think.

I'm posting this because I had the lurking temerity to jump into the
other discussion and express my incredulity at some of Barry's
behavior and some sense of fair play, misguided or not, says I should
balance it out. The anonymous pissant lurker who couldn't let Barry
off the hook, can't let you off either. You appreciated my comments
about Barry, I hope you appreciate these too.

Having said that, I'm joining curtis in backing out the door 

What if you gave an argument and nobody came  

Disclaimers :)
Nobody put words in my mouth.
Nobody gave me a script.
I have never corresponded with Barry or anyone else on this forum
privately.










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[FairfieldLife] Speaking of stories .....

[anonybliss_ff]

Speaking of the power of stories and our willingness to believe them,
here's a hilarious video of a prison escapee convincing a cop he's
just out for a jog along the railroad tracks. It's about 8 minutes
long but worth watching to the end as the cop wishes him good luck and
let's him go.

You have to watch a 15 second ad to get access if you're not a member
of Salon.com but it's painless, kind of funny even.

http://www.salon.com/ent/video_dog/media/2006/04/10/escaped_murderer/index.html

Enjoy.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: The "Feud"--one lurker's view

[anonybliss_ff]

Wayback's point that people on the list don't really need you to
defend them is a good one though. Barry does his own damage to himself
through his extremism. 

"What if they gave a war and nobody came?"

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonybliss_ff  
> > wrote:
> > 
> > > Judy, you could just let him stew in his own juices. You don't 
> have
> > > to take it on. It must feel awful enough already to feel like he 
> > > does. By continuing to engage him you just absorb his stuff and 
> it 
> > > gives him an out from having to take responsibility for himself, 
> > > the opposite of what you say you want to achieve. IMO, better to 
> > > just be a (ok, relatively) silent mirror, then all it can do is 
> > > reflect back at him—his mind, his thoughts, his feelings, his 
> > > creation and he can take responsibility for it.
> > 
> > If some others would tell him what he needs to hear,
> > as you just did, I'd be happy to shut up.
> > 
> > Thanks for your comments.
> 
> One more quick point.  In case anyone is dubious
> that I'd keep quiet if others were calling Barry
> on his misbehavior: When we had that unpleasant
> episode awhile back of the forum being reclassified
> as adult because of a certain poster's complaint,
> I didn't comment on what the poster wrote, even though
> we had a history on alt.m.t as well, although not as
> long as I've had with Barry.  Others were saying
> what needed to be said to and about this poster,
> so I didn't feel I had to add anything.
> 
> (Ironically, my one comment on those exchanges was
> in response to a particularly vicious and hypocritical
> attack of Barry's on this poster.  Later on alt.m.t,
> Barry claimed I had been "vocal on FFL in condemning"
> the poster.  I mean, the up-is-downism is just
> extraordinary.)
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: The "Feud"--one lurker's view

[anonybliss_ff]

One lurker's view of "the feud":

It takes two to tango.

I suspect people are trying to persuade Judy to change because she is
more rational and seems more persuadable by logical argument—the logic
being that her strategy to get Barry to change obviously hasn't worked
and alienates others.

I don't know how much of "the feud" is personal between the two, or
how much Barry's behaviour could change if Judy changed first.

I admit to being amazed by the level of vitriol, venom, contempt and
bile that Barry carries and expresses towards Maharishi, TM, the TMO,
and those he identifies as being sympathetic to any aspect of those.
His expressions are often forceful, searing, and yes, as Judy says,
lies, although I see them more as simply delusional fantasies and
wishful thinking, albeit extremely negative. I don't understand how
Barry lives with that black seething morass of hatred and venom inside
that has him using so much time and energy posting in discussion
groups and fighting with Judy for as long as people say this has been
going on.

A few posts back Rick made a point about living in the now: Imagine
not even being able to go to a concert in a church in France and just
enjoy it without spending your concert time making up a dark fantasy
about how the history of that church is just like Maharishi oppressing
people and forcing TM down their throats and then coming on here and
writing about it. Talk about not living in the now—Just shuddup and
enjoy the music already! 

Barry is big on claiming personal doership and responsibility but
blames Maharishi, TM and the TMO for his own shitty behaviour, while
claiming great enlightenment and spiritual superiority from all the
techniques he's received and the great teachers he's studied with. I'd
like to know what spiritual teaching and tradition condones and has as
its result the harboring and expression of sheer negativity towards
all things MMY that Barry indulges in—so I can avoid those teachers
and paths, god willing and weather permitting.

Wisdom from an old western—"Think what you like, you have to live with
your thoughts." An addendum would be, "And spare the rest of us by
keeping it to your self, too."

Yeah, Judy is obsessive about this. So is Barry. 

Judy, you could just let him stew in his own juices. You don't have to
take it on. It must feel awful enough already to feel like he does. By
continuing to engage him you just absorb his stuff and it gives him an
out from having to take responsibility for himself, the opposite of
what you say you want to achieve. IMO, better to just be a (ok,
relatively) silent mirror, then all it can do is reflect back at
him—his mind, his thoughts, his feelings, his creation and he can take
responsibility for it.

Just one (ok temporarily former) lurker's 2 cents worth.


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "wayback71" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  
> wrote:

> > So why am I getting all the flak?
> 
> It's not fair, it's a good question, and I don't know.  You may be 
> righter and more honest than Barry, but  more than enough has been 
> said by me.
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: ' 40,000 Iranian Suicide bombers/ Sunday Times'

[anonybliss_ff]

Where have all the flowers gone, long time passing?

Gone to weapons of mass destruction as reported by US and British
media and "intelligence".

When will they ever learn?



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
>  Apr. 16, 2006 2:39 | Updated Apr. 16, 2006 11:02
> Report: Iran has readied suicide 'army'
> By JPOST STAFF, YAAKOV KATZ AND HERB KEINON
>   
> 
>   Talkbacks for this article: 21
>   Iran has readied an "army" of 40,000 suicide bombers to strike
targets all over the Western world and Israel as a response to a
possible attack on their nuclear facilities, the British Sunday Times
reported Sunday morning.  






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Fundies slam TM Judge

[anonybliss_ff]

Correction! 
No one is *compelled* to participate in "The Enlightened
Sentencing Program" developed ny Farrokh. It's an option made
available, and accepted by the *choice* of the participant after they
learn what the program entails. They take *responsibility* for their
*choice* and their own lives.

The stories of the participants--in their own words--which you can
find on the TESP web site can be quite moving.

The whole civil liberties question has already been dealt with on this
issue, I believe, even more so with the program no longer being
associated with the TM movement.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> While he's often right on, I think Jody (Guruphiliac) missed 
> the boat on this one. While the lawyer in question may be
> Christian, what he's saying in his lawsuit is *correct*:
> it's fuckin' inappropriate for *any* judge *anywhere* 
> to be able to compel *anyone* to practice *any* form of 
> meditation or spiritual practice for *any* reason. Period.
> 
> Maharishi never got this, IMO because he's a control 
> freak who *already* believes that he should be able to 
> run the lives of his teachers the way *he* feels they 
> should be run.  It's a short hop from believing that to
> believing that he has the right to mandate the lifestyle 
> of everyone else in society.  And he's on record as 
> believing that he *does* have that right, and that TM 
> *should* be mandated by governments.  
> 
> Talk about missing the point.  Personally, I don't see
> that much difference between Maharishi's stance on this
> subject and that of the Ayatollahs in Iran or Afghanistan 
> who wish to "enforce" Islam, or that of religious fanatics 
> in every society and in every time who have felt they had
> the right to impose their beliefs on others.
> 
> The real issue is freedom of choice with regard to one's
> spiritual or meditational practices.  In my opinion, anyone 
> who is willing to take that freedom away from someone, while 
> claiming it's "for their own good," is on the same level as
> the despot or dictator who would take away their physical 
> freedom.
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity  wrote:
> >
> > http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/4/112006e.asp
> > 
> > Jody (Guruphiliac) comments quite rightly:
> > 
> > That bulwark of spiritual ignorance impeding progress and cultural
> > evolution, the American Family Association, is going after the 
> judge
> > who sentenced a crack-smoking vote defrauder to a course in 
> TM™.
> > Actually, it's TMSM, or Transcendental Meditation Stress 
> Management,
> > and not affiliated with the Madharishi anymore.Leading the charge 
> for
> > the AFA is lawyer Brian Fahling:"You've got a governmental actor 
> who's
> > ordering an individual to participate in something that perhaps may
> > run contrary to their own particular beliefs and belief system."
> > Still, the attorney says he is not really surprised by the judge's
> > order because it is consistent with a larger trend toward
> > secularization that is progressing in America.Wait a minute... The
> > government is ordering an individual to participate in something 
> that
> > is being construed as a religious belief, yet the fact of this is
> > evidence of the progressing secularization of America?We guess the 
> guy
> > is as uptight about his idea of religion as he looks in his 
> photograph.
> > 
> http://www.agapepress.org/PhotoArchives/PhotoFiles/LoRes/BFahling_LoR
> es.jpg
> > 
> >  Who'da thunk that?What he means to say is that TM™ is the 
> wrong
> > religion. They all are... except his. There is no doubt the guy 
> would
> > be flipping cartwheels if the judge had sentenced the girl to 
> attend a
> > Southern Baptist church instead. It would have been much harsher
> > outcome for the poor thing if you asked us.
> > 
> > http://guruphiliac.blogspot.com/
> >
>





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Hoi, Rick Archer, Help me out on this

[anonybliss_ff]

There's a pretty funny account on craigslist by a guy who started a
correspondence with some nigerian email scammers. It gives a feel for
how they work

http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/lax/119838685.html

It's always amazing that people get taken in by these things.


> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ingegerd" 
>  wrote:
> >
> > Don't answer. I have received mails and telephone calls that I 
> have 
> > won in lotteries from abroad. The Police is warning about this 
> > stuff - the only thing they want is your bank account number - to 
> > tap the account.
> > Ingegerd
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have two clients that have been scammed on this.  I'm an estate-
> planner and I deal mostly with senior citizens.
> 
> One lost only about $3,000.00.
> 
> The other lost about $250,000.00.  I didn't want to go into detail 
> with them because I would have lost my cool and would have probably 
> ended up telling them what idiots they were and since I wanted their 
> business (which I eventually got) I kept my big mouth shut.
> 
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: FFL 12 Step Program's loudest and most obsessive posters?

[anonybliss_ff]

Thanks. I'm high on life, man. Actually, most of it came to as
thoughts during my program, even though I effortlessly kept going back
to the mantra (as effortlessly as a thought comes). So really it's
just the byproduct of a moderately large release of stress, probably
brought on by overload to the nervous system from too much lurking on
FFL, even though when I examined it in the light of common sense
outside of meditation it still seemed funny--which may go to show that
the technique does actually work.

Now where are *my* nose glasses.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> Great post. Thanks for a morning laugh. What were you smoking last
night?
> 
> 
> on 3/28/06 12:41 AM, anonybliss_ff at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

>







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[FairfieldLife] Re: FFL 12 Step Program's loudest and most obsessive posters?

[anonybliss_ff]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Actually it seems this is a list for ex-TMers in recovery...an ex-TM  
> 12-step group...it just happens those still burning a candle for TM  
> and the TM$P are the loudest and most obsessive posters.
>
Really? It seems to me the ones who post most here are the virulent
anti-TM/TMO/MMY posters coupled with those who feel compelled to spar
with them.

Barry reminds one of the story—don't know where it's from; maybe some
of you know it—about the village where there was a Shiva shrine in a
clearing in the forest nearby and the villagers would stop by every
day with prayers and offerings, all except this one guy who hated
Shiva and he'd still stop by every day but to kick and curse the
statue and who knows maybe even do other despicable things to it. And
he would do this rain or shine, early or late; no matter how tired he
was from working in the his fields, he always had time to kick that
statue. 

One year when the monsoons were particularly strong everything was
flooded and just mud, creeks and rivers overflowing their banks and
all the villagers just stayed in—except for this one guy who waded
through mud and water and snakes and whatever else to go and kick the
Shiva statue even when just the head remained out of the water.

One day, after the floods and the rain when the seasons were back to
normal Shiva appeared to the guy, who was to say the least very
surprised, and offered him whatever boon he wished. The guy was
shocked saying—What do you mean? I hate you. I come every day to kick
you and curse you.

And Shiva said—You are my most devoted follower. During the floods and
the rain the others deserted me and turned their backs on me, but you
were the most loyal, never missing a day.

It makes me think that one day maybe, before or after MMY's  passing,
who knows, Maheshvara himself might appear to Barry and praise him for
his one-pointed devotion of the past 25?? 30?? years, however long
it's been, and give him this great great boon, praising his
single-minded one pointedness and devotion of TMO bashing, Barry would
see that because of this deep love in his heart he really had *no
choice* except to worship except he *did* have a choice and that was
in how HE CHOSE to do it—and take that!-- as he gives one final kick
at the can so to speak, before realizing it is all just another
attachment and melting in a pool of bliss.

And then Judy as Shiva's supreme consort would join Maheshvara in an
oh-so-juicy embrace and they would dance the highly erotic
Transcendental Tango, moving on to the Jig Is Up Jig with the
soundtrack provided by the reunited Beatles—corporeal and
non-corporeal—singing Oh-Bla-Di-Oh-Bla-Da, dressed in psychedelic
raiment and wearing Groucho Marx funny nose glasses as the remnants of
Barry's finally disappearing I screams—You suck, and you never were
creative; it was all George Martin and Donovan is the only true
transcendental troubadour!

And then in the throws of passion Judy/Pavarti/Kali and Maheshvara
would reveal the great secret—that thousands of years ago they had an
affair which produced a child and the bloodline has been protected
down through the ages and that is the true meaning of the vedic
tradition, protection of the sacred blood line and today that
bloodline resides—where else?—but in RAJA Sparaig! The Raja of
Virility whose domain is the fornicating flesh of nubile nymphs eager
to experience ecstatic quantum coupling with a descendent of the divine.

And as the Brahman's two doctors mop up the melted pool of Barry's
individuality, Dan Brown writes a book about it all which becomes a
best seller, and a moovie. Then Vaj comes rushing in shouting—No, it's
all a fraud! What about the lineage? Barry cannot be enlightened!
before he takes twelve steps backwards and dies at the side of the
road into his own buddhahood.

And they all live happily-never-after!







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Fw: Muslim Jokes

[anonybliss_ff]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
>
> Goofed up the link try this one:
> 
> Furor Over Cartoons Pits Muslim Against Muslim
>
 tml?hp&ex=1140584400&en=e85120f56c914a0a&ei=5094&partner=homepage>
> 
> JohnY
>

That's a great article. Friedman's commentary today is spot on, too:
http://select.nytimes.com/2006/02/22/opinion/22friedman.html?hp

Empty Pockets, Angry Minds

I have no doubt that the Danish cartoons mocking the Prophet Muhammad
have caused real offense to many Muslims. I'm glad my newspaper didn't
publish them. But there is something in the worldwide Muslim reaction
to these cartoons that is excessive, and suggests that something else
is at work in this story. It's time we talked about it.

To understand this Danish affair, you can't just read Samuel
Huntington's classic, "The Clash of Civilizations." You also need to
read Karl Marx, because this explosion of Muslim rage is not just
about some Western insult. It's also about an Eastern failure. It is
about the failure of many Muslim countries to build economies that
prepare young people for modernity — and all the insult, humiliation
and frustration that has produced.

Today's world has become so wired together, so flattened, that you
can't avoid seeing just where you stand on the planet — just where the
caravan is and just how far ahead or behind you are. In this flat
world you get your humiliation fiber-optically, at 56K or via
broadband, whether you're in the Muslim suburbs of Paris or Kabul.
Today, Muslim youth are enraged by cartoons in Denmark. Earlier, it
was a Newsweek story about a desecrated Koran. Why? When you're
already feeling left behind, even the tiniest insult from afar goes to
the very core of your being — because your skin is so thin.

India is the second-largest Muslim country in the world, but the
cartoon protests here, unlike those in Pakistan, have been largely
peaceful. One reason for the difference is surely that Indian Muslims
are empowered and live in a flourishing democracy. India's richest man
is a Muslim software entrepreneur. But so many young Arabs and Muslims
live in nations that have deprived them of any chance to realize their
full potential.

The Middle East Media Research Institute, called Memri, just published
an analysis of the latest employment figures issued by the U.N.'s
International Labor Office. The I.L.O. study, Memri reported, found
that "the Middle East and North Africa stand out as the region with
the highest rate of unemployment in the world": 13.2 percent. That is
worse than in sub-Saharan Africa.

While G.D.P. in the Middle East-North Africa region registered an
annual increase of 5.5 percent from 1993 to 2003, productivity, the
measure of how efficiently these resources were used, increased by
only about 0.1 percent annually — better than only one region,
sub-Saharan Africa.

The Arab world is the only area in the world where productivity did
not increase with G.D.P. growth. That's because so much of the G.D.P.
growth in this region was driven by oil revenues, not by educating
workers to do new things with new technologies.

Nearly 60 percent of the Arab world is under the age of 25. With
limited job growth to absorb them, the I.L.O. estimates, the region is
spinning out about 500,000 more unemployed people each year. At a time
when India and China are focused on getting their children to be more
scientific, innovative thinkers, educational standards in much of the
Muslim world — particularly when it comes to science and critical
inquiry — are not keeping pace.

Pervez Hoodbhoy, a professor of nuclear physics at Quaid-i-Azam
University in Islamabad, Pakistan, bluntly wrote the following in
Global Agenda 2006, the journal of the recent Davos World Economic Forum:

"Pakistan's public (and all but a handful of private) universities are
intellectual rubble, their degrees of little consequence. ...
According to the Pakistan Council for Science and Technology,
Pakistanis have succeeded in registering only eight patents
internationally in 57 years. ...

"[Today] you seldom encounter a Muslim name in scientific journals.
Muslim contributions to pure and applied science — measured in terms
of discoveries, publications, patents and processes — are marginal.
... The harsh truth is that science and Islam parted ways many
centuries ago. In a nutshell, the Muslim experience consists of a
golden age of science from the ninth to the 14th centuries, subsequent
collapse, modest rebirth in the 19th century, and a profound reversal
from science and modernity, beginning in the last decades of the 20th
century. This reversal appears, if anything, to be gaining speed."

No wonder so many young people in this part of the world are
unprepared, and therefore easily enraged, as they encounter modernity.
And no wonder backward religious leaders and dictators in places like
Syria and Iran — who have mi

[FairfieldLife] Re: Cartoons

[anonybliss_ff]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> Flags ARE burned, crucifixes ARE immersed in urine, but no one offers
> an 11.5 million dollar reward for the beheading of the purpetraitor.
> (This happened today when an Indian gov't minister offered this reward
> for the beheading of a danish cartoonist.). But I guess that's just a
> cultural/religious difference, right? 
> 
> JohnY
>

Bingo! 

All else aside, have they no sense of irony? A cartoon depicts their
religion as violent, so in protest they bomb embassies and call for
the head of the cartoonist. 

Very bewildering, and upsetting. 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Papji Quote

[anonybliss_ff]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> "God is subject. When we make honest mistake, when we
> love God we think he is an object. He is the subject,
> you know? So you have to surrender to the subject. You
> are the object. Nobody can understand what I am
> speaking to you now. So you merge into the subject so
> that no object is left behind. Nobody is left."
> 
> 
> I was listening to this tape when I heard this and
> almost drove off the road. This is really intense
> stuff!

Subject driving into Subject? 

Can you elaborate why this passage was particularly special for you?

Its true language in a way, structures the way we "perceive" things --
it molds cognitive maps that influences our take on "experience" and
"knowledge". A rough corollary  to "knowledge is structered in
consciousness" -- language structures "understanding" at the groking
level. And english -- as many languages, can structure a false
relationship of subject and object.

But do you find that is an overwhelming structure? It appears to me
that the cognitive maps and structures created or influnced by
language, begin to bend and mold to the "reality" of spiritual
"infussions"

Thus, "I pray to God", subject to object, structures our initial
cognitive "takes" on and grokingess of God. But further experience
seems to reshape and overcome this faulty and leaky cognitive
structure. For example, in doing puja, Subject (here) is sublimely
enlivenend, and the same Subjectivenss is enlivened "there". In
offerings and final bowing and surrender its enlivened Subject merging
with enlivened Subjectness. Not subject bowing to object -- as
language initially sturctures the relationship.

(I use papji's term "Subject" here, though that is not a perfect word
for it implies "somebody". )

Same with yagyas, if you have attended them, and particulary if you
have been able to participate in the offerings. That same Subject is
enlivened, and the whole "out there" "glows" and breaths in that same
Subjectness. In each offering, Subject offers to Subject.

Another example occurred when I was in Thailand. In some museums there
are literally 1000's of Buddha statues. Many from monestaries. They
seem alive with "that same stuff" -- as puja and yagyas. After a
while, walking past one after another, and bowing slightly physically,
and completely internally, upon obtaining audience with each one, one
after another, hundreds after hundreds, it was all Subject bowing to
Subjectness.

In day to daylife, particuary in walks in nature, trees and flowers,
even the ground can be "alive" with Subjectness. 

In more inner life, when we want to "explore" God, where do we look?
Its into that Subjectness "stuff" we 'peer" and swim. Not in things.
(Though we may swim in the  Subjectness of things.)

I assume all of these things are what Maharishi refers to as
"Self-Referal" -- though I sense, and experience, that there are
several levels of meaning of the phrase. Just as there is for
"Knowledge is Structured in Consciousness."

I am sure these things are common experinces. Thus "God" as Subject
does not seem an extraordinary view -- its common in many scriptures,
and explicit in many types of experiences, such as above. So I am
trying to understand what you find extraordinary in this passage. Is
it "You are the object" in contrast to God as Subject? 

I read that as simply a recognition of "dual" nature -- we,
bodies/minds etc are "object" when "praying" to God=Subject, so its a
funny contrast -- object praying to Subject" but the experience is
Subject merging into Subject. Like puja. "So you merge into the
subject so that no object is left behind. Nobody is left."

What am I missing that you find extraordinary in this passage?






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