[FairfieldLife] Here and now, boys (was Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev)
TurquoiseB wrote: This is just one of Willy's common troll tactics. He's trying to get a few people to bite on it here and get into an argument with him about it. Well, Uncle Tantra, you could clear this up by simply posting the pamplet so we could see it. He's lonely. And then shut your pie hole and get some sleep. So, you admit that you once passed out leaflets promising enlightenment in 5-7 years. If, so you are an idiot, that's fer sure. Compared to you, everyone on the entire planet is enlightened. Enlightenment within five years was right on the brochures. And then, after five years, it changed to 5 to 7 years, and then, impossible without attending these additional courses we offer, and now... Well, now it seems to me that very few people *within* the TM movement assume that they will realize their enlightenment in this life *at all*. Those who seem to have realized the nature of what has always already been present for them have left the TM movement in the dust. And, if you think about it, that's kinda approp- riate. When you find that the organization that makes money by promising you enlightenment someday (always in the future) is doing so to make money from you Here And Now, you start looking in other places for the enlightenment, places in which it costs nothing. Like in every breath you take and every step you take. Like in the phrase that the inhabitants of Aldous Huxley's Island used to use as a greeting/reminder, Here and now, boys. If enlightenment can be likened to awakening from the dream of non-enlightenment, then perhaps the TMO can be excused for selling We can help you to wake up, but not just yet all these years. They're selling Just Another Dream of Non-Enlight- enment. Five years. Five to seven years. Thirty- five years. What's the difference, really? Waking up to the always-already-present nature of one's enlightenment is *always* Here And Now, and when that happens you realize that the whole *world* has been lying to you about how far away in time enlightenment is, not just the TMO and not just the salesmen who've been hitting you up for money to bring it closer. It's always been close; it's always been Here And Now. It still is. Five to seven years? Five to seven lifetimes? Right here, right now? Your call.
[FairfieldLife] Here and now, boys (was Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: Enlightenment within five years was right on the brochures. I have an audio tape from MMY at *Humbolt* stating.., (I just re-listened to it a few moments ago). Question:Maharishi, you say within 5 to 8 years one who practices TM regularly would become Cosmically Consciousness... Answer from MMY: That has been the experience of hundreds of people around the world...even though it's not principally right to allot some fixed time for Cosmic Consciousness. There you go, on tape, in this case a data cd I had mastered from a reel to reel left over from some defunct center! I was a little surprised he said that, but, here it is.
[FairfieldLife] Here and now, boys (was Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: Enlightenment within five years was right on the brochures. I have an audio tape from MMY at *Humbolt* stating.., (I just re-listened to it a few moments ago). Question:Maharishi, you say within 5 to 8 years one who practices TM regularly would become Cosmically Consciousness... Answer from MMY: That has been the experience of hundreds of people around the world...even though it's not principally right to allot some fixed time for Cosmic Consciousness. There you go, on tape, in this case a data cd I had mastered from a reel to reel left over from some defunct center! I was a little surprised he said that, but, here it is. It's a very good think Maharishi said there. If he would have told the truth, how many would have started and had good results ?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Here and now, boys (was Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev)
On Apr 4, 2007, at 12:49 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: This is just one of Willy's common troll tactics. He's trying to get a few people to bite on it here and get into an argument with him about it. He's lonely. I get the feeling he's kidding and most of his arguments are tongue-in-cheek. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Here and now, boys (was Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's a very good think Maharishi said there. If he would have told the truth, how many would have started and had good results ? I once heard Maharishi state that CC started as just a sense of wholeness By that definition, I believe most meditators are in the beginning stages of CC very early on in their practice. Perhaps it may take a while (years, lifetimes) for moments of witnessing to occur and finally full awareness during sleep. Maybe people are so intent on having a flashy experience, that they don't realize how evolved they are already?
[FairfieldLife] Here and now, boys (was Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev)
Perhaps it may take a while (years, lifetimes) for moments of witnessing to occur and finally full awareness during sleep. Maybe people are so intent on having a flashy experience, that they don't realize how evolved they are already? This is a cool point. Personally I never found sleep witnessing as a benefit. It was just weird. One of my pet theories is that the yoga literature is just describing the ordinary states of consciousness of modern man which was big news back in the day full of people whose exposure to knowledge and experiences was limited. In a fast paced culture you really have to be on your game. When you go to places where people just hang out for days on end you can find people living in dullness. I think developing awareness might be news for them. It is overkill for most of us. We have so much awareness that we usually piss most of it away. (oh that is just me? Damn!) The terms used for describing enlightenment are so vague that they seem useless in making distinctions. I see my Self in everything, everything I see is my own Self. OK, so you are having a good day, join the club. Now would you pleze turn down the Vedic chants on your i pod so I can get a little shut eye. (without witnessing thank you) --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, martyboi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 no_reply@ wrote: It's a very good think Maharishi said there. If he would have told the truth, how many would have started and had good results ? I once heard Maharishi state that CC started as just a sense of wholeness By that definition, I believe most meditators are in the beginning stages of CC very early on in their practice. Perhaps it may take a while (years, lifetimes) for moments of witnessing to occur and finally full awareness during sleep. Maybe people are so intent on having a flashy experience, that they don't realize how evolved they are already?
[FairfieldLife] Here and now, boys (was Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: And the Maharishi apparently never did promise anyone enlightenment in 5-7 years. I am not sure if promise is the word, but in Nov 1967 in Berkeley MMY talked specifically about how TM would result in CC in 5 years for students -- and even had a pamphlet to go along with it which had the 5 years in writing. The impression of many -- and most of my friends and peers at the time -- was that doing the program for five years faithfully would result in CC. It was a common assumption, a given, in those days. This is just one of Willy's common troll tactics. He's trying to get a few people to bite on it here and get into an argument with him about it. He's lonely. Enlightenment within five years was right on the brochures. And then, after five years, it changed to 5 to 7 years, and then, impossible without attending these additional courses we offer, and now... Well, now it seems to me that very few people *within* the TM movement assume that they will realize their enlightenment in this life *at all*. Those who seem to have realized the nature of what has always already been present for them have left the TM movement in the dust. And, if you think about it, that's kinda approp- riate. When you find that the organization that makes money by promising you enlightenment someday (always in the future) is doing so to make money from you Here And Now, you start looking in other places for the enlightenment, places in which it costs nothing. Like in every breath you take and every step you take. Like in the phrase that the inhabitants of Aldous Huxley's Island used to use as a greeting/reminder, Here and now, boys. If enlightenment can be likened to awakening from the dream of non-enlightenment, then perhaps the TMO can be excused for selling We can help you to wake up, but not just yet all these years. They're selling Just Another Dream of Non-Enlight- enment. Five years. Five to seven years. Thirty- five years. What's the difference, really? Waking up to the always-already-present nature of one's enlightenment is *always* Here And Now, and when that happens you realize that the whole *world* has been lying to you about how far away in time enlightenment is, not just the TMO and not just the salesmen who've been hitting you up for money to bring it closer. It's always been close; it's always been Here And Now. It still is. Five to seven years? Five to seven lifetimes? Right here, right now? Your call.
