Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: MAHARISHI’S TEACHINGS ON SEX
Around 1977-78 a lot of TM teachers in my area started reading Muktananda's books because he answers questions Maharishi won't. Some of that was on sex. Sex is a natural part of human existence. Celibacy is bullshit because the male excretes unused sperm in the urine. In ayurveda, excessively sex will make you more vata. It's a strong drive. If you're hungry thinking about sex can even trump hunger pangs. To enlightened people though it will just seem very animalistic or those damn hormones going off again. :-D Religion is nothing more than primitive mind countrol. Cheaper than the Pharaoh maintaining a lot of cops to keep the masses from revolting. Do as the Pharaoh says or you'll go to hell. They also learned that in times of famine it was wise to keep population numbers low. Thus the sin of sex was introduced. On 12/14/2012 05:02 AM, Alex Stanley wrote: Sex can be an immensely powerful object of egoic attachment, so it has come to be regarded as inherently a bad thing, with abstinence being regarded as a spiritually ideal good thing. My take on it is that the spiritual problems with sex lie in a person's relationship with sex and are not inherent qualities of sex. With a healthy relationship with sex, i.e, no attachment and no expectation of fulfillment, sex (or any other pleasurable duality) can be enjoyed in the present moment for what it is, with no unmet expectations and no craving for more. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, obbajeeba no_reply@... wrote: Haha, not referring to you, just wondered if you had thoughts to as why so many people follow someone as a Saint or Master if they are believed to be celibate. To this way of thinking, why does belief in celibacy in full adult age bring more wisdom? Maybe a misinterpretation to ancient scriptures? I like your post and it made me think. Some people think we should shy away from questioning such nonsense. I do not, because there are so many people getting harmed by believing the ultimate path is celibacy and/or their marriages are pretend monogamy and when power is placed in these hands, innocent people are taken advantage of and then blamed for being bad themselves, the one's who may speak up and out. The money machine drives a hard bargain when combined with spiritual creating attributes. It can deceive. It, being the money machine and greed. The greed, to get something for waving a magic wand in the face of another. When one contemplates what has happened, there is a fear of disgrace and that disgrace is held in place by wand wavers, inc., that protection for the purpose to continue the same shit over and over. Point being, there is no magic in knowledge. No mystery to be found by worshiping one's who share knowledge. It is very disgusting to use information (knowledge) for deception, to lure a temporary victim for one's loins. This makes a prostitute much more truthful about their actions. Yet, a prostitute is frowned upon, there is no deception in what and why sex is offered. I say people in spiritual positions who abuse this to their sexual advantage, are actually much worse than what the perception of a prostitute is. It is clever, but nonetheless the lowest of perversions. Sexual attraction is easy to attach with knowledge in young women's eyes. People feel that attraction is love and love to share with someone because they have magic secrets is just plain wrong. Maybe there is knowledge of ancient sorts scattered about a person from traditional lineage practices, but in no way is that worth sharing of the body in exchange for. Sex and religion do not mix. No matter what label religion is given. Young women, heed this warning. You are beautiful, you want a mate or two or three, haha, and that mate who shines the light in your eyes in the name of ancient wisdom, may just be holding a flashlight. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: I'm not intrigued by it - I just expected him to do it if he said he was doing it. From: obbajeeba no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2012 9:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: MAHARISHI’S TEACHINGS ON SEX  Why are many in cultures so intrigued by people being celibate to be a spiritual master, when they lack experience in feeling the birth of a child, the love of being a parent and its unconditional desire to continue to wish to help that child? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74 mjackson74@ wrote: For years I believed that Maharishi was a lifelong celibate because that is what I was taught. I was surprised, really amazed when I first heard a TM teacher say she had heard he was sexually active. I knew her pretty well and she insisted it was true. When I asked her how she knew she told me her sister and brother in
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: MAHARISHI’S TEACHINGS ON SEX
Read it and weep? The fact that other gurus from India (those who were true to their own teachings and didn't lie to their followers) would have looked down on Maha if they knew he was screwing in no way makes me weep nor change my mind. From: emptybill emptyb...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2012 11:37 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: MAHARISHI’S TEACHINGS ON SEX India has thousands of years of experience with both celibacy and human duplicity. If a male brahmacharin/samnyasin is alone in a room with a woman then they just had sex together. In India the samnyasin's say that a brahmacharin having sex is like eating your own vomit. This is how these gurus are judged by their peers in their own tradition and their own country. Read it and weep. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74 mjackson74@... wrote: For years I believed that Maharishi was a lifelong celibate because that is what I was taught. I was surprised, really amazed when I first heard a TM teacher say she had heard he was sexually active. I knew her pretty well and she insisted it was true. When I asked her how she knew she told me her sister and brother in law, both TM teachers and Governors had assured her it was true. They had worked on national staff for some years and yet it was not first hand information. They had gotten it from a reliable source who had gotten it from the person who had it through direct experience. Third hand info was not too impressive at the time. I did run the information by another TM teacher who knew both myself and the person who told me and they didn’t believe it, nor could they believe that Susie had come to believe it. So the issue was a non-issue for me until I turned up here on FFL. A brief exchange with Rick made me feel there really might be something to the allegations so I looked further, reading everything I could from and about the women involved which made me about fifty percent convinced it was true. Even though I had come to believe Maharishi was not enlightened, and that he was extremely fond of making promises in exchange for cash, I still could not quite come to believe that he had lied about that very fundamental aspect of his lifestyle. What did convince me were the similar stories from the former skin boys like Mark Landau and Billy Clayton that I came across on the internet, especially the recent BATGAP video interview with Mark Landau. Now that got me to thinking why would M preach celibacy to everyone else if he was not practicing it himself. And I came up with a couple conclusions. First, it was not cool in those days to be a guru and be sexually active, or perhaps more to the point it wasn’t cool to be a guru, be sexually active and have people in general know that was the case. M had to maintain the facade that he was celibate to keep people coming to him believing he was a spiritual master. Being a spiritual master and fucking just didn’t go together in those days. This became particularly important when he announced he wanted TM teachers to dress and behave conservatively so TM would appeal to the “responsible members of society� meaning older, financially established people who could and would support M financially. If they had known he was dipping the wick they would never have supported him. In addition I believe he wanted to cut down on the competition. From the stories his personal secretaries have told, he would often select women from amongst those on teacher training courses or his staff †if they were being sexually active, they would be leery of cheating on their spouses or boyfriends and celibacy certainly would lead the ladies to be already horny, thus making it easier for him to get in their pants.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: MAHARISHI’S TEACHINGS ON SEX
Also not on topic, a friend recently made a remark (now you must understand this guy is a staunch Republican, one of the few I have ever met who proudly reminds everyone he voted for Nixon and he is also pretty cynical) anyway he said that Jews are the smartest people in the world because they know you can never be quite sure who the daddy is, so they count Jewish lineage to be passed down through the maternal line. It would go great on a bumper sticker, but the Anti-Defamation League would be all over it. From: Alex Stanley j_alexander_stan...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2012 7:52 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: MAHARISHI’S TEACHINGS ON SEX Not exactly on-topic, but one of my fave MMY stories is when someone asked him to talk about relationships. He laughed heartily and said one sentence: There are mothers, and there are sons. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74 mjackson74@... wrote: For years I believed that Maharishi was a lifelong celibate because that is what I was taught. I was surprised, really amazed when I first heard a TM teacher say she had heard he was sexually active. I knew her pretty well and she insisted it was true. When I asked her how she knew she told me her sister and brother in law, both TM teachers and Governors had assured her it was true. They had worked on national staff for some years and yet it was not first hand information. They had gotten it from a reliable source who had gotten it from the person who had it through direct experience. Third hand info was not too impressive at the time. I did run the information by another TM teacher who knew both myself and the person who told me and they didn’t believe it, nor could they believe that Susie had come to believe it. So the issue was a non-issue for me until I turned up here on FFL. A brief exchange with Rick made me feel there really might be something to the allegations so I looked further, reading everything I could from and about the women involved which made me about fifty percent convinced it was true. Even though I had come to believe Maharishi was not enlightened, and that he was extremely fond of making promises in exchange for cash, I still could not quite come to believe that he had lied about that very fundamental aspect of his lifestyle. What did convince me were the similar stories from the former skin boys like Mark Landau and Billy Clayton that I came across on the internet, especially the recent BATGAP video interview with Mark Landau. Now that got me to thinking why would M preach celibacy to everyone else if he was not practicing it himself. And I came up with a couple conclusions. First, it was not cool in those days to be a guru and be sexually active, or perhaps more to the point it wasn’t cool to be a guru, be sexually active and have people in general know that was the case. M had to maintain the facade that he was celibate to keep people coming to him believing he was a spiritual master. Being a spiritual master and fucking just didn’t go together in those days. This became particularly important when he announced he wanted TM teachers to dress and behave conservatively so TM would appeal to the “responsible members of society� meaning older, financially established people who could and would support M financially. If they had known he was dipping the wick they would never have supported him. In addition I believe he wanted to cut down on the competition. From the stories his personal secretaries have told, he would often select women from amongst those on teacher training courses or his staff †if they were being sexually active, they would be leery of cheating on their spouses or boyfriends and celibacy certainly would lead the ladies to be already horny, thus making it easier for him to get in their pants.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: MAHARISHI’S TEACHINGS ON SEX
I'm not intrigued by it - I just expected him to do it if he said he was doing it. From: obbajeeba no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2012 9:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: MAHARISHI’S TEACHINGS ON SEX Why are many in cultures so intrigued by people being celibate to be a spiritual master, when they lack experience in feeling the birth of a child, the love of being a parent and its unconditional desire to continue to wish to help that child? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74 mjackson74@... wrote: For years I believed that Maharishi was a lifelong celibate because that is what I was taught. I was surprised, really amazed when I first heard a TM teacher say she had heard he was sexually active. I knew her pretty well and she insisted it was true. When I asked her how she knew she told me her sister and brother in law, both TM teachers and Governors had assured her it was true. They had worked on national staff for some years and yet it was not first hand information. They had gotten it from a reliable source who had gotten it from the person who had it through direct experience. Third hand info was not too impressive at the time. I did run the information by another TM teacher who knew both myself and the person who told me and they didn’t believe it, nor could they believe that Susie had come to believe it. So the issue was a non-issue for me until I turned up here on FFL. A brief exchange with Rick made me feel there really might be something to the allegations so I looked further, reading everything I could from and about the women involved which made me about fifty percent convinced it was true. Even though I had come to believe Maharishi was not enlightened, and that he was extremely fond of making promises in exchange for cash, I still could not quite come to believe that he had lied about that very fundamental aspect of his lifestyle. What did convince me were the similar stories from the former skin boys like Mark Landau and Billy Clayton that I came across on the internet, especially the recent BATGAP video interview with Mark Landau. Now that got me to thinking why would M preach celibacy to everyone else if he was not practicing it himself. And I came up with a couple conclusions. First, it was not cool in those days to be a guru and be sexually active, or perhaps more to the point it wasn’t cool to be a guru, be sexually active and have people in general know that was the case. M had to maintain the facade that he was celibate to keep people coming to him believing he was a spiritual master. Being a spiritual master and fucking just didn’t go together in those days. This became particularly important when he announced he wanted TM teachers to dress and behave conservatively so TM would appeal to the “responsible members of society� meaning older, financially established people who could and would support M financially. If they had known he was dipping the wick they would never have supported him. In addition I believe he wanted to cut down on the competition. From the stories his personal secretaries have told, he would often select women from amongst those on teacher training courses or his staff †if they were being sexually active, they would be leery of cheating on their spouses or boyfriends and celibacy certainly would lead the ladies to be already horny, thus making it easier for him to get in their pants.
