Re: [Round 3] Alternative wallpapers for Sulphuric Waves
I placed under alternate images on the wiki with a more gaseous view of Sulphuric Waves for your consideration. It needs work, just a thought for discussion. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/F9Themes/Waves :) John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
A Thought About F9 Artwork
All, IMO the F8 artwork presents Fedora very favorably and it seems a waste not to leverage this success in F9. Does it make sense to change the theme every other release cycle and use the off cycle to improve or tweak the current theme? Presenting the same question a differ way. Would Fedora users be disappointed if the F9 came with an improved F8 theme (ie. same theme, new wallpaper)? Cheers! John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora Art Spin Update (Nicu Buculei)
On Mon, 2007-10-08 at 12:00 -0400, Nicu wrote: Mirn Duffy wrote: Nothing too exciting... there's no custom artwork for it, and none of the extra content (brushes, clipart, etc) we'd discussed earlier. I wanted to follow Nicu's suggestion of just having SOMETHING to start with so I figured getting the apps together would be a good start. I found some interesting ones: Anything I'm forgetting? I have one question: what is *Art*? The spin will focus on graphics or on art in general (including audio and video tools)? If the later (as I expect), we should include at the minimum some applications as Audacity and Jokosher (better, ask people on Fedora-music-list / Audio Creation SIG for a list of applications). -- nicu :: http://nicubunu.ro :: http://nicubunu.blogspot.com Cool Fedora wallpapers: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro/wallpapers/ Open Clip Art Library: http://www.openclipart.org my Fedora stuff: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro Nicu, Just in case you have not seen this. http://linux.startcom.org/ It looks like a multimedia version of Red Hat. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
The process is confusing, the red tape frustrating.
It has been alluded to that in Diana's absence the Art Team would be tasked with crafting the default artwork for fedora 8. Nicu indicated in volume 15, issue 49 the fedora leadership supports this. http://lwn.net/Articles/237700/ However, Mo seems to disagree with her statements in volume 15, issue 53. I have been hesitant to start really driving this because I was hoping I could get you all a more firm answer on whether or not the artwork would definitely be considered as the default theme. Since I have not been able to do that, and we are quickly running out of time, here is the one thing I can promise you: I will definitely find a way to package and make easily installable at least some of the artwork we come up with if it isn't considered for the default artwork. Let's just focus on coming up with the best theme we can. So which way is it? If we are not working on the default why not use Gnome-Art, Gnome-Look, or KDE-Look for our submissions? John Baer wrote: More curious than anything else. If we are Ok with the creative commons license, http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/2.0/ , then what does #7 of the CLA need in order to be satisfied? I'm not a lawyer, but the CLA itself seems to suggest: you may submit it to the Project separately from any Contribution, identifying the complete details of its source and of any license or other restriction which would be pretty much what I was hoping you would be willing to do - identify the author and its license, Creative Commons or not. ~m As it turns out I'm not a lawyer either and I don't understand it. On Fri, 06 Jul 2007 Nicu Buculei wrote: Ugh, if those are random photos from flickr or such, remove them and replace with links? (I think we can't host even CC-BY-SA work in the wiki, thumbnails may be fair-use, but not full-size versions) Ouch, where did this come from? Yes, some of the source photo's came from flickr. Yes they are all licensed under the creative commons license. Yes I would give full credit to the author on any image moving forward. Yes, yes, yes. Why is this vast source of artistic material considered a bad thing? I find it frustrating working in an environment shadowed by legal fine print and constant legal warnings (ie. By hitting Save Changes you put your changes under the WikiLicense. If you don't want that, hit Cancel to cancel your changes). I have not run across this disclosure on any other wiki. Although I believe the desire is to create an open forum which fosters the flow creative ideas, this is not working. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: [F8 Theme Proposal] Fedora Feng Shui
John Baer wrote: Thanks for the comments. At this early stage I just wanted to see which style had the most appeal. Even thought this is the early stages, you still need to respect the licenses and the rights of the authors of any works you've borrowed that are not your own. Please attribute these photos to their authors, and with their license. If their license conflicts with our wiki, please remove the photos from the wiki and link to them instead. Else, I will remove the photos from the wiki by next Friday. We need to be very concerned about licensing issues is all. It's fine to link to things that are hosted externally as Nicu suggested, but we shouldn't be lifting photos and uploading them to the wiki without permission. ~m To the best of my knowledge the photo's I did not personally take would meet the licensing terms of the wiki and open source. I would never suggest we use someone's effort without their approval. As my desire is not to labor over this issue the photo's from the theme submission and the wiki are removed. :( John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: [F8 Theme Proposal] Fedora Feng Shu
On Sat, 2007-07-07 at 12:00 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: John Baer wrote: To the best of my knowledge the photo's I did not personally take would meet the licensing terms of the wiki and open source. I would never suggest we use someone's effort without their approval. If this is true you didn't have to take them down, but you should link to the place where you got them with that licensing information. Of course you wouldn't suggest using something without someone's approval, but you may want to review the contributor's license agreement that you signed back when you were given wiki access, specifically #7: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Legal/Licenses/CLA ~m More curious than anything else. If we are Ok with the creative commons license, http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/2.0/ , then what does #7 of the CLA need in order to be satisfied? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora 8 theme (Sounds)
All, I put together a wiki page of sounds from the free sound project which I am currently using with Fedora 7. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/F8Themes/GnomeSounds The main issue I found with Gnome on Fedora is the timing is off for some events. For example, in many cases Gnome closes so quickly at logout the sound does not have time to play. IMO some adjustments need to be made. If this is a road the team desires to travel the final product will need to be a package. Building packages is something I have not done. Enjoy! John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
[F8 Theme Proposal] Fedora Feng Shui
All, Feng shui is the ancient Chinese practice of placement and arrangement of space to achieve harmony with the environment. The goal of Fedora Feng Shui is to craft Fedora 8 artwork which is harmonious with the goals and objectives of the final product. I placed my initial images for this submission here for your consideration. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/F8Themes/FengShui As I am unsure of the desire to add or not add branding I omitted all fedora branding. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
F8 Theme [Other Stuff]
All, It is my understanding the re-design of the RHGB is underway. If this is true is it possible to have this team included in the loop from an artwork prospective? In addition, if the boot processes is also being re-worked, can the team be in the loop for this? Thanks, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora RHGB Remix
Mark from [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: the only thing i like in that is the change of the spinner. and even that might not be wist to change because it reminds of the vista spinner. your attempt is nice but somehow it doesn`t seem to be a (big) improvement. Mark, Thanks for the comment. You are correct, the art concept is basically the same. Cheers, John 2007/6/13, John Baer [EMAIL PROTECTED]: All, We spoke some time back about providing guidance to folks who desire to customize Fedora artwork to meet their needs. In an effort to honor that commitment I created a Wiki page titled Fedora 7 Remix @ http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/ArtTeamProjects/Fedora7Remix for your consideration. I did not remove the *Under development* banner pending your comments and improvements. Once these pages are complete and if it is the desire of the team, I suggest a link is placed in Fedora news and a post submitted to the forum. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora 7 CD Labels Covers
On Thu, 2007-05-24 at 12:00 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In case it's helpful, this is a screenshot of the firefox startpage design i threw together: http://people.redhat.com/duffy/fedora/web/homepage/screenshot.png Mo, +1, very nice ... John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora-art-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 61
Mo wrote: Hey everybody, I've been interested in playing around with moin for a good while and I finally got around to getting my own server up again so I had the space and ability to set up my own install to poke around in. So I came up with a Fedora theme for it (I started with cornicen from the moin ThemeMarket [1] as a base): +1 Your mockups are awesome. Is this packaged for installation? :) John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora Firefox Start Page
Mo wrote: By default we ship Firefox to load a local Fedora-specific landing page. Dimitris worked on this for FC6. You may want to discuss its design for F7 (although at this point it's a bit late in the release cycle.) +1 Things are piling up anyway. I have FC6 how-to's I want to create and it looks like we have a mascot to create! :) John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Mascot
Nicu, This item was suggested before and did not proceed IMO because it lacked sponsorship. With the marketing team as sponsor this could be a chance for marketing and the artTeam to work together. :) I see the need for some wiki pages to hold ideas/submissions and someone to coordinate the effort. Do you have an interest in leading the artTeam on this one? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Fedora Firefox Start Page
All, I use the http://www.google.com/firefox page to perform searches using google and I considered if many others do the same. Assuming the page receives a lot of hits I thought why not consider a Fedora Firefox Start Page? I made a rough mock up of the idea for your consideration at my wiki home page. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JohnBaer Your thoughts? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Fedora Artwork Active Contributors
For those of you who may not have noticed I new wiki page was added by Luya titled Fedora Artwork Active Contributors. Nice job and thanks! If your name is not on the list and should be please let us know. :) Luya, I would be happy to add the ArtTeam banner if that is ok? Again, thank you for putting this together. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Request: User Image Submissions - Deadline March 15, 2007
Diana, I changed my music player submission to something more generic. I left the old submission as it seems to be getting some downloads. Looks like I didn't catch the subject line on my previous posts. Sorry ... :) John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
ArtTeam Wiki ReDesign
All, IMO we pushed the envelope of wiki design and the result is an attractive and professional look. Thanks Nicu for your logo submission. It looks great! I also wanted to note the logo image is a hot link back to the ArtWork page. :) John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Open Palette Wiki
Nicu, Did I understand you to say the Open Palette articles could not be hosted on the wiki. If this is correct, what is the reason? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: ArtTeam Wiki ReDesign
Dimitris wrote: My only comment is to minimize the hard-coded HTML and try to put things in CSS as much as possible. So, the 8 lines of header-code could possibly become: ||tableclass=pageHeader artTeam|| Dimitris, I agree but I did not know how to localize a style sheet specifically to the ArtTeam. Changing the HTML code in one location was not much effort (and safe). To test the theory I changed to banner to use a submission from Nicu. :) John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Request: User Image Submissions
All,
I created a wiki page from Diana's blog :) for the GDM Login Face
Browsing request.
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ArtWork/ArtTeamProjects/FaceBrowser
We could post submissions to the wiki prior to sending them to
Gnome-look if that makes sense {?}.
John
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ArtTeam Wiki ReDesign
All, I've been working in the wiki over the weekend and posted a few changes. :) 1. The ArtWork wiki page is now the home of the ArtTeam. However, there is a design flaw I must point out. The original page and many others that followed were name Artwork. This is not a wiki name. Ref: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/WikiName Therefore I named the new ArtTeam page ArtWork which is a wiki name. If there is agreement I will go through and correct the other pages. 2. Introduction of wiki themes. I have not seen this done before but I created a method to theme the ArtTeam wiki (and any other) pages. IMO I believe the new pages look nice. See this page for the details on how it is done. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ArtWork/ArtTeamProjects/WikiDesign 3. Change to the art work and placement of the image. I had the desire to use many of the elements found in the fedora community (font color) in the ArtTeam header. It's not fancy but IMO it's tasteful and the code is efficient. If you have a vision please submit it. 4. Some cleanup is needed. - We have a duplicate in the FC6 specifications. - The old Artwork page was renamed to ArtworkDeprecated. Probably should go. - Dimitris, I created a new page of Fedora Colors (great idea!) using the ArtTeam theme. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ArtWork/FedoraColors If you like it we'll keep it, otherwise we can go with your original. 5. Goals Objectives. Assuming we are in agreement, the goals and objectives are located on their own page and are complete. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ArtWork/GoalsObjectives 6. Things that need attention. The ArtTeamProjects page is very rough. - Nicu I was thinking a wiki page should be created for the Open Palette series with links to the appropriate page(s). If you agree do you want to put something together? - I will turn my attention to the customizing Fc6 GRUB page. 7. Anything else? Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Getting a better sense of community - gallery based
Nicu wrote: I did more thinking about hosting and aggregating (if we decide to run our own gallery): - for hosting: not everybody has his own hosting solution, is willing to pay for one and all free services are less then perfect. So for those in heed a gallery or something provided by Fedora could be very useful. - for aggregating only: if we host content, then we probably will want to police it, so only aggregation will provide more freedom to the contributors. Nicu, You and Mo have a much better sense of this than I but in my mind if we don't host our own solution we lose opportunities to promote Fedora. By that I mean what if the Fedora gallery became the defacto standard for the exchange of computer art? :) I believe the group has the talent and that would be very exciting. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: artTeam Home Page Mockup
Mo wrote: (I do not think that putting together an extra theme package for (the artist formerly known as) extras requires working with Desktop team at all, although we will need someone with some packaging experience to help us put it together.) I was thinking more along a buffet style theme. For example, break down the artwork of Fedora 6 into the changeable GDM components (ie. grub, rhgb, login, and wallpaper). Craft a how-to wiki page to describes how-to build the images and include an optional install script. Not as automated as a RPM package but very flexible (ie. I like grub, rhgb, but dislike gdm login). For those who desire to build and package new themes, this info is a good start. IMO flexibility and freedom of choice is key. I thought I would mock up a GRUB page to see how it plays out. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: artTeam Home Page Mockup
All, The ArtTeam mockup is looking too good (thanks Mo) to stay in my SandBox so I moved it a new home. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ArtTeam I do not know what url makes the most sense /wiki/ArtTeam, or /wiki/ArtWork/ArtTeam, or wiki/FedoraTeams/Art but in my mind the first choice was logical. :) Please feel free to rename the page. My desire is to clear the .../SandBox to start mockups for some of the other pages we discussed. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
artTeam Home Page Mockup
All, I could not be more delighted by the discussion taking place and I want to add an additional item to the discussion and that is a mock up of the team wiki home page. It currently resides in my personal sandbox but if it this is heading in the desired direction of the team I would like to move it. Please view this as a starting point. Paul, I see you are skilled writer and I would welcome any improvements your have time to offer (feel free to edit the page). http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JohnBaer/SandBox Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Including the Right People
All, I would like to make sure as we move forward that everyone that should be included is included. We are discussing changing some established processes and I would regret if these well intentioned discussions were received the wrong way. Specifically, I do not know who supports the Fedora forum and/or the Fedora gallery but can someone touch base with these individuals. Our discussions are not critical of their excellent work and we need their help going forward. Thanks, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
The New and Improved Art Team
All, On February 13th the Fedora Art Team hit the wall. I realize now it was inevitable and no one was at fault. Since that day many team members searched for answers to the questions what went wrong and why. Dialogs were exchanged in heated and direct conversations. The smoke from the event must have been black as it attracted new members who offered their thoughts and comments. The problem with art is it all about personal taste and perception. I believe we can all agree the human eye may view something one way and then see it completely different at another time. I laughed at myself as I reviewed the images created on the road to February 13th. I stated I was satisfied with my rc1 only to create something completely different a few days later. A short time ago I presented Fedora to a group of IT professionals steeped in years of effort in the Windows environment. I needed a good introduction and I wanted to deliver the message Fedora was more than Linux. To achieve this result I modified the RHGB artwork to boldly display the word “fedora” and added a subtitle stating “An Open Source Computing Solution sponsored by Red Hat, Inc”. The audience received the message. In the final analysis the Art Team wasn't ready to do business. By that I mean we did not have well crafted goals and objectives; effective and efficient outcomes. For the New and Improved Art Team I have a few in mind. Goal 1 The art team will enable the users of Fedora to enhance its visual appearance to meet their need or desire. Objective 1.1 The art team will craft wiki pages describing how to customized the appearance of Fedora. Objective 1.2 The art team will evaluate and recommend suitable upstream artwork packages to be included in the release. Objective 1.3 The art team will facilitate the exchange of computer art to promote Fedora to a wider audience. Objective 1.4 The art team will investigate creating and maintaining a Fedora sub-forum targeted to the needs of artist. Sticky posts could point back to the wiki pages created by “objective 1.1”. Goal 2 Encourage the use of open source products in the creation of art. Objective 2.1 The art team will investigate the re-design of the Fedora forum gallery to include a method of image branding such as “made with inkscape”, “crafted with gimp”. The effort could also consider targeted subsections for alternative artwork for icons, RHGB, GDM, KDE, and splash screens. As I look toward the talented artists who submit images to the Fedora gallery I considered why they were not a part of the mix. IMO the team failed to deliver on the open source value of “inclusion – all are welcomed, encourage others to join”. To quote myself, “If we are going to be open source then we need to do open source”. :) The words from David and Paul were right on and although I requested an apology from the Red Hat desktop team the only apology required is my own. The answers were all around us, all I had to do is see them. “Promote Fedora to a wider audience” and use “open source values” when doing open source business. I apologize folks for not seeing the obvious. To wrap up nothing I've stated in this email is cast in stone. Perhaps they are only starting points; but if team agrees, we have work to do. I am interested in hearing your thoughts. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Figuring out the mission (Paul W. Frields)
On 2/22/07, David wrote: Maybe this write-up by Jef is useful for you to read https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-devel-list/2007-January/msg00176.html since I think you're confused about what open source means (you seem to equate it with democracy). Anyway, I'm going to step out of this thread for a bit... David, thank you for the above link. A great read ... and Paul thank you for your comments. In my mind I am trying to sort out moving forward in a way that adds value. Here are my questions. 1. Referencing David's link above, who is our benevolent dictator (my preference of title would be Red Hat liaison)? If this is the way we must travel let's put our cards on the table. 2. Should artwork be centralized or decentralized? By that I mean should the documentation team come to the art team for art work or just do it? If the decision is decentralized then the question becomes is there a need for a art team? 3. If the decision stands that Red Hat will take control of the Fedora desktop I would argue this should also include icons. IMO icons are too closely tied to artwork to be be separated and if they are this will be source of future issues like the one we just experienced. With these questions answered I can assemble some ideas in a wiki page for the team to consider. If these questions can not be answered I am at a lost of what to do next. More as a BTW, I loaded the latest Ubuntu herd CD to see what's going on there and I was amused to see some of the artwork considered unworthy for dapper is in the package for feisty. I can only assume Mark S. realized his decision to pull artwork from the community was a mistake. Maybe there is a lesson to be learned . :) Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Figuring out the mission (Paul W. Frields)
Hello Paul, The subject of your email is very appropriate but the content really doesn't shine much light on the issue or provide comfort to the team. Let me start by stating the obvious. Prior to February 13th the Art Team was a fully functioning Open Source effort; vibrant, active, and filled with discussion. Effort in progress was posted to the wiki and feed back was solicited from the community. Checking the pulse of the team of late I would say its pretty much flat lined with little or no activity as a direct result of the actions from Red Hat. This decision is based on a number of factors, not the least of which is the involvement of thorny issues of trademark, branding, and the polish demands from both inside and outside the Fedora Project. Why did Red Hat feel the need to steal what we already agreed to give them? Other than the fact we started earlier, the processed was the same used for fedora core 6 and to my knowledge a stated concern was never brought forward. Assuming the above issues are real, why didn't someone from Red Hat post them to the list server?. Was there really a need to secretly take the effort of the team off line and continue development behind behind closed doors? But unfortunately, we haven't been completely successful, and to make a long story short, we've had to concede the default release theme work to the Desktop group inside Red Hat. Is fedora sponsored by Red Hat or owned by Red Hat? Under what authority does fedora operate and what authority does Red Hat have over fedora? The decision to pull back the artwork effort was completely unilateral. The impression I received from folks who occasionally posted messages to the art team list server was to push the envelope. IMO the actions of Red Hat in this matter is a direct reflection of the golden rule of business. That is to say he who has the gold, rules. But the default theme is not all there is to the Artwork project. There are many things left to do, including the Echo icon set. Redesign and new art is needed for the Wiki, infrastructure applications, the Some Day Soon Plone site, and so forth. In addition, Fedora is not limited to just the default release art. +1 Does Red Hat really support open source or is it just lip service? I agree there is much more to do but the question now becomes why? If open source doesn't work for fc7 default, why would it work for anything else? IMO a three alarm fire bell should be sounding loudly across the fedora community as the message is clearly who will be next? In addition, Fedora is not limited to just the default release art. As part of the initiative to give users the ability to spin their own distributions built on Fedora, we'd like contributor art to be able to function as a drop-in RPM package replacement for the default release art. Second fiddle has always been a choice. Users have always had the ability to change artwork to meet their personal desires. If this was the your reward for the concession then you didn't get much. To ensure that I do this as well as possible, and that your ideas are heard, understood, and fairly represented, I invite your comments, criticisms, and ideas. If you bring a problem to the table, bring a solution. IMO Paul, the fedora art-team is all but dead unless real changes are made. Red Hat has not conducted itself with the values of equality, love, integrity, excellence, inclusion, or teamwork. When this value system breaks down so does trust. As far as I know the development of the default artwork continues in a vacuum and Red Hat should understand the risk of this type of effort. So here are my suggestions on moving forward. 1. Define in very clear terms what authority Red Hat has over Fedora. Is it sponsorship or is it ownership? 2. Bring additional structure to the process. I've jotted down my thoughts here. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JohnBaer/ArtProcess 3. If fedora is going to be open source then fedora needs to do open source. Bring the default artwork back to the team and assign Diana as the project lead. It's always been Diana's call on the default and I would expect that role to continue. 4. Start rebuilding trust with an apology from the Red Hat desktop team posted to the list server. 5. Re-craft the art team's default wiki page to better communicate its purpose and it's relationship to other teams such as marketing and infrastructure. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Early impressions of Default artwork
Hello Diana, Welcome to the Fedora art team. I followed this link from your blog to your submission. http://people.redhat.com/dfong/fc7graphics/ As always your work is very nice. I have a couple of requests. 1. Would you move your work to a wiki page using a format similar to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRc1 ? This page needs to be a public facing and describes your concept and lays out mock ups or screen shots of your submission. I see this page being reviewed by forum members and linked to the release notes wiki page referenced by distrowatch. 2. Would you create a second wiki page similar to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHigh which is intended to be inward facing? This page would hold down-load-able artwork that can be tested by members. If you have install scripts that would be nice. My first question is one of theme design. In my mind I view a theme as a story board. The images are linked, but they are different. Your approach seems to be one of image re-use. I noticed the wallpaper image is the same as the gdm login background. The balloon behind the clouds image is used in many of the screens. In FC6 I saw the same scenario and I assumed it was because of the time constraint. I noticed the RHGB image does not confirm to the design guide. I like the image but I assume the RHGB maintainer is in agreement to the change. Until I can test the GRUB images I always worry about quality. IMO the FC6 grub image does not display well (very grainy) and my submission was an attempt to minimize this. There is also the issue of black screen, blue screen, black screen, blue screen. IMO the current boot process looks choppy as a result. The first boot screen looks very similar to the FC6 screen. I was hoping for something different as I believe this screen dates back a few versions. In addition, how do you feel about adding echo icons to your submission? I noted there is no optional artwork. I assume the decision has been made to exclude the splash screen of gimp, open office, gdm, kde, and the screen save unlock. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora-art-list Digest, Vol 11, Issue 28
On 2/16/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Nicu wrote: Open the PNG with GIMP, save as xpm.gz, test it and tell us if is too grainy or not :p Thanks, I can do that ... :) Personally I would like the GRUB image to have the same blue as the rest of the graphics (the blue background of RHGB) . I understand it can't be identical due to technical constraints (14 colors), but it may be as close as possible. Some distro's hide the initial kernel load dialog. If that is possible here the screens would flow from grub to RHGB. On the downside that approach presents the grub image for an extended period which may be problematic on some systems. Otherwise I'm good with a dark blue (RHGB) background. :) The first boot screen looks very similar to the FC6 screen. I was hoping for something different as I believe this screen dates back a few versions. In addition, how do you feel about adding echo icons to your submission? Indeed, this is a must *if* Echo will be the default icon set, but this was decided or is still up to discuss? The echo decision is still pending but my suggestion is go ahead and add them to anaconda no matter the outcome. I assume the current icons are blue curve but I am not sure. I noted there is no optional artwork. I assume the decision has been made to exclude the splash screen of gimp, open office, gdm, kde, and the screen save unlock. IIRC, the overall opinion was to leave those unmodified. Ok :( ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Artwork conversations
Rahul, Thank you for responding to this thread. I hope things went well at FUDCon Boston. Apologies for the long post but this touches a broader topic. +1 Let me state the problem here is not Diana, the problem here is Fedora. There was never any question in my mind of Diana's skill but Diana is not the only person on the planet capable of producing polished Fedora art. IMO one very talented artist and contributor named Máirín Duffy was pushed to the side and there are others. If Fedora is going to be open source then Fedora needs to embrace open source. The fact Diana was crafting Fedora final artwork off line with no communication to the team is not open source. It has nothing to do with polish or talent and has everything to do with equality, integrity, inclusion, and teamwork. I read the slashdot article on Ubuntu and don't attempt to legitimize Fedora's mistakes with theirs. IMO Mark Shuttleworth does open source better than anyone and that is why Ubuntu is so popular, but on this issue he got it completely wrong. If Mark had the time and skill I believe he would craft the artwork of Ubuntu as the Ubuntu art team had some of the best talent available. Go to their wiki today and search on art. I only see one “feisty” page. Go to launchpad and search on art or “feisty”. Compare that with the effort of “dapper”. These are not the foot steps Fedora wants to follow. Nobody knows all the pieces of the puzzle. We are bound to have intermediate failures. +1 Ok, so how do you make it work? Work as a team : Expect to receive criticism, others to take your work and come up with variations or polish it better +1 1. First and foremost Fedora has to decide to practice what it preaches. If Diana is not on our team and we are not on hers, this will never work. Use the tools of love, equality, integrity, inclusion, and teamwork to empower team members. I believe we are all mature enough to know our limits but that does not mean we can not contribute in a meaningful way. If the bar has to be high, define clearly what high means. 2. Everyone needs to be working with the same information. Although Diana's artwork guide was very helpful I noticed her artwork does not conform to the guide. I'm not saying her art won't work but plainly things changed and we were not kept in the loop. This is not a talent issue this is a Fedora's commitment to the team issue. 3. Publish a schedule which clearly defines what is due and when. The Ubuntu schedule (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeistyReleaseSchedule) notes the deadlines for artwork as well as upstream projects. IMO this can be vastly improved but it is way more than what we were given. At this moment I honestly do not know when artwork will make it into the mix. I'm guessing RC2 or RC3? Not only should Fedora be able to provide us with a release schedule for version 7, but a schedule for version 8. I realize things change but the process is the same. Finally Rahul here are the disappointments. 1. It is obvious the intent from the very beginning was to have Diana produce the final artwork. Why wasn't that stated plainly and clearly? Will that always be the case? What is the intent for “echo”? What about artwork for the doc team? 2. I do not know what tools Diana uses to create her images but many professional artists use Adobe on Apple or similar product on Windows. I have had this discussion with Diana and agree it's not the end of the world if the images for Fedora come from one of these platforms, but wouldn't it be nice if Fedora made a statement with it's head held high and showed the world what can be done with open source software. The Team said yes, what does Fedora say? So there you have it Rahul. The problem has little to do with artwork and everything to do with process. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Houston, do we have a problem?
All,
On this day I am reminded of one of my favorite movies Apollo 13. What a
classic example of what can be accomplished when folks simply decide to work
together to accomplish a well defined task.
With that thought in mind let me offer my thanks to Ben, Jiri (JJM), Mo, and
others for taking the time and effort to submit artwork for fedora 7. In the
spirit of Open Source this is truly what it is all about.
As communication from fedora has been intermittent of late, I now concern
there is a problem. Diana, Rahul, David, or someone {?}, can you explain
clearly how the default artwork will make it into fedora 7. Next steps
would also be helpful.
Thanks,
John
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A sad day for Fedora, A disappointment for Open Source
Nicu wrote: Ok, I hope I qualify as someone. I directed you some days ago at http://www.isity.net/blog/?p=57 Development on the Fedora 7 theme is ongoing but not on this list but behind some closed doors and we are not invited to the party. This is truly a sad day for Fedora and a disappointment for the community of Open Source. If Fedora did not want our help simply state it, close down the list server, call it good. Diana certainly has the skill and talent to do the artwork and obviously doesn't need our help. Letting this sham go on for months while folks invest their time and honest effort is completely contrary to the spirit of open source. To add insult to injury all of the time we are working on artwork Fedora launches echo in RC1 although the decision on artwork is pending and many would agree the echo project is incomplete and not tested. It sounds to me there are personal agendas playing out and those agendas have nothing to do with open source and the community of fedora. At this point the only thing left to do is make up excuses and assign blame. Pity, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7
Uno, I uploaded a new GDM login submission to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2?action=show for your consideration. I borrowed the wallpaper image, removed the balloons, and darken the clouds to provide a transition from the RHGB to the wallpaper. After thinking about it I would like to keep the *login* widget as I re-use it in the ScreenSaver unlock graphic. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7
All, I posted a new RHGB-Mockup submission for your consideration. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2 The colors are those currently in use (could be something different) and the artwork is *technical* with a hint of 3-D. I also experimented with the Fedora branding in the lower right corner. I will install it on a couple of different systems to see how it plays out. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7 (2)
All, I realize there is already a post in the que but I made some minor improvements to the RHGB Mockup submission and re-uploaded it to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2 I couldn't find my notes on the current RHGB colors so I made my best guess. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7
Uno wrote: Now it would be nice if the lighter blue color of the Clouds wallpaper could rub off on other parts of the GUI, e.g. such as login screen. Now that I have a revised RHGB submission in place I can take some time to look at the GDM login. I am unclear of your vision but I believe you want something like the GDM login at this link. http://art.gnome.org/themes/gdm_greeter/1229 Is this correct? If not, can you point me toward something to help me see your desire. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Unfavorable Distro-Watch Report
On 2/6/07, Luya wrote: Bah, this is only a test release intended to retrieve more bugs as possible. I have learn to take negative review as a way to improve the distribution. Contributions now know the weak point too fix. Bah? The problem with a review is you don't know who will read it. Perhaps potential new Fedora user who will now look for something better. Worst, some may decide FC7 is not worth testing. :( I was not aware the decision on the icon set had been made. Is *echo* really ready for prime time? *rant on * I participated to the inclusion of echo-icon-theme on rawhide by default. As David indicated, it was on October that the decision was made and I put the announcement for the availability of echo-icon-them on Rawhide. For what I observe on several forum, users welcome the change of icons. Despite the heavy schedule (real life sucks sometime), I do my best to work hard to the development of echo. New icons are available but xml list needs to be updated. Sources to modify the icons are available : SVG. I am not sure what else is missing for further push the development. *rant off* Based on the above comment, I am assuming you are the owner of this effort. I did not know that. I quickly searched the wiki and the only *echo* page which displayed your name was *EchoProblem*. If you are not the owner, who is? I really wonder if Mairin departure from leadership to the development of GNOME really impact some people here. Perhaps we need that. As I stated before, creating an icon theme IMO is a huge effort. Information should be flowing on a very regular bases communicating (listserv, forum, irc) it's status and direction. The owner is the advocate of the effort and assumes this responsibility. In conclusion, my concern is the number of missing icons I see on the *echo* wiki page. If the artwork is missing or substituted, a bugzillia report will not be of much help. However, if *echo* is ready and others agree then let's proceed on. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7 (final wallpaper)
All, IMO the wallpaper titled *clouds* submitted 02/04 should be the FC7 wallpaper. It's light, airy, and rich in fedora blue with a hint of red hat red. :) http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2 I installed this background on LCD and CRT systems and it displays well. In addition, I tested against a variety of GDM themes including the new beryl 3D themes and it displays well and last I used a variety of icon themes and it displays well. At this point I would like to re-focus my attention on the RHGB artwork. My thoughts are to apply the *technical drawing* perspective. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Unfavorable Distro-Watch Report
All, I was distrubed to read today's Distro-Watch report on Fedora 7 RC1. Although much of what they had to say is off topic I was surprised by this comment. (and yes, there are some positives, such as the installable live CD for the i386 systems or the beautiful new icon set) I was not aware the decision on the icon set had been made. Is *echo* really ready for prime time? It would be nice to get a little feed back on what's going on. :( John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora-art-list Digest, Vol 11, Issue 7
Nicu wrote: Before considering something *the* Fedora 7 wallpaper I would suggest you to read Diana's blog: http://www.isity.net/blog/?p=57 Thank you for the info. Before preview 1 I was in agreement with Diana's post but now I believe the last thing folks want to see is a hot air balloon floating over a landscape. My concern is time is running out and there is much to accomplish. I realize no matter which design is chosen for the FC7 there will be some who will desire something different. My desire is to have *Flying High* as complete as it can be by the 12th. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7
Nicu wrote: I find it unbalanced: the clouds look very realistic (and very good) but the balloons look very minimal. Yep, that was the plan. The balloons are actually from JJM. :) I am right when I say the light sources are inconsistent? on the clouds it appears to come from left and on the balloons it appears to come from right. You are correct. I wanted the upper left to be dark to enhance the contrast of the icons. I wanted to lower right to be dark to enhance to the *fedora branding*. Although inconsistent, IMO it still works. Are you sure you used the wordmark correctly? It seems to have an incorrect thickness of the font. The font is correct but a slight shading was added to the bottom. Thank you for your observations, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7
All, I hope I am not wallpapering all of you to death but IMO it is critical to get the wall paper correct. Struggling with the direction *monolith* idea I decided to try something from my original thoughts and the hot air balloons in the clouds. Given the chance to start over I also decided to *lighten* the colors as requested early on. The theme is not a bold as the *monolith* thread but it works. I welcome your comments. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2 Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Flying High with Fedora 7 - More
All, Added a RHGB screen to match *more 3d* wallpaper. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2 :) John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Icons for FC7
I changed the subject of this thread as it seems to be heading in a new direction. :) Nicu wrote: John Baer wrote: Nicu wrote: Each time this came into discuss, the majority of *contributors* opted for a personalized icon theme and were against using Tango directly as-is, use at least a variant of Tango (as Mairin replied). +1 This is exactly what I suggest. In fact I am using a modified Tango icon set on my computer and by changing the *folder* icon the presentation is completely changed. Back when we were talking about Bluecurve I proposed to refresh it by changing a few very visible icons, starting with the folder. So we are in agreement here. I placed an example titled *Fedora Folders* here. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JohnBaer Sorry, but this is the Vista folder icon. If we change the folder icon it should remain consistent with the rest of the theme: perspective, colors, outline, highlight, shadow. -- nicu +1 The folders I posted were simply examples and was not meant to be a submission. :) If the team is in agreement and there is time to accomplish this for FC7 the first decision to agree to is the base theme. The two mentioned are Tango and Bluecurve. Are there others? The second decision the team needs to agree on are the icons to be *refreshed*. IMO less is more. Last, what is the deadline. IMO this effort is not an attempt to change any of the current development of *echo* but rather provides additional time to grow and mature the project. Does anyone know why we shouldn't go forward with this? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Flying High with Fedora 7 - More 3D
Posted a revised wallpaper to the white board with more 3d elements. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2 +1 or -1 John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Plymouth: The next generation RHGB
I noticed this post in Fedora News. Is this targeted to FC7? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Preview2 Posted to Fedora Focus
All, I posted a *Preview2* poll to the Fedora Focus forum for community feedback. The poll is set to expire on 2/12. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
FC7ThemeProposalEnergyInterferences
On Tue, 2007-01-30 at 12:00 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, any new designs added. Nice work ... John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Flying High Preview 2 Started
Dimitris Glezos wrote: I liked the idea of the blueprint drawings (technical) for the installation. It felt as if they were professional, but the actual product isn't built yet. The blueprints put the user into the idea that he himself is building the system and is kind of anticipating. What would really be great is to see the drawings get more complete and sophisticated with the progress of the installation. So at the end of it (the Congratulations screen) the graphics will be pixel-perfect. So, here's an idea: why don't we contact the maintainers of Anaconda (Jeremy Katz?) and see if we could find a way to change the graphics used in the installation as the progress goes on? There are eight menu choices on the First Boot screen. If it were me I would allow for eight predefined images and if any were missing use the first. I'll send Jeremy an email for his advice. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Where are we?
Rahul wrote: Should we have IRC weekly meetings to discuss changes and monitor progress in #fedora-art channel? I can lead that discussion for a while if that is useful. Not a bad idea if a time can be agreed to. Otherwise, I have some questions: * Have we decided a default theme for the different spins in Fedora 7 release. The desktop spin for Fedora 7 is scheduled to be released soon I do not know who or how the default theme is selected. I put forth my best effort to prepare the *flying high* theme for consideration and if this is the theme to be used I would have no problem having it ready for the scheduled released dates. If *flying high* is not the candidate, IMO there is much work needed as the other themes are missing artwork. and we are pretty much on the conceptual stage now. Before we put a theme into the distribution, we would probably need much more polish. See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Core/Schedule. Based on Diana's guide, I believe all of the pieces are available for viewing at this wiki site. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighPreview2 * How much more work does it to make the Echo icon theme complete in some form? Does echo work with KDE, XFCE etc and can be the KDE or applications written in a non-GTK toolkit work with echo properly? Is that planned to be done for the general release of Fedora 7? I do not know the status of the *echo icon theme* but based on the number of bug reports submitted against the ubuntu dapper icon theme, it sounds like this type of effort needs extensive testing. * Do we want a unified look and feel between GNOME and KDE? There are themes like Qtcurve we might adopt. I am in agreement with a unified look and for the most part the *flying high* theme plays well for Gnome and KDE. I did not test against XFCE. IMO the artwork should be theme transparent as much as possible. I tested *flying high* against beryl, cario, blue curve, and murrina. However, a decision on the default desktop theme would be helpful. There was some discussion on an earlier thread the KDE login manager may be changed and if that is true the details of what that means from an artwork perspective needs to be discussed. http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=40492 KDE folks are looking at installing gtk-qt-engine and kmenu-gnome for the KDE spin in Fedora 7. Do we intend to install the engine and the complimentary GNOME menu extended for the Desktop spin? http://www.gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=31033 Based on a post by Mo to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes the next deadline we are shooting for is the 12th of February. Based on the release schedule, RC1 is due on 27th of February (15 days later). I do not know when new artwork should be included in the release cycle but IMO sooner is better than later. If later is the decision, we can continue to post previews to the forum. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Flying High Preview 2 Started
All, I started a Preview 2 wiki page with revised images which I hope addresses many of the comments from the forum poll. The end tally was 96 responses and the vote was split 50/50 between Ok or great and Not for me. The things I believe the folks who voted not for me were looking for are as follows ... 1. A 3-D'ish design (many liked FC6) 2. More polish In addition, I read between the lines (my perception only) many of the not for me folks were looking for a bolder statement. They were not thrilled by the flat wallpaper (too conservative). Some asked what the default icon theme was going to be as they picked up on the tango icons used in the mock ups. I assume the status quot (?). One issue I did not address in preview 2 is the dark color (About the same as FC6). Although it was not my intent to go dark blue it is just how it worked out as I needed something dark to paint the clouds mist against. On the computers I tested (CRT LCD), the color works well. At this point I need guidance in any additional changes to be made. All suggestions and/or comments are welcomed. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighPreview2 Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Inkscape 0.45pre1
Luya wrote: For people too lazy to rebuild Inkscape 0.45pre1, Fedora version is available on Luya, Thanks ... John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Branding Wallpaper
On Wed, 2007-01-24 at 12:00 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This also would need an xfce (and others which may be inclulded with Extras) wallpaper with each release. Also, more and more screen sizes... it gets too complex when desktops are brought in. Ben, Good point. I agree this is the best approach. Thanks, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Branding Wallpaper
Nicu wrote: I think this is excessive and unneeded branding: both for Fedora and the Desktop Environment. Nicu, Would your preference be no GDM/KDE branding but keep the fedora branding. Or... would you prefer all branding removed? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Flying High with Fedora 7
All, Broke away from the day-to-day to check out Las Vagas last week. Lot's of stuff going on there! I posted a new wallpaper submission for your consideration which is more surreal than the previous. I call it The Wall. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2 Note: The image is really a screen shot which I believe best shows the concept. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Fedora-art-list Digest, Vol 10, Issue 20
On Sat, 2007-01-20 at 12:00 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey folks, I will be stepping away from the Fedora Art Team for now in order to focus my efforts on upstream GNOME projects. ~m Mo, That is great news. The wonderful thing about open source development is the ability to check in and check out as the need arises. I look forward to seeing the results of your gnome efforts as they have always been top notch. Best of luck, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Borealis Theme
Joachim Frieben wrote: That's really bad news. Well, it would be nice from you to push the Borealis theme though for inclusion into Fedora [.. in my eyes still the best suggestion for F7 until now]. Joachim and Others, Without a doubt Mo is very talented and the Borealis theme is an excellent submission. I do not understand the intent of the words push it though but I encourage someone to complete the work Mo has begun. Express your passion with your contribution. The word team by definition implies a body greater than one and I know there are others. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Branding Wallpaper
In the past the wallpaper for Fedora GDM and KDE have been the same. IMO we should pay tribute to these two successful open source projects by branding the fedora wallpaper respectively. Please refer to the following link. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/FC7Themes/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighRound2 Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7 Preview
All, Thank you for your comments. Mo, as suggested I will bundle the svgs ... I am in agreement the 3D approach is what forum folks generally like and I would guess a blender theme would be very well received. Unfortunately, I do not know Blender :(. From my efforts I was looking for a theme which works at home and the office. IMO the office part of the equation tends to be more conservative. You probably won't see a graphic of a woman dressed in a bikini with a fedora logo at work. Although I believe I saw several on the wallpaper section of the forum :). When I looked to other successful products and I didn't see any with strong 3D based themes. I consulted with my colleagues and they advised the background screen needs to be more than flashy, it needs to be something a person can look at all day, every day. Busy complex images are hard to view for long periods of time. In addition, I understand the point relative to the logo but if this theme is to go forward, IMO Red Hat/Fedora will need to agree to some latitude. If the decision is strict adherence to the logo guide lines all of the submissions are in trouble. I set the poll up for two weeks and at this point I want to step back and take a break. Just for fun I would like to code the GDM login page as I have most everything else installed on my computer. Creating a 3D fork isn't a bad idea. Mola, maybe you can work your magic with Blender. Again, thank you. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: Flying High with Fedora 7 Preview
All, I uploaded my entire project to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHigh Look to the bottom under the title All project files. :) John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Anaconda Splash/Progress Header Graphic
All, I noted from the Artwork/ReleaseGraphics document the header image for the Anaconda Splash and Progress page are the same. IMO if the each page called it's own header graphic (could be the same if desired) it would allow for additional flexibility in design. Is this possible? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Who is Our Target Audience
All, I've been working under an assumption as to who our target audience is but in the world of project management every assumption should be stated so that it can be agreed to. In my mind the target audience for Fedora is an individual who's life style would include the Internet, mobile music player, multi media, and a cell phone. Is this the audience we should be crafting art toward? I also assume the business side of Fedora is really RHEL. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
[FC7 theme proposal] Flying High with Fedora 7 - Round 2
All, I added a new RHGB submission to the round 2 page titled Happy Feet! Rock on ... Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Thoughts on recent threads
Hello everyone, Wow, the list server submissions have been heated of late. In the world of project management this phase of project team building is referred to as storming and it often produces a positive outcome. Max and David thank you for your comments. Your input is valued and appreciated. What I see as the root problem is a broken process and it can be addressed with a simple question. Fedora (aka Max, David, Jonathan, others from the Fedora council), what do you want and when do you want it? Diana's development of the release guide is a big help with the what. It provided me with a list of twelve images to developed and the criteria of the desired result. It also provided a valuable resource for discussion. For example, the Open Office and Gimp splash screens; can the RHGB program be changed to render artwork differently? IMO what we are lacking is published deadlines and a clear definition of the deliverables. I remember from the FC6 cycle the artwork came in late and we were advised by Rahul the submissions for FC7 needed to be more timely. In addition, the short deadline in FC6 produced an unfair burden which fell on Diana and Mola's shoulders. As a result, the artwork effort of FC7 began earlier but I now realize Diana, Mo, and others from Fedora have other product deadlines to honor. Therefore, as a submitter of artwork to the Fedora art team I request the following. 1)Publish a development schedule to the wiki. Detail as much as possible exactly what is to be complete (visual examples are good) and the outcome of the deadline. This could also become a dashboard if one were to assign a status (ie. Green/Yellow/Red or AheadOfSchedule/OnSchedule/Late). 2)Fedora needs to communicate it's vision clearly to the group. This vision should also reside on the wiki. For example, if Fedora desires not to theme the splash screen of Open Office make the declaration, if Fedora doesn't care make the declaration. If Fedora desires to use the color blue in new theme development make the declaration. 3)The team needs an ambassador to Fedora. The perfect example is my question on changing the RHGB program. I would add this person should not be an active submitter of artwork and can change from time to time. The reason is in addition to ambassador this person should be a coach to team submitters. As this person will more than likely be from Fedora, Fedora should decide who is best qualified to fill the role. 4)I would ask the team to communicate visually. Have an idea or see an improvement for a submission? Mock it up, a picture is truly worth a 1000 words. We agreed to only use open source products for development (mainly gimp inkscape) so passing files should not be an issue. 5)I would ask team members to post their intentions to the list server. I had no idea a forum post was made and an artwork theme poll was underway. A wonderful idea but I would have liked the opportunity to comment and participate in the forum thread. (If that was done and I missed it, great.) So where are we now? In my mind the development of the Flying High Theme needed to evolved to the point Fedora could give the thumbs up or down. I believe I have accomplished that goal and the result of the effort is posted to the preview wiki. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fc7ThemeProposalFlyingHighPreview I know if I were entrusted in making the decision on which theme to use I would want to see as much as possible. If I were purchasing an auto I want to see more than the bumper. To do less places the project at risk of getting something less than desired. Once the decision on the theme is made, the effort becomes refinement and polish. In conclusion what I see before us now is an opportunity for improvement. Let's agree Fedora 7 can be as good as we want it to be. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: [FC7 theme proposal] Flying High with Fedora 7 - Round 2
Nicu Buculei wrote: Question: do we want customized splash screens for such applications? - the splash for OpenOffice.org was customized for a while (around FC2-FC3) in the Bluecurve style.; - the GIMP splash was never (AFAIK) customized in RHL/Fedora; - in the current FC6 the Eclipse splash is customized (Fedora Eclipse) but is not related at all to the rest of the desktop theming. Nicu, I do not the answer to that question but based on what other distro's are doing it appears theme-ing these two splash screen is common. I would say why not if we have the time. I've installed them on my system and IMO they provide a nice touch. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: [FC7 theme proposal] Flying High with Fedora 7 - Round 2
All, Posted some additional artwork submissions to the round 2 page. Just for fun I made an Open Office and Gimp splash screen. Cheers, John BTW, if anyone would like these I can post images with an install script. ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
[FC7 theme proposal] Flying High with Fedora 7 - Round 1
On 12/6/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It seems more themes have a convergence on the starry night idea: this moon light in Flying High, the new additions in Borealis, the whole Planet... Even Dreams may be somewhat connected with night -- Nicu, I made the same observation! I started out with something light but went back to the night. In my case I believe I was inspired by Mola's fedora planet wall paper. How dark the final theme should be is certainly something we can discuss. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: planet propose for FC7
On Wed, 2006-11-29 at 02:47 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: mola pahnadayan wrote: hi :) mola, The number of comments on your Planet Fedora wallpaper is a testimony to your talent and the quality of your artwork. I am very impressed and would like to see this grow. Questions 1. Is your desire to expand this into a theme? 2. If so, do you need assistance in the development of some other images? 3. Do you need help with the theme wiki page? If this is to be a theme I would suggest the theme title be expanded to something like the universe of fedora as IMHO this would allow additional space images. In my mind fedora planet renders to images of earthy landscapes and things. Either way thank you for your contribution. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Fedora Borealis Round 1
Máirín, This is not a critique of your submission but a thank you for again getting us off to a really good start. My first impression is positive and I will offer additional comments when I have time to study the items in more detail. As a challenge to myself and others, submit your ideas. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Last minute Login submission
Diana, Realizing the hour is late, I but together a submission of what I was thinking of for the login page. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JohnBaerFC6Login Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
FC6 wallpaper tweak
Diana,Here's a minor tweak on the FC6 wallpaper. I'm having some trouble with the shinny globe.http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JohnBaerFC6Wallpaper Cheers,John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
New background
Diana, Thank you for providing your artwork on the new background. Just a couple of comments. 1. When I view the new background on my Dell laptop the brighter image did not display as well the original. On this computer I believe something brighter than the original but darker than the current would be the best solution. I must add this wasn't as big of an issue on my desktop. The 810 video chip on the Dell may be the reason. 2. This is just me but I really liked the crystal/glass look of the ball on the first design. I would encourage you to go back to that concept. 3. It looks like some of the rounded ribbons are more flat. I like that enhancement. Given the amount of time and the number of graphics to be finalized I believe you and Mola are probably the best choice in wrapping this up. If you keep your status page updated I will be happy to test and provide feedback on how they look. If you have a specific need and if you believe inkscape or gimp will craft it, always willing to help. Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Minor tweak and an Enhancement
All, It's just the plight of a programmer. Say you are done and then something else shows up (lol). I discovered the splash image I liked did not display as I hoped on my desktop system which uses a 1280x1024 resolution. I remembered the Ubuntu folks struggled with this as they developed their usplash product and their solution was to crop the image to 640x400. With that in mind I created a 640x400 image which blends the default black background color at the bottom. At this point I have stared at this too long and can't see the best choice. In addition, Jiri made a nice improvement to my 640x480 image and I posted it the whiteboard. Thank you Jiri for your help, I like it! I posted all of the svg's in an archive to this URL. http://www.uthando.net/Fedora/Art_Proposals/ Cheers, John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Last GRUB Submission
Diana,The creative well is beginning to dry and the time grows short so I posted my last GRUB submission to my whiteboard wiki page for your and the team's consideration. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JohnBaerFC6SplashWhat I like most about this image is it displays well at 640x480px 16 color resolution. I believe the reason for this is the size of the elements.The other thing I like about this image is it displays well for the three or so seconds most will see it. To balance the over sized elements I muted the colors. In the spirit of having a little fun I used a some poetic license with the logo. :)One may see it as a balloon or a travel tag but either way we are on our way with Fedora Core 6 (lol)!I acknowledge this image does not adhere to the DNA theme but I was unable to reproduce an image of the quality I would prefer using this theme. :( IMHO a high quality image is the most important consideration.I am unaware of the policy of email attachments sent to the list server so I will email you separately the svg files.Cheers,John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Help with FC6 Theme
Mairin,
This is exciting news but I have a few comments and questions being the
new guy on the block.
First, who ever produced the current theme did a really good job. IMO it
is one of the best available. I see a lot of thought and effort went
into creating and crafting it. However, a lot will be said when FC6 is
released on it's looks and I believe folks will desire something new or
improved.
We can have a new theme in FC6, but we've got to get it in by next
Tuesday (September 5) which is the test 3 freeze. After it gets in of
course we can fix bugs and whatnot but it should really be the best
it
can possibly be for test 3.
I am assuming the decision that really must be made by 09/05 is to
change themes or keep the current. I also assume that improvements will
be accepted to the selected theme until 10/02. If 09/05 is the final
date, is five days enough time to measurably improve the status quo?
If 10/02 is the final date, then I see two choices.
1. Improve the current theme.
or
2. Implement the DNA theme.
A choice to improving the current theme could be making it more glassy.
Mark Shuttleworth has stated on numerous occasions he wants Ubuntu to be
more polished. If you look behind the curtain I believe you will see the
word polished has been translated into glassy.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/EdgyProposals/JMak?highlight=%
28art%29
I am not suggesting Fedora has to be like Ubuntu but the themeing
direction of other distro's shouldn't be ignored. The media will
evaluate a distro on how it performs and how it looks.
I believe the amount of effort of either decision would be about the
same.
It looks like the task list is as follows.
- GDM theme - we already have this but can stand to have some
graphical
modifications. It needs to keep same layout though so we don't have
to
modify the GDM theme markup too heavily.
- GNOME/KDE splash
Gnome splash
KDE splash
XFCE splash {?}
- GRUB splash
16 color, 640 x 480 {?}
- syslinux splash (Anaconda Prompt Screen on the themeing overview)
Does syslinux splash = Anaconda Prompt Screen {?}
- anaconda artwork
What is the complete list {?}
- firstboot artwork
16 color, 640 x 480 {?}
- RHGB splash
What is the current?
- screensaver lock
Doesn't this come from GUI {?}
- (optional) GTK theme
Clear looks {?} / compiz {?}
- (optional) icon theme
Status quo {?}
What about the default wall paper/background?
To conclude, I am happy to assist in anyway possible.
John
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CLA Troubles
I'm trying to work through setting up an Account and I am having difficulties. When I click the following link Request the Contributor License Agreement on this page http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/AccountSystem/CLAHowTo?highlight=%28CLAHowTo%29 I receive a Bad Gateway error page. Is this the correct page? John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
First observations
All, Thank you for your comments. Just a couple of first observations. Thanks Nicu for the info. I took a look at the link but the a in the Bryant2 font did not appear to be the same as the a in the fedora logo (?). From: Nicu Buculei [EMAIL PROTECTED] The font is a proprietary one, named Bryant2, is not possbile to redistribute it: http://www.processtypefoundry.com/typefaces/bryant2/index.html I see the fedora logo is trade marked and there is a long list of legal precautions attached as a result. Normally a trade marked logo is to be presented without alterations although I did not find examples to be used in new art work (?). IMHO the intent of any open source project is to foster inclusion. In the case of art work, encourage artistic submissions. I find myself with the desire to help but I can't get started. Here are the obstacles I see. 1) If bryant2 is the official fedora font, doesn't its $50 to $350 price place an unfair burden on those who wish to contribute? 2) If I don't use the official font will I be at odds with the trade mark or the community? Any guidance here would be appreciated. John ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
