Re: R: Criteria for theme selection
Matthias Clasen wrote: If you want to gain more feedback on the drafts you work on, here is a proposal: next time, package up the remaining candidates in the final round (at that stage they should all be complete enough for that, I guess), and ship them with the beta, maybe with some nice paragraph in the beta release notes pointing at the available candidate themes. But is not easy to package (and switch at runtime) parts of the theme like GRUB screen or Plymouth and is downright useless to provide alternate package for Anaconda/First run graphics, those are supposed to be seen only once. The only graphic for which it make sense to include as an option is the desktop wallpaper, but that is so easy to change without any packaging, only a copule of mouse clicks. -- nicu :: http://nicubunu.ro :: http://nicubunu.blogspot.com Cool Fedora wallpapers: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro/wallpapers/ Open Clip Art Library: http://www.openclipart.org my Fedora stuff: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: R: Criteria for theme selection
Sorry for off topic, but could you please reconfigure your mail client to use traditional Re: in subject instead of just R:? It breaks threading in GMail (if not everything else) and it's very hard to follow discussion On Tue, Sep 9, 2008 at 6:23 PM, Samuele Storari [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well I think the vote will be totally open to the whole community. Why I think that? Cos the graphic it's made for all, think about art, think about expression, it comes from the inside need of someone to express to other, to comunicate. I hope we don't think to elevate us over the other people, we aren't the keeper of a sort of graphical wisdom, we create for the community, we work for all them and I think will be the right thing let the community decide. Don't forget in first the community have to use what we create, and we have to hear to the voice of the majority. So this is my opinion. Free Art - Free World. :D Ciao Samuele - Messaggio originale - Da: Máirín Duffy [EMAIL PROTECTED] A: Discussions about the artwork included with Fedora, including icons, themes, and wallpapers. fedora-art-list@redhat.com Inviato: Martedì, 9 settembre 2008 16:36:04 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam/Berlino/Berna/Roma/Stoccolma/Vienna Oggetto: Criteria for theme selection Hi, Since our deadline to choose a theme is Sep 21 I would like to make sure before that point the criteria for selection are clear. Our base requirements is that the theme must have all required artwork needed for round 3. We have not yet had a case where more than one theme met this basic requirement. In case we do have multiple themes that meet this requirement, we need a fair method to choose which theme is selected as the default. Some ideas: - I believe Nicu suggested at one point that the number of people involved in creating the theme should be a selection factor, as the art team is a community effort. - I think perhaps setting up a vote could also be useful. The vote could be restricted to currently-active art team contributors and/or it could be opened to the whole set of Fedora accounts. - We could let FESCO decide. My suggestion is that we have a vote within the set of active Fedora art team contributors. The problem is how do we determine who is allowed in this vote - who is active? We could do: - anyone who contributed a theme idea or artwork throughout the 3 round process - anyone who has contributed a design to the art team (via the design queue, echo theme, or art theme process) in the past 6 months (the fedora 9 release period) - anyone who is in the art group in the account system (i don't think we have cleaned this out yet though and there are a few inactive accounts still I think) What do you all think? ~m ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list -- Samuele Storari Art Director Byte-Code srl mobile: +39 347 50 798 32 office: +39 02 9840047 http://www.byte-code.com ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list -- http://scwlab.com ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
R: Criteria for theme selection
Well I think the vote will be totally open to the whole community. Why I think that? Cos the graphic it's made for all, think about art, think about expression, it comes from the inside need of someone to express to other, to comunicate. I hope we don't think to elevate us over the other people, we aren't the keeper of a sort of graphical wisdom, we create for the community, we work for all them and I think will be the right thing let the community decide. Don't forget in first the community have to use what we create, and we have to hear to the voice of the majority. So this is my opinion. Free Art - Free World. :D Ciao Samuele - Messaggio originale - Da: Máirín Duffy [EMAIL PROTECTED] A: Discussions about the artwork included with Fedora, including icons, themes, and wallpapers. fedora-art-list@redhat.com Inviato: Martedì, 9 settembre 2008 16:36:04 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam/Berlino/Berna/Roma/Stoccolma/Vienna Oggetto: Criteria for theme selection Hi, Since our deadline to choose a theme is Sep 21 I would like to make sure before that point the criteria for selection are clear. Our base requirements is that the theme must have all required artwork needed for round 3. We have not yet had a case where more than one theme met this basic requirement. In case we do have multiple themes that meet this requirement, we need a fair method to choose which theme is selected as the default. Some ideas: - I believe Nicu suggested at one point that the number of people involved in creating the theme should be a selection factor, as the art team is a community effort. - I think perhaps setting up a vote could also be useful. The vote could be restricted to currently-active art team contributors and/or it could be opened to the whole set of Fedora accounts. - We could let FESCO decide. My suggestion is that we have a vote within the set of active Fedora art team contributors. The problem is how do we determine who is allowed in this vote - who is active? We could do: - anyone who contributed a theme idea or artwork throughout the 3 round process - anyone who has contributed a design to the art team (via the design queue, echo theme, or art theme process) in the past 6 months (the fedora 9 release period) - anyone who is in the art group in the account system (i don't think we have cleaned this out yet though and there are a few inactive accounts still I think) What do you all think? ~m ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list -- Samuele Storari Art Director Byte-Code srl mobile: +39 347 50 798 32 office: +39 02 9840047 http://www.byte-code.com ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: R: Criteria for theme selection
+1 2008/9/10 Samuele Storari [EMAIL PROTECTED] Well I think the vote will be totally open to the whole community. Why I think that? Cos the graphic it's made for all, think about art, think about expression, it comes from the inside need of someone to express to other, to comunicate. I hope we don't think to elevate us over the other people, we aren't the keeper of a sort of graphical wisdom, we create for the community, we work for all them and I think will be the right thing let the community decide. Don't forget in first the community have to use what we create, and we have to hear to the voice of the majority. So this is my opinion. Free Art - Free World. :D Ciao Samuele - Messaggio originale - Da: Máirín Duffy [EMAIL PROTECTED] A: Discussions about the artwork included with Fedora, including icons, themes, and wallpapers. fedora-art-list@redhat.com Inviato: Martedì, 9 settembre 2008 16:36:04 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam/Berlino/Berna/Roma/Stoccolma/Vienna Oggetto: Criteria for theme selection Hi, Since our deadline to choose a theme is Sep 21 I would like to make sure before that point the criteria for selection are clear. Our base requirements is that the theme must have all required artwork needed for round 3. We have not yet had a case where more than one theme met this basic requirement. In case we do have multiple themes that meet this requirement, we need a fair method to choose which theme is selected as the default. Some ideas: - I believe Nicu suggested at one point that the number of people involved in creating the theme should be a selection factor, as the art team is a community effort. - I think perhaps setting up a vote could also be useful. The vote could be restricted to currently-active art team contributors and/or it could be opened to the whole set of Fedora accounts. - We could let FESCO decide. My suggestion is that we have a vote within the set of active Fedora art team contributors. The problem is how do we determine who is allowed in this vote - who is active? We could do: - anyone who contributed a theme idea or artwork throughout the 3 round process - anyone who has contributed a design to the art team (via the design queue, echo theme, or art theme process) in the past 6 months (the fedora 9 release period) - anyone who is in the art group in the account system (i don't think we have cleaned this out yet though and there are a few inactive accounts still I think) What do you all think? ~m ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list -- Samuele Storari Art Director Byte-Code srl mobile: +39 347 50 798 32 office: +39 02 9840047 http://www.byte-code.com ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list -- tatica Maria Gracia Leandro http://www.tatica.org http://www.iseit.net http://www.latinux.org http://www.latinux.com http://www.fedora-ve.org http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MariaLeandro LinuxUser= 440285 GPG Public Key: E1CDCC56 Be yourself... Don't be anyone else ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: R: Criteria for theme selection
at least 30% or 20% should be a community decision... right? 2008/9/10 Nicu Buculei [EMAIL PROTECTED] Samuele Storari wrote: Well I think the vote will be totally open to the whole community. Why I think that? Cos the graphic it's made for all, think about art, think about expression, it comes from the inside need of someone to express to other, to comunicate. I hope we don't think to elevate us over the other people, we aren't the keeper of a sort of graphical wisdom, we create for the community, we work for all them and I think will be the right thing let the community decide. The trouble is that the large community knows little about usability and good design. I said it before and I say it again: if we keep a popular vote, I bet I storm the results if I propose some softcore anime or a half-nude photo of Angelina Jolie. Don't forget in first the community have to use what we create, and we have to hear to the voice of the majority. We usually hear the voice of a loud minority. So this is my opinion. Free Art - Free World. :D And then let's make all our decisions (about defaults, application choices, packaging) based on popular vote. -- nicu :: http://nicubunu.ro :: http://nicubunu.blogspot.com Cool Fedora wallpapers: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro/wallpapers/ Open Clip Art Library: http://www.openclipart.org my Fedora stuff: http://fedora.nicubunu.ro ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list -- tatica Maria Gracia Leandro http://www.tatica.org http://www.iseit.net http://www.latinux.org http://www.latinux.com http://www.fedora-ve.org http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MariaLeandro LinuxUser= 440285 GPG Public Key: E1CDCC56 Be yourself... Don't be anyone else ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: R: Criteria for theme selection
2008/9/9 María Leandro [EMAIL PROTECTED]: at least 30% or 20% should be a community decision... right? Here's my view, as a Board member. I consider the multiple rounds of discussion over the themes as a prolonged community decision. The final artwork decision is a culminating event in a process. Are people encouraged to participate in the earlier stages of that process as part of the art team? if they choose not to participate in the previous rounds do they have the context to make informed decisions at the final stage? Have they earned the right to be a part of the final decision? I'm not sure they do. Everything that gets done in Fedora is done by a subset of a larger community. We don't make it a point to take a community wide poll when the technical bits need to be updated. We put the trust and authority to make decisions into the teams responsible for developing those bits. And I'm not sure we should treat the default art work any differently than we treat gdm or the installer..things which end up making use of the artwork... by opening up the decision making to a popularity contest. -jefThat being said... solar better end up being the theme cuz it makes an awesome tie in to the International Heliophysical Year which is happening nowspaleta ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: R: Criteria for theme selection
On Tue, 2008-09-09 at 13:20 -0400, Máirín Duffy wrote: María Leandro wrote: +1 2008/9/10 Samuele Storari [EMAIL PROTECTED] I think the vote will be totally open to the whole community. Well, I think with a little over a week to go on the final decision, we should maybe limit to art group members for this release, and plan a larger vote for F11. The reason I say this is because we don't really have time to plan for a Fedora-wide vote, and since there's not much time to wait on people to vote and to get the word out, we won't have a good representation of our base in the vote results. Does that seem fair? It seems like the right thing, too. I don't think a general vote on the default theme is a reasonable idea at all. Taste is not something that can be decided with simple majority. Voting for the default theme would pretty much devolve into 'which is the coolest looking background when glancing at a bunch of screenshots', which is not at all what a good default theme is about. This forum is the place for qualified and interested people to work on the art that makes up the default theme. It should also be the place where the default theme gets put together. If you want to gain more feedback on the drafts you work on, here is a proposal: next time, package up the remaining candidates in the final round (at that stage they should all be complete enough for that, I guess), and ship them with the beta, maybe with some nice paragraph in the beta release notes pointing at the available candidate themes. Matthias ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
