Re: help
On Thu, Jan 07, 2010 at 09:42:06PM +, jorge a secas wrote: we at work have some PC's with 256 MB RAM, the graphical mode doesn't load, so we choice the text mode, but in all machines we get the same error, Anaconda 12.47 What is the error you get in text mode? -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: entropy
On Thu, Jan 07, 2010 at 07:28:20PM +, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: But random(4) does not. Is there some other authoritative source for this? Yes. :) http://lxr.linux.no/#linux+v2.6.32/drivers/char/random.c -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: entropy
On Thu, Jan 07, 2010 at 06:40:02PM +0100, Roberto Ragusa wrote: Hi all, if I simply write to /dev/random, will that increase the entropy of my system? (I'm assuming that the data I'm writing are random and that somehow I got them). Wikipedia says so. My tests say no. How are you testing? The wikipedia article says: Non-random data is harmless, because only a privileged user can issue the ioctl needed to increase the entropy estimate. SO -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: upstart-0.6.3 in rawhide, tomorrow 2009-12-10
On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 04:16:15PM -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: Given how it's implemented, you could do something truly disgusting like ACTIVE_CONSOLES=$([ $RUNLEVEL = 3 ] echo '/dev/tty[1-6]' || echo '/dev/tty2') I'm not sure I really want to *support* people doing that, though. You mean, you don't like the idea of having different numbers of consoles running in different runlevels, or you don't like the abusing-shell-script-as-config-file thing? The latter. :) Cool, then. :) -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: upstart-0.6.3 in rawhide, tomorrow 2009-12-10
On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 03:32:29PM -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: One notable change that was made is that we were able to simplify the jobs to the point where the number of login consoles is now configurable, without editing or removing upstart job definitions. This is done by the ACTIVE_CONSOLES parameter in /etc/sysconfig/init; the default value is /dev/tty/[1-6], which means that mingetty will be started on ttys 1 through 6. Shell globs are accepted. How hard would it be to make this be different in runlevels 3 and 5? I like to have lots in runlevel 3, and few if X is available. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FreeType patented bytecode interpreter now in rawhide
On Fri, Dec 04, 2009 at 05:56:02PM +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote: IMHO, if we want to ship this by default, we really need to fix FreeType for the case where the font doesn't provide hinting bytecode. AFAICT, currently, in that case, if FreeType is built with the BCI enabled, it won't do any [...] It should fall back to the autohinter when the font does not provide hinting bytecode. Aha! So that's why all the open-source fonts on my screen suddenly got really ugly. Is there an open bugzilla bug for this? -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FreeType patented bytecode interpreter now in rawhide
On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 04:16:10PM -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: Is there an open bugzilla bug for this? There is now: bug #547532. Thanks. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: Bug in /etc/cron.d/mlocate.cron or am I crazy?
On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 09:53:47AM +0100, Michael Schwendt wrote: Have you tried it? The code in the file isn't an error; it's just very obscure bash syntax. That is, $( /some/file ) is obscure, and $( /some/file filter-command ) is *really* obscure. Doesn't seem to be documented in the bash manual -- but it works. See first chapter of topic REDIRECTION in bash manual. Yeah, not seein' it. Wouldn't be the first time I've been dense; can you point me at the exact text? And putting a | in the middle there doesn't. That would only work as expected when also replacing with cat. Of course. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Bug in /etc/cron.d/mlocate.cron or am I crazy?
On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 02:51:58PM -0500, Steven W. Orr wrote: Yes, I agree that if I see that script hanging on a regular basis then I will provide trace data to Bugzilla for further analysis. But this begs two questions: It's pretty important to know where it's hanging. I don't think it's likely to be a bug in awk; therefore, I think it's probably likely you'll see the same thing with your version of the script. Either way, the original script is deficient because it does not properly recognize fields 1 and 2. Again, only an issue if a filesystem type happens to be given the name nodev *and* isn't itself a nodev fs *and* shouldn't be excluded from updatedb anyway. So, that seems pretty academic, even though you're technically correct. Second, there's nothing performance-sensitive about this part of the script, so optimizing out an awk call at the expense of changing a simple one-liner to a half-page function doesn't seem like a win. So, updating the awk pattern to use either a regular expression or the same logic found in your function seems like the better change (if any is to be made at all). Am I being too anal? Is it a doc problem? Is it a bug in mlocate that should be fixed? -- Time flies like the wind. Fruit flies like a banana. Stranger things have .0. happened but none stranger than this. Does your driver's license say Organ ..0 Donor?Black holes are where God divided by zero. Listen to me! We are all- 000 individuals! What if this weren't a hypothetical question? steveo at syslang.net -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Bug in /etc/cron.d/mlocate.cron or am I crazy?
On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 05:34:28PM -0500, Steven W. Orr wrote:
Now you've jinxed it! I'll betcha a buck that Murphy is subscribed to this
list and that's the next thing that's going to happen. It'll probably be a
feature of ZFS. ;-)
I'm willing to bet up to *three* imaginary dollars that ZFS will be
called something like zfs. :)
I'm willing to work with this approach, but then the proper way to do it in
awk would be as follows:
nodevs=$( /proc/filesystems awk -F '\t' '/^nodev/ NF==2 { print $2 }')
Well, I think might as well go with the more straightforward syntax of
nodevs=$(awk -F '\t' '/^nodev/ NF==2 { print $2 }' /proc/filesystems)
but yeah. File a bug. :)
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Re: Looking for testers: RPM 4.8 pre-release snapshots available
On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:05:10AM +0200, Panu Matilainen wrote: So this is a call for brave testers who eat rawhide for breakfast, to try out pre-release snapshot(s) of the oncoming RPM release. This is not I'm in. :) -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: Looking for testers: RPM 4.8 pre-release snapshots available
On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 11:11:37AM -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: So this is a call for brave testers who eat rawhide for breakfast, to try out pre-release snapshot(s) of the oncoming RPM release. This is not I'm in. :) file /usr/lib/rpm/ocaml-find-provides.sh from install of rpm-build-4.7.90-0.git9625.lorg.x86_64 conflicts with file from package ocaml-runtime-3.11.1-6.fc13.x86_64 file /usr/lib/rpm/ocaml-find-requires.sh from install of rpm-build-4.7.90-0.git9625.lorg.x86_64 conflicts with file from package ocaml-runtime-3.11.1-6.fc13.x86_64 -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: root's ssh-agent $SSH_AUTH_SOCK
On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 12:10:20AM +, Martin Airs wrote: I've setup an authorized key for a server I regularly use, but when I tried to run ssh-add as root, it wouldn't work until I had copied the SSH_AUTH_SOCK environment variable from my normal user. Wait, back up a second. Well, two seconds. First of all, off-topic on the devel list -- this should be moved to the regular fedora list. (Please direct replies there.) Second, why do you wnt to do this as the root user directly? There's probably a better way to accomplish what you want to do in the first place. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: psacct/lastcomm shows allways root as user
On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 02:04:02PM +0100, Herbert Gasiorowski wrote: On Fedora 12 lastcomm only shows root user, even for commands from other users. It seems to me that e.g. my uid is not within the /var/account/pacct file - it is allways zero - thus root. It all works fine with fedora 11. Hmmm, yeah -- something is broken there. Have you filed a bug? -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Bug in /etc/cron.d/mlocate.cron or am I crazy?
On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:55:17PM -0500, Steven W. Orr wrote:
I can't believe this is a real bug. I'm submit it to bugzilla. It's in F10, 11
and 12. I'd be curious to know just how old this bug is.
Contents of mlocate.cron is:
#!/bin/sh
nodevs=$( /proc/filesystems awk '$1 == nodev { print $2 }')
[...]
Unless I'm going cuckoo, I'm guessing that the intent was for line two to be:
nodevs=$( /proc/filesystems | awk '$1 == nodev { print $2 }')
Have you tried it? The code in the file isn't an error; it's just very
obscure bash syntax. That is, $( /some/file ) is obscure, and $(
/some/file filter-command ) is *really* obscure. Doesn't seem to be
documented in the bash manual -- but it works. And putting a | in the middle
there doesn't.
For clarity alone, though, I'd argue that it should be changed to:
nodevs=$(awk '$1 == nodev { print $2 }' /proc/filesystems)
but I don't see what your longer function really buys, and ${#BASH_REMATCH}
doesn't exactly win in readability.
Note that as it was written, it did not properly take into account the empty
first token.
Well, in the unlikely event that someone names a filesystem nodev, maybe
that's worthwhile. :) But I think
nodevs=$(awk '/^nodev\t/ { print $2 }' /proc/filesystems)
Would do just as well, yeah?
Also, I don't know about the rest of you guys, but this script used to hang on
me on a regular basis. I'll look and see awk just hung. This bypasses awk or
any pipe at all and will never hang.
I've never seen that, but if you are, I expect you're just as likely to get
hangs with the done /proc/filesystem.
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Re: Fedora 12 Graphics Issues: Cancel F13 and concentrate on fixing F12 ?
On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 02:01:00PM +, Terry Barnaby wrote: another set of problems. The new release speed also uses a lot of developer and user time in just managing to create a new release and updating systems to use it. This is the key flaw in your suggestion. Fedora developer effort isn't as malleable as you seem to think -- managing a new release is very different from fixing graphics bugs, and even if everyone involved in a different aspect of the project _wanted_ to switch to graphics driver programming _and_ was qualified to do so _and_ was able to get up to speed in a reasonable time, you can't necessarily solve programming problems faster by multiplying the number of developers. On the other hand, having a release which emphasizes stability over new features is an idea that's been around for a while. It may be a good idea occasionally, but one of the problems you get is that new development in general doesn't stop and wait for stabilization, so the _next_ release, where you open things up again, ends up extra-unstable as all that new stuff hits at once. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
PolicyKit and syslog
One of the important features of sudo is its ability to log elevated-access actions to syslog. Userhelper similarly logs actions, like so: userhelper[26491]: running '/usr/share/system-config-users/system-config-users ' with root privileges on behalf of 'mattdm'. PolicyKit serves a similar function, but doesn't seem to log anything. In fact, the only use of syslog appears to be in polkit-agent-helper-1, which logs in two possible situations -- when called with the wrong number of arguments and when stdin is a tty. (Most other things it fprintfs to stderr.) I'm not bringing this up to complain -- I just want to make sure that I'm not missing something (which happens more often than it should; *sigh*). If I'm not missing something, is this something anyone is working on already or has existing plans for? -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: PolicyKit and syslog
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:35:13AM -0500, Matthias Clasen wrote: PolicyKit itself is not running anything. It is just answering the question of a mechanism: 'is X allowed to do foo ?'. It would make more sense for the mechanisms that use PolicyKit to log privileged actions that they do or deny to do. That makes sense. However, I can see strengths in both approaches. A good analogy is PAM, particularly the auth section, which does basically the same thing¹ as PolicyKit. There, you get logs both from the application itself and from PAM directly. There are four particular strengths I see in logging at the PolicyKit level. 1) Existing applications don't need to be changed, and new applications don't need to be counted on to do the right thing. Appropriate logging just starts happening. 2) Log levels and debugging are easier to admin because there's a central configuration (and PolicyKit already has config files). If I want to turn on more authentication 3) Log messages are automatically consistent between programs, making analysis and monitoring much easier. 4) PolicyKit is in a position to log more about the decisions it makes than is (or should be) exposed to the client application. This can be particularly useful for debugging but may also be useful for auditing. (If a user was allowed access for a certain reason, and that reason turns out to be something they shouldn't have access to but do, we can know to investigate.) Also, since this is a security/auditing issue, I thing it's never wrong to error on the side of more logging. I absolutely agree that client applications should also log their elevated-privilege actions. 1. In fact, a PAM-backed authority for PolicyKit might be interesting and useful -- but there's a tangent. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: PolicyKit and syslog
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:47:03AM -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: I'd recommend filing this as a bug. I definitely will -- I just want to get some feedback first. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org http://mattdm.org/ -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
tangent: PolicyKit and PAM
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 12:44:00PM -0500, Matthias Clasen wrote: 1. In fact, a PAM-backed authority for PolicyKit might be interesting and useful -- but there's a tangent. What do you think PolicyKit is using for authentication ? See http://cgit.freedesktop.org/PolicyKit/tree/src/polkitagent/polkitagenthelper.c It uses it for authentication *and* for authorization, but it uses one service name (polkit-1) for everything (which is in turn configured by default to just defer to the standard system-auth service definition). This arrangement isn't particularly useful for a flexible authorization policy. You can use it for the big-hammer user-is-locked out stuff, but not for things like local users can install packages without a password, only during business hours, which PAM is perfectly expressive enough to do (with existing modules, even). I don't think, offhand, that it could be quite as flexible as the Local Authority currently in PolicyKit or via some fancy LDAP Authority, but I don't think it necessarily would need to be. The main advantage would be that instead of having yet another way (and again, I want to emphasize that I think PolicyKit is good work) to implement authorization policy, one could use PolicyKit with a well-understood mechanism that's been in production use since the 90s. Like I said, this is a tangent, and I'm certainly not expecting anyone to work on this. But it'd be cool if they did. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: tangent: PolicyKit and PAM
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 01:27:40PM -0500, Matthias Clasen wrote: Like I said, this is a tangent, and I'm certainly not expecting anyone to work on this. But it'd be cool if they did. Just as everybody else is struggling to get away from pam's awful apis...I don't think this would be a step forward; but sure, it might be doable. The awful API is actually an argument _for_ doing such a thing: it gets encapsulated away in only one place that needs to be maintained, and everyone can just write to PolicyKit. Annd speaking of tangents and horrible interfaces, I should add that one thing I'm very genuinely happy to learn in all of this is that the pkla config files are key=value rather than the old PolicyKit.conf xml file. So much nicer for humans to work with! -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
PolicyKit and syslog -- now bug #541040
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:47:03AM -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: I'd recommend filing this as a bug. Bug 541040 - Enable logging in PolicyKit (for policy changes and for authorizations.) https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=541040 -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org http://mattdm.org/ -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: Security testing: need for a security policy, and a security-critical package process
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 01:29:11PM -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: You mean Sugar as configured on the XO? (It has passwordless user, who can su without a password.) Annnd if you set a root password, stuff breaks. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: [RFC] unified i386/x86_64 install media.
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 06:17:08PM -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: the goal for F-13 is to have unified media, for F-14 and beyond we could look at other options like having a 64 bit kernel and 32 bit userland. i should have stated that a bit more clearly So would this mean one disk with two repositories on it, or is everything mashed together all in one repository? -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
PolicyKit and syslog
One of the important features of sudo is its ability to log elevated-access actions to syslog. Userhelper similarly logs actions, like so: userhelper[26491]: running '/usr/share/system-config-users/system-config-users ' with root privileges on behalf of 'mattdm'. PolicyKit serves a similar function, but doesn't seem to log anything. In fact, the only use of syslog appears to be in polkit-agent-helper-1, which logs in two possible situations -- when called with the wrong number of arguments and when stdin is a tty. (Most other things it fprintfs to stderr.) I'm not bringing this up to complain -- I just want to make sure that I'm not missing something (which happens more often than it should; *sigh*). If I'm not missing something, is this something anyone is working on already or has existing plans for? -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- Fedora-security-list mailing list Fedora-security-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-security-list
Re: PolicyKit and syslog
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:35:13AM -0500, Matthias Clasen wrote: PolicyKit itself is not running anything. It is just answering the question of a mechanism: 'is X allowed to do foo ?'. It would make more sense for the mechanisms that use PolicyKit to log privileged actions that they do or deny to do. That makes sense. However, I can see strengths in both approaches. A good analogy is PAM, particularly the auth section, which does basically the same thing¹ as PolicyKit. There, you get logs both from the application itself and from PAM directly. There are four particular strengths I see in logging at the PolicyKit level. 1) Existing applications don't need to be changed, and new applications don't need to be counted on to do the right thing. Appropriate logging just starts happening. 2) Log levels and debugging are easier to admin because there's a central configuration (and PolicyKit already has config files). If I want to turn on more authentication 3) Log messages are automatically consistent between programs, making analysis and monitoring much easier. 4) PolicyKit is in a position to log more about the decisions it makes than is (or should be) exposed to the client application. This can be particularly useful for debugging but may also be useful for auditing. (If a user was allowed access for a certain reason, and that reason turns out to be something they shouldn't have access to but do, we can know to investigate.) Also, since this is a security/auditing issue, I thing it's never wrong to error on the side of more logging. I absolutely agree that client applications should also log their elevated-privilege actions. 1. In fact, a PAM-backed authority for PolicyKit might be interesting and useful -- but there's a tangent. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- Fedora-security-list mailing list Fedora-security-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-security-list
Re: PolicyKit and syslog
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:47:03AM -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: I'd recommend filing this as a bug. I definitely will -- I just want to get some feedback first. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org http://mattdm.org/ -- Fedora-security-list mailing list Fedora-security-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-security-list
PolicyKit and syslog -- now bug #541040
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:47:03AM -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: I'd recommend filing this as a bug. Bug 541040 - Enable logging in PolicyKit (for policy changes and for authorizations.) https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=541040 -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org http://mattdm.org/ -- Fedora-security-list mailing list Fedora-security-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-security-list
Re: Local users get to play root?
On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 11:46:50PM -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=538615 bug is already opened. Thanks -- for some reason I couldn't find it in my early-morning searches. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: Local users get to play root?
On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 11:45:14AM -0800, Dan Williams wrote: But that's not right because those files aren't config files. Instead, you drop local authority files in /var/lib/polkit-1/localauthority/ that override those permissions on a site-by-site basis for your specific use-case, irregardless of what the defaults are. The config files live in /var? Really. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: intent to retire: kudzu
On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 10:58:24AM -0500, Peter Jones wrote: Really, temporarily removing this is more desirable than merely passing maintainership of kudzu around. Kudzu needs to actually go away. Yay! -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs / Instructional Research Computing Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: prelink: is it worth it?
On Thu, Jul 09, 2009 at 08:58:08AM -0600, Pete Zaitcev wrote: Apparently there was some fun with prelink breaking everything in rawhide recently: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=509655. I didn't notice, because like Pete Zaitcev says in the comments, removing prelink is one of the first things I do. I meant that it was the first thing I did when the root cause became known. This is not the same thing as removing mlocate upon install that everyone do. Sorry -- didn't mean to put words into your mouth. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: prelink: is it worth it?
On Thu, Jul 09, 2009 at 07:55:38AM -0700, Ulrich Drepper wrote: hot disk cache to be fair). The number of cycles for total startup is representative of the win. I'm not sure that's the case. If I can get a 50% speed up to a program's startup times, that sounds great, but if I then leave that program running for days on end, I haven't actually won very much at all -- but I still pay the price continuously. (That price being: fragility, verifiability, and of course the prelinking activity itself.) Note, also small but frequently used apps benefit. I run gcc etc a lot and like every single saved cycle. Right, this actually seems more significant to me, even though it may be less important in terms of marketing to new Linux desktop users. But saving every last possible cycle is only one concern of many, particularly when deciding on a default configuration. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: [Phoronix] Ubuntu 9.04 vs. Fedora 11 Performance
On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 06:05:52AM +0300, Gilboa Davara wrote: Up until 30 minutes ago, I was unaware of the fact that they use test-suite compiled binaries. Though I'd imagine that in Phoronix' view, having (far) different compile options in the distribution supplied binaries might generate invalid results. (Due to missing features, non-standard optimization, etc) It depends what they're trying to test. The name of the benchmark is really misleading, and causes bad extrapolation -- it's called Apache Benchmark, but really all they mean is Apache-BASED benchmark. They're not benchmarking http performance on the distro: they're benchmarking *something* represented by exercising a certain bit of code (which happens to be Apache httpd) in a certain way. -- Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org Senior Systems Architect Cyberinfrastructure Labs Computing Information Technology Harvard School of Engineering Applied Sciences -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
best fedora-out-of-the-box pcmcia wifi?
Does anyone have a recommendation for a modern PCMCIA/PC Card wifi card which just works out of the box with recent Fedora? I can download a firmware blob if I have to, but extra points for not having to. These days all new laptops have wireless built in so all the current info I can find seems focused on that. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Which ATI graphics card shall I choose for fedora/rhel
On Wed, Aug 20, 2008 at 11:24:47AM +0100, Dan Track wrote: Thanks for that. My supplier said he can't get that card but he said he can get the Saphirre Radeon x1650 Pro 512MB DDR2 AGP VGA DVI TV, would you know if that's supported and would work well with fedora 9 and compiz? That's an R500 chipset. It'll work in 2d now, and 3D (and with compiz) in the future. If you need 3D now, you need a much older card -- R200 or R300 chipset. Look at the man page for radeon for product name-to-chipset matching. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: sudo GUI frontend
On Wed, Aug 20, 2008 at 03:22:20PM +0300, Gilboa Davara wrote: I might have mis-represented my request: I'm using sudo to give users selective rights over certain services. However, sudo requires a user password, once in while (good thing) - and I rather use a GUI front-end for that. Which services? You may be able to use consolehelper (or even PolicyKit, for newer things). -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: HP 2133 Report
On Wed, Aug 20, 2008 at 09:35:10AM -0600, Phil Meyer wrote: Overall, recommended, especially if the openchrome driver gets updated. Thanks for the report. I'm looking hard at this thing as a replacement for my Vaio U101 -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: Infrastructure status, 2008-08-19 UTC 0200
On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 06:10:50PM +0930, Tim wrote: Is it just me, or do others also think that a public email (even a signed one) would be almost the worst place to trust a fingerprint announcement? Laszlo BERES: If the mail is correctly signed then it's OK. A message being correctly signed isn't quite the same thing as being able to verify that it's been produced by the person in question. If it's widely distributed and seen as okay by multiple people who can verify it directly, it's perfectly fine. After all, it's *meant* to be public information. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: Infrastructure status, 2008-08-19 UTC 0200
On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 07:45:29AM -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: Signatures tell you that whoever produced them has the private key, the rest is assumption. Same with the host key, really. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: Fedora upgrade from 6 to 9
On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 01:36:54PM +0300, Sundeep Pundamale wrote: Can some one provide instructions to upgrade fedora 6 to fedora 9. What are the precautions that needs to be taken so as to not break the system and existing configurations. Here's how I'd think about it: how would you get the system configuration and data back if the hard drive failed? At this level of update, you're probably best doing a clean install and then recreating your existing configuration. (Easiest to do if you have /home on a separate partition.) -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: Fedora upgrade from 6 to 9
On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 02:02:07PM +0300, Sundeep Pundamale wrote: Thats the constraint i have. The linux box has apache, php, mysql,svn, openfire, openvpn, samba and many more applications running. Doing a fresh installation and reconfiguring all these applications would be a very time consuming task. Is there some other alternative that is more feasible rather than a fresh installation. You could try an upgrade, but in my experience, that's *more* time consuming than a fresh install. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
important question about updates [was Re: Infrastructure status, 2008-08-19 UTC 0200]
On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 02:07:45AM +, Paul W. Frields wrote: Please give the infrastructure team the time they need to do this demanding work. They have been doing a spectacular job and deserve the absolute highest credit. Having been in some serious infrastructure-crunch situations myself, I can definitely imagine. We know the community is awaiting more detail on the past week's activities and their causes. We're preparing a timeline and details and will make them available in the near future. We appreciate the community's patience, and will continue to post updates to the fedora-announce-list as soon as possible. Paul, your original message contained an ominous warning that no one should download or update any additional packages. This is an untenable situation for anyone depending on Fedora. You haven't mentioned this at all in the subsequent messages; does this still apply? Following the line of thought to its logical conclusion, is there a risk that end-user systems are compromised in some way via previous updates? I know you've got things to work out, but with the school year starting and all, we need to know what level of recovery work of our own will be required. I'm not looking forward to following the infrastructure's long weekend with one of my own -- but if I'm going to have to, I'd really appreciate knowing about it as soon as possible. Thanks. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: Infrastructure status, 2008-08-16 UTC 1530
On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 10:15:24AM -0800, Jeff Spaleta wrote: The specific current situation aside for a moment. As a Board member, I am interested in thinking about a better mechanism of communication of anything hoped to be seen by the entire community. Is the annouce list the best thing we can do? Or is it just the best thing we can do right now given our current tools? Nothing's ever perfect but their maybe room to try something new with regard to communication mechanisms... if there are people willing to put the effort in to build it. The _mechanism_ seems fine. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: Infrastructure status, 2008-08-16 UTC 1530
On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 11:09:09PM -0400, max wrote: I wondered that, too. The original posting was too vague. You can't tell if they're just fixing a fault, or sorting out an attack. Assume the latter and act accordingly. Like, how? Quick, switch everything to another distro? We don't know enough to act reasonably. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Re: Infrastructure status, 2008-08-16 UTC 1530
On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 11:30:03AM -0400, Paul W. Frields wrote: The Fedora Infrastructure team continues to work on the issues we discovered earlier this week. Right now, we're getting the account system restored to service, along with some of the application servers. We're also taking advantage of the outages to upgrade a few systems at the same time. So, is it safe to apply updates? -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
FUDCon Boston transportation warning for those taking the Red Line
People on the Cambridge side of the river need to be aware that the MBTA is doing repairs on the tracks on the Longfellow Bridge the weekend of FUDCon, which means they'll be running busses between Kendall and Park. In the best-case scenario it means anyone planning to come to BU by that route needs to add another 15 minutes to their planned commute. I'm planning to go to Central Square and take the 47 bus across the river instead. Or if the weather is nice, just walk from there. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Fedora more successful, developer-wise, than Ubuntu
On Mon, Dec 24, 2007 at 04:02:39PM -0600, Jon Stanley wrote:
and it's derivatives, a la CentOS. Someone looking for a free as in
{speech,beer} distribution with long term support I tend to point
towards CentOS, but maybe there is middle ground between that and the
current Fedora that we don't have.
There was, in Fedora Legacy. But there turned out to be too little interest.
--
Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/
Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/
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Re: FUDCon *PLANNING* [was Re: FUDCon Marketing?]
On Wed, Dec 19, 2007 at 11:38:39AM -0500, Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote: Well, then, we should announce the summer FUDCon now, since we know it'll be in Boston in conjunction with the Red Hat Summit. Yes, totally we should. Give me a minute here though. :) -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: future of FUDCon proposal
On Wed, Oct 24, 2007 at 01:52:57PM -0700, Karsten Wade wrote: FUDCon a bigger and better thing is worth it. Imagine if $someone were doing all the logistics and all we have to do is fill the whiteboard on the day of the talks? :) Yeah, that was Pam Andrews. :) -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Fedora name stolen by another project :(
On Fri, Oct 19, 2007 at 01:43:43AM +0100, Keith G. Robertson-Turner wrote: See for yourself: http://www.fedora.info/ It /is/ an Open Source project, however they must surely have known about the /real/ Fedora project when they summarily took our name. http://www.fedora.info/about/history.shtml Predates Fedora, even Warren's original Fedora repository. Basically, both projects were using the name in their own little worlds for several years before either became a big deal. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Fedora: Freedom is a Feature
On Sun, Oct 07, 2007 at 12:24:06AM -0400, Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: liberty (or so is my [limited] understanding of the English language), I do believe that the Freedom in Fedora and Free and Open Source software is actually liberty (non-ambiguous with gratis or free of [monetary] cost). In Spanish there is no way to confuse libre with free (of In English, freedom alwys applies to the liberty-related senses of the word, not to cost-free. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Fedora: Freedom is a Feature.
On Sun, Oct 07, 2007 at 09:27:07PM +0200, M Daniel R Magarzo wrote: -Simplicity —finding the core of any idea.. Pass (maybe) -Unexpectedness —grabbing people's attention by surprising them ... FAIL (IMO) Perhaps this is the key difference between the slogan to computer-savvy English speakers and translated. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Freedom is *just* a Feature?
On Sat, Oct 06, 2007 at 01:05:02AM -0400, Máirín Duffy wrote: I don't really see the word feature as computer jargon. People's faces have features. My stove, refrigerator, and dishwasher have features. My car has features. Movies have featured actors and actresses, and the main show is considered the 'feature'. Is it just a translation issue? It's certainly *also* a non-jargon word, but it also has additional layers of meaning for software. For example, from ESR's Jargon File: There's a related joke that is sometimes referred to as the one-question geek test. You say to someone I saw a Volkswagen Beetle today with a vanity license plate that read FEATURE. If he/she laughs, he/she is a geek. The fact that this makes for a test is an indication that there is some special meaning. And I think it's particularly that special meaning in the slogan that's resonating with people. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Freedom is *just* a Feature?
On Sat, Oct 06, 2007 at 11:28:23AM +0200, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: Right -- and I think for most of Fedora's core market, as well -- Wrong Note not *total* market. precisely because we hear it in the sense of computer jargon. You've nailed it, this is a slogan for english computer jargon speakers. In other words a slogan for hardcore technophiles. I don't think we want to restrict our audience to hardcore technophiles (at least one of our major derivatives, OLPC, doesn't) The English-language/translation thing is a bit troubling. But I'm pretty comfortable with saying that Fedora's *core* market is technophiles. If we want it to be something else, we need to change some of Fedora's key design decisions -- particularly, the upgrade-yearly lifespan. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Freedom is *just* a Feature?
On Sat, Oct 06, 2007 at 10:34:52AM -0400, jkeating wrote: So again I ask, what is so terrible if English printed stuff uses 'Freedom is a Feature' and things printed in other languages use a slogan that is suitable for that language? I would hope and expect And actually, it doesn't translate badly into other languages, or badly into non-jargon English. It just loses the kick. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Freedom is *just* a Feature?
On Sat, Oct 06, 2007 at 01:13:15PM -0400, Jeremy Hogan wrote: Interesting point. I didn't read it as just a feature. I read it more like Fedora, Featuring Freedom, like freedom was being featured or highlighted as a special ingredient. I think it may suffer the nuances of English, but that may only mean having a different wording with the same sentiment in other languages. One implication is: Featuring freedom today, featuring something else tomorrow. Like a feature at the movies. :) -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: FUDcon and XO Laptop Event!
On Fri, Oct 05, 2007 at 09:37:17AM -0400, Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote: Kind of hard to get anything done at the FUDcon if it's also a circus I disagree. You just have to make sure that the Big Top is well isolated from the roustabouts who are doing the work out back. :) Well, I was skeptical about the whole barcamp thing last time and that totally worked, so I'll defer to you here. Bring on the circus! -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Fedora: Freedom is a Feature.
On Fri, Oct 05, 2007 at 11:46:57AM -0400, Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote: Or are you just remarking on the perceived irony of a phrase containing the word freedom being considered a form of intellectual property? This point exactly. With other slogans, I'd be less concerned. With this slogan, the idea of protecting the mark gives me some pretty serious heartburn. Maybe we could leave off the TM but include somewhere some lighthearted fine print about it being a trademark irony notwithstanding and we know that sounds silly but hey, gotta use the law to protect freedom too. I'm too tired to be really witty right now but maybe someone else can pick up from there. :) -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Freedom is *just* a Feature?
On Sat, Oct 06, 2007 at 03:05:50AM +0300, Saadaldine AlSaidi wrote: I guess Freedom in fedora is not just a feature its the core and putting it as a feature really reduce the whole idea. maybe we can say Fedora: Freedom is the essence or Fedora: where Freedom is the essence This is a very legitimate point. A feature is something prominent but not necessarily eanything vital. Consider: Fedora 8 Feature List Online Desktop Bluetooth Build ID Codec Buddy Eclipse33 Electronic Lab Freedom Generic Logos IcedTea Nepali Language Support Nodoka Theme PAM Console (remove it) Policy Kit Pulse Audio rsyslog Tickless Kernel Transifex Virt Security Wakeups (fix them) XFS (no more) There's a risk of Freedom: It's In There With The Other Bells And Whistles. Or worse, Freedom: A Feature Sort Of Like SELinux, Which Everybody Turns Off When It Comes Time To Do Anything Useful. But Freedom is the Essence doesn't have the same resonance. And Freedom: Not Just a Feature! takes too much thinking to be a good slogan. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: FUDcon and XO Laptop Event!
On Thu, Oct 04, 2007 at 06:15:30PM -0400, Markus McLaughlin wrote: The next major FUDcon should also be a media event because the XO Laptop Kind of hard to get anything done at the FUDcon if it's also a circus -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: FUDCon logo
On Wed, Oct 03, 2007 at 05:52:39PM -0400, Máirín Duffy wrote: What do you think about designing an official FUDcon logo to be used at FUDcons all over the world? In favor. If you can work my picture into it, so much the better. *grin* -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: FUDCon logo
On Wed, Oct 03, 2007 at 05:52:39PM -0400, Máirín Duffy wrote: What do you think about designing an official FUDcon logo to be used at FUDcons all over the world? In favor. If you can work my picture into it, so much the better. *grin* -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Question about our Brand
On Mon, Sep 17, 2007 at 02:31:49PM -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: 2) When someone asks What is Fedora what is our official answer? Apparently, my t-shirt is!. Um. Sorry. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Animated fedora logo
On Sat, Sep 15, 2007 at 01:30:53AM +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: izaac zavaleta wrote: Excellent work, but: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/gif.html That page is clearly outdated. You should inform GNU of this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GIF Err, yeah, I think they're aware, given that it starts with: While this story is a historical illustration of the danger of software patents, these particular patents are now no longer a concern (see footnote below). For details of our website policies regarding GIFs, see our web guidelines. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: [New Feature Proposition]: Nodoka Theme
On Tue, Jul 17, 2007 at 11:19:52AM +0200, Martin Sourada wrote: Comments, feedback, patches, etc. welcome. I'd really love to see a grey version of the theme (a la Mac OS X). Bright color elements are distracting to me. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ ___ Fedora-art-list mailing list Fedora-art-list@redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-art-list
Re: expanding Fedora user base
On Fri, Apr 13, 2007 at 12:28:06AM +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: 2. Fedora is not warm and fuzzy to newbies. I really love the parrot but efforts toward a masot may lead to a sense of misrepresentation by newcomers. Not a good long-term strategy. A parrot has not been decided as a mascot nor have we even decided that e need a mascot at all. Your comment on it seems premature. Although this brings up an important point -- parrots have a lifespan of decades -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: [Ambassadors] Fedora
On Mon, Mar 05, 2007 at 04:59:17PM -0300, Rodrigo Padula de Oliveira wrote: Hi Guys! Read this: http://www.linux.com/article.pl?sid=07/02/21/1340237 Or, really, really, really, don't. (It's the ESR hey everybody look at me letter again.) -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Some Idea....please reply
On Thu, Mar 01, 2007 at 12:35:01AM +0100, Giuseppe Pignataro wrote: 1) My first idea is to create a site like linuxcounter for people that use Fedora. I believe that this idea is good for two reason. [...] See: http://smolt.fedoraproject.org/ -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: ESR gives up on Fedora
On Wed, Feb 21, 2007 at 03:54:46PM +0100, Francesco Ugolini wrote: Read this article: http://enterprise.linux.com/enterprise/07/02/21/1340237.shtml?tid=23tid=12 . I think we have to reflect on this pamphlet, and we have to answer him, directly or indirectly. I think Alan Cox's short answer was the best. Beyond that, there's not much to say. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Fedora Legacy
On Fri, Jan 12, 2007 at 09:33:43PM -, Wilson Andrew wrote: Not least because it leaves me a job to do with my fedora servers (many of which are FC3)! That got me thinking... should I be lamenting lack of community interest in the project, and moving on; or should I be trying to help. Well, you probably could have helped five months ago. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Red Hat's Fedora to Get Longer Support
On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 04:43:45PM +, Leo wrote: * Tejas Dinkar (2007-01-11 08:23 -0800) said: etc... etc... etc.. Are those apps you mentioned in Debian GNU/Linux? I believe they apply a much stricter license policy than Fedora. Are you seriously asking if Debian includes the Linux kernel, the Apache web server, MySQL, or any of Perl, PHP, or Python? -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: Thanks FL! (was: Fedora Legacy shutting down)
On Sat, Dec 30, 2006 at 12:10:33PM +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: On Fri, Dec 29, 2006 at 11:23:47PM -0600, David Eisenstein wrote: In case any of you are not aware, the Fedora Legacy project is in the process of shutting down. I think since this is the very official end of the project, very official thanks for all efforts are in order! Yes, thank you so much, everyone. All of your work has been very helpful. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Legacy wiki -- statement?
On Wed, Dec 13, 2006 at 08:16:47AM -0600, Philip Molter wrote: On Tue, Dec 12, 2006 at 04:42:36PM -0600, Mike McCarty wrote: Now, let me get started on migrating those last servers running legacy versions of Fedora Core... Migrating them to what? That's my question. If you can't upgrade every year (or ideally, twice year), CentOS is the clear answer. If you make that kind of statement, you are effectively removing high-end server testing from Fedora Core. If FC is still supposed to be a testbed for the newer software, whether it's desktop or high-end server, then that sounds like the wrong thing to say. It is the *truthful* thing to say. I agree wholeheartedly with you, but without serious (financial and personnel) backing for Fedora Legacy, it *cannot happen*. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Legacy wiki -- statement?
On Tue, Dec 12, 2006 at 01:46:21PM +0100, Nils Breunese (Lemonbit) wrote: like Plesk. Yes, you're reading that right: Plesk is still supported on FC1. They don't tell you that FC1 itself has been EOL for some time now. Note that Plesk is not particularly unique in this... Totally. This is why I'm surprised that there's not been more interest in Legacy. But not too surprised -- most people don't really care about keeping their systems secure. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Legacy wiki -- statement?
On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 05:56:42PM -0600, Mike McCarty wrote: We can't and shouldn't announce anything on core/extra's behalf, we just need to say that the current model is being reorganized and while doing so distributions X, Y, Z have effectively fallen out of maintenance. where X=2, Y=3, and Z=4. :) Hmm. Do you mean FC2, FC3, and FC4? FC2 has been out of support for quite some time, and for other reasons. Well, I had three values to work with. :) -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Legacy wiki -- statement?
On Sat, Dec 09, 2006 at 10:40:30PM +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: We can't and shouldn't announce anything on core/extra's behalf, we just need to say that the current model is being reorganized and while doing so distributions X, Y, Z have effectively fallen out of maintenance. where X=2, Y=3, and Z=4. :) -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: nails in coffins? Re: Openssl updates
On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 09:11:52AM -0600, Rex Dieter wrote: Unfortunately I will have to be migrating our last Fedora servers over to CentOS even sooner now... I take it, then, that extending Fedora's (supported) life-cycle to 13+ mos isn't sufficient for your needs? That's the case here too, and as I suggested earlier, is also true for many, many other people who haven't said anything. (I'm basing this on circumstantial evidence, but, for example, observe the number of people who crop on fedora-list with FC3 questions.) However, ample evidence has made it clear that without significant resources from someone with money to dedicate to this project (i.e. at least one full-time position), more than 13 months is not practical. Therefore, CentOS is the best answer for this large segment of users. That's a loss for Fedora, but, whatchagonnado. Going to 13 months will at least cover a different largish segment. ..__ ...___ ..__ __ ._.. _ ._ ___ ._.. ._ .__ .._ .____ ._ .____ Fedora +13 mo.CentOS/RHEL RHELUnixStill running mainframes -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: nails in coffins? Re: Openssl updates
On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 08:12:53AM -0500, Jesse Keating wrote: That honestly depends on if releasing core to the outside world gets the approval of Red Hat management. We hope it does, and if it does (and if Legacy and FESCO agrees) than the 13month will fall into effect. So it hasn't been decided yet. Everyone's pretty much talking like this is a done deal. Any idea when an official decision will be made? -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: nails in coffins? Re: Openssl updates
On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 10:35:44AM -0500, Jesse Keating wrote: Everyone's pretty much talking like this is a done deal. Any idea when an official decision will be made? I'm involved in discussions with RH management this week, and probably next week. Okay, thanks for the update. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: nails in coffins? Re: Openssl updates
On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 04:40:55PM +0100, Nils Breunese (Lemonbit) wrote: Not for that couple of FC3 machines my clients have running. Or am I misunderstanding the 13 months of support somehow? FC3 was released on November 8 2004. Also, FC4 (I don't have any FC4 machines) was released on June 13 2005, so I guess that is also EOL effectively. In terms of have their been a meaningful number of updates for real security problems, they are EOL *now* -- just sans announcement. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: [Fedora-marketing-list] Name for future Fedora distribition?
On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 02:37:21AM -0500, Luya Tshimbalanga wrote: How about Fedora Synergy? That name implies the effort from both community and developers and the fact it is the base of several distribution like Red Hat Enterprise Linux and One Laptop Per Child. Fedora Buzzwordy. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
Re: nails in coffins? Re: Openssl updates
On Wed, Nov 29, 2006 at 01:26:12PM -0600, David Eisenstein wrote: I wish I could do more. But really, I don't know that that wish is realistic. Does anyone else wish more could be done? Or do we just kill the project? Well, as I've said, I wish more could be done, but I can't really do it. I think the best thing is to officially hang up the Closed sign as soon as possible. If, later, there's interest in extending the lifespan of a particular release, we can revisit. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: nails in coffins? Re: Openssl updates
On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 03:33:59AM +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: I would rephrase it in a positive way: Legacy is merged with Core and Extras under one umbrella redefining EOL time marks. E.g. there is a shorter total lifespan, but during that lifespan there is more manpower assigned to get timely security fixes out. The current compromise is that FL was extending Fedora by 12 months, where now it will be only 4 additional months. Reviving FL in these terms would mean to try to extend a couple more months. But let's give that new model a new chance first and measure demand and available manpower after the first implementation of this model. Sounds good. I think the important thing, though, is to state clearly that FC3, FC4, and before are effectively unsupported *right now*. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 10:40:57PM -0500, Nils Breunese wrote: Every system needs an admin. I don't think it's realistic to not run 'yum update' for a year and expect everything to be fine. If you'd If there's no updates available, it doesn't matter how often they run yum update. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Thu, Nov 16, 2006 at 10:39:12AM -0500, Nils Breunese (Lemonbit) wrote: That's why every system needs an admin (and not a nightly yum cron job). A real admin will know or notice there are no updates available and take appropriate action. Preaching to the choir. However, there's reality for you. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Tue, Nov 14, 2006 at 10:06:57PM -0600, Eric Rostetter wrote: First I would like to say to those who say Fedora Legacy has failed, that it _did_ work (i.e. didn't fail) for the most critical time period and the most critical OS version (RHL 7-9, FC1). If it has failed, or is failing, it must not be forgotten that before it failed it worked exceedingly well. Or at least moderately well. Let's not over-sell. :) Second, I'm fairly comfortable with saying that if FC goes to a 13 month support cycle, FL is basically not needed anymore. IMHO, people can upgrade once a year when presented with a known/documented release cycle, and known documented alternatives. One month of annual overlap is still a bit short. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 10:10:13AM -0500, Jesse Keating wrote: So why don't you use CentOS which as a annual or every other year release? We use CentOS too. However, people a) want more cutting-edge and b) want Fedora. And if my group doesn't provide something that covers that demand, people will go off on their own, and then the security team will go back to being hugely overloaded with Linux break-ins. To expand on my earlier kvetching (sorry, no coffee yet): I'm not able to force anyone here to do anything. Therefore, I have to encourage good practice entirely via carrots. This works best when we align with the academic year -- a release in the spring, current through the following summer to allow time for upgrades. Ideally, *two* years and a summer, but I understand that's not practical. As it is, what will happen is: whatever Fedora release is current as of June-July-August will get installed on people's systems, and, with goading, upgraded the next summer. If the actual Fedora release happens to be new in June-July, the 13-month plan will be great, but if the latest release was from, say, January, that leaves a big hole in which systems *will* get broken into. But, I find If you need it to really work, use CentOS to be a bad answer for Fedora. CentOS is great, but since it is by necessity in its own world, CentOS users don't feed back into the Fedora ecosystem in the same way, which is a big loss for Fedora. (With the new baby, I missed out on following the extras-for-RHEL discussion -- I need to check into how that's panning out, and how it fits with merging Extras and Core. The availability of Extras is currently a huge draw for Fedora over CentOS.) So, given the realities, we probably will end up shifting our main BU Linux efforts to Fedora, but may also provide a BU Linux Extreme Fedora spin. I'm not sure how best to fit this into our calendar. If we disregard that, we'll end up with insecure systems that just disregard *us*. Extending the lifespan from ~9 to ~13 months is a huge help, but to cover the gaps, we really need more like 18-19. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 11:17:19AM -0500, Jesse Keating wrote: How much of this is just speculation at this point, and how close is this to being actual policy? Depends on your feedback (: Don't get me wrong -- this is definitely a positive development. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 11:43:10AM -0500, Jesse Keating wrote: Well, based on history, it'll be slightly behind-the-newest at release date (RHEL stabilization + a month or so for CentOS) but generally current enough, but then by this spring we'll see a batch of computers with hardware that doesn't work. Isn't this where the quarterly updates with new hardware support come in? Is RHEL5 going to go wholesale to new kernel versions with the quarterly updates, or is it actually going to backport all updated drivers to the older release? -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 12:45:16PM -0400, Jeff Sheltren wrote: If Fedora decides to officially support releases for ~13 months, perhaps there is enough interest in extending them another 5-6 months to keep Legacy going? If my thinking is correct, that would leave Perhaps, yeah. legacy with 2 releases at a time, which *should* be manageable.. ;) Another possibility would be to pick either even- or odd-numbered fedora releases, and have Legacy only extend *one* of those. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 11:49:13AM -0500, Jesse Keating wrote: about to. I think there really needs to be significant interest in it, more than just Matt Miller, although he is a very interesting case. The majority Yeah, because frankly, I have a _lot_ more interest than time. It's, like, a 10:1 ratio. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 11:58:02AM -0500, Jesse Keating wrote: Is RHEL5 going to go wholesale to new kernel versions with the quarterly updates, or is it actually going to backport all updated drivers to the older release? From what I gather out in the community (not looking at any internal documentation), that the new drivers would be backported. We'll have to see how this works out. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 11:15:51AM -0600, Eric Rostetter wrote: My problem has always been I work in University settings where updates only happen during breaks (Spring break, Summer break, or Winter break). On the Same here -- except I'm not sure I can rely on people to update during the spring and especially winter breaks, or that the 13th month hits the summer break in a convenient way. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 02:00:47PM -0600, Eric Rostetter wrote: I'm not able to force anyone here to do anything. Therefore, I have to That's the first problem... You either need to be able to force them to do the right thing, or punish them for failure. If you can't do one or the other of those then you're screwed, to put it bluntly. Well, we're screwed, then. :) sticks work also. You get hacked, we unplug you from the network until you comply. Gets their attention real fast when they are removed from the network. Works better than carrots actually, in the long run. Oh, we do that if it comes to that. However, the goal is to avoid that in the first place. [...] 1.08 years... But your call for 2.5 years seems way too long for a project that wants to be cutting edge (and which you point out your users want because it is cutting edge. If they want cutting edge, they need to upgrade once a year, or else they are not cutting edge anymore). Well, as I said, 2.5 years would be ideal, but I recognize it to be not really obtainable. I really would like, however, to see 1.5, or better, 1.6. panning out, and how it fits with merging Extras and Core. The availability of Extras is currently a huge draw for Fedora over CentOS.) CentOS has Extras/Plus also for a lot of packages... And there are lots of Nothing like Fedora Extras, though. And third-party repos can be helpful but coordinating them is work, and each requires a layer of maintenance of its own. [...] I really disagree. The project is to be cutting edge, your users want cutting edge, the only way to do that is to upgrade yearly. Otherwise, Oh yes. In short, users want cake and they want to shoot themseves in the foot with it. both the project and your users are not cutting edge. If you can't manage the upgrades in a year, then you need to hire more staff locally Yes, it'd be great to be able to convince everyone I support to hire more staff. That ain't going to happen. (or better automate your upgrades). There's significant engineer resistance to working towards making Fedora yum-upgradable between releases. So that's really a non-starter. Now, I really do feel for you and your situation. But I don't think you can impose your bad situation on the Fedora Project, when you claim your Clearly I'm in no position to impose anything. However, it'd certainly be helpful to us if Legacy could contine to extend the lifespan beyond the new proposed 13 months. And I mention it in case I'm not alone. [*] * In fact, I'm pretty certain I'm not, and that there are thousands of users running FC1, FC2, and FC3 and just waiting to become botnet members if they're not already. The difference is that my users have me to care about them. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Important information regarding the merger of core and extras, and what this means to Legacy
On Wed, Nov 15, 2006 at 03:43:43PM -0500, Jesse Keating wrote: But is there enough you to go around to do the updates? That's the real Speaking for me personally, no. :) question here. We can't stop people from being dumb and not upgrading their release when it goes dead. If we gave them 2 years, they'd take it and still not upgrade and then what? I think the Fedora project is really trying to Oh, that's for sure -- I routinely see incredibly ancient RHL machines still in production. However, there's a curve, and the shorter the lifespan the more people will be caught in it. At the current 9 months, I wouldn't be surprised if it actually includes the majority of users. At 13 months, not so bad -- but still a huge amount. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: I get this error when trying to upgrade my 2.4.20-8 to 2.6.3 after make install
On Tue, Nov 14, 2006 at 12:50:22PM -0600, Eric Rostetter wrote: RHL 9 had disk quota support. The same support basically as RHEL 3.x. You should not have to upgrade to any newer kernel. Actually, there was a bug in quota support in the kernel shipped with the initial RHL9 release. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: I get this error when trying to upgrade my 2.4.20-8 to 2.6.3 after make install
On Wed, Nov 08, 2006 at 01:36:48PM -0800, Bill Perrotta wrote: I get this error when trying to upgrade my 2.4.20-8 to 2.6.3 after make install see below Any particular reason 2.6.3? Among other things, that's going to leave you with some huge security problems. But additionally, I don't think the infrastructure is there in RHL 9 to run the 2.6 kernel without a lot of work. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: I get this error when trying to upgrade my 2.4.20-8 to 2.6.3 after make install
On Mon, Nov 13, 2006 at 02:11:14PM -0800, Bill Perrotta wrote: Security is not a concern. I am using redhat 9 because it is almost the same as rhel3. This is a test not a production box. What kernel can i use CentOS 3 is probably a better choice there. to easilly upgrade rhel9 to have the disk quota feature because it is not there in 2.4.20-8 kernel. This is a bug in that kernel version. Make sure you have at least 2.4.20-18.7. You don't need to go all the way to 2.6.x. The latest RHL9 kernel 2.4.20-46.9.legacy. And, although I haven't specifically tested, I'd be shocked if the RHEL3/CentOS 3 kernel (kernel-2.4.21-47.0.1.EL) didn't have the problem fixed as well. That may or may not work without modification on RHL9 -- I wouldn't bother to try that route though and instead would just install CentOS. The disk quota feature is all i'm interested in because it's on the rhce exam. Forget about security or anything else. I need to complete the labs. Why RHEL3, though? Wouldn't you want RHEL4? -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
Re: Self Introduction: Jeroen 'kanarip' van Meeuwen
On Sun, Nov 12, 2006 at 12:39:45AM +0100, Jeroen van Meeuwen wrote: So, here's my self introduction. My name is Jeroen van Meeuwen, age 23, and I live in a little city near Utrecht, in The Netherlands. Hi Jeroen. We'll definitely appreciate the help. I suppose the most useful thing to do right now is to look in bugzilla or at Pekka's buglist at http://www.netcore.fi/pekkas/buglist.html and start poking at things. Hopefully, we'll have some better infrastructure in place soon. -- Matthew Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mattdm.org/ Boston University Linux -- http://linux.bu.edu/ -- fedora-legacy-list mailing list fedora-legacy-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-legacy-list
