Self-introduction: Mel Chua
Hi! I'm Mel. This is my current mental model of our website, which you may have seen on Planet Fedora. http://blog.melchua.com/2009/06/09/fedora-website-graphical-notes/ I'm still learning my way around, so I'm going to make tons of mistakes! Please correct me! Right now I'm trying to get lots of data dumps, perspectives on how the site's going, how it could be improved, trying to find stuff to hack on... Experience-wise, I'm fluent in (X)HTML and CSS, though cross-browser compatibility issues make me Very Sad. I occasionally put up basic sites for friends as a combination hobby/because-I'm-the-"computer-person" thing. I've been playing on and off with it since high school when my idea of "good design" involved a tiled background of a Star Wars X-wing fighter and the tag. (My taste has improved considerably since then.) Anti-skillz: My sketching ability and sense of space and color (or lack thereof, particularly for the last one) can be seen in the image linked to above, and I understand how javascript-based UIs and db-backed webapps are made, but am not particularly gifted at making them, and I've learned just enough about usability to be dangerous. Skillz: What I'm actually pretty good at is being articulately confused, and at breaking things - being a sort of Perpetual Newbie From Hell who inexplicably submits good bug reports. I blame my brief stint as a QA engineer for that. I can also be a Mediawiki fiend, having spent the past 2 years or so building up, weeding, and admin-ing http://wiki.laptop.org. I try to ask interesting questions and to not get distracted by shiny stuff, though the success rate of the latter is... a work in progress. A question, since I'm following down the http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Join page: when is the next meeting? According to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings#Time_and_Place, the next meeting is in 2008 - so I'm curious whether there are still meetings held, and if not, if folks would be interested in gathering for one on IRC sometime this week or early next. Seems like a good time to look at our site, since plenty of new users are hitting it and giving us potentially interesting data on the kinds of things that could be improved. ;) --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Fedora wiki FIrefox shortcuts
Thought you folks might appreciate - these are Firefox shortcuts that make navigating the wiki much, much faster (I usually whip these up for wikis that I spend a lot of time on). I can't imagine I'm the first one to come up with this idea, but I couldn't find a prior implementation, so here you go. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Mchua/Templates For instance, instead of typing "https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Mchua/Templates"; as above, I typed "fu Mchua/Templates" and boom, you're there. A longer explanation is here, and should be popping on the Planet in a moment: http://blog.melchua.com/2009/06/09/fedora-wiki-shortcuts-for-firefox/ --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
WIki standards review request - education SIG page
Wikis rock! Except when they turn into unmaintainable swamps of information (in which case they still rock, just... more frustratingly than optimal.) In the spirit of Trying To Do Things Right, I went through the Edu SIG pages and tried to redo them to fit wiki standards. Here's what I did: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Talk:SIGs/Education#Following_wiki_standards Thoughts, feedback? In particular, I don't really expect the meeting minutes pages to all get categorized correctly, unless we can figure out a clever solution to remembering (or automatically doing) that... Ian, as the wiki czar, I thought I'd ping you especially to see if you could take a quick look and make recommendations. ;) Thanks in advance for taking a peek! --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Self-introduction: Mel Chua
Ricky, IIRC, we had a table on the wiki for meeting times. I don't remember where it is though. I set up a whenisgood for scheduling, and will send it out in a separate email momentarily. Does anybody else have any thoughts on how we can improve the website? Mark had some, they're up at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Markg85. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Tasks list updated
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Tasks Check 'er out. Thanks to Ricky for the updates! --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Self-introduction: Mel Chua
Ricky, IIRC, we had a table on the wiki for meeting times. I don't remember where it is though. I set up a whenisgood for scheduling, and will send it out in a separate email momentarily. Does anybody else have any thoughts on how we can improve the website? Mark had some, they're up at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Markg85. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Meeting scheduling! (Also: status check-in get together Friday 1800 UTC.)
Multiple people have expressed the thought that it'd be good to have a I set up a whenisgood for meeting scheduling. Hope that's ok. Vote here: http://whenisgood.net/fedorawebsites It's also on the wiki: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings#Time_and_Place Before then, Mark and I will be checking in on what's up with https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Tasks (which is getting updated with status info from Ricky shortly as well), and we'd love company. Join us (markg85 and mchua) on #fedora-websites this Friday at 20:00 Dutch time, which is 18:00 UTC, or (for me, in Boston) 14:00 EST (UTC-4). We'll post notes/logs to the list, and this isn't really an official meeting of any sort, but it's a good time for us to catch up on what's going on. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Meeting scheduling! (Also: status check-in get together Friday 1800 UTC.)
doing...), however I do not believe the above url is going to work out so well for the group as a whole to track meeting times. That's ok. :) I thought I'd toss it out there in case it did make things easier (and so far we've got it down to 7 potential meeting times, see http://whenisgood.net/fedorawebsites/results/6kgyqj - noting that we've only had 3 responses so far) but if something else works out better, that's awesome. no link to it now, but we *had* a matrix for this: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings/Matrix Thanks! You're right; there wasn't anything linking to that page before, so I linked it at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings#Time_and_Place where folks can find it, and I guess we'll see which one people use. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Brainstorms section
Since we have some ideas in the formation phase right now, I added a section to our main wikipage... https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites#Brainstorms ...which links to this. It needs more work and cleaning up, but hopefully the general idea is clear. Please add! I know there's at least one person who had some things to pitch in *winks at juank_prada*. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Brainstorms --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Notes from today's IRC get-together
Here you go! https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings/2009-06-12 These are formatted in the most hideous way imaginable. How do I make them pretty, like other Fedora meeting notes I've seen (like https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:Marketing_meeting_2009-06-09)? --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Notes from today's IRC get-together
The meeting notes are actually readable now. Thanks, Rahul! Mel Chua wrote: Thanks - I'll check it out. Well-formatted meeting notes are the win. Rahul Sundaram wrote: On 06/13/2009 02:18 AM, Mel Chua wrote: Here you go! https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings/2009-06-12 These are formatted in the most hideous way imaginable. How do I make them pretty, like other Fedora meeting notes I've seen (like https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:Marketing_meeting_2009-06-09)? Use irclog2html available in the repo Rahul -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Websites Meeting - 17:00 UTC in #fedora-websites
Hey, there has recently been a lot of discussion about the website, especially now that we just finished a release. Let's have a meeting to go over what went right/wrong with this release and to discuss changes going forward. I'm going to be pinging people listed on http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Tasks to see if we can't get that updated before tomorrow's meeting. Also, the length of http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Brainstorms is rapidly growing... pop ideas and such there if you have them, and I'll do my best to tackle it with a shovel before tomorrow's meeting and put things into some coherent readable order. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Meeting Log - 2009-06-19
Meeting logs are on the wiki! https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings/2009-06-19 (man, irclog2html rocks.) Who's doing what: see https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites#Projects. (hiemanshu, I apologise - I couldn't figure out your wiki username, but if you let me know I'll link it in.) The general summary: in order of priority, f12 projects so far are get.fpo, decision process, www.fpo, docs.fpo, and then join.fpo, translation, and user gallery. Right now it's mizmo on get.fp.o, with markg85's help, hiemanshu on the user gallery, markg85 on www.fp.o with hiemanshu's help, ricky on decisionmaking process and docs.fp.o, mchua on join.fp.o, and translation as a "we need to find someone." Starting to see some action around stuff already, which is great. :) More when I'm not about to fall asleep at my computer. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Meeting Log 26/06/2009
now also on https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings/2009-06-26 (man I love irclog2html.) -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
tasktracking: wikitables aren't going to work much longer
Keeping track of tasks on the wiki is starting to get a bit annoying. Can we get a project-tracking component in bz and track tasks there? Here's what it looks like for docs: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/buglist.cgi?component=project-tracking&product=Fedora%20Documentation If we get the bz component up I'll volunteer to migrate all websites tasks to bz and notify all owners. Thoughts? There was also discussion of a separate trac during today's meeting, which is another option (however, I'm lazy and tend to favor using an existing installation. ;) Note that this provides an easy place for us to do patch comments and reviews as well (we can make a tracking blocker bug called WEBSITES-NEEDS-COMMENT or something). How would we make this bz component happen? --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Trac tasktracking
Experiment: instead of using wiki tables, what if we could keep track of projects and tasks in Trac? https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/report/9 It's not quite working yet - blocked by https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1488 - but you should get the general idea, and this is a heads-up on the tinkering going on. --Mel PS: Non-meta stuff when I regain consciousness, on join.fp.o work. Had a good design discussion with Eve this afternoon, and she had some thoughts about approach. -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Websites Meeting - 2009-07-03 17:00 UTC
Hey, just a reminder that there'll be a meeting at 17:00 UTC today. I'm afraid I won't be able to make this one, but hopefully Mel and some of the other regulars will be around to keep this going. I'm actually going to be on the road traveling back from DC then, so I won't be able to make it either - but I'll be hitting up the list with join.fp.org updates today. Apologies for being so quiet and slow on this; it's been a hectic week. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Feedback gathered for fedoraproject.org and get.fedoraproject.org
Wow. This is fantastic, Mark - thanks to you and Hiemanshu for taking the time to go out and get a ton of data! Comments inline. User 4 - fedora main site -- "I've been able to find everything I need on the websites." I wonder how experienced this user was. :) User 5 - fedora main site -- posibly more of a note that its based on the comercial Red Hat distro ...hm, that's a thought, if somewhat backwards - if anything, RHEL is based on Fedora, not the other way around (as I understand it, anyway) - not sure how the current way of showing the Fedora <--> Red Hat connection was chosen (it's currently in a tiny little sponsorship-note footer at the bottom of http://fedoraproject.org/) but I'm sure there's a good reason for it. User 6 - fedora main site -- if I'm new to linux and need help, do I click docs, wiki, get help, or what? +infinity - get.fp.o -- and it lacks consistancy -- if you have several options, display them in a consistent manner -->that page has a couple different options in the middle, other options in a different style on the right (well, i think they are different) and then other, alternat eoptions at the bottom -->could it not list all the options in one consistant list, explaining what each is, with the different download options? Man, this person gives good, concrete feedback. - fedora main site -- and it should probably have a better link text -- I mean, imagine reading it; Get Fedora 11 Desktop Edition Now INSTALLABLE LIVE CD! YES -- one last thing; the layout breaks on a small viewport (4-500px wide) -- should have some minimal width limiter -- http://w-wins.com/images/brokenlayout.png Great point - do we have any heuristics that we're evaluating our sites against, any standard tests we run for sanity? (Making sure it works on a certain list of screen sizes, a certain set of browsers, that kind of thing?) -- if i didn't know what fedora is i wouldn't immediately know what it was This is *incredibly* important. -- most people who visit your site won't want a tour. They want a download link. Really? I wonder if there is a good way we can empirically prove this. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Feedback gathered for fedoraproject.org and get.fedoraproject.org
-- and it should probably have a better link text -- I mean, imagine reading it; Get Fedora 11 Desktop Edition Now INSTALLABLE LIVE CD! YES I'm not following at all... Yeah, I wasn't really clear... Current http://fedoraproject.org site: tiny blue "--> Get Fedora" on the middle of the left side" Compare to, say, http://www.ubuntu.com/ - banner stretching across the top with "Ubuntu 9.04 Desktop Edition / Save time and boot faster / Get productive with the latest apps / Enjoy an improved user experience" and then a high-contrast "Download" (and "Take the Tour") button right below that text. Maybe we don't need *all* that stuff, but it's more descriptive and a lot easier to find. Great point - do we have any heuristics that we're evaluating our sites against, any standard tests we run for sanity? (Making sure it works on a certain list of screen sizes, a certain set of browsers, that kind of thing?) 800x600 and up is reasonable. 400-500 px wide isn't quite as reasonable. That's a totally reasonable minimum bar - I think we just need to make clear somewhere that that *is* the minimum bar, and that problems at lower resolutions are a wontfix. I started https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Heuristics to try and keep track of ideas for this - it's very much a draft, but I'm wondering whether having a good set of rules-of-thumb might help us answer "it breaks in this case, do we care about this case?" questions in the future. Trying to think out loud why someone might have less than 800px width: * Viewing fp.o on a mobile browser is probably an edge case and can be ignored (stats could prove me wrong, though - I wonder how to get access to those stats... maybe Ian might have some ideas) * Someone on an 800+px wide display might have two windows open side-by-side (comparing the Fedora homepage with the Gentoo homepage, or surfing the web on the left side of his/her screen and reading email on the right). This sounds more plausible to me; my laptop is 1024x768 and it's not uncommon for me to have two browser windows side by side, each filling up half my screen (so, accounting for scrollbars and such, somewhere around 500px width each). -- most people who visit your site won't want a tour. They want a download link. Really? I wonder if there is a good way we can empirically prove this. Why would I expend energy to download an operating system if I don't understand what it is I would be getting for the effort? Also thinking off the top of my head... I think a better reason might be "some people will already come to fp.o knowing that they want to dl Fedora, even before taking the tour. Who are they?" * someone (I trust, possibly an Ambassador standing beside me) has already told me I should just download this "Fedora" thing and they'll help me get started * I do understand what I'd be getting; I already know what Fedora is and just need to grab an image file and am easily frustrated by Fitt's Law * some people blithely click on download links first, then figure out what they're getting afterwards. Not that it's a good idea, mind you... but I've watched enough people have this as almost a knee-jerk reaction to a webpage that... I mean, it happens. All my reasoning in this email and my previous one are a lot more hand-wavy conjecturing than I'd like. I need to sit down and learn how to get hold of our actual website stats, so I can base these kinds of statements on Actual Data. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Feedback gathered for fedoraproject.org and get.fedoraproject.org
Thanks for pushing back and pointing out holes in my reasoning, btw - always good especially when it's 3:20am (...it's one of Those Nights when I can't sleep). We really should just format the site differently - at the very least have a different style sheet - to target this specifically if we decide to support it. We don't officially now. Yay! wontfix, then. *docs at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Heuristics#Screen_size* "some people will already come to fp.o knowing that they want to dl Fedora, even before taking the tour. Who are they?" * someone (I trust, possibly an Ambassador standing beside me) has already told me I should just download this "Fedora" thing and they'll help me get started * I do understand what I'd be getting; I already know what Fedora is and just need to grab an image file and am easily frustrated by Fitt's Law * some people blithely click on download links first, then figure out what they're getting afterwards. Not that it's a good idea, mind you... but I've watched enough people have this as almost a knee-jerk reaction to a webpage that... I mean, it happens. I agree with all of this, although i think the last two cases are far less common than the first. I wonder if "IP addresses that have dl'd one of the prior Fedora releases before" vs "IP addresses that have not downloaded Fedora before" would be a useful differentiation metric for this - it's hard to tell who's actually arriving at the site for what. I'll have a chat with Ian (since he's doing similar work) about ways we might instrument things up better to get the kind of data these discussions should be based on... who else is into stats and metrics? --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
j.fp.o design process strawman (criticism please!)
As I pore through Websites stuff tonight and think about how to tackle join.fp.o, I'm realizing that I have a very dim notion (actually, "dim" is generous) of what a good design process to go through for this kind of thing would be. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engineering_design_process seems to... not exactly fit, but I will stab in the dark and try to use it, and hope better alternatives present themselves. *Please* criticize this gameplan. It's put up here so that it can be ripped apart - I'm stuck on finding a better way to think about this, so I figured I'd try something (anything) and then let y'all tell me what my mistakes are. --- 1. Identify a need: "j.fp.o doesn't really get people to join fedora." 2. Define the problem: I can think of several angles to tackle this from - not sure which (if any) are useful ways of looking at this. * Improve click-through percentages from j.fp.o to the "How To Join $Group" page of any group. (If someone reads j.fp.o clicks through to read step-by-step join instructions for at least one team, it counts as a yes; if they read j.fp.o but don't read a team's join instructions afterwards, it counts as a no.) * Minimize the time it takes a newcomer to go from "I have started reading j.fp.o because it looked interesting, and know nobody to help me" to "I have made my first tracked project contribution." A good target might be 90 minutes. * Minimize the time it takes a newcomer to go from "I have started reading j.fp.o because it looked interesting, and know nobody to help me" to having a mentor contact and welcome them, and help them decide on a first project to do. A good target might be 20 minutes. (yes, these targets are ambitious.) * For each successive release, raise the number of contributions made by community members whose first contribution was towards that release. (For instance, F12 contributions made by volunteers who first got involved with Fedora during the F12 cycle.) 3. Conduct research: (This is where I am now, I am trying to figure out the answers to these questions.) * How can the above metrics be instrumented? (Is it possible to measure them at all?) * Who are the current users... ** looking at j.fp.o? ** finding j.fp.o helpful? (how?) ** not finding j.fp.o helpful (and disappearing rather than telling us it didn't help them out? what would have made it useful to them?) * Who do we want... ** looking at j.fp.o? ** joining our community? (Do we *want* to consciously set up a minimum-effort barrier to encourage only the motivated? Are we trying to get more non-code contributors?) * Who is it that wants these people looking at and using j.fp.o (beyond the Websites team)? Are there specific people on specific teams that have particular recruiting needs, and who can offer to mentor newcomers (or otherwise set up a newbie-contribution infrastructure for their particular projects/teams)? * What does the 'join' experience look like for other projects - what do they consider? How do they compare, and what can we learn from them? (The rest of the steps I'm not even going to think about just yet - this is plenty to tackle for now.) 4. Narrow the research: 5. Analyzing set criteria: 6. Finding alternative solutions: 7. Analyzing possible solutions: 8. Making a decision: 9. Presenting the product: 10. Communicating and selling the product: -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Adding Phone Browser support
They probably would want to read planet and fedora news? Anything else you can think of that might be useful to view on fpo while on the go? The front/about page, for the on-the-go scenario of "I wonder what Fedora is/let me show you what Fedora is, this is our homepage." I agree with Mo that mobile browsers of fp.o will probably only look at a few pages. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Almost-finalized: Marketing F12 schedule
I've updated the F12 schedule according to the meeting (https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-marketing-list/2009-July/msg00140.html) that Paul, John, and myself had today. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Marketing_F12_schedule We've got some dates and such to coordinate with various teams (cc'd here) before Monday in order to make sure our calendars sync up. One of the things we'll be talking about at the Marketing meeting tomorrow (https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Marketing_meetings) is how to make sure that each Marketing + OtherTeam coordination happens this week - some of these connections already have delegates, others have people who probably should be, others are wide open. The notes below are very, *very* much drafts, and only starting points! It's also entirely possible that I've put *too* much in the notes below (that figuring out something shouldn't be Marketing's job, or its focus). Patches welcome. --Mel Design: We should make sure we get you a release slogan in time, and give fast enough feedback/final-slogan turnaround based on your designs that you can make release buttons/banners with time to spare. Also need to see what sort of work we need to coordinate in order to make spiffy Ambassadors kits. Docs: We should commit to those 1-page shiny release notes you wanted, and find other good points during the cycle to check in with each other. We also need to talk (possibly with News) on who'd like to do what portions of talking points and in-depth feature profiles. (How can we market our documentation as awesome, too?) Ambassadors: We need to schedule a briefing for you folks to happen once the talking points are ready - but most importantly, we need to learn how we can listen to you better so that we can make the things you actually want and *need* to spread the word on the ground. What can we do? Websites: We should talk - potentially with Design - about how we're going to coordinate various webpage redesigns and revisions, and how our respective roles complement each other. News: We also need to talk (possibly with Docs) on who'd like to do what portions of talking points and in-depth feature profiles. We should also figure out what's going on with News and Marketing and Fedora Insight, so we can schedule in coordination times with other teams if needed. -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Websites + Marketing schedules: synced!
Websites and Marketing folks: just a heads-up so you know the stuff that the two groups will be working on together for this release cycle - Ricky and I just froze the milestone dates for things the two teams will be collaborating on (our version is at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Marketing_F12_schedule). Here are the relevant parts for y'all on what Marketing is going to deliver for Websites... Final release slogan is ready for websites/design 2009-09-17 Marketing creates this, influenced by the Design themes/wallpaper/etc. for the release. The slogan then (circularly?) affects the Design team's release button/banner for the website. Need to make sure this lines up with Design and Website's dates. This date is a start date; the end date needs to be set in conjunction with Design. All desired website changes taken to websites team 2009-09-15 The Websites team has a 09/29 feature freeze, so we need to make sure any features/changes we want (text, images, page restructuring, etc...) have been approved by them by that date. This means that two weeks prior, Marketing should know exactly what changes we'd like to see on the websites, that all those changes should be tickets filed in the Website team's Trac, and that each change should have a Marketing delegate working on it from within the Websites team. (For Marketing's reference...) Groups we (Marketing) have synced with: Websites, Design Groups left to sync with: Docs, Ambassadors, News ...that is all. Thanks for your time! --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Fedoracommunity.org index page
Is having a site named Fedora Community that isn't Fedora Community (admin.fedoraproject.org/community) going to cause confusion? Ohh boy, I hadn't even put 2 and 2 together yet on that one. Looks like we've got a 2 apps 1 name problem :) Searching for "Fedora Community" also brings up references to the community of Fedora contributors rather than the platform itself. Which imo is as it should be, but... it makes it hard to find; at one point I went to fp.o and sat and refreshed until the rotating banner became a Fedora Community link, because I couldn't remember the URL otherwise. Your friendly local marketing person makes a plea for eigenbrands. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Fedoracommunity.org index page
I'm going to try to chime in from a Marketing standpoint as best I can, and am Ccing the Marketing list in the hopes that Those Who Know More Than I can speak about branding here. To summarize the conversation to date, both to catch up newcomers tothe conversation and to try and form a better understanding of this for myself: we have a naming collision problem. (The thread is at https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/2009-September/msg00010.html, please correct me if I've missed/mis-stated anything.) The term "Fedora Community" currently refers to three things. 1. The community of contributors working on the Fedora Project (in other words, "us"). 2. https://admin.fedoraproject.org/community/, a site that helps keep track of who is packaging what, and what state those packages are in. 3. http://fedoracommunity.org, the top-level domain for a few (only 2 so far, it sounds like) local group homepages (such as http://ph.fedoracommunity.org/ for the Philippines). http://fedoracommunity.org itself is not up and running, but was supposed to be a directory for all such homepages. Needless, to say, this is confusing, particularly in the case of the two websites. What should we do? Should one or both of the websites be renamed/rebranded? If so, which one(s), and what to? How can we adjust? Some solutions proposed on the list so far: One way we could solve this would be to simply include the page listing at the Fedora Community portal site somewhere, as static content. Ugh. Renaming fedoracommunity.org is very ugly because people have been accumulating subdomains there for months. Plus, the domain name was blessed by Legal last year (when we were still talking about "MyFedora") because the domain name helps make it clear that we don't own the site, and aren't responsible for content. So it seems the only choice is to rename Fedora Community. I have no idea what it could be renamed to. Right now it's focused on package maintainers but we're hoping to expand it out more... developers.fedoracommunity.org ? makeit.fedoracommunity.org? I think it would be a branch from the overall fedora community. My thoughts at this point are mainly questions - some of which have partially been answered in the discussion above. 0. What is the purpose of each website being discussed? (#2, admin.fedoraproject.org/community and #3, fedoracommunity.org) 1. For each of the websites being discussed, what were the historical reasons for choosing that name? (Pointers to wiki pages, list archives, or IRC logs would be great.) 2. For each of the websites being discussed , what would the cost of renaming it be? (What effort would we have to go through, and how many people would be affected, in what way?) --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Fedoracommunity.org index page
Having said that, I'd propose that we get in touch with the groups using the fedoracommunity.org domain (#3) to find out to what extent a renaming would hamper their community efforts. I'd like to do that with a Cc: of an appropriate list -- Marketing? Websites? Logistics? Other? I think Logistics is the right list for this, since it involves Websites, Infrastructure, and (eventually, when we need to do a marketing campaign for whatever new names go out there) Marketing, so I'd start a thread there and send a message to each list saying "hey, this discussion is happening in Logistics, ." /me is also happy to do the legwork on this if desired. ;) --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Zikula theme status
Here's the stuff still needing to be resolved: I put this on https://fedorahosted.org/design-team/ticket/66 so people can comment on the ticket and such when they're done, too. • Author names - I can't figure out how to get real human names :( not sure how. Also my method of linking to the author's profile is rather hacky. • Feature story - I'd like to have one story displayed in full blinginess on the front page, it seems the news module has a way to do this but I can't figure out how to make it work (how do you assign 'today's feature' to an article?) • EZComments packaging - we need someone to package this ASAP. Any takers? -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Fwd: Re: Zikula theme status
Update: Mo and Simon are working on the first two • Author names - I can't figure out how to get real human names :( not sure how. Also my method of linking to the author's profile is rather hacky. Done, yay for Mo and Simon! • Feature story - I'd like to have one story displayed in full blinginess on the front page, it seems the news module has a way to do this but I can't figure out how to make it work (how do you assign 'today's feature' to an article?) ...and now they're working on this. • EZComments packaging - we need someone to package this ASAP. Any takers? I'm working on this now. We're in #fedora-website if anyone would like to to join the fun. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Fwd: Re: Zikula theme status
• EZComments packaging - we need someone to package this ASAP. Done. I'm going to need a reviewer: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=523343 - I based it on the other zikula module packages in the hopes that this would make the review process faster/cleaner/easier (...mostly faster). Tracking bug in Marketing: https://fedorahosted.org/marketing-team/ticket/36. If you can pick up any part of this, let me know how I can unblock you - being on IRC at any particular time (I'll try to be on as much as I can this week), etc. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Introduction
On 11/23/2009 02:02 PM, Toshio Kuratomi wrote: On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 03:14:13AM -0600, Gregory Sieranski wrote: Hi guys, I just wanted to introduce myself. I am a Programmer Analyst who works for a large fortune 500 company. I have been using Fedora for over 3 years and would love to give back in any way that I can. I absolutely love what Fedora and open source does and believe in both 100%. I am skilled in Java, J2EE, C, C++, Python, HTML, CSS and a bunch of other technologies. I am an avid programming language enthusiast and am working toward getting my Masters in Computer Science. I would love to contribute to the website project in any way that I can. I deal with website technology on a daily basis and feel that I would be able to provide a lot of help to the fedora website team. No task is to small. If you guys just need someone to enter text or change a CSS style I am willing to do it. Thank you for your time and I look forward to talking with all of you! Welcome! What would you be most interested in working on? If it's mostly python with a bit of html, css, and javascript thrown in the fedora I'd be happy to have you help out on some of the projects we're working on in Fedora Infrastructure. (Things like the account system, packagedb, updates tool, etc). If you're more interested in html and css, websites is the right place to start! -Toshio Gregory's already started helping us out with https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Insight - thanks, Gregory! --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Fedora Insight update: the Websites team rocketh / will be taking back-end after launch.
Went to the Websites meeting yesterday to talk about Fedora Insight. Short version: We've got us some CSS help from Websites to finish up theming, and they'll be taking on maintenance of the back-end (FWN and Marketing will continue to own workflow and content) once we do the initial launch: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites#Fedora_Insight What this means immediately: CSS design tickets are getting worked on. (https://fedorahosted.org/design-team/query?status=new&status=assigned&status=reopened&keywords=~insight&order=priority) I've cc'd everyone with FAS access to the theme group and everyone who owns a Fedora Insight CSS/Design ticket to make sure they're informed, know who the others working on the theme are, and can (possibly) make arrangements to sprint on IRC together; I'd suggest making sure that both the Websites and Design teams know when and where that work will be happening. We'll also have proper versioning for theme stuff, finally - thanks to Hiemanshu for getting us into git! (Hosting ticket = https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1886, but it's just been taken care of.) Hiemanshu should be posting "here's the repo / how to use it" instructions shortly, I believe. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: Fedora Insight update: the Websites team rocketh / will be taking back-end after launch.
On 12/19/2009 11:43 AM, Hiemanshu Sharma wrote: Anyways the repo is located at git://git.fedorproject.org/git/fedora-insight-theme.git Wow. Thanks, Hiemanshu! I've also copied these instructions over to https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Insight#Design, and am happy to move them somewhere else if there's a better spot on the wiki. I suspect that eventually we'll want to move this to the Websites space, perhaps after launch when we update the documentation as part of the backend handoff. --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
Re: new member introduction
On 12/27/2009 03:37 PM, Vikram Dhillon wrote: Hi all, How are you guys doing? I have been working over at Ubuntu, and currently I am one of the moderators of edubuntu (a deritive of Ubuntu) and of Ubuntu start page. So I would like to get started with fedora websites, how can I help out here. Thanks for your help on getting started :D Regards, Vikram Dhillon Hi, Vikram - things are a bit slow right now because of the holidays, but here are a few resources for getting started. If you're an IRC user, we hang out in #fedora-websites in irc.freenode.net. If you're new to IRC, https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/IRC may be of help. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites#Join_the_Fedora_Websites_Project points to https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Join - if you've already seen this and the email you sent was part of working through step #4, that's great! Knowing more about your skills (do you do graphics, html, css, programming with web frameworks, webmastering, etc?) and interests will help people point you in the direction of a specific project to get started with. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/Meetings may also be helpful; I'm not sure if we're having one this week because of the New Year, but hopefully someone else on this list can chime in on when the next meeting is going to be. I might also take a look at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites#Projects and see if any of these catch your eye; some projects are more active/recent than others. The one I'm most involved with is Fedora Insight, but depending on your background there may be others you might want to lend a hand with. In summary, I'd suggest: * telling us a little more about your skills and interests so we can help you find a better match * finding out when the next (IRC) meeting will be and whether you can attend it - they're a great chance to ask questions. * checking out the list of current projects to see if there's anything you're particularly interested in helping with - some already have a ticket queue set up, so you can just go in and grab a task if you'd like to start with that. Welcome! --Mel -- Fedora-websites-list mailing list Fedora-websites-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
