[filmscanners] RE: Scanner profile builder
> From: michael shaffer > > What do you mean by "intall it"? By "install", I mean right-click on it and select "Install". This lists it in the registry somewhere, for what purpose I don't know. Actually, I think it may also copy it to the built-in profiles folder, if it's in a different folder. > I didn't know that the Nikon software allowed for conversions(?) You > should be able to embed the profile by copying the ICM to the > proper Windows > folder ... opening the image file with PS, and assigning the preferred > profile ... subsequently "saving as" will prompt you for embedding the > profile. The previous poster was talking about the standalone NikonScan, which I've never tried, but since it allows you to specify what color space you want your file in, a conversion is taking place from the scanner's device color space (i.e., the raw numbers from the A/D). I'm sure that this conversion is done in the Windows ICM engine, but it's requested by the scanner software. If it were possible to specify the scanner's device profile as the destination, then the conversion would be a null operation. > I am missing your "purpose" in doing this. Please explain ... Well, it wasn't my idea, but the result would be a file that had the raw numbers from the A/D. That seemed to be what the previous poster wanted. -- Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco Paulmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
[filmscanners] RE: Scanner profile builder
Paul D. writes ... > I wonder if NikonScan will let you embed the device profile > if you copy the device profile into the Windows profile > folder and install it. What do you mean by "intall it"? > "Converting" to the device profile is a null operation, > but it's possible that NikonScan won't notice, > and will do the useless math anyway. Or does it refuse to > convert to any profile that's marked as a device profile? I didn't know that the Nikon software allowed for conversions(?) You should be able to embed the profile by copying the ICM to the proper Windows folder ... opening the image file with PS, and assigning the preferred profile ... subsequently "saving as" will prompt you for embedding the profile. I am missing your "purpose" in doing this. Please explain ... cheerios ... shAf :o) Avalon Peninsula, Newfoundland www.micro-investigations.com (in progress) Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
[filmscanners] RE: Scanner profile builder
Tony Terlecki writes ... > Nikon doesn't have proper ICC colour management in its scanning > software so any profile you make will have to be applied > afterwards in Photoshop or another ICC compliant program. > ... This is somewhat misleading. The standalone Nikonscan software will properly convert and embed a editing profile (e.g., AdobeRGB, Colormatch), but not the device profile. The twain software will properly convert to the preferred color space but will not embed (... no twain scanning interface to PS will embed ... the proper profile will have to be assigned by PS). This is the way Nikon makes CM work ... the only problem I have with the Nikon software are the device profiles themselves. I have seen the "shadows" problem with Nikonscan, and I do believe it has something to do with the device CLUT profiles. I have also seen posterization in other subtle gradients like skin tones, which disappeared when I turned NS CM off. I don't know if the original author has tried turning CM off, but I suggest he/she try it and move to a 3rd party profiler ... or better yet ... After playing with Vuescan's raw files and the color capacity of my LS-2000, I'm quite satisfied with the color accuracy of Vuescan and embedding highbits into Ektaspace RGB. cheerios ... shAf :o) Avalon Peninsula, Newfoundland www.micro-investigations.com (in progress) Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
[filmscanners] Re: Scanner profile builder
On 8/12/02 10:16 PM, "Tony Terlecki" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Firstly any scanner profiling software will probably produce a similar > result - basically they all function by scanning an IT8 target and build a > profile from that. I have done this with EZColor and the results are an > improvement over what I can get with the NikonScan software. Doesn't the Nikon Scan software install scanner profiles? On my system (Mac OS X), I have a bunch of files with names like NKLS4000LS40_*.icm I have read about workflows where you scan with Nikon Color Management turned off, import the scans into Photoshop, and then assign one of the Nikon profiles to the image. I think I tried this out once, but now I am mostly using VueScan, which has its own built-in profiles for supported scanners. If you build your own scanner profile, is it likely to be better than the ones provided by Nikon? -- Julian Vrieslander <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
[filmscanners] Re: Scanner profile builder
On Mon, Aug 12, 2002 at 05:35:39PM +0200, Alex Zabrovsky wrote: > Has anybody have a chance to try Kodak's COLORFLOW ICC color profiles > builder software to calibrate his scanners ? (especially would be interested > in IV ED calibration experience). > I found quite rave review of this thing from Bruce Fraser using it on > LS-4000. According to him it would noticeably improve shadow rendering > performance opening up considerably (Nikon's CMS is disabled of course). > Are you referrring here to Bruce's reveiew of the LS4000? Firstly any scanner profiling software will probably produce a similar result - basically they all function by scanning an IT8 target and build a profile from that. I have done this with EZColor and the results are an improvement over what I can get with the NikonScan software. Colour accuracy is the main goal of profiling, if shadow detail is improved it *may* be a bonus - it may also be a shortcoming. I think shadow detail from any of these packages is far from ideal, and can easily be improved with a simple curves adjustment after the fact if you think the image requires it. The detail is usually there in the raw scan, just not usually brought out sufficiently well by the profile. Bruce mentions that the Imacon produces better shadow detail than the LS4000. That may be so but his examples were very poor representations of what he was trying to convey. The Imacon image has a very compressed tonal scale which I presume was necessary to raise the lower tones sufficiently high enough to present more shadow detail. I bet a quick curves manipuation on the LS4000 image could produce a similar result because it is capable of good shadow detail. Many people would manipuate shadow areas of an image differently to prevent tonal compression in the mid & high tones (which often results in washed out colours). In summary I would say that profiling software is useful to get better colour accuracy from you scanner. Shadow detail is better served by making your own custom curves for post processing or by manipulating images on an individual basis according to your needs. -- Tony Terlecki [EMAIL PROTECTED] Running Debian/GNU 3.0 Linux Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
[filmscanners] RE: Scanner profile
>In Photoshop I use Photoshop's own CM engine. Then when using Photoshop as the destination for your scanned files you should not be using any other engine and should have them turned off (this includes the scanner driver/software color management engine and the operating system's color management engine). Thus all color management of those images would be done by Photoshop and nowhere else. Other colormanagement aware applications should recognize and use the embedded profiles in the Photoshop exported or outputted files; those applications which are not color management aware will not recognize said embedded profiles and will display the file in whatever there native color space is which may very well be different and appear so. Similarly, under this senario, the scanner driver/program preview of the scan will not be necessarily the same as that displayed in Photoshop since the colormanagement will come after the scan has been done and exported to Photoshop, UNLESS you specifiy the scanner's color profile in Photoshop as Photoshop's working space (or you choose to do a soft proof using the scanner profile as your soft proofing profile, which in my oipinion is silly since the scanner product is not the final version that one would want to proof. >I was told I will have to Assign Profile with the scanner's calibrated >profile to the image brought into the Photoshop to do the thing. I am unclear as to what you mean by "to do the thing." What thing? I would say in general that with respect to the scanner, all you really should be concerned with is that it is calibrated which it does typically automatically using an internal calibration strip in most cases and not with the color space that it uses for its files if you are exporting it to another program for color management. Calibration and color management are two spearate and different although related activities; the former does not utilize profiles while the latter does; the former is geared to standardizing the scanner output so as to produce consistency between scans while the later is aimed at defineing color spaces so as to produce a common language which will enable those spaces to be translated from one device to another device with as much fedelity as possible. If the devices are inconsistent or uncalibrated, it will render any color management impossible; but if they are calibrated, it does not necessarily mean that they will be color manageable. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Alex Zabrovsky Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2002 6:36 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [filmscanners] RE: Scanner profile In Photoshop I use Photoshop's own CM engine. I was told I will have to Assign Profile with the scanner's calibrated profile to the image brought into the Photoshop to do the thing. Regards, Alex Z -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Laurie Solomon Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002 10:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [filmscanners] RE: Scanner profile >The same for Photoshop. I'll work in it acquiring the scans by calling > NikonScan as TWAIN. > The Photoshop is normally configured for Adobe RGB working > space, how to > tell him to treat the image using custom scanner's profile ? > (Or I only have > to tell NikonScan that, and the Photoshop will pick the > processed image > already ?) First, it depends on which color management engine you are using - the os's engine or Photoshop's engine. Second if you use the Photoshop engine, you can select the scanner's custom profile as the Photoshop workingspace which will cause Photoshop to operate on the same working space as the scanner's profile defines. This should result in the scanner output and the photoshop version being the same unless you fiddle with some other contols related to the scanner output in the scanner's driver or application. > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Alex Zabrovsky > Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002 9:41 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [filmscanners] Scanner profile > > > Once I'll have scanner profile generated, how can I tell the > NikonScan to > use it instead of his own CMS ? > > > Regards, > Alex Z > > -- > -- > Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with > 'unsubscribe filmscanners' > or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the > message title or body > Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest&#x
[filmscanners] RE: Scanner profile
In Photoshop I use Photoshop's own CM engine. I was told I will have to Assign Profile with the scanner's calibrated profile to the image brought into the Photoshop to do the thing. Regards, Alex Z -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Laurie Solomon Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002 10:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [filmscanners] RE: Scanner profile >The same for Photoshop. I'll work in it acquiring the scans by calling > NikonScan as TWAIN. > The Photoshop is normally configured for Adobe RGB working > space, how to > tell him to treat the image using custom scanner's profile ? > (Or I only have > to tell NikonScan that, and the Photoshop will pick the > processed image > already ?) First, it depends on which color management engine you are using - the os's engine or Photoshop's engine. Second if you use the Photoshop engine, you can select the scanner's custom profile as the Photoshop workingspace which will cause Photoshop to operate on the same working space as the scanner's profile defines. This should result in the scanner output and the photoshop version being the same unless you fiddle with some other contols related to the scanner output in the scanner's driver or application. > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Alex Zabrovsky > Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002 9:41 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [filmscanners] Scanner profile > > > Once I'll have scanner profile generated, how can I tell the > NikonScan to > use it instead of his own CMS ? > > > Regards, > Alex Z > > -- > -- > Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with > 'unsubscribe filmscanners' > or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the > message title or body > Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body Unsubscribe by mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with 'unsubscribe filmscanners' or 'unsubscribe filmscanners_digest' (as appropriate) in the message title or body
