Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
And HE had kids! mmathew_musicp...@yahoo.com http://www.musicengravers.com/cgi-bin/engravers.pl http://oregonmts.com/mathew/ > > From: John Howell >To: finale@shsu.edu >Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 11:50 AM >Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin > >At 7:52 AM -0500 9/22/12, Patrick Sheehan wrote: >>Who needs courtesy accidentals? Such a crutch. Forget it! > > >Bach for one, but what did HE know?! > >John > > >-- >John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music >Virginia Tech Department of Music >School of Performing Arts & Cinema >College of Liberal Arts & Human Sciences >290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 >Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 >(mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) >http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html > >"Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön." >(Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms > >___ >Finale mailing list >Finale@shsu.edu >http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
At 7:52 AM -0500 9/22/12, Patrick Sheehan wrote: >Who needs courtesy accidentals? Such a crutch. Forget it! Bach for one, but what did HE know?! John -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts & Cinema College of Liberal Arts & Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html "Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön." (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
Well stated, Mr. Israels! Michael mmathew_musicp...@yahoo.com http://www.musicengravers.com/cgi-bin/engravers.pl http://oregonmts.com/mathew/ > > From: Chuck Israels >To: finale@shsu.edu >Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 8:55 AM >Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin > > >On Sep 22, 2012, at 5:52 AM, Patrick Sheehan >wrote: > >> Who needs courtesy accidentals? Such a crutch. Forget it! >> > >Those who value considerate and clear communication with musicians. > >Those who pay for rehearsal time. > >Those who live in a world that extends beyond the diatonic. > >Those who understand that conventions are arrived at by consensus and change >over time and are aware of and respectful of contemporary standards >(especially the more useful ones). > >Those who prefer addressing interpretive nuance over technical distractions. > >Those who respect the degree of preparation and concentration required of >skilled sight readers of complex music and want a significant proportion of >that concentration free to be trained on elements beyond questions of pitch. > >I suppose this list could be lengthened, but that's probably enough. Language >changes. Communication usually tends to become more efficient (i.e. losing the >distinction between "less" and "fewer"; the dropping of pronouns when the verb >makes the "person" clear), and sometimes becomes impoverished as in the >confused and confusing substitution of subjective and objective case as >practiced by otherwise educated contemporary speakers, "They took a photo of >George and I". > >Whatever is going on in contemporary communication, thoughtful choices are >required to make that communication clear and elegant. Awareness of and >respect for the expectations of the recipients of musical notation is part of >the equation and it's not an academic issue, it's a practical one. > >Chuck > > > > > >> Patrick J. M. Sheehan >> Music Director, Instructor: Woodlawn Arts Academy >> P. S. Music >> Host: "The Saturday Blues" on 89.5 WNIJ-FM, 1 pm - 4 pm (CST) & WNIJ.org >> 1-815-973-2317 (m) >> >> patricksheehanmu...@gmail.com >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Chuck Israels [mailto:cisra...@comcast.net] >> Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2012 10:33 AM >> To: finale@shsu.edu >> Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin >> >> Perfect! Jari to the rescue again. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Sep 20, 2012, at 1:36 AM, Jari Williamsson >> wrote: >> >>> On 2012-09-20 02:31, Chuck Israels wrote: >>>> The most annoying is that accidentals that >>>> appeared correctly in the file now have parentheses >>>> applied to them necessitating a meticulous process >>>> of removing them - a process that is only slightly >>>> less harrowing than proof reading the file and entering >>>> the cautionary accidentals by hand. Incidentally, my >>>> plugin is set to show no parentheses even on the >>>> cautionary accidentals. >>> >>> I don't use the Cautionary Accidentals plug-in myself, but if you want >>> to remove all the parentheses from your accidentals, you can do that >>> easily in the JW Change (Beta). Accidentals->Parentheses->Hide and apply >>> on the whole document. >>> >>> >>> Best regards, >>> >>> Jari Williamsson >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> Finale mailing list >>> Finale@shsu.edu >>> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale >> >> >> >> ___ >> Finale mailing list >> Finale@shsu.edu >> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > >Chuck Israels >8831 SE 12th Ave. >Portland, OR 97202-7097 > >land line: (503) 954-2107cell phone: (360) 201-3434 > > > > >___ >Finale mailing list >Finale@shsu.edu >http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
Dear Patrick, On a more positive note, I have seen many published scores of music written in the last hundred years wherein the particular notation conventions that are in play are displayed on separate first pages of the published music that leave little to speculation. This is a more useful approach, I believe? mmathew_musicp...@yahoo.com http://www.musicengravers.com/cgi-bin/engravers.pl http://oregonmts.com/mathew/ > > From: Patrick Sheehan >To: finale@shsu.edu >Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 5:52 AM >Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin > >Who needs courtesy accidentals? Such a crutch. Forget it! > >Patrick J. M. Sheehan >Music Director, Instructor: Woodlawn Arts Academy >P. S. Music >Host: "The Saturday Blues" on 89.5 WNIJ-FM, 1 pm - 4 pm (CST) & WNIJ.org >1-815-973-2317 (m) > >patricksheehanmu...@gmail.com > >-Original Message- >From: Chuck Israels [mailto:cisra...@comcast.net] >Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2012 10:33 AM >To: finale@shsu.edu >Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin > >Perfect! Jari to the rescue again. > >Sent from my iPhone > >On Sep 20, 2012, at 1:36 AM, Jari Williamsson > wrote: > >> On 2012-09-20 02:31, Chuck Israels wrote: >>> The most annoying is that accidentals that >>> appeared correctly in the file now have parentheses >>> applied to them necessitating a meticulous process >>> of removing them - a process that is only slightly >>> less harrowing than proof reading the file and entering >>> the cautionary accidentals by hand. Incidentally, my >>> plugin is set to show no parentheses even on the >>> cautionary accidentals. >> >> I don't use the Cautionary Accidentals plug-in myself, but if you want >> to remove all the parentheses from your accidentals, you can do that >> easily in the JW Change (Beta). Accidentals->Parentheses->Hide and apply >> on the whole document. >> >> >> Best regards, >> >> Jari Williamsson >> >> >> ___ >> Finale mailing list >> Finale@shsu.edu >> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > >___ >Finale mailing list >Finale@shsu.edu >http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
On Sep 22, 2012, at 5:52 AM, Patrick Sheehan wrote: > Who needs courtesy accidentals? Such a crutch. Forget it! > Those who value considerate and clear communication with musicians. Those who pay for rehearsal time. Those who live in a world that extends beyond the diatonic. Those who understand that conventions are arrived at by consensus and change over time and are aware of and respectful of contemporary standards (especially the more useful ones). Those who prefer addressing interpretive nuance over technical distractions. Those who respect the degree of preparation and concentration required of skilled sight readers of complex music and want a significant proportion of that concentration free to be trained on elements beyond questions of pitch. I suppose this list could be lengthened, but that's probably enough. Language changes. Communication usually tends to become more efficient (i.e. losing the distinction between "less" and "fewer"; the dropping of pronouns when the verb makes the "person" clear), and sometimes becomes impoverished as in the confused and confusing substitution of subjective and objective case as practiced by otherwise educated contemporary speakers, "They took a photo of George and I". Whatever is going on in contemporary communication, thoughtful choices are required to make that communication clear and elegant. Awareness of and respect for the expectations of the recipients of musical notation is part of the equation and it's not an academic issue, it's a practical one. Chuck > Patrick J. M. Sheehan > Music Director, Instructor: Woodlawn Arts Academy > P. S. Music > Host: "The Saturday Blues" on 89.5 WNIJ-FM, 1 pm - 4 pm (CST) & WNIJ.org > 1-815-973-2317 (m) > > patricksheehanmu...@gmail.com > > -Original Message- > From: Chuck Israels [mailto:cisra...@comcast.net] > Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2012 10:33 AM > To: finale@shsu.edu > Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin > > Perfect! Jari to the rescue again. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Sep 20, 2012, at 1:36 AM, Jari Williamsson > wrote: > >> On 2012-09-20 02:31, Chuck Israels wrote: >>> The most annoying is that accidentals that >>> appeared correctly in the file now have parentheses >>> applied to them necessitating a meticulous process >>> of removing them - a process that is only slightly >>> less harrowing than proof reading the file and entering >>> the cautionary accidentals by hand. Incidentally, my >>> plugin is set to show no parentheses even on the >>> cautionary accidentals. >> >> I don't use the Cautionary Accidentals plug-in myself, but if you want >> to remove all the parentheses from your accidentals, you can do that >> easily in the JW Change (Beta). Accidentals->Parentheses->Hide and apply >> on the whole document. >> >> >> Best regards, >> >> Jari Williamsson >> >> >> ___ >> Finale mailing list >> Finale@shsu.edu >> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > > ___ > Finale mailing list > Finale@shsu.edu > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 8831 SE 12th Ave. Portland, OR 97202-7097 land line: (503) 954-2107cell phone: (360) 201-3434 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
At 9/22/2012 11:01 AM, Michael Mathew wrote: >Patrick, > >Your lackadaisical attitude towards cautionary accidentals will lead to many >misinterpretations of your music. > >Cautionary accidentals are necessary to avoid any confusion about the pitch >of a note, thank you very much! Don't be lazy! They sure make sight-reading easier and more accurate. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
Patrick, Your lackadaisical attitude towards cautionary accidentals will lead to many misinterpretations of your music. I find that the cautionary accidentals leave little to speculation as to whether a note continues to be a flat , natural, or sharp and eliminates major confusion for the interpreter. I have found a major offender in the published music of Hal Leonard. There are many areas in their music where no clear solution is evident including a reading of the vertical instance. I believe that the non-use of cautionary accidentals will leave a lot of musical texts unreadable in the future. The notational reading and realization of early music is an excellent example of trying for years to decide which of the interpretations of a squiggle is correct. Is this not true in this case? Cautionary accidentals are necessary to avoid any confusion about the pitch of a note, thank you very much! Don't be lazy! mmathew_musicp...@yahoo.com http://www.musicengravers.com/cgi-bin/engravers.pl http://oregonmts.com/mathew/ > > From: Patrick Sheehan >To: finale@shsu.edu >Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 5:52 AM >Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin > >Who needs courtesy accidentals? Such a crutch. Forget it! > >Patrick J. M. Sheehan >Music Director, Instructor: Woodlawn Arts Academy >P. S. Music >Host: "The Saturday Blues" on 89.5 WNIJ-FM, 1 pm - 4 pm (CST) & WNIJ.org >1-815-973-2317 (m) > >patricksheehanmu...@gmail.com > >-Original Message- >From: Chuck Israels [mailto:cisra...@comcast.net] >Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2012 10:33 AM >To: finale@shsu.edu >Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin > >Perfect! Jari to the rescue again. > >Sent from my iPhone > >On Sep 20, 2012, at 1:36 AM, Jari Williamsson > wrote: > >> On 2012-09-20 02:31, Chuck Israels wrote: >>> The most annoying is that accidentals that >>> appeared correctly in the file now have parentheses >>> applied to them necessitating a meticulous process >>> of removing them - a process that is only slightly >>> less harrowing than proof reading the file and entering >>> the cautionary accidentals by hand. Incidentally, my >>> plugin is set to show no parentheses even on the >>> cautionary accidentals. >> >> I don't use the Cautionary Accidentals plug-in myself, but if you want >> to remove all the parentheses from your accidentals, you can do that >> easily in the JW Change (Beta). Accidentals->Parentheses->Hide and apply >> on the whole document. >> >> >> Best regards, >> >> Jari Williamsson >> >> >> ___ >> Finale mailing list >> Finale@shsu.edu >> http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > >___ >Finale mailing list >Finale@shsu.edu >http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale > > > ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
On 2012-09-22 14:52, Patrick Sheehan wrote: > Who needs courtesy accidentals? Musicians. Best regards, Jari Williamsson ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
Who needs courtesy accidentals? Such a crutch. Forget it! Patrick J. M. Sheehan Music Director, Instructor: Woodlawn Arts Academy P. S. Music Host: "The Saturday Blues" on 89.5 WNIJ-FM, 1 pm - 4 pm (CST) & WNIJ.org 1-815-973-2317 (m) patricksheehanmu...@gmail.com -Original Message- From: Chuck Israels [mailto:cisra...@comcast.net] Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2012 10:33 AM To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin Perfect! Jari to the rescue again. Sent from my iPhone On Sep 20, 2012, at 1:36 AM, Jari Williamsson wrote: > On 2012-09-20 02:31, Chuck Israels wrote: >> The most annoying is that accidentals that >> appeared correctly in the file now have parentheses >> applied to them necessitating a meticulous process >> of removing them - a process that is only slightly >> less harrowing than proof reading the file and entering >> the cautionary accidentals by hand. Incidentally, my >> plugin is set to show no parentheses even on the >> cautionary accidentals. > > I don't use the Cautionary Accidentals plug-in myself, but if you want > to remove all the parentheses from your accidentals, you can do that > easily in the JW Change (Beta). Accidentals->Parentheses->Hide and apply > on the whole document. > > > Best regards, > > Jari Williamsson > > > ___ > Finale mailing list > Finale@shsu.edu > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
Perfect! Jari to the rescue again. Sent from my iPhone On Sep 20, 2012, at 1:36 AM, Jari Williamsson wrote: > On 2012-09-20 02:31, Chuck Israels wrote: >> The most annoying is that accidentals that >> appeared correctly in the file now have parentheses >> applied to them necessitating a meticulous process >> of removing them - a process that is only slightly >> less harrowing than proof reading the file and entering >> the cautionary accidentals by hand. Incidentally, my >> plugin is set to show no parentheses even on the >> cautionary accidentals. > > I don't use the Cautionary Accidentals plug-in myself, but if you want > to remove all the parentheses from your accidentals, you can do that > easily in the JW Change (Beta). Accidentals->Parentheses->Hide and apply > on the whole document. > > > Best regards, > > Jari Williamsson > > > ___ > Finale mailing list > Finale@shsu.edu > http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
On 2012-09-20 02:31, Chuck Israels wrote: >The most annoying is that accidentals that > appeared correctly in the file now have parentheses > applied to them necessitating a meticulous process > of removing them - a process that is only slightly > less harrowing than proof reading the file and entering > the cautionary accidentals by hand. Incidentally, my > plugin is set to show no parentheses even on the > cautionary accidentals. I don't use the Cautionary Accidentals plug-in myself, but if you want to remove all the parentheses from your accidentals, you can do that easily in the JW Change (Beta). Accidentals->Parentheses->Hide and apply on the whole document. Best regards, Jari Williamsson ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] erratic cautionary accidental plugin
When applying the Cautionary Accidental plugin to a newly created file, as far as I can tell it works as it's supposed to. But when I apply it to an older file - one that has been around for a while and never had that plugin applied, strange things happen. The most annoying is that accidentals that appeared correctly in the file now have parentheses applied to them necessitating a meticulous process of removing them - a process that is only slightly less harrowing than proof reading the file and entering the cautionary accidentals by hand. Incidentally, my plugin is set to show no parentheses even on the cautionary accidentals. Are there any ideas about why this might be happening? I did try replacing my preference file, but that had no effect on the problem. Thanks, Chuck Chuck Israels 8831 SE 12th Ave. Portland, OR 97202-7097 land line: (503) 954-2107cell phone: (360) 201-3434 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
