Re: Harrison Fjord and riding - help!
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I like the 3-part snaffle bits for riding. They have different names like French link, Dr. Bristol, dog bone -- all slightly different in shape but same design. In case we haven't noticed, Fjords have very large and strong necks ;-) It helps to condition them to give to the bit, whichever bit you choose. There are a million varieties of this "natural horsemanship" exercise. John Lyons writes about it a lot. I do as follows: when I first mount, I let the horse stand for a while (nothing like trotting off while you're halfway in the saddle). I reach down one rein and take up contact, pulling the rein out in an "opening" way. Many Fjords, especially those who've been ridden/driven with heavy hands, or ridden very little, will respond by pulling the other way. Oops! Here's where I cheat. I make sure the horse knows I have a treat in the hand on that side. I again take up the contact and ask for a give. If he gives, I click and treat. Note: I don't treat just for turning the head, he must respond to the bit and understand it's a cue. This may take many repetitions, but the results are wonderful! The only caveat is that you must ride with! light hands from then on -- the clever Fjord will remember that if he responds immediately, he'll get a release and maybe even a goodie -- heavy hands can cause a regression to the wrestling match. Brigid Wasson SF Bay Area, CA www.brigid.clickryder.com
Re: Harrison Fjord and riding - help!
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> OK, Do change the bit..But not to a "harsher" bit! Get rid of the broken snaffle. does it have shanks by any chance? I use the "Glory" bits or Mylers on my Fjords. All go very well in the Glory butterfly, which technically is a driving bit but also works well for riding. I have now gotten a Myler elbow bit, with a 6" low wide port (solid) mouthpiece for big Bjorken. Harrison probably takes at least a 5 1/2" or 6" bit for starters. Even a mullen mouth Pelham (5 1/2 inch" or 6") would be better than the snaffle especially for smaller kids. what I like about the two ring Glory butterfly is that you can use the higher ring for a direct snaffle effect or put the rein on the lower ring for more control out on the trail. Same with the Myler Elbow bit only it has more options. most Fjords tend to have low pallets and large tongues..and a snaffle with a single joint will poke them in the roof of the mouth, or poke painfully dowhn into his tongue.. No doubt he did learn to lug on the bit when he was driven, but you CAN change that..by starting over essentially, teaching him to give to the bit with an instant release when he does. But a child is not going to do that..so a pelham or Kimberwick with mullen mouth would work If you can't afford a Glory bit or Myler. Here is a website showing the Glory bits http://www.CarriageDrivingEssentials.com/bits.shtml Glory metalworks also make a Glory riding bit.I'll give you Rayl Jonson's phone # if you want to roder a Glory. Myler bits: http://www.CarriageDrivingEssentials.com/myler.shtml Here is the Myler butterfly with Low Wide Port.http://www.CarriageDrivingEssentials.com/images/cde158.jpg If you do want to get a Myler to fit him try BIG HORSE Feed and Farm Supply, in Temecula, California (your neighborhood?) (909)676-2544 33320 Highway 79, Temecula, CA. They have a lot in stock to fit larger horses! For a less expensive solution I suggest: 05-0311 KMSS Mullem Mouth Eggbutt Pelham Bit in the Libertyville catalog: http://www.saddleshop.com/eng/engset.htm #05-0311 comes in 5 1/2" and 6" and is only $27.50 Now a disclaimer! I am sure Beth Beymer, Karen McCarthy or Pat Holland or others are much more qualified to advise you on training! As far as his bucking in that situation,he probably got hyped by that other horse and thought "YEHAW!! lets go! A new situation, strange surrondings,other horses, etc. He needs to go back to some basics and if you do use a "snaffle" try a Myler comfort snaffle..but no shanked snaffles please! Jean in Hot and sunny Fairbanks, Alaska, 85 degrees NOW, will get to 90+ today, sunny for almost 22 hours! Much too hot for us Alaskans! >another horse came uncorked and came bucking and twirling at Harrison >which led Harrison to start crowhopping and spinning and unseated my >daughter. She was fine, but only Harrison and one other horse reacted >to the horse that uncorked. Although a friend was watching and she >said she didn't blame Harrison for reacting because the horse was >headed right for him. So I'm thinking no big deal. Yes? BUT after >that happened he was a real stinker in terms of resisting the bit. Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Harrison Fjord and riding - help!
This message is from: Tamara Rousso <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> On Saturday, June 19, 2004, at 04:26 PM, Marsha Jo Hannah wrote: This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sleepy appears to be afraid of Arabian horses---or any other breed with very "expressive" or unusual movement (like Pasos). Near as I can tell, this is due to a mismatch between Fjord body language and that of other breeds. Thank you for all of your comments Marsha. That is a very interesting observation about your Fjord and other hot breeds. I think that may explain some of Harrison's behavior. He also was previously owned by a woman with a Rottwieller that chased and nipped at him. He has already proven around our place that he is very alert to any danger coming his way. It took him several months to not worry about our dogs. So, when he encounters one of these "killer Arabs" on the trail, he sometimes does a rollback and exit stage left, without warning me that it's coming, whereupon I get "left sitting in midair"; THUD. I will let my daughter know she is in good company with the Fjord "leave 'em on the trail" maneuver. When I spoke to a trainer about this, she said the solution was to "give him lots of little jobs to do"---lower his head, step to one side, give to the bit, back a step, forward a step---basically keep him so busy listening to me that he didn't have time to think about what the other horse was saying to him. I have a tendency to be a passive rider, That is totally my daughter. She is only 12, but not at all interested in competition. She just loves horses and wants to sit on them and enjoy. I will pass along your whole email to her! What worked best for him was a low-port Kimberwicke, with the reins on the "curb" slot. That is very interesting. The trainer we are working with has experience with Fjords, but does not own one herself. She said we would look at a number of possibilities, so I am copying off suggestions from the list. Thank you so much for yours. Tamara Rousso Fallbrook CA www.algedifarm.com
Re: Harrison Fjord and riding - help!
This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Tamara Rousso <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Harrison has been primarily trained as a cart horse. He is close to > 15hh and a drafty build. He has been ridden some but does not have the > fine tuning. [...] riding club's overnight camp [...] He was a > typical Fjord about big noises, crossing wooden bridges, getting close > to flags flapping and that sort of thing (i.e. no reaction), but > another horse came uncorked and came bucking and twirling at Harrison > which led Harrison to start crowhopping and spinning and unseated my > daughter. She was fine, but [...] after > that happened he was a real stinker in terms of resisting the bit. [...] > comment by one of my friends that rides after she was on > him. Her words "he makes you carry him around the ring". Harrison was > being ridden in a broken snaffle. One of the suggestions was to get a > harsher bit. I'm really a softie and not crazy about that idea. Is he > like this from being a driving horse? Can he be trained to do both > well? What kind of bit do most of you use? I've experienced similar things with my Fjord gelding, Sleepy---he's 14.3, out of "foundation American" stock, i.e. a bit drafty. His early training was mostly draft-style driving, although he was also packed and ridden western. I mostly used him for trail riding. Sleepy appears to be afraid of Arabian horses---or any other breed with very "expressive" or unusual movement (like Pasos). Near as I can tell, this is due to a mismatch between Fjord body language and that of other breeds. Fjords tend to be somewhat subtle in their interactions amongst each other---a nose wrinkle and an eyebrow lift speak volumes. When they encounter a breed that's always in motion, like some endurance-bred Arabs, it's as if the other horse is always SHOUTING threats at them! Sleepy is low man on the totem pole around here, so has had lots of experience at getting his body out of harms way when someone offers to kill him. So, when he encounters one of these "killer Arabs" on the trail, he sometimes does a rollback and exit stage left, without warning me that it's coming, whereupon I get "left sitting in midair"; THUD. When he has been exposed to a particular individual horse for a while, he seems to "compile" that animal's body language, and reacts less to such "unintentional threats". It's not clear whether repeated exposure to many horses would cause him to generalize about all other-horse body language. When I spoke to a trainer about this, she said the solution was to "give him lots of little jobs to do"---lower his head, step to one side, give to the bit, back a step, forward a step---basically keep him so busy listening to me that he didn't have time to think about what the other horse was saying to him. I have a tendency to be a passive rider, and she wanted me to become more "in command" of him. At the time, I didn't understand what she meant; after years of reading John Lyons' magazine, her comments now make sense to me. Sleepy also had a tendency to hang on my hands in a snaffle bit. I think part of it is that the draftier Fjords are built somewhat on the forehand, so their default is to lean into the bit. Certainly, draft-style driving (I've seen photos of Sleepy in a plow hitch) encourages that. Correct carriage-style driving seeks to rebalance the horse, as does ridden dressage work. It can be done, but it will be work, for both the rider and the horse. My neighbor (who was giving us "trail riding lessons") had me try all of my bits on Sleepy during an arena lesson. With a jointed snaffle, or a mullen-mouth Pelham on the snaffle ring, he hung on my hands. The curb ring of the Pelham (and other curb bits that we tried) was too much leverage---he lightened up, but sucked back out of contact. What worked best for him was a low-port Kimberwicke, with the reins on the "curb" slot. My neighbor said that, "according to the book", it made no sense to put that much bit on a horse that really didn't want to go forward, but that was what he travelled best in, so that's what we used. Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! 15 mi SW of Roseburg, Oregon
Re: It's a (grey) boy - X 2!
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Whoo Hoo!!! Congratulations to both Catherine and Peg on their new grey baby boys! Amy Evers Dun Lookin' Fjords Redmond, OR Fjord [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Harrison Fjord and riding - help!
This message is from: Tamara Rousso <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Well we have finally started working Harrison under saddle. I have a trainer giving my 12 year old daughter lessons on him, but I would also like some input from those of you with lots of experience with Fjords. Harrison has been primarily trained as a cart horse. He is close to 15hh and a drafty build. He has been ridden some but does not have the fine tuning. We took him to her riding club's overnight camp and discovered a couple of things I would like your input on. He was a typical Fjord about big noises, crossing wooden bridges, getting close to flags flapping and that sort of thing (i.e. no reaction), but another horse came uncorked and came bucking and twirling at Harrison which led Harrison to start crowhopping and spinning and unseated my daughter. She was fine, but only Harrison and one other horse reacted to the horse that uncorked. Although a friend was watching and she said she didn't blame Harrison for reacting because the horse was headed right for him. So I'm thinking no big deal. Yes? BUT after that happened he was a real stinker in terms of resisting the bit. My daughter became exhausted and in tears, so a couple of other people rode him. One little girl has a Morgan/Arab cross and she stayed on him about 5 minutes and said "no way, he is too much work". A 13 year old boy that also owns a Fjord then rode him for the rest of the games and just loved him, but did say he was very heavy on the bit. And again the same comment by one of my friends that rides after she was on him. Her words "he makes you carry him around the ring". Harrison was being ridden in a broken snaffle. One of the suggestions was to get a harsher bit. I'm really a softie and not crazy about that idea. Is he like this from being a driving horse? Can he be trained to do both well? What kind of bit do most of you use? thanks in advance, Tamara Rousso Fallbrook CA www.algedifarm.com
Re: Pine's Edge Oliver
This message is from: "Pat Holland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Its been awhile since I told you about receiving the 6 yr old ride and drive gelding "Oliver" - I think I have him figured out now. He has really nice ground manners, a good gentleman on the ground. baths, clips, crossties, stands without pawing, great in the stall, no worries about him. He is independent and doesn't require company of another horse. He stands tipping 15 hands, but lets call him a 14-3 plus size. he is not drafty, long, lean and currently in very good shape. Legs are good and conformation wise he is very good. His owners rode and drove him only on the trails - he has had little ring work. He took him to a trial ride out west somewhere and has been places and seen things. He is not a wide body, I (with short legs and top heavy) sit well on him. He needs some of the refinement work, a softer, more educated mouth, doesn't understand contact or leg yields - type of situation. He has been trained Parelli - he was ridden in the Parelli halter technique and knows all the Parelli "stuff" on the ground - as in everytime you turn around he's there! (as you can see I don't do, nor understand Parelli)... He is a "looker"..lots of presence. His movement is long and very free. really good mover, better than his 3/4 brother that I own. My opinion with a bit more educated riding he could be an outstanding show horse - has "that" look...otherwise he already does the trails - win - win. He was being sold with his cart and harness, but I bought those. I have his picture up on my website - www.pathollandtraining.com.
Re: HELP
This message is from: "Pat Holland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I need a Ring Steward for Judge Karen Cabic for the Blue Earth show. This a great job, you get to learn allot and spend time with a knowledgable horse person, also a Sr. Evaluator. You also get to stand out in the sun and sweat. Requirements: good shoes, the ability to go long periods of time without the need to go to the bathroom and a desire for a good tan. Please contact me if you would like this job. Pay?..what do they say in the Visa ad?...priceless. Pat Holland
Re: Animated Rainbow Bridge
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jean, Thanks You! I just lost my Lab Kelli of 17years. I watched with tears pouring. MJ Olympia, WA
Re: Animated Rainbow Bridge
This message is from: "Warren Stockwell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Thank You Jean it is B E A utiful!!! But you forgot to tell us to be ready with the Kleenex!!! Roberta MN - Original Message - From: "Jean Ernest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Saturday, June 19, 2004 11:18 AM Subject: Animated Rainbow Bridge > This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > http://www.indigo.org/rainbowbridge_ver2.html/ > > Jean Ernest > Fairbanks, Alaska > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Animated Rainbow Bridge
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.indigo.org/rainbowbridge_ver2.html/ Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tee Shirts Refunds
This message is from: Steve McIlree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To those of you who might be wondering where your tee shirt refunds are I own an explanation. When it became obvious I wasn't going to pay the printer immediately, I parked the money in a separate account to keep it from being commingled with my other money. After I promised to send refunds I discovered I couldn't practically access the account until last Tuesday, June 15th. I've now transferred it to my checking account, and will be writing checks and mailing them today. Thank you for your patience. -- Steve McIlree - Pferd, Skipper & Clust - Omaha, NE/Las Cruces, NM, USA What if the hokey pokey IS what it's all about?
Colt
This message is from: "Douglas Knutsen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Well, OK, maybe he's brown, but he is still incredibly, royally, beautiful! Off to the barn - Peg Peg Knutsen www.elltel.net/kffjord/
