Re: The worth of a good horse
This message is from: "Arthur Rivoire" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hello Everybody from Carol Rivoire at Beaver Dam Farm in Nova Scotia ' I'd like to respond to John & Eunice's opinions regarding THE LAW OF VALUE . . . ~~~ "> This message is from: "John & Eunice Bosomworth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >... wouldn't make much sense if you were buying a new truck or tractor, for example. It pays to shop for the best deal when you are comparing the same make and model. Yes, of course, "if" you are comparing the same make and model, but that's impossible with horses as each one is born unique, and has had a different environment and handling. John & Eunice say . . . ~ I think the LAW OF VALUE is particularly applicable to horses, and I believe if more people followed it, there would be far fewer disappointed horse owners who didn't get what they really needed and wanted, and very often ended up spending loads of money and a lot of time trying to remedy a bad situation. I've heard these stories a lot. As to "some breeders simply asking more than other breeders for their weanlings (and others)" . . . . This statement implies that one breeder is asking more than another for exactly the same "merchandise". Again, by definition this is not possible with animals. Each one is unique, and not every Fjord can be made suitable to every buyer, no matter how young you get them, or how much training you put into them.That's my opinion after 24 years breeding Fjords. If you find a breeder who's pricing all 2 yr. old fillies alike, then he either doesn't know his horses, or doesn't care about their individual differences, and therefore, couldn't possibly effectively match the horse to the prospective buyer. ~~~ >Then one may argue the breeding and so forth ... BUT... there have been cases where the less expensive fjord has scored higher at an evaluation or performed better in competiton. So the higher the price doesn't necessarily mean you will be getting a better fjord. Yes, of course, that can happen, but I don't think there's much argument about the importance of good bloodlines. Bloodlines are what it's all about in consistently producing good horses. At BDF, we've always prided ourselves on developing each horse according to his individual character and abilities, and then finding him the right home, and never being tempted for the sake of a dollar to sell someone the wrong horse. -- We want to have happy, satisfied customers, and at the same time, we need the assurance that we're placing our beloved horses with the right people. With a new owner that is capable of carrying on what we've done with the horse. --- When we sell a horse, that's not the end of it. We delight in staying in touch with most of our custoemrs and following their successes. Presently, at our farm, we have 18 Fjordhorses for sale, and they range inprice from $4500 - $17,000. The difference in price reflects the different attributes of each horse. > > As for the statement -- <<<"How much are your horses?" That shouldn't be the first question. >>> Perhaps the buyer would be far better served if he said upfront (which some do) . . . "I'm looking for a horse, and I don't want to or can't pay more than $_ " ~~ Buying a horse is a big step financially and emotionally, not to mention the personal safety issue. The buyer should make every effort to inform the seller about his personal situation, and personal wants and needs. Hopefully, the seller can be relied on to make every effort to provide a suitable horse, and if he doesn't have anything suitable, he will say so. It's an old adage that the price of the horse is the most insignificant par of the total cost of horse ownership, meaning it costs "at least" as much to care for a bad one as a good one. Much more often, it costs a whole lot more to deal with the bad horse.And that cost is a lot more than money. It's frustration and sadness and loss of quality time the person could have enjoyed with the right horse. I realize most people are working within a budget, and for some, maybe $4,000 (for example) is all they can spend. To them, my advice would be to spend that $4,000 on a high quality weanling. Dont' try to get a trained 7 yr. old for the price. Considering the emotional, safety, and financial issues involved in horse ownership, it is wise to research your purchase extensively, and buy the very best you can find. Therefore, my opinion stands that "How much are your horses?" should not be a buyer's first question. -- He should tell the breeder/seller about himself including his price range, and ask if the seller has anything suitable. Kind Regards, Carol Rivoire
Re: The Worth of a Good Horse
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi, I agree that you should get a horse that is suited to you. But price is a factor, I am a back yard horse owner and cannot afford a 2,000 dollar horse so it would be a waste of my time and the owners time if I look at one. I don't think price should be the sole factor in choosing a horse, but almost everyone must take price into account. It's not a bad first question so you know if your wasting your time. Just my humble opinion. Bye Erica
re: the worth of a good horse
This message is from: "John & Eunice Bosomworth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> In regard to --- "This goes back to THE LAW OF VALUE written by English philosopher, John Ruskin, 1819 - 1900." This certainly sounds like a philosopher ... wouldn't make much sense if you were buying a new truck or tractor, for example. It pays to shop for the best deal when you are comparing the same make and model.You probably would pay more for a John Deere compared to well ... compared to almost anything else.Probably buying a JD would be money well spent. :>) The Philosopher's LAW OF VALUE would be hard to apply to fjords as well because some breeders simply ask more than other breeders -- for their weanlings (or others) with the same training.Then one may argue the breeding and so forth ... BUT... there have been cases where the less expensive fjord has scored higher at an evaluation or performed better in competiton. So the higher the price doesn't necessarily mean you will be getting a better fjord. As for the statement -- <<<"How much are your horses?" That shouldn't be the first question. >>> In some cases I wish that were the inquirer's first question ... it would possibly save a lot of time talking with them or emailing information. Enjoying our warm sunny weather! Fjordally yours, Eunice ~~ John & Eunice Bosomworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] Deere Country Fjords--- where visitors are always welcome! Ayton, Ontario, CANADA tel. 519-665-2303 ~~
Re: The Worth of a Good Horse
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 6/6/2002 5:29:02 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Don't > ask the breeder - "How much are your horses?" That shouldn't be the first > question. You should first tell the breeder your needs, your strengths, > your weaknesses, and then ask if he has anything suitable. --- Hopefully, > you'll be talking to an honest, knowledgeable breeder. --- > This has always been a big pet peeve of mine too. Way back when we were raising Quarter Horses - Every time someone would call in answer to a newspaper ad or a sign, it was always "How much are your asking for the horses?" I always thought - don't they want to know what the horses are? or aren't they even interested in how old they are or whether it's a mare or gelding? or if they are broke to ride or not? I never could quite understand people. We still get that with our Fjords too. Even if someone is not interested in buying - just looking at these "odd" horses - they still pop up with "How much do they cost?" My standard answer now is something like, "Oh, anywhere from $2500 - $3000 for a weanling to $10,000 - $12,000 or so for a horse that's well trained to ride and drive." I do think I love to kind of shock these "window shoppers!" Although, I did have one lady that raised Arabs stop by and when I gave her that line she said "Oh, that's not bad." And then proceeded to tell me about the mare she'd bought for $35,000 which she thought was a bargain! Amy Amy Evers Dun Lookin' Fjords Redmond, OR Fjord [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Worth of a Good Horse - or- "What's your life worth?"
This message is from: "Arthur Rivoire" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Good Morning Everybody from Carol Rivoire at Beaver Dam Farm in Nova Scotia --- I'd just made the morning tea(s) - Red Rose for me, and Red Raspberry for Maryke, and settled in front of the computer to check the mail. After getting business mail answered, I clicked on the Digest, and found Philis Anderson's description of what must have been a very scary experience. ~ >my son went with his truck and pulled> the cart out of the mess. When things go like that I say the price of that> horse just went up another $1000.00!! > > Philis Anderson ~~~ The other day, I said something similar regarding the worth of one of our horses - It was a 3 yr. old gelding, BDF Quasar who's been in driving training 3 weeks. Our trainer, Don, had just finished a session, and gotten out of the cart, tying the reins up on the backstrap. Three of us were standing beside the cart talking when Dave, our handyman, came up with the tractor about three meters away, and dropped the bucket with a bang. - All three people jumped. Quasar never budged. That's when I said, "The price of that horse just went up $2,000", and believe me, I meant it. -- If a horse isn't brave, calm, and self-confident, it doesn't matter much what other attributes he has because you can't do much with him. This goes back to THE LAW OF VALUE written by English philosopher, John Ruskin, 1819 - 1900. He says --- "it is unwise to pay too much, but is is unwise to pay too little. When you pay too much you lose a little money that is all. When you pay too little, you sometimes lose everthing, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the thing you bought it to do. The common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot . . . It can't be done. --- If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run. And if you do that, you will have enough to pay for something bett er." I believe this implicity and apply it to the horses we sell, whether they're our home-breds or horses we take on consignment. A good horse is not only worth a lot of money, he is invaluable; that is, if you value your own life and the lives of your family, and if you know enough about horses to realize the dangers they can represent. Frankly, it has always astounded and annoyed the hell out of me when people call up looking for a cheap horse for their families. --- The best advice I possibly can give anybody buying a horse is to look for one suitable for your particular situation . . . And then think about the price. --- Don't ask the breeder - "How much are your horses?" That shouldn't be the first question. You should first tell the breeder your needs, your strengths, your weaknesses, and then ask if he has anything suitable. --- Hopefully, you'll be talking to an honest, knowledgeable breeder. --- One of the first lessons I learned when we were importing a lot of horses from Holland, is to get people the best, most reliable, most suitable, most problem-free horse that it's possible to find. There are multiple reasons to do this, and most of them very practical and good for business. But to sum up . . . . If the horse seller operates this way, he'll have no problems after the sale. And, in fact, will have gained a new friend, not just a customer. Getting back to our brave, steady 4 yr. old gelding, Quasar . . . BDF Quasar is a son of Gjest, out of Holly, and I've liked this horse since birth. In fact, I thought he was stallion material, and still think so, although we gelded him two years ago being unable to find a buyer for a stud colt. -- Too bad! Someone missed out on a wonderful horse. Quasar has never disappointed me. In fact, everything he does reinforces my certainty that he's a very special horse.. He's got a visible substance and solidity of both mind and body. You can see and feel his calmness and good sense. He's intelligent, calm, and sensible. When we began training him on longlines, we realized he has remarkable athletic abilities. In fact, all the attributes of a good dressage horse. He's big (not tall, but big) and muscular and built "uphill". He has natural and quite remarkable self-carriage. There's a regularity about his gaits that you don't find in many horses of any age. And, he has wonderful movement. Guess what? I may have just convinced myself to keep BDF Quasar, and sell either Saskia or Saakje, the two great mares we'd reserved for our retirement. But why keep two quality mares if we're not going to reed? This bears some more thought. If we do decide to sell one of the mares, it will probably be Saakje as she's the most talented. A daughter of Ohlsen-Junior, she's an incredible mover, and a thoroughly delightful riding and driving horse that we'll be using in our Nova Scot
