Re: [Flac-dev] Git branch with compiling fixes for win32

2011-11-16 Thread Avuton Olrich
Hello,

Hate to be Capt. obvious here, but there's a lot of development going
on here that should be encouraged. If the FLAC project isn't going to
open up, it would make a lot of sense for someone to take over
maintenance on a github account with the git-cvsimport or such. I
don't see anyone stepping up, me included, but I wanted to throw this
out there in case someone hasn't really thought about it yet.
-- 
avuton
--
If someone nearby has an iphone and leaves it near you, be aware they
may be spying on you.
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Re: [Flac-dev] Git branch with compiling fixes for win32

2011-11-16 Thread Erik de Castro Lopo
Avuton Olrich wrote:

 Hello,
 
 Hate to be Capt. obvious here, but there's a lot of development going
 on here that should be encouraged. If the FLAC project isn't going to
 open up, it would make a lot of sense for someone to take over
 maintenance on a github account with the git-cvsimport or such. I
 don't see anyone stepping up, me included, but I wanted to throw this
 out there in case someone hasn't really thought about it yet.

There is a Git branch on the Xiph server here:

http://git.xiph.org/?p=flac.git;a=summary

When I find a little bit of time (the weekend) I will be validating
these patches and commiting them to that repo.

Erik
-- 
--
Erik de Castro Lopo
http://www.mega-nerd.com/
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Re: [Flac-dev] Git branch with compiling fixes for win32

2011-11-16 Thread Declan Kelly
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 05:41:21AM -0800, avu...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hate to be Capt. obvious here, but there's a lot of development going
 on here that should be encouraged. If the FLAC project isn't going to
 open up, it would make a lot of sense for someone to take over
 maintenance on a github account with the git-cvsimport or such. I
 don't see anyone stepping up, me included, but I wanted to throw this
 out there in case someone hasn't really thought about it yet.

Looking at the FLAC website, the most recent news is almost 2 years old,
and there's no evidence to show that the project's still live. I haven't
seen any post from Josh Coalson on this list in a while: is he still
running the project?

Something else to think about:
Apple recently released sources for Apple Lossless reference utilities.
It's all under an Apache license.

This will (presumably) lead to more software developers spending more
time improving ALAC support in their projects, with more reference
material available than the unofficial reverse-engineered code (as used
in vlc and libavcodec).

This will leave Apple with even less reasons to support FLAC in their
own products. Anyone with an iPad/iPhone/iPod must install Rockbox to
play FLAC files, and the Apple TV can only play FLAC (and anything that
was not bought from iTunes) using XBMC, after being jailbroken.

But for the Average End User, they don't want to have to jump through a
bunch of hoops to get FLAC support. Apple Lossless will Just Work on all
Apple devices (as it always did), but now it's more freely available so
the freedom-loving hippies can stop complaining about the source code.

-- 
-Dec.
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Re: [Flac-dev] Git branch with compiling fixes for win32

2011-11-16 Thread Brian Willoughby

On Nov 16, 2011, at 14:11, Declan Kelly wrote:
 On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 05:41:21AM -0800, avu...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hate to be Capt. obvious here, but there's a lot of development going
 on here that should be encouraged. If the FLAC project isn't going to
 open up, it would make a lot of sense for someone to take over
 maintenance on a github account with the git-cvsimport or such. I
 don't see anyone stepping up, me included, but I wanted to throw this
 out there in case someone hasn't really thought about it yet.

 Looking at the FLAC website, the most recent news is almost 2 years  
 old,
 and there's no evidence to show that the project's still live. I  
 haven't
 seen any post from Josh Coalson on this list in a while: is he still
 running the project?

 Something else to think about:
 Apple recently released sources for Apple Lossless reference  
 utilities.
 It's all under an Apache license.

 This will (presumably) lead to more software developers spending more
 time improving ALAC support in their projects, with more reference
 material available than the unofficial reverse-engineered code (as  
 used
 in vlc and libavcodec).

 This will leave Apple with even less reasons to support FLAC in their
 own products. Anyone with an iPad/iPhone/iPod must install Rockbox to
 play FLAC files, and the Apple TV can only play FLAC (and anything  
 that
 was not bought from iTunes) using XBMC, after being jailbroken.

 But for the Average End User, they don't want to have to jump  
 through a
 bunch of hoops to get FLAC support. Apple Lossless will Just Work  
 on all
 Apple devices (as it always did), but now it's more freely  
 available so
 the freedom-loving hippies can stop complaining about the source code.


Declan,

You make some important observations, but I do not see how anything  
can be done by the FLAC team about Apple's lack of support.

As for FLAC, no news is good news.  That means the code is stable and  
bug free.  As a seasoned software developer, I've learned the hard  
way that every single change to a source code repository is a chance  
for a new or old bug to appear.  I am not aware of any bugs in FLAC,  
so the lack of changes is perfect.

It seems that all of the recent updates have been efforts to port  
FLAC to operating systems like Windows and Linux.  In terms of your  
comments above, Windows/Linux support does absolutely nothing to help  
FLAC compete against ALAC on the OSX platform.

It is indeed noteworthy that Apple has released the source for ALAC.   
The power of FLAC is that it was designed for embedded systems from  
the beginning, and that's why you see portable recorders like the  
Sound Devices 700 Series supporting FLAC, as well as various optical  
disc players (CD, DVD, etc.).  One question that remains for me is  
whether Apple's ALAC open source can be ported to these kinds of  
embedded systems with the same ease.

Yes, it has always been an issue that Apple never seemed motivated to  
support FLAC as a first class file format in OSX, CoreAudio, iTunes,  
and their hardware platforms based on iOS. I really don't see how  
there is much that Josh Coalson or anyone outside Apple can do about  
this.

If people in the FLAC community have CoreAudio converters for FLAC or  
iTunes plugins for FLAC, then it would be great to see those  
contributed to the open source collection.  However, none of those  
items would really result in a change to the FLAC library sources,  
which have been stable and solid for a respectable amount of time.

Brian Willoughby
Sound Consulting

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