Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-07 Thread Chris Velevitch
On 2/8/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The idea of a single table that shows all the class elements, both
> defined in the class and inherited, is a bit daunting. For example, the
> table for the DataGrid would contain over 200 rows, probably closer to
> 250 rows.

I appreciate that some classes will have that many methods and
properties (we are talking public ones?), and that a single table
showing all elements is daunting. However, even more daunting is
trying to get a birds eye view of a class, when you're an inch off the
ground! That's certainly how I feel, when I look at the class summary
of a class like the DataGrid.

I just thought of an issue (and this may be off topic) with highly
specialised classes. When a class has large family tree, the
names/meanings of methods/properties of ancestor classes tend be very
generic and many not make sense in the specialised decedent class.
What mechanisms are in place to rename ancestor methods/properties so
they make sense in the context of the decedent class. This issue is
important when learning a new class that has a large family tree,
because you are trying to understand what this class can do for you
and generic names can slow you down.


Chris
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RE: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-07 Thread Stephen Gilson
Hi Chris,

We have a few ideas on how to better show the inherited items. One idea
is to show all inherited items, for example methods, in a single summary
table rather than as a collection of tables that list each inherited
item. The summary table would look like the summary table for the
methods defined in the class itself; they would contain the method
signature and the one line summary of the method. 

Since the table of inherited items can be quite long, we might make it
collapsible so you first see the methods defined in the class, then
expand the table to see inherited methods.

The idea of a single table that shows all the class elements, both
defined in the class and inherited, is a bit daunting. For example, the
table for the DataGrid would contain over 200 rows, probably closer to
250 rows. 

Stephen



-Original Message-
From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Chris Velevitch
Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 6:28 PM
To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

On 2/7/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> For your comment on issue #4, we are planning on adding the "Use" and

I'm interested in knowing what your thoughts are on my comments on issue
#1.
> On 2/3/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > 1. ... We have a
> > request to split the public and protected methods into separate 
> > tables, so that you do not see the protected methods if you are 
> > using the class, but view them only when you are creating a
subclass.
>
> The distinction between using a class and subclassing a class is very 
> important.
>
> When using a class however, a single alphabetic list of all public 
> properties, methods, styles, effects, etc is more usable than lots of 
> little boxes all over the place because:-
>
> a. we're using THIS class and more interested seeing the behaviour and

> attributes of THIS class as a whole, not the individual components 
> that make up the class.
>
> b. useful for people new to the class to help them understand what the

> class can do before moving on the how the class is constructed (ie 
> inheritance hierarchy) or how to subclass it.
>
> c. show the name of the class in which it is defined next to it.
>
> > 3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use of color, 
> > font, and layout make sense?
>
> No, see above.
>
> > 4. Are the inheritance tables usable? These are the tables that list

> > the inherited items from the superclasses.
>
> How about a graphical inheritance hierarchy of all classes? It would 
> be a great way to visually see where a class fits in the whole scheme 
> of things.


Chris
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Manager - Sydney Flash Platform Developers Group www.flashdev.org.au


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Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-06 Thread Chris Velevitch
On 2/7/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> For your comment on issue #4, we are planning on adding the "Use" and

I'm interested in knowing what your thoughts are on my comments on issue #1.
> On 2/3/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > 1. ... We have a
> > request to split the public and protected methods into separate
> > tables, so that you do not see the protected methods if you are using
> > the class, but view them only when you are creating a subclass.
>
> The distinction between using a class and subclassing a class is very
> important.
>
> When using a class however, a single alphabetic list of all public
> properties, methods, styles, effects, etc is more usable than lots of
> little boxes all over the place because:-
>
> a. we're using THIS class and more interested seeing the behaviour and
> attributes of THIS class as a whole, not the individual components that
> make up the class.
>
> b. useful for people new to the class to help them understand what the
> class can do before moving on the how the class is constructed (ie
> inheritance hierarchy) or how to subclass it.
>
> c. show the name of the class in which it is defined next to it.
>
> > 3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use of color,
> > font, and layout make sense?
>
> No, see above.
>
> > 4. Are the inheritance tables usable? These are the tables that list
> > the inherited items from the superclasses.
>
> How about a graphical inheritance hierarchy of all classes? It would be
> a great way to visually see where a class fits in the whole scheme of
> things.


Chris
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RE: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-06 Thread Stephen Gilson
Hi Chris,

For your comment on issue #4, we are planning on adding the "Use" and
"Tree" options to the output, which are modeled on the JavaDocs "Use"
and "Tree" options. The "Tree" option will show you a class hierarchy of
Flex in a text format, rather than a graphical one. Each class has a
graphical inheritance tree at the top of the class description.

Stephen

-Original Message-
From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Chris Velevitch
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 7:16 PM
To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

On 2/3/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 1. ... We have a
> request to split the public and protected methods into separate 
> tables, so that you do not see the protected methods if you are using 
> the class, but view them only when you are creating a subclass.

The distinction between using a class and subclassing a class is very
important.

When using a class however, a single alphabetic list of all public
properties, methods, styles, effects, etc is more usable than lots of
little boxes all over the place because:-

a. we're using THIS class and more interested seeing the behaviour and
attributes of THIS class as a whole, not the individual components that
make up the class.

b. useful for people new to the class to help them understand what the
class can do before moving on the how the class is constructed (ie
inheritance hierarchy) or how to subclass it.

c. show the name of the class in which it is defined next to it.

> 3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use of color, 
> font, and layout make sense?

No, see above.

> 4. Are the inheritance tables usable? These are the tables that list 
> the inherited items from the superclasses.

How about a graphical inheritance hierarchy of all classes? It would be
a great way to visually see where a class fits in the whole scheme of
things.


Chris
--
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Manager - Sydney Flash Platform Developers Group www.flashdev.org.au


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RE: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-03 Thread Stephen Gilson
We use the tool internally for AS3, Flex, FlashLite, and other products.
It's not ready for distribution yet, though we are working on it.

Stephen

-Original Message-
From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jens Halm
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 12:11 PM
To: Stephen Gilson
Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc


> We modeled this documentation on JavaDocs. So, if you are familiar 
> with JavaDocs, it should look pretty familiar. You can see it here:

Will there be a tool in the free release of Compiler/Framework to
generate such documentation? Would be a great thing to have the same doc
format used by all frameworks/tools/products throughout the whole Flash
Platform. Like it is with javadoc in the Java world.

Jens




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Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-03 Thread Jens Halm

> We modeled this documentation on JavaDocs. So, if you are familiar with
> JavaDocs, it should look pretty familiar. You can see it here:

Will there be a tool in the free release of Compiler/Framework to
generate such documentation? Would be a great thing to have the same
doc format used by all frameworks/tools/products throughout the whole
Flash Platform. Like it is with javadoc in the Java world.

Jens




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RE: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-03 Thread Stephen Gilson





Thanks for the feedback,
 

For 
#4, we would not remove the inheritance tables, but make them look like the 
summary tables for the elements defined within the class. 

 
Right now, the inheritance tables are just a list of the 
inherited elements with no description. Instead, we could replace 
the lists with actual summary tables, like the list of methods defined in the 
class. These tables show the method signature, and contain a one-line 
description of the method. It would make each page much longer, so we would also 
need a way to show/hide the inheritance tables if we implement 
it.
 
Stephen


From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Teoti 
GraphixSent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:14 PMTo: 
flexcoders@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking 
for feedback on Flex API doc
1. Would there be a way to toggle them? I develop components, so 
having everything is nice. But when you are making an application, yes, you 
definitly don't need protected stuff.2.I think it's nice, for me it's 
likle seeing flash cards over and over, you memorize things quicker seeing 
compact groups. Let's remember howmany learning styles there are out there 
to.3.I love it, but my opinion again. I really think for as serious of 
documentaion this is, it is just drab enough to catch your attention every time 
you read them. The style lends well to 'surfing' the classes.4. Please 
keep them or at least create toggles for them. They are invaluable as methioned 
above about memorization.I think you could ditch them if they did not serve 
a pratical purpose. But hey, they put the whole picture together, over and 
over.Great job on the docs, for me they are a pleasure to allow my self 
to see how kewl this stuff really is. Gets the inventive mid 
going!Peace, Mike
On 2/2/06, Stephen 
Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
All,We 
  are looking for feedback on the Flex API documentation. Thisdocumentation 
  is titled "Macromedia Flex 2 ActionScript and MXMLLanguage Reference" and 
  is available from Flex Builder Help, or in astandalone form. We 
  modeled this documentation on JavaDocs. So, if you are familiar 
  withJavaDocs, it should look pretty familiar. You can see it 
  here:http://livedocs.macromedia.com/labs/1/flex/langref/index.htmlAfter 
  the Alpha release, we made several changes to it based on userfeedback. 
  One change was to move static properties and methods to theirown area of 
  the output. Topics for discussion now are:1. For each class, 
  we mix both public and protected methods in the samesummary table. This is 
  the way JavaDocs handles methods. We have arequest to split the public and 
  protected methods into separate tables,so that you do not see the 
  protected methods if you are using the class,but view them only when you 
  are creating a subclass.Is this a change you would like to 
  see?2. We include a summary of the MXML syntax for the Flex 
  components atthe top of each class description. The syntax lists the MXML 
  tagattributes and default values for each component.Is this 
  helpful, or should we just remove it? Without it, you would haveto look at 
  the tables of properties, events, effects, and styles todetermine the MXML 
  syntax.3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use 
  of color,font, and layout make sense?4. Are the inheritance 
  tables usable? These are the tables that list theinherited items from the 
  superclasses.One possibility is to replace these inheritance lists 
  with actualsummary tables, like you see for the properties and methods 
  defined inthe class. The summary table shows the item, and includes a 
  one-linesummary.Thanks,Stephen Flex Doc 
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Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-03 Thread Michael Hansen



They are just perfect! Nice work.I definitely don't agree with Gunnar's remark that:"The MXML examples at the end, however, should be removed and replaced with AS-examples."Cheers -michael
On 2/3/06, gunnar a reinseth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:



1. The docs should definately display both protected and public methods/properties - just the way it is! (and it's nice to see that the 'override' keyword is used as well)2. The MXML syntax summary is helpful to get a quick overview of the component - 
e.g. if i'm only looking for a style name. The MXML examples at the end, however, should be removed and replaced with AS-examples.3. No problems with the styling...4. I use the inheritance tables all the time - so, yes.
--gunnarOn 2/2/06, Stephen Gilson <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:




All,

We are looking for feedback on the Flex API documentation. This
documentation is titled "Macromedia Flex 2 ActionScript and MXML
Language Reference" and is available from Flex Builder Help, or in a
standalone form. 

We modeled this documentation on JavaDocs. So, if you are familiar with
JavaDocs, it should look pretty familiar. You can see it here:

http://livedocs.macromedia.com/labs/1/flex/langref/index.html

After the Alpha release, we made several changes to it based on user
feedback. One change was to move static properties and methods to their
own area of the output. 

Topics for discussion now are:

1. For each class, we mix both public and protected methods in the same
summary table. This is the way JavaDocs handles methods. We have a
request to split the public and protected methods into separate tables,
so that you do not see the protected methods if you are using the class,
but view them only when you are creating a subclass.

Is this a change you would like to see?


2. We include a summary of the MXML syntax for the Flex components at
the top of each class description. The syntax lists the MXML tag
attributes and default values for each component.

Is this helpful, or should we just remove it? Without it, you would have
to look at the tables of properties, events, effects, and styles to
determine the MXML syntax.


3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use of color,
font, and layout make sense?


4. Are the inheritance tables usable? These are the tables that list the
inherited items from the superclasses.

One possibility is to replace these inheritance lists with actual
summary tables, like you see for the properties and methods defined in
the class. The summary table shows the item, and includes a one-line
summary.

Thanks,

Stephen 
Flex Doc Team







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Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-03 Thread gunnar a reinseth



1. The docs should definately display both protected and public methods/properties - just the way it is! (and it's nice to see that the 'override' keyword is used as well)2. The MXML syntax summary is helpful to get a quick overview of the component - 
e.g. if i'm only looking for a style name. The MXML examples at the end, however, should be removed and replaced with AS-examples.3. No problems with the styling...4. I use the inheritance tables all the time - so, yes.
--gunnarOn 2/2/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:




All,

We are looking for feedback on the Flex API documentation. This
documentation is titled "Macromedia Flex 2 ActionScript and MXML
Language Reference" and is available from Flex Builder Help, or in a
standalone form. 

We modeled this documentation on JavaDocs. So, if you are familiar with
JavaDocs, it should look pretty familiar. You can see it here:

http://livedocs.macromedia.com/labs/1/flex/langref/index.html

After the Alpha release, we made several changes to it based on user
feedback. One change was to move static properties and methods to their
own area of the output. 

Topics for discussion now are:

1. For each class, we mix both public and protected methods in the same
summary table. This is the way JavaDocs handles methods. We have a
request to split the public and protected methods into separate tables,
so that you do not see the protected methods if you are using the class,
but view them only when you are creating a subclass.

Is this a change you would like to see?


2. We include a summary of the MXML syntax for the Flex components at
the top of each class description. The syntax lists the MXML tag
attributes and default values for each component.

Is this helpful, or should we just remove it? Without it, you would have
to look at the tables of properties, events, effects, and styles to
determine the MXML syntax.


3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use of color,
font, and layout make sense?


4. Are the inheritance tables usable? These are the tables that list the
inherited items from the superclasses.

One possibility is to replace these inheritance lists with actual
summary tables, like you see for the properties and methods defined in
the class. The summary table shows the item, and includes a one-line
summary.

Thanks,

Stephen 
Flex Doc Team







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Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-02 Thread Chris Velevitch
On 2/3/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 1. ... We have a
> request to split the public and protected methods into separate tables,
> so that you do not see the protected methods if you are using the class,
> but view them only when you are creating a subclass.

The distinction between using a class and subclassing a class is very important.

When using a class however, a single alphabetic list of all public
properties, methods, styles, effects, etc is more usable than lots of
little boxes all over the place because:-

a. we're using THIS class and more interested seeing the behaviour and
attributes of THIS class as a whole, not the individual components
that make up the class.

b. useful for people new to the class to help them understand what the
class can do before moving on the how the class is constructed (ie
inheritance hierarchy) or how to subclass it.

c. show the name of the class in which it is defined next to it.

> 3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use of color,
> font, and layout make sense?

No, see above.

> 4. Are the inheritance tables usable? These are the tables that list the
> inherited items from the superclasses.

How about a graphical inheritance hierarchy of all classes? It would
be a great way to visually see where a class fits in the whole scheme
of things.


Chris
--
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Manager - Sydney Flash Platform Developers Group
www.flashdev.org.au


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Re: [flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-02 Thread Teoti Graphix



1. Would there be a way to toggle them? I develop components, so having
everything is nice. But when you are making an application, yes, you
definitly don't need protected stuff.

2.I think it's nice, for me it's likle seeing flash cards over and
over, you memorize things quicker seeing compact groups. Let's remember
howmany learning styles there are out there to.

3.I love it, but my opinion again. I really think for as serious of
documentaion this is, it is just drab enough to catch your attention
every time you read them. The style lends well to 'surfing' the classes.
4. Please keep them or at least create toggles for them. They are invaluable as methioned above about memorization.
I think you could ditch them if they did not serve a pratical purpose.
But hey, they put the whole picture together, over and over.

Great job on the docs, for me they are a pleasure to allow my self to
see how kewl this stuff really is. Gets the inventive mid going!

Peace, Mike
On 2/2/06, Stephen Gilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:




All,

We are looking for feedback on the Flex API documentation. This
documentation is titled "Macromedia Flex 2 ActionScript and MXML
Language Reference" and is available from Flex Builder Help, or in a
standalone form. 

We modeled this documentation on JavaDocs. So, if you are familiar with
JavaDocs, it should look pretty familiar. You can see it here:

http://livedocs.macromedia.com/labs/1/flex/langref/index.html

After the Alpha release, we made several changes to it based on user
feedback. One change was to move static properties and methods to their
own area of the output. 

Topics for discussion now are:

1. For each class, we mix both public and protected methods in the same
summary table. This is the way JavaDocs handles methods. We have a
request to split the public and protected methods into separate tables,
so that you do not see the protected methods if you are using the class,
but view them only when you are creating a subclass.

Is this a change you would like to see?


2. We include a summary of the MXML syntax for the Flex components at
the top of each class description. The syntax lists the MXML tag
attributes and default values for each component.

Is this helpful, or should we just remove it? Without it, you would have
to look at the tables of properties, events, effects, and styles to
determine the MXML syntax.


3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use of color,
font, and layout make sense?


4. Are the inheritance tables usable? These are the tables that list the
inherited items from the superclasses.

One possibility is to replace these inheritance lists with actual
summary tables, like you see for the properties and methods defined in
the class. The summary table shows the item, and includes a one-line
summary.

Thanks,

Stephen 
Flex Doc Team







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[flexcoders] Flex 2 - Looking for feedback on Flex API doc

2006-02-02 Thread Stephen Gilson
All,

We are looking for feedback on the Flex API documentation. This
documentation is titled "Macromedia Flex 2 ActionScript and MXML
Language Reference" and is available from Flex Builder Help, or in a
standalone form. 

We modeled this documentation on JavaDocs. So, if you are familiar with
JavaDocs, it should look pretty familiar. You can see it here:

http://livedocs.macromedia.com/labs/1/flex/langref/index.html

After the Alpha release, we made several changes to it based on user
feedback. One change was to move static properties and methods to their
own area of the output. 

Topics for discussion now are:

1. For each class, we mix both public and protected methods in the same
summary table. This is the way JavaDocs handles methods. We have a
request to split the public and protected methods into separate tables,
so that you do not see the protected methods if you are using the class,
but view them only when you are creating a subclass.

Is this a change you would like to see?


2. We include a summary of the MXML syntax for the Flex components at
the top of each class description. The syntax lists the MXML tag
attributes and default values for each component.

Is this helpful, or should we just remove it? Without it, you would have
to look at the tables of properties, events, effects, and styles to
determine the MXML syntax.


3. Is it styled well? Is it easy to read and does the use of color,
font, and layout make sense?


4. Are the inheritance tables usable? These are the tables that list the
inherited items from the superclasses.

One possibility is to replace these inheritance lists with actual
summary tables, like you see for the properties and methods defined in
the class. The summary table shows the item, and includes a one-line
summary.

Thanks,

Stephen 
Flex Doc Team


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