Re: [Flightgear-devel] Proposed change: visibility inside a cloud layer
Curtis L. Olson wrote: On the same subject of clouds. Is anyone still using the bump mapping code in the cloud layers. I thought this yielded interesting results for the middle of the day, but didn't do the correct thing as the sun got lower and lower in the sky. It adds a lot of complexity to the cloud code and if it's not really being used it would almost be nice to be able to remove it. Could you please leave it there for a moment? I am working on getting some better results from them for a few days. I would hate to see it disappear just prior to that :-/ Erik ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Proposed change: visibility inside a cloud layer
David Megginson wrote: On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 13:59:28 -0600, Curtis L. Olson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: One issue to consider is that going to nil visibility (and not drawing the cloud plane) hides when you pass through the "cloud plane". When the cloud plane intersects the near clip plane you get some ugly artifacts. I don't know how you get around this if you go to only partial visibility. I don't know if I'm willing to live with that artifact. I'm not even going to only partial vis -- I'm not touching vis at all with under 50% cloud coverage. On my system, it doesn't look too bad -- FlightGear doesn't draw the cloud texture at all when you're (supposedly) inside the cloud layer. It does reappear when you get below it, but that sudden pop is not nearly so big a problem as not being able to use FlightGear to fly VFR in what should be VFR conditions. For an inexperienced user, especially, having everything go white when trying to descend past a few clouds (far away) is a far worse visual glitch than having a texture suddenly pop into view, and will probably cause the user to loose control and get frustrated. Should I tentatively commit it so that people can try it out? We can always revert if people hate it (and then I'll have to run it just as a local patch). David, Is it possible to fade the alpha value of the cloud layer to zero as you fade the visibility to 100 (or 50%)? Once the alpha is zero then you can stop drawing the layer. I'm not sure if this is possible by setting the alpha component of the base color of the cloud polygons? On the same subject of clouds. Is anyone still using the bump mapping code in the cloud layers. I thought this yielded interesting results for the middle of the day, but didn't do the correct thing as the sun got lower and lower in the sky. It adds a lot of complexity to the cloud code and if it's not really being used it would almost be nice to be able to remove it. Regards, Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Proposed change: visibility inside a cloud layer
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 13:59:28 -0600, Curtis L. Olson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > One issue to consider is that going to nil visibility (and not drawing > the cloud plane) hides when you pass through the "cloud plane". When > the cloud plane intersects the near clip plane you get some ugly > artifacts. I don't know how you get around this if you go to only > partial visibility. I don't know if I'm willing to live with that artifact. I'm not even going to only partial vis -- I'm not touching vis at all with under 50% cloud coverage. On my system, it doesn't look too bad -- FlightGear doesn't draw the cloud texture at all when you're (supposedly) inside the cloud layer. It does reappear when you get below it, but that sudden pop is not nearly so big a problem as not being able to use FlightGear to fly VFR in what should be VFR conditions. For an inexperienced user, especially, having everything go white when trying to descend past a few clouds (far away) is a far worse visual glitch than having a texture suddenly pop into view, and will probably cause the user to loose control and get frustrated. Should I tentatively commit it so that people can try it out? We can always revert if people hate it (and then I'll have to run it just as a local patch). All the best, David -- http://www.megginson.com/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Proposed change: visibility inside a cloud layer
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 20:56:41 +0100, Erik Hofman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This is due to a faulty SGSky::modify_vis() function. Actually it has > been broken since early 0.7.x as I recall it. I've never remembered to > look at it prior to a release, but I would recommend to fix that > function rather than to apply any kind of hack. I'm not sure I understand. The modify_vis() function isn't buggy as far as I can see, but it does have logic that makes FlightGear less useful -- that's what I'm proposing changing. All the best, David -- http://www.megginson.com/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Proposed change: visibility inside a cloud layer
Erik Hofman wrote: This is due to a faulty SGSky::modify_vis() function. Actually it has been broken since early 0.7.x as I recall it. I've never remembered to look at it prior to a release, but I would recommend to fix that function rather than to apply any kind of hack. Erik, Can you explain in greater detail? What exactly is broken in the modify_vis() function? Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Proposed change: visibility inside a cloud layer
David Megginson wrote: Currently, FlightGear (SimGear, actually) always sets visibility to near-nil when the plane is inside a cloud layer -- obviously, the right and proper solution is 3D clouds, but until we have that working, or at least until we can detect whether the plane is actually near the cloudy part of a texture, I suggest that we do not limit the visibility when the cloud coverage is under 50% (i.e. scattered, few, or clear). This is due to a faulty SGSky::modify_vis() function. Actually it has been broken since early 0.7.x as I recall it. I've never remembered to look at it prior to a release, but I would recommend to fix that function rather than to apply any kind of hack. Erik ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Proposed change: visibility inside a cloud layer
David Megginson wrote: Currently, FlightGear (SimGear, actually) always sets visibility to near-nil when the plane is inside a cloud layer -- obviously, the right and proper solution is 3D clouds, but until we have that working, or at least until we can detect whether the plane is actually near the cloudy part of a texture, I suggest that we do not limit the visibility when the cloud coverage is under 50% (i.e. scattered, few, or clear). It's a bit of a hack, but it does make it possible to fly VFR under conditions that are legal VFR -- it's quite normal for VFR pilots to climb through a scattered cloud layer, for example (our scattered texture might be a little too busy for realism, though). You should have everything go white when there are only a few clouds in the sky. I'd like to commit this (very small) change. Are there any objections? It's especially useful with --enable-real-weather-fetch, where otherwise a low layer of few clouds gives you IMC right off the end of the runway. Here's the complete summay: clear: normal vis few: normal vis scattered: normal vis broken: low vis overcast: low vis cirrus: low vis Thanks, and all the best, David, One issue to consider is that going to nil visibility (and not drawing the cloud plane) hides when you pass through the "cloud plane". When the cloud plane intersects the near clip plane you get some ugly artifacts. I don't know how you get around this if you go to only partial visibility. I don't know if I'm willing to live with that artifact. Regards, Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
