Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Andreas Kupries]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Stephan Beal  wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 9:50 PM, Andreas Kupries 
> wrote:
>>
>> Mirroring of fossil to git ?
>> I use
>>
>> http://core.tcl.tk/akupries/fossil2git/index
>
>
> @Chad: Andreas wins :)

There was a competition ?
Ah well. I will celebrate with a bit of chocolate ;)

>
> i'll take a look at that when i'm feel snarky enough to export code from
> Fossil into the belly of my arch-nemesis. So far my own use of git has been
> limited to cloning from github and one brief project at work.
>
> --
> - stephan beal
> http://wanderinghorse.net/home/stephan/
> http://gplus.to/sgbeal
>
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Senior Tcl Developer
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F: 778.786.1133
andre...@activestate.com
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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Stephan Beal]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 9:50 PM, Andreas Kupries
wrote:

> Mirroring of fossil to git ?
> I use
>
> http://core.tcl.tk/akupries/fossil2git/index


@Chad: Andreas wins :)

i'll take a look at that when i'm feel snarky enough to export code from
Fossil into the belly of my arch-nemesis. So far my own use of git has been
limited to cloning from github and one brief project at work.

-- 
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http://wanderinghorse.net/home/stephan/
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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Andreas Kupries]

Mirroring of fossil to git ?
I use

http://core.tcl.tk/akupries/fossil2git/index

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 12:43 PM, Themba Fletcher
 wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 10:30 AM, Chad Perrin  wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 10:45:08AM +0200, Stephan Beal wrote:
>> > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Chad Perrin  wrote:
>> > >
>> > > mirror should be set up on GitHub to boost its search engine ranking a
>> > > little bit (with a prominent mention of its canonical version control
>> > > repository being elsewhere using Fossil itself, of course).  While
>> >
>> > OMG! lol. It never occurred to me to do such a thing, but you're right,
>> > it
>> > would probably be a good idea.
>>
>> I'd like to be kept abreast of how you accomplish that in an automated
>> manner.  I too would like to do that with some projects of mine, but
>> it's low enough on the priority list for my own stuff right now that I
>> won't get to it for a while.  If you end up doing the hard work of
>> figuring out the best way to do it sooner than I'd get around to even
>> starting, it could save me a lot of effort.
>
>
> Did you say "best way?"
>
> I can't really help you there, but I do run the following script from time
> to time to keep 20+ fossil repos synced to private bitbucket repos. Github
> vs bitbucket should just be a matter of what the prefix portion of the
> remote path is -- it's all just git of course.
>
> https://gist.github.com/tifletcher/5399728
>
> Caveats:
>
> - Everything is hard coded and is really just a rough draft / not intended
> for public consumption.
>
> - I'm calling 'tree' at the end because it helps me visualize / confirm what
> I just did. Please delete that line if 'which tree' returns nothing on your
> system.
>
> - You have to clean up the 'export' directory by hand at the moment (I don't
> personally like seeing rm -r in a script ... especially one that I run
> infrequently)
>
> On the other hand it has been working quite well for me with multiple pushes
> looking as expected on the remote for a while, so maybe it can be a starting
> point for you? And if you fix it please do fork and republish and let me
> know :)
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Themba
>
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Senior Tcl Developer
Code to Cloud: Smarter, Safer, Faster™
F: 778.786.1133
andre...@activestate.com
http://www.activestate.com
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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Themba Fletcher]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 10:30 AM, Chad Perrin  wrote:

> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 10:45:08AM +0200, Stephan Beal wrote:
> > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Chad Perrin  wrote:
> > >
> > > mirror should be set up on GitHub to boost its search engine ranking a
> > > little bit (with a prominent mention of its canonical version control
> > > repository being elsewhere using Fossil itself, of course).  While
> >
> > OMG! lol. It never occurred to me to do such a thing, but you're right,
> it
> > would probably be a good idea.
>
> I'd like to be kept abreast of how you accomplish that in an automated
> manner.  I too would like to do that with some projects of mine, but
> it's low enough on the priority list for my own stuff right now that I
> won't get to it for a while.  If you end up doing the hard work of
> figuring out the best way to do it sooner than I'd get around to even
> starting, it could save me a lot of effort.
>

Did you say "best way?"

I can't really help you there, but I do run the following script from time
to time to keep 20+ fossil repos synced to private bitbucket repos. Github
vs bitbucket should just be a matter of what the prefix portion of the
remote path is -- it's all just git of course.

https://gist.github.com/tifletcher/5399728

Caveats:

- Everything is hard coded and is really just a rough draft / not intended
for public consumption.

- I'm calling 'tree' at the end because it helps me visualize / confirm
what I just did. Please delete that line if 'which tree' returns nothing on
your system.

- You have to clean up the 'export' directory by hand at the moment (I
don't personally like seeing rm -r in a script ... especially one that I
run infrequently)

On the other hand it has been working quite well for me with multiple
pushes looking as expected on the remote for a while, so maybe it can be a
starting point for you? And if you fix it please do fork and republish and
let me know :)

Best Regards,

Themba
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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Chad Perrin]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 08:46:43PM +0200, Stephan Beal wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 7:30 PM, Chad Perrin  wrote:
> >
> > An acquaintance and I might be able to contribute to it in the meantime.
> >
> > We're interested in a C API for Fossil being available for
> > production use some time in the next year or so, and as such might
> > be motivated to hack on it.  We'll have to discuss it and let you
> > know if we're up for it, if you'd like to see some concerted
> > contribution effort from us.
> 
> The only requirement for code submissions is that a license/copyright
> waiver be on file with DRH, so that this code can be kept license-clean
> vis-a-vis fossil(1) (from which it borrows a huge (and growing) amount of
> code). Any sort of assistance, coding or not, is more than welcomed. As far
> as "in the next year or so" goes, my very rough guess is that it will take
> about until about the end of the year to get most of the fossil(1)
> functionality, minus the HTML and networking bits, working at a usable
> equivalent level. That might be pessimistic, though: as of a few moments
> ago, the formerly-missing low-level pieces of SCM machinery are in place
> and working in libfossil. The "verify at commit" bits were just added,
> which frees me up to experiment a bit more without concern about completely
> breaking my repo during experimentation/testing. Now it's mainly about
> tweaking those core APIs and adding the "real" functionality on top of
> that. e.g. you can save a wiki page _if_ you know how to brew the secret
> sauce (it's not hard, but it's a bit tedious), but the APIs for working
> with them at a higher level have yet to be developed (it's an ongoing
> process).
> 
> If you decide you'd like to contribute code, the waiver can be found here:
> 
> http://www.fossil-scm.org/index.html/doc/trunk/www/copyright-release.html
> 
> and needs to be snail-mailed to DRH (address is in the form).

After discussing this with my collaborator, we'll send those off if
we've decided to commit time to working on libfossil.  Thanks.

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Stephan Beal]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 7:30 PM, Chad Perrin  wrote:

> I'd like to be kept abreast of how you accomplish that in an automated
>  manner.  I too would like to do that with some projects of mine, but
> it's low enough on the priority list for my own stuff right now that I
> won't get to it for a while.  If you end up doing the hard work of
> figuring out the best way to do it sooner than I'd get around to even
> starting, it could save me a lot of effort.
>
> It's all about me, after all.
>

Right back at ya ;).


> > That said, i do appreciate (==love/hate) the power of marketing and i
> would
> > be very appreciative if someone would take over such a role :). How does
> > the title of PR Manager sound to you :)?
>
> . . . kinda like that plea for assistance right there.
>

i am by no means too proud to accept assistance, especially for areas i
have little interest or skill in (PR being one of them - i value it but
don't do it well).


> An acquaintance and I might be able to contribute to it in the meantime.
>
We're interested in a C API for Fossil being available for production
> use some time in the next year or so, and as such might be motivated to
> hack on it.  We'll have to discuss it and let you know if we're up for
> it, if you'd like to see some concerted contribution effort from us.
>

The only requirement for code submissions is that a license/copyright
waiver be on file with DRH, so that this code can be kept license-clean
vis-a-vis fossil(1) (from which it borrows a huge (and growing) amount of
code). Any sort of assistance, coding or not, is more than welcomed. As far
as "in the next year or so" goes, my very rough guess is that it will take
about until about the end of the year to get most of the fossil(1)
functionality, minus the HTML and networking bits, working at a usable
equivalent level. That might be pessimistic, though: as of a few moments
ago, the formerly-missing low-level pieces of SCM machinery are in place
and working in libfossil. The "verify at commit" bits were just added,
which frees me up to experiment a bit more without concern about completely
breaking my repo during experimentation/testing. Now it's mainly about
tweaking those core APIs and adding the "real" functionality on top of
that. e.g. you can save a wiki page _if_ you know how to brew the secret
sauce (it's not hard, but it's a bit tedious), but the APIs for working
with them at a higher level have yet to be developed (it's an ongoing
process).

If you decide you'd like to contribute code, the waiver can be found here:

http://www.fossil-scm.org/index.html/doc/trunk/www/copyright-release.html

and needs to be snail-mailed to DRH (address is in the form).

-- 
- stephan beal
http://wanderinghorse.net/home/stephan/
http://gplus.to/sgbeal
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Re: [fossil-users] Fingerprinting a fossil repository

[Ron Aaron]

Yeah, something on that order.  I need to refine it (but what I have
does work, it's just clunky).  Still would be nice to simply be able to
say "fossil fingerprint"...

On 08/22/2013 06:26 PM, Stephan Beal wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Ron Aaron  > wrote:
>
> Adding 'select mtime from config order by mtime;' helps, but it's too
> sensitive (the update time is there, as are a few other things which
> would change without the repo itself changing).
>
>
> why not:
>
> {
>   ...Joerg's code...
>   echo 'select name, value FROM config ORDER BY name' | fossil sqlite
> } | fossil sha1 -
>
> :-?
>
> That allows you to add any number of such queries as you find other
> areas which need to be accounted for (user list!).
>
> -- 
> - stephan beal
> http://wanderinghorse.net/home/stephan/
> http://gplus.to/sgbeal

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Chad Perrin]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 10:45:08AM +0200, Stephan Beal wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Chad Perrin  wrote:
> >
> > mirror should be set up on GitHub to boost its search engine ranking a
> > little bit (with a prominent mention of its canonical version control
> > repository being elsewhere using Fossil itself, of course).  While
> 
> OMG! lol. It never occurred to me to do such a thing, but you're right, it
> would probably be a good idea.

I'd like to be kept abreast of how you accomplish that in an automated
manner.  I too would like to do that with some projects of mine, but
it's low enough on the priority list for my own stuff right now that I
won't get to it for a while.  If you end up doing the hard work of
figuring out the best way to do it sooner than I'd get around to even
starting, it could save me a lot of effort.

It's all about me, after all.


> >
> > you're at it, if you're willing to bother, you could twit about it on
> > Twitter and/or homestead the @libfossil name there.  I wouldn't go so
> > far as to recommend doing anything on Facebook, of course.
> 
> While i occasionally (or more often) act like one, i don't twit or FB, and
> try to keep my G+ to a minimum. It's all too distracting for me - "oh,
> something shiny with moving parts..."

I try to avoid all those things, myself.  For some startup stuff I want
to get rolling, I will probably eventually just hire someone to manage
the "social networking" crap so I don't have to look at it.


> 
> That said, i do appreciate (==love/hate) the power of marketing and i would
> be very appreciative if someone would take over such a role :). How does
> the title of PR Manager sound to you :)?

. . . kinda like that plea for assistance right there.


> >
> > I'll see if, at its current level of (in)completeness, it passes muster
> > for inclusion in some of the Copyfree Initiative's lists (like copyfree
> > licensed projects worthy of support or addition to the copyfree software
> > listing), if you want to finally declare an official name for it as
> > libfossil.
> 
> Don't bother at this point - it's alpha quality. The basics are in place
> and working but there are months of work left in the lib-level SCM-related
> components and about a thousand unit tests to write, and then several more
> months for things like network sync. i also don't want to propagate the
> home page link too much at this point because i will rename the repo as
> soon as we decide to settle on the name libfossil ;).

Noted.  I can be lazy, at your insistence.  I'm pretty good at it.


>
> advantage of having a week off of work, and got far more done on the code
> than i had hoped to, but i won't have any more time off until probably
> October, so i'm restricted to what i can get done in ~6 hours/night plus
> weekends. The point being only that it's moving steadily but not quickly,
> and is not something someone will be able to just sit down and use for at
> least a few months (and at that point it'll almost certainly be limited to
> local usage, but local app-embedded SCM is one of my primary goals here).

An acquaintance and I might be able to contribute to it in the meantime.
We're interested in a C API for Fossil being available for production
use some time in the next year or so, and as such might be motivated to
hack on it.  We'll have to discuss it and let you know if we're up for
it, if you'd like to see some concerted contribution effort from us.

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[B Harder]

On Aug 22, 2013 7:58 AM, "Stephan Beal"  wrote:
>
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 10:45 AM, Stephan Beal 
wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Chad Perrin  wrote:
>>>
>>> I'd say the name should just be set in stone as libfossil now, and a
>>
>>
>> i tend to agree. But then we'll have to find another bikeshedding topic
;). (Oh, i've got plenty of them lined up...)
>
>
> Hi, all,
>
> let's end this misery...
>
> At Chad's insistence ;), and after getting Richard's blessing, the
library API effort has officially been renamed to...
>
> libfossil

Thank you drh, for this blessing, and fossil, and all your hard work.

Thanks Stephan for libfossil.

If it's not apparent to everybody, this community is exciting. I sense a
bright future for all involved!

Fossil all the codes!

-bch

> The new link is:
>
> http://fossil.wanderinghorse.net/repos/libfossil/
>
> the old one still works and uses the same repo, so there's no particular
need to re-clone if you have cloned. i'll eventually get around to updating
the links in the docs.
>
> Happy Hacking!
>
> --
> - stephan beal
> http://wanderinghorse.net/home/stephan/
> http://gplus.to/sgbeal
>
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Re: [fossil-users] Fingerprinting a fossil repository

[Stephan Beal]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Ron Aaron  wrote:

> Adding 'select mtime from config order by mtime;' helps, but it's too
> sensitive (the update time is there, as are a few other things which
> would change without the repo itself changing).
>

why not:

{
  ...Joerg's code...
  echo 'select name, value FROM config ORDER BY name' | fossil sqlite
} | fossil sha1 -

:-?

That allows you to add any number of such queries as you find other areas
which need to be accounted for (user list!).

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Fingerprinting a fossil repository

[Ron Aaron]

That is a nice start.

Unfortunately, it doesn't catch config changes.

Adding 'select mtime from config order by mtime;' helps, but it's too
sensitive (the update time is there, as are a few other things which
would change without the repo itself changing).

Food for thought, though.

On 08/22/2013 12:00 PM, Joerg Sonnenberger wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 06:41:58AM +0300, Ron Aaron wrote:
>> So I tried to find a way to discern whether or not a repo was *really*
>> different, and I hit upon the following.  I think it would be nice if
>> there were an easier way.
> echo 'select uuid from blob order by blob' | fossil sqlite | fossil sha1 -
>
> would be a good start.
>
> Joerg
>

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Re: [fossil-users] Fingerprinting a fossil repository

[Stephan Beal]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 5:07 PM, Ron Aaron  wrote:

>  Em, rsync doesn't help.  ...Secondly, because I'm putting the files
> 'on the cloud', and rsync can't help me there.
>

Ah, of course.

i suspect that Joerg's suggestion (or some derivative) is probably the
easiest.

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Re: [fossil-users] Fingerprinting a fossil repository

[Ron Aaron]

Em, rsync doesn't help.  Firstly, because I'm doing my backup on an
encrypted version of the entire fossil repo (not the individual files),
which changes in its entirety if after a 'fossil upd'.   Secondly,
because I'm putting the files 'on the cloud', and rsync can't help me there.

On 08/22/2013 11:48 AM, Stephan Beal wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 5:41 AM, Ron Aaron  > wrote:
>
> So I tried to find a way to discern whether or not a repo was *really*
> different, and I hit upon the following.  I think it would be nice if
> there were an easier way.
>
>
> Have you tried rsync?
>
> rsync -qza -e ssh *.fsl me@remote:/remote/dir/.
>
> that will only copy the bits which changed AND only transport the
> diffs, so it's really efficient. Leave off the 'q' option to see what
> it's doing and get a report of how much data actually goes over the wire.
>
> Note that it can also copy to another local fs - it doesn't have to go
> over a network.
>
>
> -- 
> - stephan beal
> http://wanderinghorse.net/home/stephan/
> http://gplus.to/sgbeal

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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Stephan Beal]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 10:45 AM, Stephan Beal wrote:

> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Chad Perrin  wrote:
>
>> I'd say the name should just be set in stone as libfossil now, and a
>>
>
> i tend to agree. But then we'll have to find another bikeshedding topic
> ;). (Oh, i've got plenty of them lined up...)
>

Hi, all,

let's end this misery...

At Chad's insistence ;), and after getting Richard's blessing, the library
API effort has officially been renamed to...

libfossil

The new link is:

http://fossil.wanderinghorse.net/repos/libfossil/

the old one still works and uses the same repo, so there's no particular
need to re-clone if you have cloned. i'll eventually get around to updating
the links in the docs.

Happy Hacking!

-- 
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http://wanderinghorse.net/home/stephan/
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Re: [fossil-users] Fingerprinting a fossil repository

[Joerg Sonnenberger]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 06:41:58AM +0300, Ron Aaron wrote:
> So I tried to find a way to discern whether or not a repo was *really*
> different, and I hit upon the following.  I think it would be nice if
> there were an easier way.

echo 'select uuid from blob order by blob' | fossil sqlite | fossil sha1 -

would be a good start.

Joerg
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Re: [fossil-users] Fingerprinting a fossil repository

[Stephan Beal]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 5:41 AM, Ron Aaron  wrote:

> So I tried to find a way to discern whether or not a repo was *really*
> different, and I hit upon the following.  I think it would be nice if
> there were an easier way.
>

Have you tried rsync?

rsync -qza -e ssh *.fsl me@remote:/remote/dir/.

that will only copy the bits which changed AND only transport the diffs, so
it's really efficient. Leave off the 'q' option to see what it's doing and
get a report of how much data actually goes over the wire.

Note that it can also copy to another local fs - it doesn't have to go over
a network.


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Re: [fossil-users] Bikeshedding opportunity: back to the topic of "libfossil"'s name

[Stephan Beal]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Chad Perrin  wrote:

> http://chiselapp.com/user/cutterpillow/repository/fossil-iOS/
>
> There's a libfossil.cpp in the src directory of the source tree
> (requires anonymous login to view, naturally).
>

i'm not worried about collisions of individual files, just the overall
project name (but if they collide "across namespaces" that doesn't bother
me all that much). From what you and Brad have found, it seems like that's
of no real concern.


> I'd say the name should just be set in stone as libfossil now, and a
>

i tend to agree. But then we'll have to find another bikeshedding topic ;).
(Oh, i've got plenty of them lined up...)


> mirror should be set up on GitHub to boost its search engine ranking a
> little bit (with a prominent mention of its canonical version control
> repository being elsewhere using Fossil itself, of course).  While
>

OMG! lol. It never occurred to me to do such a thing, but you're right, it
would probably be a good idea.


> you're at it, if you're willing to bother, you could twit about it on
> Twitter and/or homestead the @libfossil name there.  I wouldn't go so
> far as to recommend doing anything on Facebook, of course.
>

While i occasionally (or more often) act like one, i don't twit or FB, and
try to keep my G+ to a minimum. It's all too distracting for me - "oh,
something shiny with moving parts..."

That said, i do appreciate (==love/hate) the power of marketing and i would
be very appreciative if someone would take over such a role :). How does
the title of PR Manager sound to you :)?

I'll see if, at its current level of (in)completeness, it passes muster
> for inclusion in some of the Copyfree Initiative's lists (like copyfree
> licensed projects worthy of support or addition to the copyfree software
> listing), if you want to finally declare an official name for it as
> libfossil.
>

Don't bother at this point - it's alpha quality. The basics are in place
and working but there are months of work left in the lib-level SCM-related
components and about a thousand unit tests to write, and then several more
months for things like network sync. i also don't want to propagate the
home page link too much at this point because i will rename the repo as
soon as we decide to settle on the name libfossil ;). Last week i had the
advantage of having a week off of work, and got far more done on the code
than i had hoped to, but i won't have any more time off until probably
October, so i'm restricted to what i can get done in ~6 hours/night plus
weekends. The point being only that it's moving steadily but not quickly,
and is not something someone will be able to just sit down and use for at
least a few months (and at that point it'll almost certainly be limited to
local usage, but local app-embedded SCM is one of my primary goals here).

Thanks, {Ch,Br}ad!

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Re: [fossil-users] strange `fossil diff ' behaviour

[j. van den hoff]

On Thu, 22 Aug 2013 00:55:56 +0200, Matt Welland   
wrote:



On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 2:29 PM, j. van den hoff
wrote:


On Wed, 21 Aug 2013 23:19:46 +0200, Stephan Beal 
wrote:

 On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 11:07 PM, Mark Janssen 
>wrote:

 The fossil rebuild logic uses a two pass algorithm. I am not quite  
sure

why this is necessary, it could have something to do with delta
manifests.
At  
http://mpcjanssen.nl/fossil/**fossil/timeline?r=revlistI  
have changed

this to a single pass. This results in relatively monotomic ids which
should be stable across consecutive rebuilds. One caveat, this could
break
horribly when delta manifests are present so use at your own risk.



Minor caveat: the rids might change across different clones of the same
repo (the rids are never transported/synced, always computed locally)  
or

(theoretically/maybe) when doing a rebuild with --vacuum or --randomize
(though i'm speculating there).



but I believe this to be irrelevant: the whole point is to work with any
given local clone/repo using revnums. there should not and need not be  
any

expectation/requirement that these revnums are consistent across clones.
it's all about interaction with the given local repo. as you repeatedly
correctly stated it will lead to errors/confusion if people tell each  
other

"there is a problem in rev no. 123" and the other guys has a different
interpretation of what revnum 123 is. empirically, that is not an issue  
I

would say presuming that the "`hg' field test" is accepted as being
"statistically significant".



A request; if this mechanism gets implemented please ensure that a)
displaying the numbers on the timeline is optional and b) off by default.
In my experience ordinary users are very annoyed when things are  
different

between different checkouts and having stable looking numbers that
essentially can't be trusted is guaranteed to cause grief. For the very
limited (too me) utility in these numbers the consequences of  
accidentally

trusting them in the wrong context is far too high.


but trusting them you can: every action you perform on your clone using  
revnums of course _will_ do what you intended. so the question remains what
is the "wrong context" in which users "accidentally" (erroneously?) trust  
the revnums? there is none except when _all_ collaborating users are  
completely ignorant of the "local" nature of the revnums and start  
conversions like indicated "did you see what I did in rev 123?" and the  
recipient(s), too do(es) not understand the situation (granted that such a  
misunderstanding will quickly be discovered and nothing bas has happened  
to the repos anyway). if you can _now_ tell the users to use the sha1  
hashes when referring to checkins in human correspondence, you can tell  
them that in the future, too. again: I'm quite sure (but have not checked)  
that the `hg' mailing lists will _not_ show up lots of pseuod-bug  
reports/questions: "my revision 123 is different from your revsion 123".  
`hg' is out there for years, they never saw a need to abolish the revnums.  
I sincerely believe the concerns w.r.t. revnums are essentially  
unfounded/artificial.


I'll now try to step out of this. I believe I have repeated myself already  
too often regarding this issue.


j.


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