Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
2011/2/12 Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com: Given that we want to be more welcoming to women, I think it is awesome that we will be able to address women as women. The fact that we gain some statistical insight is a fringe benefit. The only question left is, when can this be implemented.. I raised this question in the Hebrew Wikipedia Village Pump. All the people who replied–female, male and of unknown gender–were generally in favor of implementing such a thing. As it often happens in Wikipedia, the discussion veered off into proposals to change the translation of the word User itself into something else, such as Editor, Contributor, Participant, etc., but even then, all the proposals were m/f pairs. ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
I have one:
I want you to tell me WHY is easy make a female noob will be able to use
javascript, templates and redirects than click in one button and say I'm a
girl.
MediaWiki is full of things since forever. The software will not broke
because one more feature.
*Béria Lima (Beh)
(351) 925 171 484*
2011/2/14 Ryan Lomonaco wiki.ral...@gmail.com
Rather than implementing MediaWiki code that could be controversial,
there's
probably an easier solution that requires no code:
- Add a pseudo-namespace (such as the WP: prefix on Wikipedia, WN: on
Wikinews, etc.) that forwards from Benutzerin to Benutzer (and the relevant
User talk namespaces). This would mean that either Benutzer or Benutzerin
would successfully link to one's user pages.
- Let users add a template to their user and talk pages that changes the
title of the page from Benutzer to Benutzerin. This could be easily done
using the magic word {{DISPLAYTITLE}} and possibly JavaScript to modify the
user/user talk links at the top of the page.
This has the benefits of not adding more code to MediaWiki, not requiring
users to choose their gender unless they want to, and ensuring that if
someone doesn't know whether I'm male or female, they can get to my user
page without having to guess.
It would obviously be a decision for communities to make, but if there were
consensus to do it, I'm pretty sure that it could easily be done this way.
Any thoughts?
--
[[User:Ral315]]
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Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
I agree with Beria here :) If (where) you implement it, then do it well.
Creating a look-a-like solution with redirect-and-template structures seems
a bit like a typical wikipedia-workaround, and I probably don't have to
remind you that many of these workarounds together (resulting in complicated
templates for example) are one of the reasons we are loosing touch with a
big part of our potential editor base.
Best,
Lodewijk
2011/2/14 Béria Lima berial...@gmail.com
I have one:
I want you to tell me WHY is easy make a female noob will be able to use
javascript, templates and redirects than click in one button and say I'm a
girl.
MediaWiki is full of things since forever. The software will not broke
because one more feature.
*Béria Lima (Beh)
(351) 925 171 484*
2011/2/14 Ryan Lomonaco wiki.ral...@gmail.com
Rather than implementing MediaWiki code that could be controversial,
there's
probably an easier solution that requires no code:
- Add a pseudo-namespace (such as the WP: prefix on Wikipedia, WN: on
Wikinews, etc.) that forwards from Benutzerin to Benutzer (and the
relevant
User talk namespaces). This would mean that either Benutzer or
Benutzerin
would successfully link to one's user pages.
- Let users add a template to their user and talk pages that changes the
title of the page from Benutzer to Benutzerin. This could be easily done
using the magic word {{DISPLAYTITLE}} and possibly JavaScript to modify
the
user/user talk links at the top of the page.
This has the benefits of not adding more code to MediaWiki, not requiring
users to choose their gender unless they want to, and ensuring that if
someone doesn't know whether I'm male or female, they can get to my user
page without having to guess.
It would obviously be a decision for communities to make, but if there
were
consensus to do it, I'm pretty sure that it could easily be done this
way.
Any thoughts?
--
[[User:Ral315]]
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Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
On Mon, 14 Feb 2011 00:32:34 -0500, Ryan Lomonaco wiki.ral...@gmail.com wrote: Rather than implementing MediaWiki code that could be controversial, there's probably an easier solution that requires no code: - Add a pseudo-namespace (such as the WP: prefix on Wikipedia, WN: on Wikinews, etc.) that forwards from Benutzerin to Benutzer (and the relevant User talk namespaces). This would mean that either Benutzer or Benutzerin would successfully link to one's user pages. My understanding is that this is how it has been realized in Russian Wikipedia for years already: we have for some female users Участница:X rather than Участник:Х (default). It seems to work, and nobody ever complained. Cheers Yaroslav ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
And do you want it to be implemented :) But that question is to be answered on a community level of course - but I guess there are a few potential reasons why they might not want to implement it: * It could potentially give people the feeling they have to tell their gender: some people might not be willing to (male or female) * Although grammatically correct, I would find gebruikster in Dutch very weird - because it is rarely used it would put a huge emphasis on the fact that someone is female - this will depend per language. * I'm no expert in the field, but I can imagine some issues around transgender people * If you have a male/female version, and someone never told which they are: which will be the default? Male of female? * What to do when people fill in the incorrect gender? Will there be attempts to enforce correctness? (because it could be perceived as lying) etc. I would be a supporter of making it possible for a community to make this choice, but I would not like us to make that choice for them. Best, Lodewijk 2011/2/12 Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com: Hoi, In English the word User does not indicate if it is male or female, The word Gebruiker or Benutzer do; the female form is Gebruikster or Benutzerin. It is with pleasure that I learned that Nikerabbit has written the code that allows for those languages where there is both a male and a female form the namespace to indicate the sex of a user. Given that we want to be more welcoming to women, I think it is awesome that we will be able to address women as women. The fact that we gain some statistical insight is a fringe benefit. The only question left is, when can this be implemented.. Thanks, GerardM ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
Lodewijk is absolutely right. For example, Benutzer in German is a default term, it covers both male and female users (probably the same with gebruiker in Dutch), so why change it to something causing problems all over the place, not only technical ones? They can add it to the code of Mediawiki but per default it would be disabled, and to enable it, it needs of course a community decision. Btw., Gerard, this wouldn't really help to attract more new female users. Or how would you think the software could know the gender of an anonymous user to address them with female language if appropriate? ^^ Best regards Th. 2011/2/13 Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.org: And do you want it to be implemented :) But that question is to be answered on a community level of course - but I guess there are a few potential reasons why they might not want to implement it: * It could potentially give people the feeling they have to tell their gender: some people might not be willing to (male or female) * Although grammatically correct, I would find gebruikster in Dutch very weird - because it is rarely used it would put a huge emphasis on the fact that someone is female - this will depend per language. * I'm no expert in the field, but I can imagine some issues around transgender people * If you have a male/female version, and someone never told which they are: which will be the default? Male of female? * What to do when people fill in the incorrect gender? Will there be attempts to enforce correctness? (because it could be perceived as lying) etc. I would be a supporter of making it possible for a community to make this choice, but I would not like us to make that choice for them. Best, Lodewijk ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 10:49 AM, Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.org wrote: And do you want it to be implemented :) But that question is to be answered on a community level of course - but I guess there are a few potential reasons why they might not want to implement it: [...] * Although grammatically correct, I would find gebruikster in Dutch very weird - because it is rarely used it would put a huge emphasis on the fact that someone is female - this will depend per language. In English, of course, Userette would be even worse, being totally contrived. Like with many European languages, the masculine is the default and feminine suffixes are added only for emphasis, which is pretty anti-feminist, and it doesn't help that the feminine forms are related to or even the same as the diminutive forms. And so we're systematically eliminating words like stewardess and usherette. (Though we've introduced new forms like chairwoman and gentlelady, so we're not exactly consistent.) As I understand it, the Dutch word for secretary has two different connotations based on the gender applied. Secretaris is more like UN General Secretary, while secretaresse is someone who does your typing and gets you coffee. I don't tink Dutch is unique in that. * I'm no expert in the field, but I can imagine some issues around transgender people Not touching that one, but yes. etc. I would be a supporter of making it possible for a community to make this choice, but I would not like us to make that choice for them. I would have taken this for granted, but I don't think it's a strictly linguistic issue, and I'm not sure it's even something that should be determined on a wiki-by-wiki basis. It seems more like an individual preference to me. Austin ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
Gerard, a girl posting here, not anymore a male discussion ;) *Lodewijk and Thomas: so why change it to something causing problems all over the place, not only technical ones?* Why? Maybe to call a girl by her real gender. The problems you both listed are not real problems. The male version is only used if you don't know the gender. But all wikimedia know that Sue (for example) is a girl, so why we still need to see a male word in her user page? *Lodewijk: **Gerard, this wouldn't really help to attract more new female users. * Could you please tell me why? I can set my preferences to male or female, but i can't see my user page with my real gender. And yes, that is a matter of choice, you can say that not every girl will like to be called usuária or Gebruikster or Benutzerin, but if you guys change the MediaWiki they can have the power to chose. And right now we don't have that, do we? *Austin: Like with many European languages, the masculine is the default and feminine suffixes are added only for emphasis, which is pretty anti-feminist, and it doesn't help that the feminine forms are related to or even the same as the diminutive forms.* Anti feminist and partenalist is see several guys deciding what we want or don't want in our user pages. We are not here to change French or German grammar, if the feminine is made by adding a sufix, is a local language problem (btw, in portuguese, the male version is also a sufix, so is usuári*o* / usuári*a*). Again here we are not change grammar, we are only talking about give girls the possibility to be called by the right form in the MediaWiki system. *Austin: **It seems more like an individual preference to me.* It is a individual preference. But a preference you people don't seems to want us to decide if we want of not. _ *Béria Lima* http://wikimedia.pt/ *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. É isso o que estamos a fazer. * 2011/2/13 Austin Hair adh...@gmail.com On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 10:49 AM, Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.org wrote: And do you want it to be implemented :) But that question is to be answered on a community level of course - but I guess there are a few potential reasons why they might not want to implement it: [...] * Although grammatically correct, I would find gebruikster in Dutch very weird - because it is rarely used it would put a huge emphasis on the fact that someone is female - this will depend per language. In English, of course, Userette would be even worse, being totally contrived. Like with many European languages, the masculine is the default and feminine suffixes are added only for emphasis, which is pretty anti-feminist, and it doesn't help that the feminine forms are related to or even the same as the diminutive forms. And so we're systematically eliminating words like stewardess and usherette. (Though we've introduced new forms like chairwoman and gentlelady, so we're not exactly consistent.) As I understand it, the Dutch word for secretary has two different connotations based on the gender applied. Secretaris is more like UN General Secretary, while secretaresse is someone who does your typing and gets you coffee. I don't tink Dutch is unique in that. * I'm no expert in the field, but I can imagine some issues around transgender people Not touching that one, but yes. etc. I would be a supporter of making it possible for a community to make this choice, but I would not like us to make that choice for them. I would have taken this for granted, but I don't think it's a strictly linguistic issue, and I'm not sure it's even something that should be determined on a wiki-by-wiki basis. It seems more like an individual preference to me. Austin ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 12:50 PM, Béria Lima berial...@gmail.com wrote: Lodewijk: Gerard, this wouldn't really help to attract more new female users. Could you please tell me why? I can set my preferences to male or female, but i can't see my user page with my real gender. And yes, that is a matter of choice, you can say that not every girl will like to be called usuária or Gebruikster or Benutzerin, but if you guys change the MediaWiki they can have the power to chose. And right now we don't have that, do we? I won't speak for Lodewijk, but what I understood him to mean was that you wouldn't know about the feature until you've already created an account, so it doesn't *attract* them. One might argue that it helps *keep* them, but that's a different matter. Austin: Like with many European languages, the masculine is the default and feminine suffixes are added only for emphasis, which is pretty anti-feminist, and it doesn't help that the feminine forms are related to or even the same as the diminutive forms. Anti feminist and partenalist is see several guys deciding what we want or don't want in our user pages. We are not here to change French or German grammar, if the feminine is made by adding a sufix, is a local language problem (btw, in portuguese, the male version is also a sufix, so is usuário / usuária). Again here we are not change grammar, we are only talking about give girls the possibility to be called by the right form in the MediaWiki system. Austin: It seems more like an individual preference to me. It is a individual preference. But a preference you people don't seems to want us to decide if we want of not. I think you misunderstand me. I think it *should* be an individual preference. What I argue against is making that decision for everyone. Lodewijk is worried about making that decision for communities whose linguistic and/or cultural norms might be different; I take it one step further and say the individual should be able to do that, if it's to be done at all. (And as long as we're picking nits: I don't speak Portuguese, but I do speak Spanish, so I'm guessing that one male user and three female users are still collectively usuários?) But back to your first point: Lodewijk and Thomas: so why change it to something causing problems all over the place, not only technical ones? Why? Maybe to call a girl by her real gender. The problems you both listed are not real problems. The male version is only used if you don't know the gender. But all wikimedia know that Sue (for example) is a girl, so why we still need to see a male word in her user page? This may be important to you in your language, but it may not be important to others (in fact, they might resent being explicitly labeled as a woman), if it's even a distinction made in that language. Austin ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
To be absolutely clear: I am not against the feature, I am just against applying it to every user that indicated his/her gender without asking. Up to now (afaik) the male/female setting was only used for communication *to* the user: that is private. To turn on suddenly a feature that shows this also explicitely to the outside world is a whole different thing. Also, in some languages the difference between male/female maybe exist if you search hard (like Dutch), but are not commonly used (like gebruikster - I never ever heard that being used in common conversations). I am just saying that we should not force these changes on communities and groups of people without consulting them. They know their language best and how common the term is, how it comes across culturally etc. The fact that a term exists doesnt mean we should use it. I also agree with Austin that it should be even better to determine it as well on a personal level. But I would make it a two level choice: first the community should decide to turn it on in the first place in their wiki, then the user should decide to turn it on in their individual case. Lodewijk 2011/2/13 Austin Hair adh...@gmail.com: On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 12:50 PM, Béria Lima berial...@gmail.com wrote: Lodewijk: Gerard, this wouldn't really help to attract more new female users. Could you please tell me why? I can set my preferences to male or female, but i can't see my user page with my real gender. And yes, that is a matter of choice, you can say that not every girl will like to be called usuária or Gebruikster or Benutzerin, but if you guys change the MediaWiki they can have the power to chose. And right now we don't have that, do we? I won't speak for Lodewijk, but what I understood him to mean was that you wouldn't know about the feature until you've already created an account, so it doesn't *attract* them. One might argue that it helps *keep* them, but that's a different matter. Austin: Like with many European languages, the masculine is the default and feminine suffixes are added only for emphasis, which is pretty anti-feminist, and it doesn't help that the feminine forms are related to or even the same as the diminutive forms. Anti feminist and partenalist is see several guys deciding what we want or don't want in our user pages. We are not here to change French or German grammar, if the feminine is made by adding a sufix, is a local language problem (btw, in portuguese, the male version is also a sufix, so is usuário / usuária). Again here we are not change grammar, we are only talking about give girls the possibility to be called by the right form in the MediaWiki system. Austin: It seems more like an individual preference to me. It is a individual preference. But a preference you people don't seems to want us to decide if we want of not. I think you misunderstand me. I think it *should* be an individual preference. What I argue against is making that decision for everyone. Lodewijk is worried about making that decision for communities whose linguistic and/or cultural norms might be different; I take it one step further and say the individual should be able to do that, if it's to be done at all. (And as long as we're picking nits: I don't speak Portuguese, but I do speak Spanish, so I'm guessing that one male user and three female users are still collectively usuários?) But back to your first point: Lodewijk and Thomas: so why change it to something causing problems all over the place, not only technical ones? Why? Maybe to call a girl by her real gender. The problems you both listed are not real problems. The male version is only used if you don't know the gender. But all wikimedia know that Sue (for example) is a girl, so why we still need to see a male word in her user page? This may be important to you in your language, but it may not be important to others (in fact, they might resent being explicitly labeled as a woman), if it's even a distinction made in that language. Austin ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
So my user page would be at Male:Mono or Man:Mono? On Sunday, February 13, 2011, Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.org wrote: To be absolutely clear: I am not against the feature, I am just against applying it to every user that indicated his/her gender without asking. Up to now (afaik) the male/female setting was only used for communication *to* the user: that is private. To turn on suddenly a feature that shows this also explicitely to the outside world is a whole different thing. Also, in some languages the difference between male/female maybe exist if you search hard (like Dutch), but are not commonly used (like gebruikster - I never ever heard that being used in common conversations). I am just saying that we should not force these changes on communities and groups of people without consulting them. They know their language best and how common the term is, how it comes across culturally etc. The fact that a term exists doesnt mean we should use it. I also agree with Austin that it should be even better to determine it as well on a personal level. But I would make it a two level choice: first the community should decide to turn it on in the first place in their wiki, then the user should decide to turn it on in their individual case. Lodewijk 2011/2/13 Austin Hair adh...@gmail.com: On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 12:50 PM, Béria Lima berial...@gmail.com wrote: Lodewijk: Gerard, this wouldn't really help to attract more new female users. Could you please tell me why? I can set my preferences to male or female, but i can't see my user page with my real gender. And yes, that is a matter of choice, you can say that not every girl will like to be called usuária or Gebruikster or Benutzerin, but if you guys change the MediaWiki they can have the power to chose. And right now we don't have that, do we? I won't speak for Lodewijk, but what I understood him to mean was that you wouldn't know about the feature until you've already created an account, so it doesn't *attract* them. One might argue that it helps *keep* them, but that's a different matter. Austin: Like with many European languages, the masculine is the default and feminine suffixes are added only for emphasis, which is pretty anti-feminist, and it doesn't help that the feminine forms are related to or even the same as the diminutive forms. Anti feminist and partenalist is see several guys deciding what we want or don't want in our user pages. We are not here to change French or German grammar, if the feminine is made by adding a sufix, is a local language problem (btw, in portuguese, the male version is also a sufix, so is usuário / usuária). Again here we are not change grammar, we are only talking about give girls the possibility to be called by the right form in the MediaWiki system. Austin: It seems more like an individual preference to me. It is a individual preference. But a preference you people don't seems to want us to decide if we want of not. I think you misunderstand me. I think it *should* be an individual preference. What I argue against is making that decision for everyone. Lodewijk is worried about making that decision for communities whose linguistic and/or cultural norms might be different; I take it one step further and say the individual should be able to do that, if it's to be done at all. (And as long as we're picking nits: I don't speak Portuguese, but I do speak Spanish, so I'm guessing that one male user and three female users are still collectively usuários?) But back to your first point: Lodewijk and Thomas: so why change it to something causing problems all over the place, not only technical ones? Why? Maybe to call a girl by her real gender. The problems you both listed are not real problems. The male version is only used if you don't know the gender. But all wikimedia know that Sue (for example) is a girl, so why we still need to see a male word in her user page? This may be important to you in your language, but it may not be important to others (in fact, they might resent being explicitly labeled as a woman), if it's even a distinction made in that language. Austin ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l -- *Mono* http://enwp.org/m:User:Mono ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
No Momo, your user page will be User:Mono as always. _ *Béria Lima (Beh) (351) 925 171 484* 2011/2/13 The Mono m...@mono.x10.bz So my user page would be at Male:Mono or Man:Mono? On Sunday, February 13, 2011, Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.org wrote: To be absolutely clear: I am not against the feature, I am just against applying it to every user that indicated his/her gender without asking. Up to now (afaik) the male/female setting was only used for communication *to* the user: that is private. To turn on suddenly a feature that shows this also explicitely to the outside world is a whole different thing. Also, in some languages the difference between male/female maybe exist if you search hard (like Dutch), but are not commonly used (like gebruikster - I never ever heard that being used in common conversations). I am just saying that we should not force these changes on communities and groups of people without consulting them. They know their language best and how common the term is, how it comes across culturally etc. The fact that a term exists doesnt mean we should use it. I also agree with Austin that it should be even better to determine it as well on a personal level. But I would make it a two level choice: first the community should decide to turn it on in the first place in their wiki, then the user should decide to turn it on in their individual case. Lodewijk 2011/2/13 Austin Hair adh...@gmail.com: On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 12:50 PM, Béria Lima berial...@gmail.com wrote: Lodewijk: Gerard, this wouldn't really help to attract more new female users. Could you please tell me why? I can set my preferences to male or female, but i can't see my user page with my real gender. And yes, that is a matter of choice, you can say that not every girl will like to be called usuária or Gebruikster or Benutzerin, but if you guys change the MediaWiki they can have the power to chose. And right now we don't have that, do we? I won't speak for Lodewijk, but what I understood him to mean was that you wouldn't know about the feature until you've already created an account, so it doesn't *attract* them. One might argue that it helps *keep* them, but that's a different matter. Austin: Like with many European languages, the masculine is the default and feminine suffixes are added only for emphasis, which is pretty anti-feminist, and it doesn't help that the feminine forms are related to or even the same as the diminutive forms. Anti feminist and partenalist is see several guys deciding what we want or don't want in our user pages. We are not here to change French or German grammar, if the feminine is made by adding a sufix, is a local language problem (btw, in portuguese, the male version is also a sufix, so is usuário / usuária). Again here we are not change grammar, we are only talking about give girls the possibility to be called by the right form in the MediaWiki system. Austin: It seems more like an individual preference to me. It is a individual preference. But a preference you people don't seems to want us to decide if we want of not. I think you misunderstand me. I think it *should* be an individual preference. What I argue against is making that decision for everyone. Lodewijk is worried about making that decision for communities whose linguistic and/or cultural norms might be different; I take it one step further and say the individual should be able to do that, if it's to be done at all. (And as long as we're picking nits: I don't speak Portuguese, but I do speak Spanish, so I'm guessing that one male user and three female users are still collectively usuários?) But back to your first point: Lodewijk and Thomas: so why change it to something causing problems all over the place, not only technical ones? Why? Maybe to call a girl by her real gender. The problems you both listed are not real problems. The male version is only used if you don't know the gender. But all wikimedia know that Sue (for example) is a girl, so why we still need to see a male word in her user page? This may be important to you in your language, but it may not be important to others (in fact, they might resent being explicitly labeled as a woman), if it's even a distinction made in that language. Austin ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l -- *Mono* http://enwp.org/m:User:Mono ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:
Re: [Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
Rather than implementing MediaWiki code that could be controversial, there's
probably an easier solution that requires no code:
- Add a pseudo-namespace (such as the WP: prefix on Wikipedia, WN: on
Wikinews, etc.) that forwards from Benutzerin to Benutzer (and the relevant
User talk namespaces). This would mean that either Benutzer or Benutzerin
would successfully link to one's user pages.
- Let users add a template to their user and talk pages that changes the
title of the page from Benutzer to Benutzerin. This could be easily done
using the magic word {{DISPLAYTITLE}} and possibly JavaScript to modify the
user/user talk links at the top of the page.
This has the benefits of not adding more code to MediaWiki, not requiring
users to choose their gender unless they want to, and ensuring that if
someone doesn't know whether I'm male or female, they can get to my user
page without having to guess.
It would obviously be a decision for communities to make, but if there were
consensus to do it, I'm pretty sure that it could easily be done this way.
Any thoughts?
--
[[User:Ral315]]
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[Foundation-l] Showing the difference between the sexes
Hoi, In English the word User does not indicate if it is male or female, The word Gebruiker or Benutzer do; the female form is Gebruikster or Benutzerin. It is with pleasure that I learned that Nikerabbit has written the code that allows for those languages where there is both a male and a female form the namespace to indicate the sex of a user. Given that we want to be more welcoming to women, I think it is awesome that we will be able to address women as women. The fact that we gain some statistical insight is a fringe benefit. The only question left is, when can this be implemented.. Thanks, GerardM ___ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
