RE: tables and translation
Dear Verner, I have been working with table-heavy translated FrameMaker files (for clients, I am a translation vendor) for about 15 years now. Tables are always a troublesome area. Besides some of the other excellent suggestions already made, here are some other best practices that can help: == Your Language Service Provider (LSP) should Quote on the initial project to include time to make localized templates. These templates may include slight point size and spread changes to help text fit. == Table styles should be used extensively, and should have smaller left/right cell margins in some target languages than in your source language. == NEVER define paragraph styles that have fixed or modified cell margins on the paragraph level. This makes corrections of tables far more difficult to accomplish. It is especially important to avoid this as a format override in the source language, as it is difficult to locate and correct such instances in translated text. == There is nothing wrong with a moderate amount of format overrides to your table styles (e.g. overrides to cell margins, etc.) or paragraphs (cellbody) in tables. There are simply too many variations possible in tables to allow you to make a unique table style for every instance. == You can also have your LSP translate the text for table header row cells ahead of time, to help determine ideal column widths == Avoid the temptation to squeeze too much data into tables in your source files. I have frequently seen training materials in English which have a one page table that reaches the bottom of the page, with every cell packed with 7 pt condensed text. Obviously, when text expansion occurs, (which can be quite dramatic in Dutch, German, Hungarian or Italian) there is no solution other than to let the table break to a second page. In many such instances, a table header row (which would repeat) was not used. NOTE: full page tables crammed with tiny font sizes are also a challenge for reader retention, in any language. == (This is a common problem in English source files): avoid ALL CAPS text in table header rows. This will nearly always cause grief with text expansion. == Never use vertically rotated text in table header rows for documents that will be translated (unless going into the few languages that cause text shrinkage instead of text expansion.)The text expansion that occurs from translation will dramatically increase the depth of your table header rows. == Common problem in English source file tables: many writers use abbreviations in table cells and just assume that an abbreviation is acceptable in the target language. Not always. It is not uncommon for a 3 letter acronym to expand to 20-30 characters in some target languages. == Finally, when authoring, ask yourself, does this really need to be in a table? Sometimes the answer is now. Often simple steps can be conveyed as effectively in a more flexible list. I hope that this helps. I will soon be posting The 10 most common mistakes that FrameMaker users do which makes source files toxic in a blog or white paper on our web site. Maxwell Hoffmann Director, Document Globalization Practice Globalization Partners International (GPI) Toll Free: 866.272.5874 ∞ Direct: 503.336.5952 (PDX) Mobile: 503.805.3719 ∞ Fax: 202.478.0956 ∞ Skype ID: Maxwell.Hoffmann mhoffm...@globalizationpartners.com www.globalizationpartners.com -Original Message- From: Andersen, Verner Engell VEA [mailto:verner.ander...@radiometer.dk] Sent: Monday, February 08, 2010 6:53 AM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: tables and translation Hi When we translated our manual from English to German via the Trados translation workbench it turned out that many of columns in tables were too small. The result was that a letter or two wre placed in line two of the column. I fixed this in the files I received from the translator but would like to fix it in my English source so that I won't have to do this again in the next release. My plan was to open a copy ofthe English files and manually compare all tables with those in the German files. Originally I used tables from the table designer by I fear that many of them habe been manually modified. Do you have any suggestions about how to handle the task? I know that a Framescript can solve the issue, I am in doubt whether it will be too costly compared to the one time manual work. Best regards, Verner Radiometer Medical ApS Akandevej 21 2700 Bronshoj Denmark Phone: +45 38 27 38 27 CVR: 27 50 91 85 www.radiometer.com For the latest trends in acute care testing, go to Radiometer's knowledge site www.acutecaretesting.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit
RE: tables and translation
I look forward to that posting, Maxwell. I'd appreciate it if you'd post a link when it happens. Thanks! Lea _ Lea Rush Software and Documentation Specialist Astoria-Pacific International www.astoria-pacific.com ph: 800-536-3111 fax: 503-655-7367 l...@astoria-pacific.com Please consider the environment before printing this email. `·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸ º`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸º NOTICE OF CONFIDENTIALITY This communication is from Astoria-Pacific International and is intended to be confidential and solely for the use of the persons or entities addressed above. If you are not an intended recipient, be aware that the information contained herein may be protected from unauthorized use by privilege or law, and any copying, distribution, disclosure, or other use of this information is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please contact the sender by return email or telephone (503) 657-3010 immediately, and delete or destroy all copies. Thank you for your cooperation. -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers- boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Hoffmann Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 2:40 AM To: 'Andersen, Verner Engell VEA'; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: tables and translation Dear Verner, I have been working with table-heavy translated FrameMaker files (for clients, I am a translation vendor) for about 15 years now. Tables are always a troublesome area. Besides some of the other excellent suggestions already made, here are some other best practices that can help: == Your Language Service Provider (LSP) should Quote on the initial project to include time to make localized templates. These templates may include slight point size and spread changes to help text fit. == Table styles should be used extensively, and should have smaller left/right cell margins in some target languages than in your source language. == NEVER define paragraph styles that have fixed or modified cell margins on the paragraph level. This makes corrections of tables far more difficult to accomplish. It is especially important to avoid this as a format override in the source language, as it is difficult to locate and correct such instances in translated text. == There is nothing wrong with a moderate amount of format overrides to your table styles (e.g. overrides to cell margins, etc.) or paragraphs (cellbody) in tables. There are simply too many variations possible in tables to allow you to make a unique table style for every instance. == You can also have your LSP translate the text for table header row cells ahead of time, to help determine ideal column widths == Avoid the temptation to squeeze too much data into tables in your source files. I have frequently seen training materials in English which have a one page table that reaches the bottom of the page, with every cell packed with 7 pt condensed text. Obviously, when text expansion occurs, (which can be quite dramatic in Dutch, German, Hungarian or Italian) there is no solution other than to let the table break to a second page. In many such instances, a table header row (which would repeat) was not used. NOTE: full page tables crammed with tiny font sizes are also a challenge for reader retention, in any language. == (This is a common problem in English source files): avoid ALL CAPS text in table header rows. This will nearly always cause grief with text expansion. == Never use vertically rotated text in table header rows for documents that will be translated (unless going into the few languages that cause text shrinkage instead of text expansion.)The text expansion that occurs from translation will dramatically increase the depth of your table header rows. == Common problem in English source file tables: many writers use abbreviations in table cells and just assume that an abbreviation is acceptable in the target language. Not always. It is not uncommon for a 3 letter acronym to expand to 20-30 characters in some target languages. == Finally, when authoring, ask yourself, does this really need to be in a table? Sometimes the answer is now. Often simple steps can be conveyed as effectively in a more flexible list. I hope that this helps. I will soon be posting The 10 most common mistakes that FrameMaker users do which makes source files toxic in a blog or white paper on our web site. Maxwell Hoffmann Director, Document Globalization Practice Globalization Partners International (GPI) Toll Free: 866.272.5874 ∞ Direct: 503.336.5952 (PDX) Mobile: 503.805.3719 ∞ Fax: 202.478.0956 ∞ Skype ID: Maxwell.Hoffmann mhoffm...@globalizationpartners.com www.globalizationpartners.com -Original Message- From: Andersen, Verner Engell VEA [mailto:verner.ander...@radiometer.dk] Sent: Monday, February 08, 2010 6:53 AM To:
FM 9 books
Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: FM 9 books
Linda: Scriptorium has a FrameMaker 8 book that we bought when we were still considering the move to FrameMaker. By the time a decision was made, FM 9 was out. However, the book is still very useful as the differences between 8 and 9 are mostly in the onscreen structure (ie, the pods). As far as functionality goes, I have found Scriptorium's book to be an excellent tool. http://store.scriptorium.com/items/books/publishing-fundamentals-unstructured-framemaker-8-all-detail.htm Alison Alison Craig, Technical Writer Ultrasonix Medical Corporation Tel: (604) 279-8550, ext 127 E-mail: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:42 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasonix.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: FM 9 books
I agree with Alison. In fact, until I got the FM8 book from Scriptorium last year, I was using the FrameMaker for Dummies 5.5.6 because the essentials are still the same. Nadine On 10/02/2010 6:48 PM, Alison Craig wrote: Linda: Scriptorium has a FrameMaker 8 book that we bought when we were still considering the move to FrameMaker. By the time a decision was made, FM 9 was out. However, the book is still very useful as the differences between 8 and 9 are mostly in the onscreen structure (ie, the pods). As far as functionality goes, I have found Scriptorium's book to be an excellent tool. http://store.scriptorium.com/items/books/publishing-fundamentals-unstructured-framemaker-8-all-detail.htm Alison Alison Craig, Technical Writer Ultrasonix Medical Corporation Tel: (604) 279-8550, ext 127 E-mail: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:42 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasonix.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as generic...@yahoo.ca. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/generic668%40yahoo.ca Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: FM 9 books
The Classroom in a Book for FM 9 is useless - speaking from personal experience. It was NOT written as a new book for FM9, but basically the author just updated 7.2 information and thought it would fit FM9 and it doesn't. More questions are left unanswered than answered at all. If you need to learn FM 9 specifics, like docking, etc., then RJ's blogs are the way to go. TVB Tammy Van Boening Owner/Principal Spectrum Writing, LLC www.spectrumwritingllc.com i...@spectrumwritingllc.com -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 4:42 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as i...@spectrumwritingllc.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/info%40spectrumwritingll c.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: FM 9 books
I like the Scriptorium book a lot too. My only regret is that they decided not to publish the Structured FrameMaker version of it ... I hope that this happens sometime. I would gladly buy it! Z -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison Craig Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:48 PM To: Linda G. Gallagher; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: FM 9 books Linda: Scriptorium has a FrameMaker 8 book that we bought when we were still considering the move to FrameMaker. By the time a decision was made, FM 9 was out. However, the book is still very useful as the differences between 8 and 9 are mostly in the onscreen structure (ie, the pods). As far as functionality goes, I have found Scriptorium's book to be an excellent tool. http://store.scriptorium.com/items/books/publishing-fundamentals-unstruc tured-framemaker-8-all-detail.htm Alison Alison Craig, Technical Writer Ultrasonix Medical Corporation Tel: (604) 279-8550, ext 127 E-mail: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:42 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultra sonix.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as syed.hos...@aeris.net. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/syed.hosain%40aeris. net Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: FM 9 books
We at Front Runner highly recommend Scriptorium's Publishing Fundamentals: Unstructured FrameMaker 8. This is the book we provide our students as a reference book for our FrameMaker training. Sincerely, Veronica Kütt President Front Runner Training, a Div. of Front Runner Publishing Solutions Inc. 416-515-0155 Call Toll free: 1-877-999-0155 veron...@front-runner.com www.front-runner.com Learn what you wish you'd known yesterday!® -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison Craig Sent: February 10, 2010 6:48 PM To: Linda G. Gallagher; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: FM 9 books Linda: Scriptorium has a FrameMaker 8 book that we bought when we were still considering the move to FrameMaker. By the time a decision was made, FM 9 was out. However, the book is still very useful as the differences between 8 and 9 are mostly in the onscreen structure (ie, the pods). As far as functionality goes, I have found Scriptorium's book to be an excellent tool. http://store.scriptorium.com/items/books/publishing-fundamentals-unstructure d-framemaker-8-all-detail.htm Alison Alison Craig, Technical Writer Ultrasonix Medical Corporation Tel: (604) 279-8550, ext 127 E-mail: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:42 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasoni x.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as veron...@front-runner.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/veronica%40front-runner. com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: FM 9 books
At 01:07 PM 11/02/2010, syed.hos...@aeris.net wrote: I like the Scriptorium book a lot too. My only regret is that [Scriptorium] decided not to publish the Structured FrameMaker version of it ... I hope that this happens sometime. I would gladly buy it! Me too. But I don't underestimate the work involved in designing the content for such a book. I'm sure one of the problems would be that one would have to write two books in one. On the one hand is the *present* mainstream (DocBook and other monolithic architectures), which are easier for unstructured diehards to grokk, but which can't provide a single content source solution. On the other are the coming things that we (as writers and content developers) can't ignore: DITA and maybe other granular architectures we haven't seen in public yet. I reckon it would need at least two authors and someone to keep bread on their table while they were doing it. That, of course, means establishing that there would be a sufficiently worthwhile ROI associated with such a project. Helen ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
tables and translation
Dear Verner, I have been working with "table-heavy" translated FrameMaker files (for clients, I am a translation vendor) for about 15 years now. Tables are always a troublesome area. Besides some of the other excellent suggestions already made, here are some other best practices that can help: == Your Language Service Provider (LSP) should Quote on the initial project to include time to make localized templates. These templates may include slight point size and spread changes to help text fit. == Table styles should be used extensively, and should have smaller left/right cell margins in some target languages than in your source language. == NEVER define paragraph styles that have fixed or modified cell margins on the paragraph level. This makes corrections of tables far more difficult to accomplish. It is especially important to avoid this as a format override in the source language, as it is difficult to locate and correct such instances in translated text. == There is nothing wrong with a moderate amount of format overrides to your table styles (e.g. overrides to cell margins, etc.) or paragraphs (cellbody) in tables. There are simply too many variations possible in tables to allow you to make a unique table style for every instance. == You can also have your LSP translate the text for table header row cells ahead of time, to help determine ideal column widths == Avoid the temptation to squeeze too much data into tables in your source files. I have frequently seen training materials in English which have a "one page" table that reaches the bottom of the page, with every cell packed with 7 pt condensed text. Obviously, when text expansion occurs, (which can be quite dramatic in Dutch, German, Hungarian or Italian) there is no solution other than to let the table break to a second page. In many such instances, a table "header row" (which would repeat) was not used. NOTE: full page tables crammed with tiny font sizes are also a challenge for reader retention, in any language. == (This is a common problem in English source files): avoid ALL CAPS text in table header rows. This will nearly always cause grief with text expansion. == Never use vertically rotated text in table header rows for documents that will be translated (unless going into the few languages that cause text shrinkage instead of text expansion.)The text expansion that occurs from translation will dramatically increase the depth of your table header rows. == Common problem in English source file tables: many writers use abbreviations in table cells and just assume that an abbreviation is acceptable in the target language. Not always. It is not uncommon for a 3 letter acronym to expand to 20-30 characters in some target languages. == Finally, when authoring, ask yourself, "does this really need to be in a table?" Sometimes the answer is now. Often simple steps can be conveyed as effectively in a more flexible list. I hope that this helps. I will soon be posting "The 10 most common mistakes that FrameMaker users do which makes source files toxic" in a blog or white paper on our web site. Maxwell Hoffmann Director, Document Globalization Practice Globalization Partners International (GPI) Toll Free: 866.272.5874 ? Direct: 503.336.5952 (PDX) Mobile: 503.805.3719 ? Fax: 202.478.0956 ? Skype ID: Maxwell.Hoffmann mhoffmann at globalizationpartners.com www.globalizationpartners.com >-Original Message- >From: Andersen, Verner Engell VEA [mailto:verner.andersen at radiometer.dk] >Sent: Monday, February 08, 2010 6:53 AM >To: framers at lists.frameusers.com >Subject: RE: tables and translation > >Hi > >When we translated our manual from English to German via the Trados >translation workbench it turned out that many of columns in tables were >too small. The result was that a letter or two wre placed in line two of >the column. > >I fixed this in the files I received from the translator but would like >to fix it in my English source so that I won't have to do this again in >the next release. >My plan was to open a copy ofthe English files and manually compare all >tables with those in the German files. > >Originally I used tables from the table designer by I fear that many of >them habe been manually modified. > >Do you have any suggestions about how to handle the task? >I know that a Framescript can solve the issue, I am in doubt whether it >will be too costly compared to the one time manual work. > >Best regards, > >Verner > > > >Radiometer Medical ApS >Akandevej 21 >2700 Bronshoj >Denmark >Phone: +45 38 27 38 27 >CVR: 27 50 91 85 >www.radiometer.com >For the latest trends in acute care testing, go to Radiometer's knowledge site www.acutecaretesting.org
tables and translation
I look forward to that posting, Maxwell. I'd appreciate it if you'd post a link when it happens. Thanks! Lea _ Lea Rush Software and Documentation Specialist Astoria-Pacific International www.astoria-pacific.com ph: 800-536-3111 fax: 503-655-7367 lea at astoria-pacific.com Please consider the environment before printing this email. `?.??.???`?.?.???`?...? >`?.??.???`?.?.???`?...?> NOTICE OF CONFIDENTIALITY This communication is from Astoria-Pacific International and is intended to be confidential and solely for the use of the persons or entities addressed above. If you are not an intended recipient, be aware that the information contained herein may be protected from unauthorized use by privilege or law, and any copying, distribution, disclosure, or other use of this information is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please contact the sender by return email or telephone (503) 657-3010 immediately, and delete or destroy all copies. Thank you for your cooperation. > -Original Message- > From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers- > bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Hoffmann > Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 2:40 AM > To: 'Andersen, Verner Engell VEA'; framers at lists.frameusers.com > Subject: RE: tables and translation > > Dear Verner, > > I have been working with "table-heavy" translated FrameMaker files (for > clients, I am a translation vendor) for about 15 years now. Tables are > always a troublesome area. Besides some of the other excellent suggestions > already made, here are some other best practices that can help: > > == Your Language Service Provider (LSP) should Quote on the initial project > to include time to make localized templates. These templates may include > slight point size and spread changes to help text fit. > == Table styles should be used extensively, and should have smaller > left/right cell margins in some target languages than in your source > language. > == NEVER define paragraph styles that have fixed or modified cell margins on > the paragraph level. This makes corrections of tables far more difficult to > accomplish. It is especially important to avoid this as a format override in > the source language, as it is difficult to locate and correct such instances > in translated text. > == There is nothing wrong with a moderate amount of format overrides to your > table styles (e.g. overrides to cell margins, etc.) or paragraphs (cellbody) > in tables. There are simply too many variations possible in tables to allow > you to make a unique table style for every instance. > == You can also have your LSP translate the text for table header row cells > ahead of time, to help determine ideal column widths > == Avoid the temptation to squeeze too much data into tables in your source > files. I have frequently seen training materials in English which have a > "one page" table that reaches the bottom of the page, with every cell packed > with 7 pt condensed text. Obviously, when text expansion occurs, (which can > be quite dramatic in Dutch, German, Hungarian or Italian) there is no > solution other than to let the table break to a second page. In many such > instances, a table "header row" (which would repeat) was not used. NOTE: > full page tables crammed with tiny font sizes are also a challenge for > reader retention, in any language. > == (This is a common problem in English source files): avoid ALL CAPS text > in table header rows. This will nearly always cause grief with text > expansion. > == Never use vertically rotated text in table header rows for documents that > will be translated (unless going into the few languages that cause text > shrinkage instead of text expansion.)The text expansion that occurs from > translation will dramatically increase the depth of your table header rows. > == Common problem in English source file tables: many writers use > abbreviations in table cells and just assume that an abbreviation is > acceptable in the target language. Not always. It is not uncommon for a 3 > letter acronym to expand to 20-30 characters in some target languages. > == Finally, when authoring, ask yourself, "does this really need to be in a > table?" Sometimes the answer is now. Often simple steps can be conveyed as > effectively in a more flexible list. > > I hope that this helps. I will soon be posting "The 10 most common mistakes > that FrameMaker users do which makes source files toxic" in a blog or white > paper on our web site. > > Maxwell Hoffmann > Director, Document Globalization Practice > > Globalization Partners International (GPI) > Toll Free: 866.272.5874 ? Direct: 503.336.5952 (PDX) > Mobile: 503.805.3719 ? Fax: 202.478.0956 ? Skype ID: Maxwell.Hoffmann > mhoffmann at globalizationpartners.com > www.globalizationpartners.com > > > >-Original Message- > >From: Andersen, Verner Engell VEA
FM 9 books
Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org
FM 9 books
Linda: Scriptorium has a FrameMaker 8 book that we bought when we were still considering the move to FrameMaker. By the time a decision was made, FM 9 was out. However, the book is still very useful as the differences between 8 and 9 are mostly in the onscreen structure (ie, the "pods"). As far as functionality goes, I have found Scriptorium's book to be an excellent tool. http://store.scriptorium.com/items/books/publishing-fundamentals-unstructured-framemaker-8-all-detail.htm Alison Alison Craig, Technical Writer Ultrasonix Medical Corporation Tel: (604) 279-8550, ext 127 E-mail: alison.craig at ultrasonix.com -Original Message- From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:42 PM To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.craig at ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasonix.com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FM 9 books
I agree with Alison. In fact, until I got the FM8 book from Scriptorium last year, I was using the FrameMaker for Dummies 5.5.6 because the essentials are still the same. Nadine On 10/02/2010 6:48 PM, Alison Craig wrote: > Linda: > > Scriptorium has a FrameMaker 8 book that we bought when we were still > considering the move to FrameMaker. By the time a decision was made, FM 9 was > out. However, the book is still very useful as the differences between 8 and > 9 are mostly in the onscreen structure (ie, the "pods"). As far as > functionality goes, I have found Scriptorium's book to be an excellent tool. > > http://store.scriptorium.com/items/books/publishing-fundamentals-unstructured-framemaker-8-all-detail.htm > > Alison > > Alison Craig, Technical Writer > Ultrasonix Medical Corporation > Tel: (604) 279-8550, ext 127 > E-mail: alison.craig at ultrasonix.com > > > -Original Message- > From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces at > lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher > Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:42 PM > To: framers at lists.frameusers.com > Subject: FM 9 books > > Framers, > > Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's > the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS > 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) > > Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review > copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've > thought of it for teaching FM 9. > > Thanks! > > ~ > Linda G. Gallagher > TechCom Plus, LLC > lindag at techcomplus dot com > www.techcomplus.com > 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 > User guides, online help, FrameMaker and > WebWorks ePublisher templates > > RMIMA Membership Manager > www.RMIMA.org > > > > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.craig at ultrasonix.com. > > Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasonix.com > > Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as generic668 at yahoo.ca. > > Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/generic668%40yahoo.ca > > Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. > >
FM 9 books
The Classroom in a Book for FM 9 is useless - speaking from personal experience. It was NOT written as a new book for FM9, but basically the author just "updated" 7.2 information and thought it would fit FM9 and it doesn't. More questions are left unanswered than answered at all. If you need to learn FM 9 specifics, like docking, etc., then RJ's blogs are the way to go. TVB Tammy Van Boening Owner/Principal Spectrum Writing, LLC www.spectrumwritingllc.com info at spectrumwritingllc.com -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 4:42 PM To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as info at spectrumwritingllc.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/info%40spectrumwritingll c.com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FM 9 books
I like the Scriptorium book a lot too. My only regret is that they decided not to publish the "Structured FrameMaker" version of it ... I hope that this happens sometime. I would gladly buy it! Z -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison Craig Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:48 PM To: Linda G. Gallagher; framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: FM 9 books Linda: Scriptorium has a FrameMaker 8 book that we bought when we were still considering the move to FrameMaker. By the time a decision was made, FM 9 was out. However, the book is still very useful as the differences between 8 and 9 are mostly in the onscreen structure (ie, the "pods"). As far as functionality goes, I have found Scriptorium's book to be an excellent tool. http://store.scriptorium.com/items/books/publishing-fundamentals-unstruc tured-framemaker-8-all-detail.htm Alison Alison Craig, Technical Writer Ultrasonix Medical Corporation Tel: (604) 279-8550, ext 127 E-mail: alison.craig at ultrasonix.com -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:42 PM To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.craig at ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultra sonix.com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as Syed.Hosain at aeris.net. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/syed.hosain%40aeris. net Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FM 9 books
We at Front Runner highly recommend Scriptorium's Publishing Fundamentals: Unstructured FrameMaker 8. This is the book we provide our students as a reference book for our FrameMaker training. Sincerely, Veronica K?tt President Front Runner Training, a Div. of Front Runner Publishing Solutions Inc. 416-515-0155 Call Toll free: 1-877-999-0155 veronica at front-runner.com www.front-runner.com "Learn what you wish you'd known yesterday!"? -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison Craig Sent: February 10, 2010 6:48 PM To: Linda G. Gallagher; framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: FM 9 books Linda: Scriptorium has a FrameMaker 8 book that we bought when we were still considering the move to FrameMaker. By the time a decision was made, FM 9 was out. However, the book is still very useful as the differences between 8 and 9 are mostly in the onscreen structure (ie, the "pods"). As far as functionality goes, I have found Scriptorium's book to be an excellent tool. http://store.scriptorium.com/items/books/publishing-fundamentals-unstructure d-framemaker-8-all-detail.htm Alison Alison Craig, Technical Writer Ultrasonix Medical Corporation Tel: (604) 279-8550, ext 127 E-mail: alison.craig at ultrasonix.com -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:42 PM To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: FM 9 books Framers, Does anyone know of any FM 9 books, aside from the Classroom in a Book? It's the only thing I've found that is just FM 9. (I know about Icon Logic's TCS 2 book, but that does not fit my need.) Has anyone used the Classroom in a Book for FM 9? I just requested a review copy, but I'm not sure when I'll receive it. I'd like to know what you've thought of it for teaching FM 9. Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates RMIMA Membership Manager www.RMIMA.org ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.craig at ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasoni x.com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as veronica at front-runner.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/veronica%40front-runner. com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Utilities for FM 8
Hi! After a 3-year hiatus I am trying to work with FM 8 (unstructured) again for a non-work project. Having designed a lot of my own templates and documents, I know a *lot* about what's built in to FM 8, but I've forgotten all the utilities I once used such as Character Tools, Paragraph Tools, etc. I'm looking for tools that will automatically copy formats, layouts, master pages, reference pages, etc. from an existing document to a new one. Is there a site somewhere that has a list of sources? Joe Malin
