Re: Fit or fitted

[Davis, David]

Date: Fri, 30 May 2014 21:54:42 +
From: Tim Pann 

> Hm... "Bastard"? How so?

Because the Norman French tended to rape and pillage the native Saxons, rather 
than marry them in church.


David

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RE: Fit or fitted?

[Jeff Coatsworth]

Bastard in this sense:
"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English 
is about as pure as a cribhouse  whore. We don't just borrow words; on 
occasion, English  has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them 
unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary."

[James Nicoll, in rec.arts.sf-lovers, 1990. Mr Nicoll is a Canadian freelance 
games and science-fiction reviewer.]

-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Tim Pann
Sent: May-30-14 5:55 PM
To: Helen Borrie; framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Fit or fitted?

Hm... "Bastard"? How so?

Tim

From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com 
[framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] on behalf of Helen Borrie 
[hele...@iinet.net.au]
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2014 2:47 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Fit or fitted?

At 12:28 p.m. 30/05/2014, Writer wrote:
>It's not a verb in this case; it's a predicate adjective.
>
>Nadine
>
>>
>> From: Robert Lauriston 
>>To: Stephen O'Brien ; "Frame Users 
>>(framers@lists.frameusers.com)" 
>>Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 11:42:49 AM
>>Subject: Re: Fit or fitted?
>>
>>
>>
>>Per Betty Azar, in American English, the present, simple past, and past tense 
>>of the verb "to fit" are all "fit."

Actually, it's not.  The example from the OP used "fit" as a transitive verb 
and "fitted" was applied as the past participle.  A pedagogue would rule this 
usage illegal but English, the bastard language of the world, grows this way.  
Usage of "fit" as a transitive verb has become widespread in my lifetime, 
although I'd have got the red crayon if I used it in a high school composition.

Things get muddy when we try to use fit in the passive voice, which is the 
usage in question here.  Intransitive verbs can't be used in passive voice so 
what do we do?  We can try to borrow the past historic of the intransitive 
verb, which is "fit" or we can pursue the formation of a participle by 
regularising it.  "The members iof the Olympic team were fit for their new 
uniforms" doesn't work.  "The members of the Olympic team were fitted for their 
new uniforms" seems to.

My call would be that the regularising rule applies here.  If the OP MUST use 
passive voice (dubious tech writing practice at best) then make "fitted" the 
participle, rather than awkwardly stealing the past historic from the 
transitive verb. It fits better (sic: intransitive!) with other forward 
formations that are already in use.

Helen


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Re: Fit or fitted?

[Robert Lauriston]

The Chicago Manual of Style prefers "fitted" in this case: "This verb
is undergoing a shift. It has traditionally been conjugated
fit–fitted–fitted, but today fit–fit–fit is prevalent in American
English {when she tried on the dress, it fit quite well}. In the
passive voice, however, fitted is still normal {the horse was fitted
with a new harness}."
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RE: Fit or fitted?

[Tim Pann]

Hm... "Bastard"? How so?

Tim

From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com 
[framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] on behalf of Helen Borrie 
[hele...@iinet.net.au]
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2014 2:47 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Fit or fitted?

At 12:28 p.m. 30/05/2014, Writer wrote:
>It's not a verb in this case; it's a predicate adjective.
>
>Nadine
>
>>
>> From: Robert Lauriston 
>>To: Stephen O'Brien ; "Frame Users 
>>(framers@lists.frameusers.com)" 
>>Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 11:42:49 AM
>>Subject: Re: Fit or fitted?
>>
>>
>>
>>Per Betty Azar, in American English, the present, simple past, and past tense 
>>of the verb "to fit" are all "fit."

Actually, it's not.  The example from the OP used "fit" as a transitive verb 
and "fitted" was applied as the past participle.  A pedagogue would rule this 
usage illegal but English, the bastard language of the world, grows this way.  
Usage of "fit" as a transitive verb has become widespread in my lifetime, 
although I'd have got the red crayon if I used it in a high school composition.

Things get muddy when we try to use fit in the passive voice, which is the 
usage in question here.  Intransitive verbs can't be used in passive voice so 
what do we do?  We can try to borrow the past historic of the intransitive 
verb, which is "fit" or we can pursue the formation of a participle by 
regularising it.  "The members iof the Olympic team were fit for their new 
uniforms" doesn't work.  "The members of the Olympic team were fitted for their 
new uniforms" seems to.

My call would be that the regularising rule applies here.  If the OP MUST use 
passive voice (dubious tech writing practice at best) then make "fitted" the 
participle, rather than awkwardly stealing the past historic from the 
transitive verb. It fits better (sic: intransitive!) with other forward 
formations that are already in use.

Helen


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Re: Fit or fitted?

[Robert Lauriston]

In "The bed has fitted sheets," "fitted" is an adjective. In "The
sheets are fitted to the bed," it's passive voice.

On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 8:38 AM, Stuart Rogers
 wrote:
> On 2014-May-29 8:28 PM, Writer wrote:
>>
>> It's not a verb in this case; it's a predicate adjective.
>>
>> Nadine
>
> Exactly. No one sells "fit sheets" :-)
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Re: Fit or fitted?

[Robert Lauriston]

It's passive voice.

On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 5:28 PM, Writer  wrote:
> It's not a verb in this case; it's a predicate adjective.
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Re: Fit or fitted?

[Helen Borrie]

At 12:28 p.m. 30/05/2014, Writer wrote:
>It's not a verb in this case; it's a predicate adjective.
>
>Nadine
>
>>
>> From: Robert Lauriston 
>>To: Stephen O'Brien ; "Frame Users 
>>(framers@lists.frameusers.com)"  
>>Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 11:42:49 AM
>>Subject: Re: Fit or fitted?
>> 
>>
>>
>>Per Betty Azar, in American English, the present, simple past, and past tense 
>>of the verb "to fit" are all "fit." 

Actually, it's not.  The example from the OP used "fit" as a transitive verb 
and "fitted" was applied as the past participle.  A pedagogue would rule this 
usage illegal but English, the bastard language of the world, grows this way.  
Usage of "fit" as a transitive verb has become widespread in my lifetime, 
although I'd have got the red crayon if I used it in a high school composition.

Things get muddy when we try to use fit in the passive voice, which is the 
usage in question here.  Intransitive verbs can't be used in passive voice so 
what do we do?  We can try to borrow the past historic of the intransitive 
verb, which is "fit" or we can pursue the formation of a participle by 
regularising it.  "The members iof the Olympic team were fit for their new 
uniforms" doesn't work.  "The members of the Olympic team were fitted for their 
new uniforms" seems to. 

My call would be that the regularising rule applies here.  If the OP MUST use 
passive voice (dubious tech writing practice at best) then make "fitted" the 
participle, rather than awkwardly stealing the past historic from the 
transitive verb. It fits better (sic: intransitive!) with other forward 
formations that are already in use.

Helen


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Re: Fit or fitted?

[Stuart Rogers]

On 2014-May-29 8:28 PM, Writer wrote:

It's not a verb in this case; it's a predicate adjective.

Nadine





Exactly. No one sells "fit sheets" :-)

s.

--
Stuart Rogers
Technical Communicator
Phoenix Geophysics Limited
3781 Victoria Park Avenue, Unit 3
Toronto, ON, Canada  M1W 3K5
+1 (416) 491-7340 x 325

http://www.phoenix-geophysics.com

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Re: Fit or fitted?

[Writer]

It's not a verb in this case; it's a predicate adjective.

Nadine

>
> From: Robert Lauriston 
>To: Stephen O'Brien ; "Frame Users 
>(framers@lists.frameusers.com)"  
>Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 11:42:49 AM
>Subject: Re: Fit or fitted?
> 
>
>
>Per Betty Azar, in American English, the present, simple past, and past tense 
>of the verb "to fit" are all "fit." 
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Re: Fit or fitted?

[Robert Lauriston]

Per Betty Azar, in American English, the present, simple past, and past
tense of the verb "to fit" are all "fit."
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RE: Fit or fitted?

[Jaime Zuniga]

I would go with fitted.

Here's the definition:
shaped for a precise fit

Jaime


From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 2:50 PM
To: Frame Users (framers@lists.frameusers.com)
Subject: Fit or fitted?

Hi,

We cannot undecided :

"Typically, curves are fit/fitted to the surface."

Any help is appreciated.

Stephen O'BRIEN
Coordonnateur à la documentation et rédacteur technique senior | Documentation 
Coordinator and Senior Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels | Software
sobr...@innovmetric.com<mailto:sobr...@innovmetric.com>
T (1) 418.688.2061
F (1) 418.688.3001
[cid:image001.gif@01CF7A85.2EEB5F10]<http://www.innovmetric.com/>
AVIS DE CONFIDENTIALITÉ/CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: Ce message peut contenir des 
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RE: Fit or fitted?

[Stephen O'Brien]

Hi,

Yes, and this is the standard answer from the group as well.

Thanks for the many answers!

Stephen O'BRIEN
Coordonnateur à la documentation et rédacteur technique senior | Documentation 
Coordinator and Senior Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels | Software
T (1) 418.688.2061

De : Doris Evans-McCarthy [mailto:doris.evans-mccar...@riverbed.com]
Envoyé : Wednesday, May 28, 2014 3:12 PM
À : Writer; Stephen O'Brien; Frame Users (framers@lists.frameusers.com)
Objet : RE: Fit or fitted?

Yes, “fit” is generally American usage. “Fitted” is used globally.

D

From: 
framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com>
 [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Writer
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 3:06 PM
To: Stephen O'Brien; Frame Users 
(framers@lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com>)
Subject: Re: Fit or fitted?

Merriam-Webster seems to accept "fitted".

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fitted

Nadine


From: Stephen O'Brien mailto:sobr...@innovmetric.com>>
To: "Frame Users 
(framers@lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com>)" 
mailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 2:50:01 PM
Subject: Fit or fitted?

Hi,

We cannot undecided :

"Typically, curves are fit/fitted to the surface."

Any help is appreciated.

Stephen O'BRIEN
Coordonnateur à la documentation et rédacteur technique senior | Documentation 
Coordinator and Senior Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels | Software
sobr...@innovmetric.com<mailto:sobr...@innovmetric.com>
T (1) 418.688.2061
F (1) 418.688.3001
[cid:image001.gif@01CF7A88.3499A860]<http://www.innovmetric.com/>
AVIS DE CONFIDENTIALITÉ/CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: Ce message peut contenir des 
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Re: Fit or fitted?

[Writer]

Merriam-Webster seems to accept "fitted".

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fitted


Nadine


>
> From: Stephen O'Brien 
>To: "Frame Users (framers@lists.frameusers.com)" 
> 
>Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 2:50:01 PM
>Subject: Fit or fitted?
> 
>
>
> 
>Hi,
> 
>We cannot undecided :
> 
>"Typically, curves are fit/fitted to the surface."
> 
>Any help is appreciated.
> 
>Stephen O'BRIEN
>Coordonnateur à la documentation et rédacteur technique senior | Documentation 
>Coordinator and Senior Technical Writer
>InnovMetric Logiciels | Software
>sobr...@innovmetric.com
>T (1) 418.688.2061
>F (1) 418.688.3001
>
>AVIS DE CONFIDENTIALITÉ/CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: Ce message peut contenir des 
>renseignements confidentiels appartenant exclusivement à InnovMetric Logiciels 
>inc. ou à ses filiales. Si vous n’êtes pas le destinataire indiqué dans ce 
>message (ou responsable de livrer ce message à la personne indiquée ou prévue) 
>ou si vous pensez que ce message vous a été adressé par erreur, vous ne pouvez 
>pas utiliser ou reproduire ce message, ni le livrer à quelqu’un d’autre. Dans 
>ce cas, veuillez le retourner à l’expéditeur et le détruire. Proprietary 
>confidential information belonging to InnovMetric Software Inc. and its 
>affiliates may be contained in this message. If you are not a recipient 
>indicated or intended in this message (or responsible for delivering this 
>message to such a person), or you think for any reason that this message may 
>have been addressed to you by mistake, you may not use or copy this message, 
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 which case, notify the sender and destroy the e-mail.
> 
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RE: Fit or fitted?

[Jeff Coatsworth]

"fit"

From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Stephen O'Brien
Sent: May-28-14 2:50 PM
To: Frame Users (framers@lists.frameusers.com)
Subject: Fit or fitted?

Hi,

We cannot undecided :

"Typically, curves are fit/fitted to the surface."

Any help is appreciated.

Stephen O'BRIEN
Coordonnateur à la documentation et rédacteur technique senior | Documentation 
Coordinator and Senior Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels | Software
sobr...@innovmetric.com<mailto:sobr...@innovmetric.com>
T (1) 418.688.2061
F (1) 418.688.3001
[cid:image001.gif@01CF7A85.7F1BA170]<http://www.innovmetric.com/>
AVIS DE CONFIDENTIALITÉ/CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: Ce message peut contenir des 
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Fit or fitted?

[Stephen O'Brien]

Hi,

We cannot undecided :

"Typically, curves are fit/fitted to the surface."

Any help is appreciated.

Stephen O'BRIEN
Coordonnateur à la documentation et rédacteur technique senior | Documentation 
Coordinator and Senior Technical Writer
InnovMetric Logiciels | Software
sobr...@innovmetric.com
T (1) 418.688.2061
F (1) 418.688.3001
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