Page break paragraph style
Linda G. Gallagher wrote: > > Here's another quick one. Are there Windows keyboard shortcuts to switch > from Body pages to Master pages, etc.? I feel like I've seen someone use > something faster than Esc v B, Esc v R, and Esc v M that I found in the > help. The Alt key is your friend ;-) I use my left thumb on the Alt key for most Windows shortcuts, as that is what activates the menu hotkeys, and my fingers don't leave the home keys, as they do when using Escape sequences. You also generally don't need to worry about case, although there are exceptions. So Alt + v opens the (V)iew menu, then type d for Bo(d)y, m for (M)aster, or e for R(e)ference pages. There is a Windoze setting somewhere (or is it a setting in each application?? I can't remember) that determines whether the hotkeys are underlined all the time or not until you press Alt. I prefer to see them all the time, as that makes them easier to learn. -- Stuart Rogers Technical Communicator Phoenix Geophysics Limited Toronto, ON, Canada +1 (416) 491-7340 x 325 srogers phoenix-geophysics com "It is not enough that I succeed. Others must fail." -- Oscar Wilde
Page break paragraph style
Matt Sullivan wrote: > > I suggest a third option to students: > 3)Create a Master Page override by Control-Clicking on the text frame > & adjusting the height of the page. Not only is this Paragraph Tag > independent, but when you re-import your template after formatting > revisions, you can remove all "manual page breaks" (the Page Layout > overrides) without worrying about bad breaks from the use of either > Pagination or Space Below paras. This technique also allows for an extra > line on the page if needed, something the first 2 do not. Interesting alternative, but I don't think that would work in a multi-column layout, when you want to bump a heading over to the next column on the same page? Or do you have a method that works for that situation, too? thx, -- Stuart Rogers Technical Communicator Phoenix Geophysics Limited Toronto, ON, Canada +1 (416) 491-7340 x 325 srogers phoenix-geophysics com "It is not enough that I succeed. Others must fail." -- Oscar Wilde
Page break paragraph style
I use widow/orphan options and keep with next/previous on various tags to come up with relatively bulletproof page breaks. Only when that fails do I consider any of the options discussed. In my experience, when I can't globally control the page breaks through para tag options in my template, the Page Layout override "cheat" works great. As many of my projects go into the 1,000 page range, I preach the 95% perfect rule... I'd rather have a controllable document with 95% of my desired formatting than have an uncontrollable document (in terms of extra tags & manual housekeeping) that gives me 100% perfect formatting. If you spend the time keeping your template simple & controllable, manual page breaks and extra tags can be minimized if not eliminated. -Matt Sullivan GRAFIX Training, Inc. An Adobe Authorized Training Center www.grafixtraining.com 888 882-2819 -Original Message- From: Stuart Rogers [mailto:srog...@phoenix-geophysics.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2007 7:37 AM To: Matt Sullivan Cc: 'Framers List' Subject: Re: Page break paragraph style Matt Sullivan wrote: > > I suggest a third option to students: > 3)Create a Master Page override by Control-Clicking on the text frame > & adjusting the height of the page. Not only is this Paragraph Tag > independent, but when you re-import your template after formatting > revisions, you can remove all "manual page breaks" (the Page Layout > overrides) without worrying about bad breaks from the use of either > Pagination or Space Below paras. This technique also allows for an extra > line on the page if needed, something the first 2 do not. Interesting alternative, but I don't think that would work in a multi-column layout, when you want to bump a heading over to the next column on the same page? Or do you have a method that works for that situation, too? thx, -- Stuart Rogers Technical Communicator Phoenix Geophysics Limited Toronto, ON, Canada +1 (416) 491-7340 x 325 srogers phoenix-geophysics com "It is not enough that I succeed. Others must fail." -- Oscar Wilde
Re: Page break paragraph style
Linda, The method you use actually produces a column break that moves the _next_ paragraph to the top of the next column. Setting Pagination to Top of Column (or Top of Page) moves the _current_ paragraph to the top of the next column (or page). I prefer your method. It works a bit like Special Page Break At Top of Next Available Column, except that Frame doesn't see it as an override. So Remove Overrides won't undo it. I also prefer your method because it requires only one special paragraph format and leaves me to decide which kind of paragraph will be at the top of the next column or page. Using the Pagination settings requires a paragraph format for each paragraph style you might want to have follow a break. For example, in addition to a Heading1 format that can start mid-column, you might need something like a Heading1ColBreak format and Heading1PageBreak. I'd keep doin' it the way you're doin' it! Mike Wickham - Original Message - From: Linda G. Gallagher [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2007 3:31 PM Subject: Page break paragraph style Framers, Years ago, I learned from this list about creating a paragraph style to use for page breaks. I've always done this using something like 800 pts of space after for the page break paragraph tag to force the new page. In talking about this with a colleague, she asked why not set the Pagination to Top of Page. Hmmm. Good question. Do you folks have any words of wisdom (pros or cons) for using one method over the other for a page break paragraph tag? Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates Manager, STC Consulting and Independent Contracting SIG http://www.stcsig.org/cic/index.html ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mewickham%40compuserve.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Page break paragraph style
Framers, Years ago, I learned from this list about creating a paragraph style to use for page breaks. I've always done this using something like 800 pts of space after for the page break paragraph tag to force the new page. In talking about this with a colleague, she asked why not set the Pagination to Top of Page. Hmmm. Good question. Do you folks have any words of wisdom (pros or cons) for using one method over the other for a page break paragraph tag? Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates Manager, STC Consulting and Independent Contracting SIG http://www.stcsig.org/cic/index.html
Page break paragraph style
Linda G. Gallagher wrote: > Framers, > > Years ago, I learned from this list about creating a paragraph style to use > for page breaks. I've always done this using something like 800 pts of space > after for the page break paragraph tag to force the new page. In talking > about this with a colleague, she asked why not set the Pagination to Top of > Page. Hmmm. Good question. I assume you mean, "Top of Page for the following paragraph" rather than for the special page break tag. If you make the special tag Top of Page, even with the smallest allowable font size of 2pt, you'll end up with a ragged top margin on facing pages. > > Do you folks have any words of wisdom (pros or cons) for using one method > over the other for a page break paragraph tag? If you don't use a dedicated pagebreak tag and instead set the next pgf to Top of Page, you're creating an override of its tag. Override = Bad. Hard to maintain. Having a dedicated page break tag for empty pgfs means you have no overrides; you can also colour the empty tag differently so it's easier to recognize. You can search for the tags without needing a plug-in to find overrides. HTH, -- Stuart Rogers Technical Communicator Phoenix Geophysics Limited Toronto, ON, Canada +1 (416) 491-7340 x 325 srogers phoenix-geophysics com "It is not enough that I succeed. Others must fail." -- Oscar Wilde
Page break paragraph style
The difference is that adding space below the "page break" paragraph
leaves it in place on page X and forces the following paragraph (of any
style) to start at the very top of page X+1, while setting the
pagination to top of page pushes the "page break" from page X to the
start of page X+1 and then whatever follows it is below that, not at the
top of the text frame.
I have always used the added space below method, so my templates have a
single "page break" paragraph format (in fact, usually called
{_Page_Break_} as the braces force it to the end of the catalog list and
definitely make it stand out), and I do not need to have perhaps many
duplicated styles for body & top_body, etc where the only difference is
the pagination setting, or using format overrides to achieve the same
result on only selected instances to force those paragraph to start a
new page.
On Tuesday, April 03, 2007 04:31 PM, Linda G. Gallagher wrote:
| Years ago, I learned from this list about creating a paragraph
| style to use for page breaks. I've always done this using
| something like 800 pts of space after for the page break
| paragraph tag to force the new page.
| In talking about this with a colleague, she asked why not set
| the Pagination to Top of Page. Hmmm. Good question.
|
| Do you folks have any words of wisdom (pros or cons) for using
| one method over the other for a page break paragraph tag?
|
| Thanks!
- Lester
---
Lester C. Smalley Email: lsmalley AT infocon DOT com
Information Consultants, Inc. Phone: 302-239-2942 FAX: 302-239-1712
Yorklyn, DE 19736 Web: www.infocon.com
---
Page break paragraph style
If you use the Top of Page pagination property for a dedicated paragraph tag to force a page break, then the space occupied by this paragraph will push the following paragraph down the page. You can play with the line spacing and space before/after this paragraph to minimize its effect, but unless you set its Space After to a negative value and then modify each and every paragraph tag that might follow it to have a similar amount of negative Space Before. And once you've gone to all that trouble, you're left with a paragraph that is almost impossible to see or select manually. On the other hand, if you use the large Space After technique, the paragraph that forces the break is always on the preceding page so that it does not affect the vertical alignment on the following page. And you can make the default font something visually obvious (e.g. red and bold) so that you can see the paragraph easily and won't be tempted to use it as a regular text paragraph. My opinions only; I don't speak for Intel. Fred Ridder (fred dot ridder at intel dot com) Intel Parsippany, NJ -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+fred.ridder=intel@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+fred.ridder=intel.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2007 4:31 PM To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Page break paragraph style Framers, Years ago, I learned from this list about creating a paragraph style to use for page breaks. I've always done this using something like 800 pts of space after for the page break paragraph tag to force the new page. In talking about this with a colleague, she asked why not set the Pagination to Top of Page. Hmmm. Good question. Do you folks have any words of wisdom (pros or cons) for using one method over the other for a page break paragraph tag? Thanks! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC
Page break paragraph style
Linda, The method you use actually produces a column break that moves the _next_ paragraph to the top of the next column. Setting Pagination to Top of Column (or Top of Page) moves the _current_ paragraph to the top of the next column (or page). I prefer your method. It works a bit like Special> Page Break> At Top of Next Available Column, except that Frame doesn't see it as an override. So Remove Overrides won't undo it. I also prefer your method because it requires only one special paragraph format and leaves me to decide which kind of paragraph will be at the top of the next column or page. Using the Pagination settings requires a paragraph format for each paragraph style you might want to have follow a break. For example, in addition to a Heading1 format that can start mid-column, you might need something like a Heading1ColBreak format and Heading1PageBreak. I'd keep doin' it the way you're doin' it! Mike Wickham - Original Message - From: "Linda G. Gallagher" <lin...@techcomplus.com> To: Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2007 3:31 PM Subject: Page break paragraph style > > Framers, > > Years ago, I learned from this list about creating a paragraph style to > use > for page breaks. I've always done this using something like 800 pts of > space > after for the page break paragraph tag to force the new page. In talking > about this with a colleague, she asked why not set the Pagination to Top > of > Page. Hmmm. Good question. > > Do you folks have any words of wisdom (pros or cons) for using one method > over the other for a page break paragraph tag? > > Thanks! > > ~ > Linda G. Gallagher > TechCom Plus, LLC > lindag at techcomplus dot com > www.techcomplus.com > 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 > User guides, online help, FrameMaker and > WebWorks ePublisher templates > > Manager, STC Consulting and Independent > Contracting SIG > http://www.stcsig.org/cic/index.html > > > > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as mewickham at compuserve.com. > > Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mewickham%40compuserve.com > > Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. >
Page break paragraph style
Well, I knew there was a reason, but I could not think of it. Stuart, Lester, Fred, and Mike hit the nail on the head. I'll recommend sticking with the page break that with the space after. I'm not sure I'd suggest Matt's idea of resizing the page frame. That might work in some cases, but you could end with a number of odd looking pages, in my view. Here's another quick one. Are there Windows keyboard shortcuts to switch from Body pages to Master pages, etc.? I feel like I've seen someone use something faster than Esc v B, Esc v R, and Esc v M that I found in the help. Thanks all!!! ~ Linda G. Gallagher TechCom Plus, LLC lindag at techcomplus dot com www.techcomplus.com 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 User guides, online help, FrameMaker and WebWorks ePublisher templates Manager, STC Consulting and Independent Contracting SIG http://www.stcsig.org/cic/index.html -Original Message- From: Mike Wickham [mailto:mewick...@compuserve.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2007 3:34 PM To: Linda G. Gallagher; Frame Users Subject: Re: Page break paragraph style Linda, The method you use actually produces a column break that moves the _next_ paragraph to the top of the next column. Setting Pagination to Top of Column (or Top of Page) moves the _current_ paragraph to the top of the next column (or page). I prefer your method. It works a bit like Special> Page Break> At Top of Next Available Column, except that Frame doesn't see it as an override. So Remove Overrides won't undo it. I also prefer your method because it requires only one special paragraph format and leaves me to decide which kind of paragraph will be at the top of the next column or page. Using the Pagination settings requires a paragraph format for each paragraph style you might want to have follow a break. For example, in addition to a Heading1 format that can start mid-column, you might need something like a Heading1ColBreak format and Heading1PageBreak. I'd keep doin' it the way you're doin' it! Mike Wickham - Original Message - From: "Linda G. Gallagher" <lin...@techcomplus.com> To: Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2007 3:31 PM Subject: Page break paragraph style > > Framers, > > Years ago, I learned from this list about creating a paragraph style to > use > for page breaks. I've always done this using something like 800 pts of > space > after for the page break paragraph tag to force the new page. In talking > about this with a colleague, she asked why not set the Pagination to Top > of > Page. Hmmm. Good question. > > Do you folks have any words of wisdom (pros or cons) for using one method > over the other for a page break paragraph tag? > > Thanks! > > ~ > Linda G. Gallagher > TechCom Plus, LLC > lindag at techcomplus dot com > www.techcomplus.com > 303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144 > User guides, online help, FrameMaker and > WebWorks ePublisher templates > > Manager, STC Consulting and Independent > Contracting SIG > http://www.stcsig.org/cic/index.html > > > > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as mewickham at compuserve.com. > > Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mewickham%40compuserve.c om > > Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. >
Page break paragraph style
So does the {Page Break} tag mirror your Body tag, or is it used on an empty
para?
1) I find that an empty para is easier to insert, but unwieldy after
editing. It may result in unwanted breaks after editing.
2) If the {Page Break} tag mirrors the Body, you need to ensure
consistency between the two tags, much like Numbered & Numbered1.
I suggest a third option to students:
3) Create a Master Page override by Control-Clicking on the text frame
& adjusting the height of the page. Not only is this Paragraph Tag
independent, but when you re-import your template after formatting
revisions, you can remove all "manual page breaks" (the Page Layout
overrides) without worrying about bad breaks from the use of either
Pagination or Space Below paras. This technique also allows for an extra
line on the page if needed, something the first 2 do not.
-Matt Sullivan
GRAFIX Training, Inc.
An Adobe Authorized Training Center
www.grafixtraining.com
888 882-2819
-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+matt=grafixtraining@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+matt=grafixtraining.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Linda G. Gallagher
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2007 1:31 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Page break paragraph style
Framers,
Years ago, I learned from this list about creating a paragraph style to use
for page breaks. I've always done this using something like 800 pts of space
after for the page break paragraph tag to force the new page. In talking
about this with a colleague, she asked why not set the Pagination to Top of
Page. Hmmm. Good question.
Do you folks have any words of wisdom (pros or cons) for using one method
over the other for a page break paragraph tag?
Thanks!
~
Linda G. Gallagher
TechCom Plus, LLC
lindag at techcomplus dot com
www.techcomplus.com
303-450-9076 or 800-500-3144
User guides, online help, FrameMaker and
WebWorks ePublisher templates
Manager, STC Consulting and Independent
Contracting SIG
http://www.stcsig.org/cic/index.html
___
You are currently subscribed to Framers as matt at grafixtraining.com.
Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
To unsubscribe send a blank email to
framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
or visit
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/matt%40grafixtraining.co
m
Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
