RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
Sorry. My error. I was dealing with 2 problems at the same time and spoke to the wrong issue in my reply. As for the page breaks and the 95% factor, I firmly believe that certain formatting issues add significantly to manual usability (in the medical device industry, we are mandated to provide printed materials). In my opinion, orphaning the first couple of steps in a series of instructions at the bottom of a page and/or starting a new section at the bottom of a page does not enhance usability - especially if either of these example would not only flow to next page, but would fit nicely on the next page in their entirety. So this particular instance - for me - does not fall into the 95% factor, while other issues, can and do. Alison From: Fred Ridder [mailto:docu...@hotmail.com] Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 2:24 PM To: Alison Craig; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks I fail to see how futzing with manual page breaks (the subject of the thread and of Matt's reply, which was basically advising not to worry about those last 5% details) has any bearing on the TOC setup, and particularly on whether section numbers appear in the TOC. If you set up the section numbering and the TOC template properly (neither of which is rocket science), you should never have to worry about them again even when the content changes. -FR From: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com To: m...@grafixtraining.com; will...@inch.com; framers@lists.frameusers.com Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 14:13:40 -0700 Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks In general I would agree with you, but... Both I and my company are new to FrameMaker so that means - by definition - there will be teething pains. I've been warned that the learning curve is steep. Because I am setting up the initial TOC configuration and I have zero plans to change it, it is worth the extra time and effort to get it right in the first place. The products covered by the manuals have existed for some years and the format of the manual is not changing. This means the changeover needs to be seamless as far as our customers are concerned. Additionally, if the manual uses numbered sections with titles (1.1 Audience, 1.2 Manual Conventions, etc), not including this numbering in the TOC means the TOC information is incomplete and will degrade its usefulness. So I will continue for a while longer... Alison -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sullivan Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 9:40 PM To: Alison Craig; 'William Abernathy'; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks In class, and in practice, I preach the Design to 95% Perfect rule. If I can't handle any of my numbering, referencing, and pagination at arm's length in my template, then I let it go. In my world, a consistent and predictable 95% perfect beats an inconsistent frustrating 100% perfectly formatted document every time. Of course, I also tell my clients that I can help with everything but the politics...including a supervisor who wants to make Frame (and the authors) jump through hoops all day long for trivial formatting issues. I'd suggest you attach a dollar figure to the time associated with the extra formatting, double-checking required by the formatting, and time associated with discussing the formatting. If management feels that sacraficing that money and productivity is worth the nominal improvement in the documentation, there's not much you can do, short of looking for job postings here... -Matt Matt Sullivan GRAFIX Training m...@roundpeg.com www.roundpeg.com Office 714 960-6840 Cell text 714 585-2335 SMS message 7145852...@vtext.com skype: mattatroundpeg LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/grafixtraining facebook| plaxo Click to tell me the social media sites you belong to -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison Craig Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 5:13 PM To: William Abernathy; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks I already use this method (for almost any kind of heading) - and I have widow/Orphan control set to a more than just a couple of lines - but it doesn't cover all situations. Thanks, Alison -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 2:39 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks If you need to insert these breaks in running text for aesthetic reasons (i.e., you don't want to have a heading and three lines
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
In general I would agree with you, but... Both I and my company are new to FrameMaker so that means - by definition - there will be teething pains. I've been warned that the learning curve is steep. Because I am setting up the initial TOC configuration and I have zero plans to change it, it is worth the extra time and effort to get it right in the first place. The products covered by the manuals have existed for some years and the format of the manual is not changing. This means the changeover needs to be seamless as far as our customers are concerned. Additionally, if the manual uses numbered sections with titles (1.1 Audience, 1.2 Manual Conventions, etc), not including this numbering in the TOC means the TOC information is incomplete and will degrade its usefulness. So I will continue for a while longer... Alison -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Matt Sullivan Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 9:40 PM To: Alison Craig; 'William Abernathy'; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks In class, and in practice, I preach the Design to 95% Perfect rule. If I can't handle any of my numbering, referencing, and pagination at arm's length in my template, then I let it go. In my world, a consistent and predictable 95% perfect beats an inconsistent frustrating 100% perfectly formatted document every time. Of course, I also tell my clients that I can help with everything but the politics...including a supervisor who wants to make Frame (and the authors) jump through hoops all day long for trivial formatting issues. I'd suggest you attach a dollar figure to the time associated with the extra formatting, double-checking required by the formatting, and time associated with discussing the formatting. If management feels that sacraficing that money and productivity is worth the nominal improvement in the documentation, there's not much you can do, short of looking for job postings here... -Matt Matt Sullivan GRAFIX Training m...@roundpeg.com www.roundpeg.com Office 714 960-6840 Cell text 714 585-2335 SMS message 7145852...@vtext.com skype: mattatroundpeg LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/grafixtraining facebook| plaxo Click to tell me the social media sites you belong to -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison Craig Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 5:13 PM To: William Abernathy; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks I already use this method (for almost any kind of heading) - and I have widow/Orphan control set to a more than just a couple of lines - but it doesn't cover all situations. Thanks, Alison -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 2:39 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks If you need to insert these breaks in running text for aesthetic reasons (i.e., you don't want to have a heading and three lines of body text, followed by a page break), consider using the Keep With Next Paragraph exception in the paragraph definition. This is no more effort than inserting a dummy paragraph to force the page break, and has the benefit of lower maintenance -- If the upstream formatting changes, you stand a much better chance of the break falling in a logical/aesthetic fashion than if you force a break (either with a P-tag exception or by inserting a dummy paragraph). Once either paragraph crosses the page boundary, the break is redrawn in a way that looks good. I believe it is also possible to program this behavior into your body text definition's Widow/Orphan Lines control, but I have not investigated this. --William Alison Craig wrote: Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasoni x.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as m...@grafixtraining.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email
Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
If you need to insert these breaks in running text for aesthetic reasons (i.e., you don't want to have a heading and three lines of body text, followed by a page break), consider using the Keep With Next Paragraph exception in the paragraph definition. This is no more effort than inserting a dummy paragraph to force the page break, and has the benefit of lower maintenance -- If the upstream formatting changes, you stand a much better chance of the break falling in a logical/aesthetic fashion than if you force a break (either with a P-tag exception or by inserting a dummy paragraph). Once either paragraph crosses the page boundary, the break is redrawn in a way that looks good. I believe it is also possible to program this behavior into your body text definition's Widow/Orphan Lines control, but I have not investigated this. --William Alison Craig wrote: Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
I already use this method (for almost any kind of heading) - and I have widow/Orphan control set to a more than just a couple of lines - but it doesn't cover all situations. Thanks, Alison -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 2:39 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks If you need to insert these breaks in running text for aesthetic reasons (i.e., you don't want to have a heading and three lines of body text, followed by a page break), consider using the Keep With Next Paragraph exception in the paragraph definition. This is no more effort than inserting a dummy paragraph to force the page break, and has the benefit of lower maintenance -- If the upstream formatting changes, you stand a much better chance of the break falling in a logical/aesthetic fashion than if you force a break (either with a P-tag exception or by inserting a dummy paragraph). Once either paragraph crosses the page boundary, the break is redrawn in a way that looks good. I believe it is also possible to program this behavior into your body text definition's Widow/Orphan Lines control, but I have not investigated this. --William Alison Craig wrote: Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasonix.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
In class, and in practice, I preach the Design to 95% Perfect rule. If I can't handle any of my numbering, referencing, and pagination at arm's length in my template, then I let it go. In my world, a consistent and predictable 95% perfect beats an inconsistent frustrating 100% perfectly formatted document every time. Of course, I also tell my clients that I can help with everything but the politics...including a supervisor who wants to make Frame (and the authors) jump through hoops all day long for trivial formatting issues. I'd suggest you attach a dollar figure to the time associated with the extra formatting, double-checking required by the formatting, and time associated with discussing the formatting. If management feels that sacraficing that money and productivity is worth the nominal improvement in the documentation, there's not much you can do, short of looking for job postings here... -Matt Matt Sullivan GRAFIX Training m...@roundpeg.com www.roundpeg.com Office 714 960-6840 Cell text 714 585-2335 SMS message 7145852...@vtext.com skype: mattatroundpeg LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/grafixtraining facebook| plaxo Click to tell me the social media sites you belong to -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison Craig Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 5:13 PM To: William Abernathy; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks I already use this method (for almost any kind of heading) - and I have widow/Orphan control set to a more than just a couple of lines - but it doesn't cover all situations. Thanks, Alison -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 2:39 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks If you need to insert these breaks in running text for aesthetic reasons (i.e., you don't want to have a heading and three lines of body text, followed by a page break), consider using the Keep With Next Paragraph exception in the paragraph definition. This is no more effort than inserting a dummy paragraph to force the page break, and has the benefit of lower maintenance -- If the upstream formatting changes, you stand a much better chance of the break falling in a logical/aesthetic fashion than if you force a break (either with a P-tag exception or by inserting a dummy paragraph). Once either paragraph crosses the page boundary, the break is redrawn in a way that looks good. I believe it is also possible to program this behavior into your body text definition's Widow/Orphan Lines control, but I have not investigated this. --William Alison Craig wrote: Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alison.craig%40ultrasoni x.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as m...@grafixtraining.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/matt%40grafixtraining.co m Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
Alison-- You can create a style that has a large space below defined, which has the effect of pushing everything to the next page. This is what I have done and has worked well for years. I called mine 0PageBreak so that it is the first tag that appears in the list when I press F9, which makes it very easy to insert. It's also easy to search and remove all of these artificial breaks too by using a specific paragraph tag. -Lief -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison Craig Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 12:45 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison This email has been scanned. This e-mail (including any attachments) is confidential and may be legally privileged. If you are not an intended recipient or an authorized representative of an intended recipient, you are prohibited from using, copying or distributing the information in this e-mail or its attachments. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete all copies of this message and any attachments. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
On the Pagination tab of the Paragraph Designer, you can set the paratag to start at the top of the next page by setting Start to Top of Page. For example, if you have an H1 tag, you can create a twin tag called H1_break, but set it to start at the top of the next page. Nadine --- On Tue, 6/23/09, Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com wrote: From: Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com Subject: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks To: framers@lists.frameusers.com framers@lists.frameusers.com Received: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 1:45 PM Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as generic...@yahoo.ca. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/generic668%40yahoo.ca Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
Alison Craig wrote: Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ I use a PageBreak tag defined with 2pt font and 999pt space below, inserted (with no content) immediately before the pgf that should move to the next page or column. -- Stuart Rogers Technical Communicator Phoenix Geophysics Limited Toronto, ON, Canada +1 (416) 491-7340 x 325 srogers phoenix-geophysics com It is not enough that I succeed. Others must fail. -- Oscar Wilde ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
Stuart Rogers wrote: I use a PageBreak tag defined with 2pt font and 999pt space below, inserted (with no content) immediately before the pgf that should move to the next page or column. I used a similar approach at a previous employer. But because we would globally delete all PageBreak paragraphs so that we could re-do the manual page breaks after a file was edited significantly, we wanted to ensure that nobody put any text in the special paragraphs. Instead of using a 2 pt font, we set the line spacing to be 2 pts, but set the paragraph font to some obviously decorative face (e.g. Cooper Black or some script face) in 14 pt red. -Fred Ridder ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
I'd already thought of that, but... won't it affect the auto-creation of TOC entries from Headings? Alison -Original Message- From: Writer [mailto:generic...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 11:03 AM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison Craig Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks On the Pagination tab of the Paragraph Designer, you can set the paratag to start at the top of the next page by setting Start to Top of Page. For example, if you have an H1 tag, you can create a twin tag called H1_break, but set it to start at the top of the next page. Nadine --- On Tue, 6/23/09, Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com wrote: From: Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com Subject: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks To: framers@lists.frameusers.com framers@lists.frameusers.com Received: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 1:45 PM Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as generic...@yahoo.ca. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/generic668%40yahoo.ca Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
You just have to edit the TOC setup to include both the regular and the break-before versions of each heading. In other words, both H1 and H1_break, both H2 and H2_break, etc. Works like a champ. -Fred Ridder From: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com To: generic...@yahoo.ca; framers@lists.frameusers.com Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 12:23:24 -0700 Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks I'd already thought of that, but... won't it affect the auto-creation of TOC entries from Headings? Alison -Original Message- From: Writer [mailto:generic...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 11:03 AM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison Craig Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks On the Pagination tab of the Paragraph Designer, you can set the paratag to start at the top of the next page by setting Start to Top of Page. For example, if you have an H1 tag, you can create a twin tag called H1_break, but set it to start at the top of the next page. Nadine ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
Depends on whether or not you include it in the TOC. Do you want it in the TOC? --- On Tue, 6/23/09, Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com wrote: From: Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks To: generic...@yahoo.ca generic...@yahoo.ca, framers@lists.frameusers.com framers@lists.frameusers.com Received: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 3:23 PM I'd already thought of that, but... won't it affect the auto-creation of TOC entries from Headings? Alison -Original Message- From: Writer [mailto:generic...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 11:03 AM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison Craig Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks On the Pagination tab of the Paragraph Designer, you can set the paratag to start at the top of the next page by setting Start to Top of Page. For example, if you have an H1 tag, you can create a twin tag called H1_break, but set it to start at the top of the next page. Nadine --- On Tue, 6/23/09, Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com wrote: From: Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com Subject: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks To: framers@lists.frameusers.com framers@lists.frameusers.com Received: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 1:45 PM Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as generic...@yahoo.ca. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/generic668%40yahoo.ca Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
But note that the alternate approach of a break-after paragraph (i.e. one with 999 pts of space after) doesn't require any change to the TOC setup at all. Which is one reason why I personally prefer that approach. -Fred Ridder From: docu...@hotmail.com To: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com; generic...@yahoo.ca; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 15:47:47 -0400 You just have to edit the TOC setup to include both the regular and the break-before versions of each heading. In other words, both H1 and H1_break, both H2 and H2_break, etc. Works like a champ. -Fred Ridder From: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com To: generic...@yahoo.ca; framers@lists.frameusers.com Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 12:23:24 -0700 Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks I'd already thought of that, but... won't it affect the auto-creation of TOC entries from Headings? Alison -Original Message- From: Writer [mailto:generic...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 11:03 AM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison Craig Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks On the Pagination tab of the Paragraph Designer, you can set the paratag to start at the top of the next page by setting Start to Top of Page. For example, if you have an H1 tag, you can create a twin tag called H1_break, but set it to start at the top of the next page. Nadine ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as docu...@hotmail.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/docudoc%40hotmail.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
That's good - although I'm having issues with the TOC, so that will be one of my next questions... Alison From: Fred Ridder [mailto:docu...@hotmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 12:48 PM To: Alison Craig; generic...@yahoo.ca; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks You just have to edit the TOC setup to include both the regular and the break-before versions of each heading. In other words, both H1 and H1_break, both H2 and H2_break, etc. Works like a champ. -Fred Ridder From: alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com To: generic...@yahoo.ca; framers@lists.frameusers.com Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 12:23:24 -0700 Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks I'd already thought of that, but... won't it affect the auto-creation of TOC entries from Headings? Alison -Original Message- From: Writer [mailto:generic...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 11:03 AM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison Craig Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks On the Pagination tab of the Paragraph Designer, you can set the paratag to start at the top of the next page by setting Start to Top of Page. For example, if you have an H1 tag, you can create a twin tag called H1_break, but set it to start at the top of the next page. Nadine ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
Yes. My headings are always configured to be auto-included in the TOC. With the kind of manuals I create, this makes things simplest. Alison -Original Message- From: Writer [mailto:generic...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 12:50 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison Craig Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks Depends on whether or not you include it in the TOC. Do you want it in the TOC? --- On Tue, 6/23/09, Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com wrote: From: Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com Subject: RE: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks To: generic...@yahoo.ca generic...@yahoo.ca, framers@lists.frameusers.com framers@lists.frameusers.com Received: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 3:23 PM I'd already thought of that, but... won't it affect the auto-creation of TOC entries from Headings? Alison -Original Message- From: Writer [mailto:generic...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 11:03 AM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison Craig Subject: Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks On the Pagination tab of the Paragraph Designer, you can set the paratag to start at the top of the next page by setting Start to Top of Page. For example, if you have an H1 tag, you can create a twin tag called H1_break, but set it to start at the top of the next page. Nadine --- On Tue, 6/23/09, Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com wrote: From: Alison Craig alison.cr...@ultrasonix.com Subject: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks To: framers@lists.frameusers.com framers@lists.frameusers.com Received: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 1:45 PM Is there a way to create a style that accepts all existing formatting and simply applies (i.e., forces) a page break? My attempts to create such a style have failed so far. I really don't want to have to create an Override every time I want a page break based on layout/esthetic reasons. Alison ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as generic...@yahoo.ca. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/generic668%40yahoo.ca Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating an FM9 Style to Apply Forced Page Breaks
I also use a PageBreak para format to insert manual page breaks. I think I just cloned it from our basic para format (Normal), but set the space below to 700pt. To make it visible, I set the colour to blue and set tabs stops at 5mm intervals across the whole text column, with the last tab stop set 5mm in from the right margin (so I can still see the para marker). I then inserted an equal number of tab commands in the numbering tab in Para Designer. So, when I insert a PageBreak, I can see a row of blue tab text symbols across the page. I also set the Next Pgf Tag to Normal. I've used this method for years after reading about it on this list and it works well. I also find it handy when I'm working in a draft manual and I want to move any text I'm editing onto a new page so it doesn't break across two pages. Cheers Dave Fred Ridder wrote, on 24/06/2009 6:37 a.m.: Stuart Rogers wrote: I use a PageBreak tag defined with 2pt font and 999pt space below, inserted (with no content) immediately before the pgf that should move to the next page or column. I used a similar approach at a previous employer. But because we would globally delete all PageBreak paragraphs so that we could re-do the manual page breaks after a file was edited significantly, we wanted to ensure that nobody put any text in the special paragraphs. Instead of using a 2 pt font, we set the line spacing to be 2 pts, but set the paragraph font to some obviously decorative face (e.g. Cooper Black or some script face) in 14 pt red. -Fred Ridder ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as dave.reyno...@tait.co.nz. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/dave.reynolds%40tait.co.nz Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ Dave Reynolds Phone: (64) (3) 358 1029 Senior Technical Author Fax: (64) (3) 359 4632 Tait Electronics Ltd Email: dave.reyno...@tait.co.nz PO Box 1645 Christchurch New Zealand === This email, including any attachments, is only for the intended addressee. It is subject to copyright, is confidential and may be the subject of legal or other privilege, none of which is waived or lost by reason of this transmission. If the receiver is not the intended addressee, please accept our apologies, notify us by return, delete all copies and perform no other act on the email. Unfortunately, we cannot warrant that the email has not been altered or corrupted during transmission. === ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
