roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
On Wed, 21 May 2008 08:31:47 -0700 (PDT), Rene Stephenson wrote: >I would: >d) Buy the current Adobe Technical Communicator Suite, just a $900 upgrade >with ANY previous license for FM or RH. > >because the new RH and FM8 work together seamlessly. As I understand it, >you don't have to roundtrip stuff back and forth through MIF anymore. You just >set up your RH template, point it to the FM source, make all your edits in FM, >and as the content evolves in FM, so does your Help output. Just regenerate >the RH project as needed. Or: e) Buy Mif2Go, a $295 plugin for any version of Frame since 5.5.6, including 8.x, and save $600...Save way more than that compared to ePP. ... because it really *does* what you want, with your single source in Frame, and you never have to roundtrip at all. All Help features are in your Frame file, either implicitly (based on formats used) or explicitly (markers), and you can generate the Help in seconds whenever you want to look at it. ;-) BTW, that *does* include drop-down text, something mentioned later in this thread... And none of the Help markup interferes in any way with Frame's normal functionality for print and PDF outputs. HTH! -- Jeremy H. Griffith, at Omni Systems Inc. http://www.omsys.com/
Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
On Wed, 21 May 2008 08:31:47 -0700 (PDT), Rene Stephenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >I would: >d) Buy the current Adobe Technical Communicator Suite, just a $900 upgrade >with ANY previous license for FM or RH. > >because the new RH and FM8 work together seamlessly. As I understand it, >you don't have to roundtrip stuff back and forth through MIF anymore. You just >set up your RH template, point it to the FM source, make all your edits in FM, >and as the content evolves in FM, so does your Help output. Just regenerate >the RH project as needed. Or: e) Buy Mif2Go, a $295 plugin for any version of Frame since 5.5.6, including 8.x, and save $600...Save way more than that compared to ePP. ... because it really *does* what you want, with your single source in Frame, and you never have to roundtrip at all. All Help features are in your Frame file, either implicitly (based on formats used) or explicitly (markers), and you can generate the Help in seconds whenever you want to look at it. ;-) BTW, that *does* include drop-down text, something mentioned later in this thread... And none of the Help markup interferes in any way with Frame's normal functionality for print and PDF outputs. HTH! -- Jeremy H. Griffith, at Omni Systems Inc. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.omsys.com/ ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
Based on a recent evaluation of TCS, my understanding is that the HTML cannot be round-tripped. What's more, certain things you might want in your HTML cannot be marked up in Frame. For example, if you want to use drop-down hotspots, there's no way to mark them up in FrameMaker; you have to modify the HTML topics that were generated from the Frame source. These modifications cannot be brought back to Frame. If you update your Frame source and regenerate the topics, you have to add the drop-down hotspots to the topics all over again. In fact, as far as I know, any modifications you make to the HTML topics are not round-tripped back to your FM files. Basically what you are getting in the TCS is a good HTML Help editor that can import FrameMaker documents with support for cross-reference, index, and context sensitivity markers. Please correct me if I'm wrong about any of this. Rene Stephenson wrote: > I would: > d) Buy the current Adobe Technical Communicator Suite, just a $900 upgrade > with ANY previous license for FM or RH. > > ...because the new RH and FM8 work together seamlessly. As I understand it, > you don't have to roundtrip stuff back and forth through MIF anymore. You > just set up your RH template, point it to the FM source, make all your edits > in FM, and as the content evolves in FM, so does your Help output. Just > regenerate the RH project as needed. > > ;-) > > Rene L. Stephenson >
roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
Hi Ben Years ago, during my first single sourcing project for a client (when I hadn't even heard the term...grin), we started with the help file design. We ALWAYS started with a map of the components we wanted to include in each deliverable type and documented what each category of information would include. And we always created in Frame and exported to the help tool. To this day, that is the way I do single sourcing. My initial analysis provides the framework for the content, FrameMaker is my source for the content, and I output to another tool for other deliverables (help, etc.). In my opinion, it is the analysis of your content and what goes where, what the differences are and the like that are the most important aspect of this type of project. The big question I ask myself first is "how do I define what is included in each deliverable?". Then, *why* am I including/excluding the information on my list. Then I move on from there. Don't know if that helps...and please do feel free to send a private email or give me a call at 317-508-2898 if you need someone to chat with. A note: My background is in using unstructured FrameMaker to create single sourced projects. There are others on this group who have amazing talents in various tools and techniques and I stand in awe of their gifts! Blessings Jerilynne Knight On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 10:07 AM, Ben Hechter wrote: > Hi All, > > Competent in Framemaker but new to Robohelp, with the following question: > > If you had to design roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp) > for a constantly evolving product, would you: > > a) begin in Framemaker and export to Robohelp > b) begin in Robohelp and export to Framemaker > c) prototype in both and iterate as you go > > Certainly interested in tools integration war stories from the battlefront, > but even more interested in the information design perspective... > > ...potential benefits of the chunking constraint of starting with help > first (to keep the user guide tight), vs. needing to hammer down expanded > user guide content into help topics. > > >
Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
I'll take your experience over my watching webinars any day. Bummer.. Oh, well, I guess I can just stick with WWP Pro and FM 7.2 for a while longer. ;-) Rene L. Stephenson - Original Message From: Jim Owens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> In fact, as far as I know, any modifications you make to the HTML topics are not round-tripped back to your FM files. Basically what you are getting in the TCS is a good HTML Help editor that can import FrameMaker documents with support for cross-reference, index, and context sensitivity markers. ... ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
I'll take your experience over my watching webinars any day. Bummer.. Oh, well, I guess I can just stick with WWP Pro and FM 7.2 for a while longer. ;-) Rene L. Stephenson - Original Message From: Jim Owens In fact, as far as I know, any modifications you make to the HTML topics are not round-tripped back to your FM files. Basically what you are getting in the TCS is a good HTML Help editor that can import FrameMaker documents with support for cross-reference, index, and context sensitivity markers. ...
Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
Based on a recent evaluation of TCS, my understanding is that the HTML cannot be round-tripped. What's more, certain things you might want in your HTML cannot be marked up in Frame. For example, if you want to use drop-down hotspots, there's no way to mark them up in FrameMaker; you have to modify the HTML topics that were generated from the Frame source. These modifications cannot be brought back to Frame. If you update your Frame source and regenerate the topics, you have to add the drop-down hotspots to the topics all over again. In fact, as far as I know, any modifications you make to the HTML topics are not round-tripped back to your FM files. Basically what you are getting in the TCS is a good HTML Help editor that can import FrameMaker documents with support for cross-reference, index, and context sensitivity markers. Please correct me if I'm wrong about any of this. Rene Stephenson wrote: > I would: > d) Buy the current Adobe Technical Communicator Suite, just a $900 upgrade > with ANY previous license for FM or RH. > > ...because the new RH and FM8 work together seamlessly. As I understand it, > you don't have to roundtrip stuff back and forth through MIF anymore. You > just set up your RH template, point it to the FM source, make all your edits > in FM, and as the content evolves in FM, so does your Help output. Just > regenerate the RH project as needed. > > ;-) > > Rene L. Stephenson > ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
I would: d) Buy the current Adobe Technical Communicator Suite, just a $900 upgrade with ANY previous license for FM or RH. ...because the new RH and FM8 work together seamlessly. As I understand it, you don't have to roundtrip stuff back and forth through MIF anymore. You just set up your RH template, point it to the FM source, make all your edits in FM, and as the content evolves in FM, so does your Help output. Just regenerate the RH project as needed. ;-) Rene L. Stephenson - Original Message From: Ben Hechter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 11:07:17 AM Subject: Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg? Hi All, Competent in Framemaker but new to Robohelp, with the following question: If you had to design roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp) for a constantly evolving product, would you: a) begin in Framemaker and export to Robohelp b) begin in Robohelp and export to Framemaker c) prototype in both and iterate as you go Certainly interested in tools integration war stories from the battlefront, but even more interested in the information design perspective... ...potential benefits of the chunking constraint of starting with help first (to keep the user guide tight), vs. needing to hammer down expanded user guide content into help topics. Any and all opinions most welcome! Ben Ben Hechter objectives.ca Vancouver BC ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/rinnie1%40yahoo.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
I would: d) Buy the current Adobe Technical Communicator Suite, just a $900 upgrade with ANY previous license for FM or RH. ...because the new RH and FM8 work together seamlessly. As I understand it, you don't have to roundtrip stuff back and forth through MIF anymore. You just set up your RH template, point it to the FM source, make all your edits in FM, and as the content evolves in FM, so does your Help output. Just regenerate the RH project as needed. ;-) Rene L. Stephenson - Original Message From: Ben Hechter To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 11:07:17 AM Subject: Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg? Hi All, Competent in Framemaker but new to Robohelp, with the following question: If you had to design roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp) for a constantly evolving product, would you: a) begin in Framemaker and export to Robohelp b) begin in Robohelp and export to Framemaker c) prototype in both and iterate as you go Certainly interested in tools integration war stories from the battlefront, but even more interested in the information design perspective... ...potential benefits of the chunking constraint of starting with help first (to keep the user guide tight), vs. needing to hammer down expanded user guide content into help topics. Any and all opinions most welcome! Ben Ben Hechter objectives.ca Vancouver BC ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as rinnie1 at yahoo.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/rinnie1%40yahoo.com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
Hi Ben Years ago, during my first single sourcing project for a client (when I hadn't even heard the term...grin), we started with the help file design. We ALWAYS started with a map of the components we wanted to include in each deliverable type and documented what each category of information would include. And we always created in Frame and exported to the help tool. To this day, that is the way I do single sourcing. My initial analysis provides the framework for the content, FrameMaker is my source for the content, and I output to another tool for other deliverables (help, etc.). In my opinion, it is the analysis of your content and what goes where, what the differences are and the like that are the most important aspect of this type of project. The big question I ask myself first is "how do I define what is included in each deliverable?". Then, *why* am I including/excluding the information on my list. Then I move on from there. Don't know if that helps...and please do feel free to send a private email or give me a call at 317-508-2898 if you need someone to chat with. A note: My background is in using unstructured FrameMaker to create single sourced projects. There are others on this group who have amazing talents in various tools and techniques and I stand in awe of their gifts! Blessings Jerilynne Knight On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 10:07 AM, Ben Hechter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi All, > > Competent in Framemaker but new to Robohelp, with the following question: > > If you had to design roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp) > for a constantly evolving product, would you: > > a) begin in Framemaker and export to Robohelp > b) begin in Robohelp and export to Framemaker > c) prototype in both and iterate as you go > > Certainly interested in tools integration war stories from the battlefront, > but even more interested in the information design perspective... > > ...potential benefits of the chunking constraint of starting with help > first (to keep the user guide tight), vs. needing to hammer down expanded > user guide content into help topics. > > > ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
Hi All, Competent in Framemaker but new to Robohelp, with the following question: If you had to design roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp) for a constantly evolving product, would you: a) begin in Framemaker and export to Robohelp b) begin in Robohelp and export to Framemaker c) prototype in both and iterate as you go Certainly interested in tools integration war stories from the battlefront, but even more interested in the information design perspective... ...potential benefits of the chunking constraint of starting with help first (to keep the user guide tight), vs. needing to hammer down expanded user guide content into help topics. Any and all opinions most welcome! Ben Ben Hechter objectives.ca Vancouver BC ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
Hi All, Competent in Framemaker but new to Robohelp, with the following question: If you had to design roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp) for a constantly evolving product, would you: a) begin in Framemaker and export to Robohelp b) begin in Robohelp and export to Framemaker c) prototype in both and iterate as you go Certainly interested in tools integration war stories from the battlefront, but even more interested in the information design perspective... ...potential benefits of the chunking constraint of starting with help first (to keep the user guide tight), vs. needing to hammer down expanded user guide content into help topics. Any and all opinions most welcome! Ben Ben Hechter objectives.ca Vancouver BC
Re: roundtrip documentation and help (Framemaker/Robohelp - chicken or egg?
___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
