RE: MIDI on SB Live! ?
just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? Nobody. Our target for nearest future is Audigy/Audigy2 support. Yuriy Tsibizov, http://chibis.persons.gfk.ru/audigy/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
RE: MIDI on SB Live! ?
Am Mo, 2003-03-24 um 07.47 schrieb Yuriy Tsibizov: just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? Nobody. Our target for nearest future is Audigy/Audigy2 support. Yuriy Tsibizov, http://chibis.persons.gfk.ru/audigy/ Your page says: 0. It works for SB Live! and Audigy. Not for Audigy2. and MIDI is on the TODO-list So, guess there is still some hope for SB Live! MIDI in the not-so-near future. :) Or are the differences between an EMU10K2 (as seen in the dmesg, I guess Audigy?) and EMU10K1 that big? Regards, Julian Stecklina signature.asc Description: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil
RE: MIDI on SB Live! ?
From: Julian St. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 3:26 PM just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? Nobody. Our target for nearest future is Audigy/Audigy2 support. Your page says: 0. It works for SB Live! and Audigy. Not for Audigy2. and MIDI is on the TODO-list Yes, MIDI I/O is in my TODO list, but I'm not working on it now. So, guess there is still some hope for SB Live! MIDI in the not-so-near future. :) I can't promise that I start to code MIDI I/O in nearest future Mostly because I don't need it. I don't have any MIDI device at home or at work. Or are the differences between an EMU10K2 (as seen in the dmesg, I guess Audigy?) and EMU10K1 that big? EMU10K2=Audigy MIDI I/O should be almost the same between EMU10Kx cards... But I don't have any MIDI devices (other than AudigyDrive remote control, it should act as a MIDI controller on second MIDI port, AFAIK) to check it. Yuriy To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
RE: MIDI on SB Live! ?
Am Mo, 2003-03-24 um 14.02 schrieb Yuriy Tsibizov: MIDI I/O should be almost the same between EMU10Kx cards... But I don't have any MIDI devices (other than AudigyDrive remote control, it should act as a MIDI controller on second MIDI port, AFAIK) to check it. I have several devices to test it on. :) Perhaps until then I have learned enough (sound) driver hacking that I could adapt (with the help of some hardware documentation) your EMU10K2 MIDI code to EMU10K1 boards. It is a bit hard to get started though. Regards, Julian Stecklina signature.asc Description: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil
Need ALSA [was: Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? Regards, Julian Stecklina Having a port of ALSA would sure round out 5.2 nicely, and would get you MIDI support: http://www.alsa-project.org/ This can easily happen if we get behind a developer. ALSA has been sponsored by SuSE for the benefit of Linux, and there's no reason we can't pull together our resources to do the same for our OS. I'm sure someone will step forward to do the port if we have the cash for them to comfortably sit in front of their computer until the port is complete. I'd certainly be more than willing to throw some money into a paypal account or whatever, and I think there are others who would too. OSS is so 20th century, lets get FreeBSD into 21st century sound architecture design. :-) If you're a developer seriously interested in this, lets talk. So much of FreeBSD development is sponsored by Universities and whatnot that we take it for granted. When stuff like ALSA doesn't get ported right away, I feel we need to realize our responsibility to contribute to the project as well. Sincerely, Pete... To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
RE: Need ALSA [was: Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?]
Hello, Having a port of ALSA would sure round out 5.2 nicely, and would get you MIDI support: http://www.alsa-project.org/ Quote from this page: Known bugs - MIDI on SB live drive not working properly. Seems MIDI is not a great priority anymore. But I would certainly greet a new sound architecture. Broken MIDI is at least better than no MIDI. ;) [porting] I'd certainly be more than willing to throw some money into a paypal account or whatever, and I think there are others who would too. OSS is so 20th century, lets get FreeBSD into 21st century sound architecture design. :-) I would have no objections. If you're a developer seriously interested in this, lets talk. So much of FreeBSD development is sponsored by Universities and whatnot that we take it for granted. When stuff like ALSA doesn't get ported right away, I feel we need to realize our responsibility to contribute to the project as well. Uh... Ok, I have C experience, but my insight into FreeBSD and sound card programming (I remember some experiments with soundblasters in DOS times) is quite limited. Regards, Julian Stecklina To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: Need ALSA [was: Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?]
On Saturday 22 March 2003 14:52, Peter Schultz wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? Regards, Julian Stecklina Having a port of ALSA would sure round out 5.2 nicely, and would get you MIDI support: http://www.alsa-project.org/ I think you wouldn't really do anyone a favour, including the ALSA folks, if you went and made a port right now. The ALSA project is still not at 1.00 status and still quite in-flux. This can easily happen if we get behind a developer. ALSA has been sponsored by SuSE for the benefit of Linux, and there's no reason we can't pull together our resources to do the same for our OS. I'm sure someone will step forward to do the port if we have the cash for them to comfortably sit in front of their computer until the port is complete. I'd appreciate sponsoring somebody to work on our existing newpcm stuff and add the missing bits and pieces much more. Donating hardware (soundcards and MIDI-devices) would probably help very much already. -- Regards, Michael Nottebrock pgp0.pgp Description: signature
Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?
On Friday 21 March 2003 21:01, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? On and off, as far as I can tell. If you want MIDI right now, take a look at what 4Front Technologies offers in their commercial OSS package. -- Regards, Michael Nottebrock pgp0.pgp Description: signature
Re: Need ALSA [was: Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?]
Michael Nottebrock wrote: On Saturday 22 March 2003 14:52, Peter Schultz wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? Regards, Julian Stecklina Having a port of ALSA would sure round out 5.2 nicely, and would get you MIDI support: http://www.alsa-project.org/ I think you wouldn't really do anyone a favour, including the ALSA folks, if you went and made a port right now. The ALSA project is still not at 1.00 status and still quite in-flux. One could go either way with this. Leave it for after 1.0, or grab it now and help build it up for a better 2.0. Or I guess we could initiate the ABSDSA and have support for both ALSA and OSS. Wouldn't this be even more work though? This can easily happen if we get behind a developer. ALSA has been sponsored by SuSE for the benefit of Linux, and there's no reason we can't pull together our resources to do the same for our OS. I'm sure someone will step forward to do the port if we have the cash for them to comfortably sit in front of their computer until the port is complete. I'd appreciate sponsoring somebody to work on our existing newpcm stuff and add the missing bits and pieces much more. Donating hardware (soundcards and MIDI-devices) would probably help very much already. OSS is on the outs. New applications that are ALSA only will soon be common, won't they? Newpcm is what, five years old? Whatever it is, it ain't new anymore. Of course, maybe I'm completely mistaken about the whole situation and all newpcm needs is a boost. What is the right answer? Does OS X have a completely proprietary sound arch? It would be nice to be able to work with what they've got too. Pete... To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: Need ALSA [was: Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?]
Having a port of ALSA would sure round out 5.2 nicely, and would get you MIDI support: http://www.alsa-project.org/ I think you wouldn't really do anyone a favour, including the ALSA folks, if you went and made a port right now. The ALSA project is still not at 1.00 status and still quite in-flux. One could go either way with this. Leave it for after 1.0, or grab it now and help build it up for a better 2.0. Or I guess we could initiate the ABSDSA and have support for both ALSA and OSS. Wouldn't this be even more work though? porting alsa would gain very little and be a huge regression. This can easily happen if we get behind a developer. ALSA has been sponsored by SuSE for the benefit of Linux, and there's no reason we can't pull together our resources to do the same for our OS. I'm sure someone will step forward to do the port if we have the cash for them to comfortably sit in front of their computer until the port is complete. I'd appreciate sponsoring somebody to work on our existing newpcm stuff and add the missing bits and pieces much more. Donating hardware (soundcards and MIDI-devices) would probably help very much already. OSS is on the outs. New applications that are ALSA only will soon be common, won't they? Newpcm is what, five years old? Whatever it is, it ain't new anymore. Of course, maybe I'm completely mistaken about the whole situation and all newpcm needs is a boost. you are completely mistaken. first, let me correct some of the factual inaccuracies that you are propounding: * newpcm is not even 4 years old yet. * alsa is in no way desireable- it is not a device abstraction system. every app must do userland resampling to play, say 44.1khz sound on a 48khz only chipset. given that it does not provide hardware abstraction, alsa's kernel components are far too complex. * alsa drivers are difficult to write- compare one to its corresponding newpcm driver. * newpcm has a much more advanced architecture than alsa, and is entirely different than oss. the fact that newpcm's dsp and mixer layers implement the oss api is incidental. newpcm v2, which may gain a better name, is under development. i originally hoped to have it ready for 5.0, but very poor health over the last year prevented this. instead, it will be targetted at 6.0 and probably backported to ~5.3+ once feature complete and demonstrably stable. i will not elaborate here on the features planned for v2, but replacing the api is one of them, although oss compatibility will be provided. there are a few people out there who know the plans, but they all know that i want them kept under wraps for now. with only two main developers, you should not expect v2 to be committed much before the end of this year. additional manpower would help, but don't volunteer if i'm going to have to spend time teaching you c, the kernel, kobj or the current design of newpcm. someone well versed in dsp techniques and acquainted with the mathematics of accoustics would be very helpful. money and/or hardware would be nice, but i at least am limited in speed by my body and nothing short of a few million dollars is likely to change that. the single greatest incentive to continue that the community could provide is to refrain from suggesting that newpcm be scrapped or replaced, especially by proponents who are not willing to do the code themselves, do not have a replacement working prior to their proposal, and/or have little to zero knowledge of sound hardware and the requirements of a top-flight audio infrastructure. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: Need ALSA [was: Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?]
Peter Schultz wrote: Michael Nottebrock wrote: On Saturday 22 March 2003 14:52, Peter Schultz wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? Regards, Julian Stecklina Having a port of ALSA would sure round out 5.2 nicely, and would get you MIDI support: http://www.alsa-project.org/ I think you wouldn't really do anyone a favour, including the ALSA folks, if you went and made a port right now. The ALSA project is still not at 1.00 status and still quite in-flux. One could go either way with this. Leave it for after 1.0, or grab it now and help build it up for a better 2.0. Or I guess we could initiate the ABSDSA and have support for both ALSA and OSS. Wouldn't this be even more work though? This can easily happen if we get behind a developer. ALSA has been sponsored by SuSE for the benefit of Linux, and there's no reason we can't pull together our resources to do the same for our OS. I'm sure someone will step forward to do the port if we have the cash for them to comfortably sit in front of their computer until the port is complete. I'd appreciate sponsoring somebody to work on our existing newpcm stuff and add the missing bits and pieces much more. Donating hardware (soundcards and MIDI-devices) would probably help very much already. OSS is on the outs. New applications that are ALSA only will soon be common, won't they? Alsa is condemned to driver + some silly user space daemon with naive signal filter anyway. So no problem here. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: Need ALSA [was: Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?]
On Saturday 22 March 2003 16:15, Peter Schultz wrote: OSS is on the outs. New applications that are ALSA only will soon be common, won't they? No. In fact, there is quite an explosion in multimedia middleware projects right now and people are having heated discussions in other places which one is the most promising. :) Don't expect many audio apps in the future to be talking directly to some API exported by a kernel. -- Regards, Michael Nottebrock pgp0.pgp Description: signature
Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?
On Mar 22, Michael Nottebrock wrote: On Friday 21 March 2003 21:01, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? On and off, as far as I can tell. If you want MIDI right now, take a look at what 4Front Technologies offers in their commercial OSS package. Hello Micheal and all, (this is reply targeted at the thread) In not sure about 4front compatability with -current. ALSA would require a complete rewrite to work for multiple platforms because they are intimate with the linux pci interface. IMHO, it would require a fork of their project. MIDI in FreeBSD is highly hackable. It took me only a couple of days to get midi working for an es173x, a made a small web page a few months ago, it was for 5.0-dp2 but would probably work with 5.0-R. As it is, midi can be a kld and all that is required for a particular card is basic IO. The emu10k should be easier than most because we already have code for a generic mpu401. Here are some web links, http://www.cnd.mcgill.ca/~mat/es137xmidi.html (my small es137x midi page, mostly derived from other sources) Nice references for midi hacking: from NetBSD (it's .se.netbsd because .netbsd seems to be down) http://cvsweb.se.netbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/src/sys/dev/midi.c http://cvsweb.se.netbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/src/sys/dev/midisyn.c http://cvsweb.se.netbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/src/sys/dev/sequencer.c http://cvsweb.se.netbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/src/sys/dev/pci/esa.c http://cvsweb.se.netbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/src/sys/dev/pci/emuxki.c (oops, no midi for emu on netbsd) from ALSA: http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/alsa/alsa-kernel/drivers/mpu401/ http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/alsa/alsa-kernel/pci/ http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/alsa/alsa-kernel/pci/emu10k1/ After all of this, the reality is, very few people care about midi for freebsd and it has been neglected for along time. We're lucky that the work done long ago still works. --Mat -- Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? Pinky: I think so Brain, but pants with horizontal stripes make me look chubby. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: MIDI on SB Live! ?
Hello, no luck here either: http://www.opensound.com/readme/README.SBLive.html - o EMU Wavetable MIDI synthesizer not yet supported The only thing that is (partially) working seems to be ALSA. Regards, Julian On 22-Mar-2003 Michael Nottebrock wrote: On Friday 21 March 2003 21:01, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? On and off, as far as I can tell. If you want MIDI right now, take a look at what 4Front Technologies offers in their commercial OSS package. -- Regards, Michael Nottebrock To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
MIDI on SB Live! ?
Hello, just out of curiosity: Is someone working in MIDI support for Creative EMU10K1 based sound cards (aka Soundblaster Live!) ? Regards, Julian Stecklina To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
