Re: is it possible to install freebsd on tablet?

2012-07-28 Thread Matthias Apitz
El día Tuesday, July 24, 2012 a las 07:23:03AM -0500, Robert Bonomi escribió:

 
  From: Mr U mru...@yahoo.com
  Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2012 04:34:14 -0700 (PDT)
  Subject: is it possible to install freebsd on tablet?
 
  hi
 
  I have a question, is it possible to install freebsd (or netbsd) on an 
  android tablet?
 
 Authoritative answer:
   Theoetically poszible? yes.
Realistically doable? Maybe.
 
 And it's a _big_ maybe.
 
 It depends on the -exact- hardware details of the tablet device in question.
 
 If the particular make/model of tablet is not explicitly listed in the
 'supported hardware' list ffor the vesion of FreeBSD that you are consideing,
 then it will take a -lot- of research to deteming whether FreeBSD will
 run without modification on that device.
 ...

I would be better to spent such efforts in porting FreeBSD to an open
device, and not to such propriety beast; there have been steps in the
past to port to Openmoko Freerunner:

http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FreeBSD

I'm using such a mobile as my one and only daily cell phone, but it
still runs a Linux distribution, SHR

http://www.shr-project.org/trac/wiki

matthias
-- 
Matthias Apitz
t +49-89-61308 351 - f +49-89-61308 399 - m +49-170-4527211
e g...@unixarea.de - w http://www.unixarea.de/
UNIX since V7 on PDP-11 | UNIX on mainframe since ESER 1055 (IBM /370)
UNIX on x86 since SVR4.2 UnixWare 2.1.2 | FreeBSD since 2.2.5
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FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Vladimir Videscu
Good day. I have recently bought a Seagate Momentus XT for my laptop.

The specs for the drive are :

RPM : 7200
Buffer : 32 MB
HDD Memory : 750 GB
SSD Memory : 8 GB


I wish to install FreeBSD on it, but I wanted to ask this beforehand :

Would it would be possible to install it on the 8 GB SSD sector ?
Would it work, and how would FreeBSD generally handle the SSD share of the
memory ?

Thank you, V.
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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Erich Dollansky
Hi,

On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 12:44:35 +0300
Vladimir Videscu vladimir.vide...@gmail.com wrote:

 Good day. I have recently bought a Seagate Momentus XT for my laptop.
 
 The specs for the drive are :
 
 RPM : 7200
 Buffer : 32 MB
 HDD Memory : 750 GB
 SSD Memory : 8 GB
 
 
 I wish to install FreeBSD on it, but I wanted to ask this beforehand :
 
 Would it would be possible to install it on the 8 GB SSD sector ?
 Would it work, and how would FreeBSD generally handle the SSD share
 of the memory ?
 
isn't the SSD part 100% hidden? Doesn't the SSD work as a plain read
cache for the disk?

Erich
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bsdinstall to jail aborted (9.0-RELEASE-p3, amd64)

2012-07-28 Thread Matthias Petermann
Hello,

currently I experienced an unexpected behavior of the FreeBSD bsdinstall 
installer. Some weeks ago I could use it sucessfully to create a jail 
environment with

# bsdinstall jail /jails/myjail

Today I tried to repeat this on another system(2) and it fails after the 
selection of the to-be-used mirror. Also re-trying it on the original system(1) 
leads to an error but a different one. Since then I upgraded from 9.0-RELEASE 
to 9.0-RELEASE-p3 using freebsd-update.

Here are the symptoms:

(2) FreeBSD 9.0-RELEASE-p3 amd64: After typing bsdinstall... it brings me 
directly to the mirror selection list, but after selecting a mirror it aborts 
with an error message An installation step has beeen aborted. Would you like 
to restart the installer or exit the installer?

(1) FreeBSD 9.0-RELEASE-p3 i386: After typing bsdinstall... it brings me to 
the distribution select dialog. After selection of the distribution set, it 
shows the mirror selection dialog. After selecting a mirror it aborts with a 
fetch error Error while fetching /base.txz: Invalid URL scheme

I tried different mirrors, too. And they all seem to be basically online - 
pointing an FTP client to them showed no errors.

So what am I doing wrong? Does bsdinstall maintain some hidden configuration 
file which may influence its behavior? The environment variables mentioned in 
bsdinstall(8) are not set on both systems. Or is there a known issue with 
9.0-RELEASE-p3 which appears different on amd64 and i386 systems?

It would be great if anyone could validate this. 

Kind regards,
Matthias


-- 
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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Damien Fleuriot

On 28 Jul 2012, at 11:58, Erich Dollansky erichfreebsdl...@ovitrap.com wrote:

 Hi,
 
 On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 12:44:35 +0300
 Vladimir Videscu vladimir.vide...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 Good day. I have recently bought a Seagate Momentus XT for my laptop.
 
 The specs for the drive are :
 
 RPM : 7200
 Buffer : 32 MB
 HDD Memory : 750 GB
 SSD Memory : 8 GB
 
 
 I wish to install FreeBSD on it, but I wanted to ask this beforehand :
 
 Would it would be possible to install it on the 8 GB SSD sector ?
 Would it work, and how would FreeBSD generally handle the SSD share
 of the memory ?
 
 isn't the SSD part 100% hidden? Doesn't the SSD work as a plain read
 cache for the disk?
 
 Erich
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Vladimir,


Erich has the right of it.

You have not bought a real SSD but rather a hdd with built-in SSD-backed cache.

I don't think there is a way for you to install the OS specifically to the SSD 
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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Polytropon
On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 12:44:35 +0300, Vladimir Videscu wrote:
 Good day. I have recently bought a Seagate Momentus XT for my laptop.
 
 The specs for the drive are :
 
 RPM : 7200
 Buffer : 32 MB
 HDD Memory : 750 GB
 SSD Memory : 8 GB
 
 
 I wish to install FreeBSD on it, but I wanted to ask this beforehand :
 
 Would it would be possible to install it on the 8 GB SSD sector ?
 Would it work, and how would FreeBSD generally handle the SSD share of the
 memory ?

I think you're misunderstanding what this drive basically is.
According to what I read from Seagate's web page, it is _not_
a combination of a HDD and a SSD where each part can be
addressed _independently_. The SSD component seems to
function as a kind of read cache, but it is controlled
by the disk unit's firmware itself. (I'm not even sure
it works without software drivers, judging by the funny
little pictures...)

http://www.seagate.com/internal-hard-drives/laptop-hard-drives/momentus-xt-hybrid/

http://www.seagate.com/internal-hard-drives/laptop-hard-drives/momentus-xt-hybrid/specs/

(manual see 3.2.2)

You could easily test it by attaching the drive to a FreeBSD
system and see if _one_ or _two_ disk devices (ad or ada)
appear.

If I'm wrong and it should really be two units in one, your
idea would work. Install FreeBSD to the SSD part and apply the
known optimizations. Make use of the HDD part for OS components
that need much writes to prevent wearing the SSD.



-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: bsdinstall to jail aborted (9.0-RELEASE-p3, amd64)

2012-07-28 Thread Darren Baginski


28.07.2012, 13:46, Matthias Petermann matth...@d2ux.net:
 Hello,

 currently I experienced an unexpected behavior of the FreeBSD bsdinstall 
 installer. Some weeks ago I could use it sucessfully to create a jail 
 environment with

 # bsdinstall jail /jails/myjail

 Today I tried to repeat this on another system(2) and it fails after the 
 selection of the to-be-used mirror. Also re-trying it on the original 
 system(1) leads to an error but a different one. Since then I upgraded from 
 9.0-RELEASE to 9.0-RELEASE-p3 using freebsd-update.

 Here are the symptoms:

 (2) FreeBSD 9.0-RELEASE-p3 amd64: After typing bsdinstall... it brings me 
 directly to the mirror selection list, but after selecting a mirror it aborts 
 with an error message An installation step has beeen aborted. Would you like 
 to restart the installer or exit the installer?

 (1) FreeBSD 9.0-RELEASE-p3 i386: After typing bsdinstall... it brings me to 
 the distribution select dialog. After selection of the distribution set, it 
 shows the mirror selection dialog. After selecting a mirror it aborts with a 
 fetch error Error while fetching /base.txz: Invalid URL scheme

 I tried different mirrors, too. And they all seem to be basically online - 
 pointing an FTP client to them showed no errors.

 So what am I doing wrong? Does bsdinstall maintain some hidden configuration 
 file which may influence its behavior? The environment variables mentioned in 
 bsdinstall(8) are not set on both systems. Or is there a known issue with 
 9.0-RELEASE-p3 which appears different on amd64 and i386 systems?

 It would be great if anyone could validate this.

I did a quick test on 9.1-PRERELEASE,  ant bsdinstall trying to fetch 
9.1-PRERELEASE files, which it surely can't find.
There must be an option like 'TARGET' to specify exact version to fetch like 
it's the case for Debian debootsrap.


 Kind regards,
 Matthias

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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Wojciech Puchar

HDD Memory : 750 GB
SSD Memory : 8 GB


I wish to install FreeBSD on it, but I wanted to ask this beforehand :

Would it would be possible to install it on the 8 GB SSD sector ?


no idea how seagate momentus XT work.
AFAIK it tries to automatically move often used things to flash. so 
install normally.





Would it work, and how would FreeBSD generally handle the SSD share of the
memory ?

Thank you, V.
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Re: On-access AV scanning

2012-07-28 Thread Wojciech Puchar


His problem is that there's a corporate reglementation
of what he has to do, which he needs to obey in order to

the only cure for such case is changing a job.

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Re: bsdinstall to jail aborted (9.0-RELEASE-p3, amd64)

2012-07-28 Thread Darren Baginski


28.07.2012, 17:13, Darren Baginski kick...@yandex.com:
 28.07.2012, 13:46, Matthias Petermann matth...@d2ux.net:

  Hello,

  currently I experienced an unexpected behavior of the FreeBSD bsdinstall 
 installer. Some weeks ago I could use it sucessfully to create a jail 
 environment with

  # bsdinstall jail /jails/myjail

  Today I tried to repeat this on another system(2) and it fails after the 
 selection of the to-be-used mirror. Also re-trying it on the original 
 system(1) leads to an error but a different one. Since then I upgraded from 
 9.0-RELEASE to 9.0-RELEASE-p3 using freebsd-update.

  Here are the symptoms:

  (2) FreeBSD 9.0-RELEASE-p3 amd64: After typing bsdinstall... it brings me 
 directly to the mirror selection list, but after selecting a mirror it 
 aborts with an error message An installation step has beeen aborted. Would 
 you like to restart the installer or exit the installer?

  (1) FreeBSD 9.0-RELEASE-p3 i386: After typing bsdinstall... it brings me 
 to the distribution select dialog. After selection of the distribution set, 
 it shows the mirror selection dialog. After selecting a mirror it aborts 
 with a fetch error Error while fetching /base.txz: Invalid URL scheme

  I tried different mirrors, too. And they all seem to be basically online - 
 pointing an FTP client to them showed no errors.

  So what am I doing wrong? Does bsdinstall maintain some hidden 
 configuration file which may influence its behavior? The environment 
 variables mentioned in bsdinstall(8) are not set on both systems. Or is 
 there a known issue with 9.0-RELEASE-p3 which appears different on amd64 and 
 i386 systems?

  It would be great if anyone could validate this.

 I did a quick test on 9.1-PRERELEASE,  ant bsdinstall trying to fetch 
 9.1-PRERELEASE files, which it surely can't find.
 There must be an option like 'TARGET' to specify exact version to fetch like 
 it's the case for Debian debootsrap.


What I did next is:

#diff -u mirrorselect.orig mirrorselect
--- mirrorselect.orig   2012-07-28 12:55:33.0 +
+++ mirrorselect2012-07-28 12:58:49.0 +
@@ -192,7 +192,7 @@
 MIRROR_BUTTON=$?
 exec 3-
 
-BSDINSTALL_DISTSITE=$MIRROR/pub/FreeBSD/releases/`uname -m`/`uname -p`/`uname 
-r`
+BSDINSTALL_DISTSITE=$MIRROR/pub/FreeBSD/releases/`uname -m`/`uname 
-p`/$TARGET
 
 case $MIRROR_BUTTON in
 $DIALOG_CANCEL)

and then:
#export TARGET=9.0-RELEASE
and again
#bsdinstall jail  /tmp/tstenv

Got a working environment after that.
I thing release/arch selection has to be a part of the installer, either 
directly or via environment variables.


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Re: On-access AV scanning

2012-07-28 Thread Matthew Seaman
On 28/07/2012 11:32, Wojciech Puchar wrote:

 His problem is that there's a corporate reglementation
 of what he has to do, which he needs to obey in order to

 the only cure for such case is changing a job.

A little drastic perhaps?  Company policies can be changed[*].

Cheers,

Matthew

[*] It's important that the workers believe this.  It helps keep them in
line.

-- 
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey




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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Wojciech Puchar

by the disk unit's firmware itself. (I'm not even sure
it works without software drivers, judging by the funny
little pictures...)

yes it works without any drivers other than standard SATA driver.

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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Виталий Туровец
2012/7/28 Wojciech Puchar woj...@wojtek.tensor.gdynia.pl:
 HDD Memory : 750 GB
 SSD Memory : 8 GB


 I wish to install FreeBSD on it, but I wanted to ask this beforehand :

 Would it would be possible to install it on the 8 GB SSD sector ?


 no idea how seagate momentus XT work.
 AFAIK it tries to automatically move often used things to flash. so
 install normally.




 Would it work, and how would FreeBSD generally handle the SSD share of the
 memory ?

 Thank you, V.
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I have exactly the same drive in my laptop, Seagate Momentus XT 750GB,
with dualboot FreeBSD/Window$ installed on it using MBR and BSD
slices. The installation of FreeBSD was exactly the same as anywhere
else :) As it was said here, Momentus' Adaptive Memory technology uses
SSD as read cache, that's all. The OS doesn't even guess that these
8GBs of SSD are present somewhere :)


-- 




~~~
WBR,
Vitaliy Turovets
Systems Administrator
Corebug.Net
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Re: On-access AV scanning

2012-07-28 Thread Wojciech Puchar



the only cure for such case is changing a job.


A little drastic perhaps?  Company policies can be changed[*].


depends on the company. But i assumed attempt to point out nonsense of 
such policy were already done.



[*] It's important that the workers believe this.  It helps keep them in
line.

true and proven.


but my point was that if policy is just nonsense (requirement of virus 
protection in spite of using virus-incapable OS) and still enforced in 
spite of this then



No matter if it is 5 users of 80 users (largest i have to control in one 
place) then the policy should be think what you are doing, and do your 
work at work, not your toys.


Believe me that having 2-3 virus problems per year, with no spreading, 
WITH WINDOWS USERS, and windows workstations running few years without 
touching is possible.


It's simple, but off topic to explain in details.


PS make in every shared (used by many people) samba share a directory 
Autorun.inf, owned by root with access rights of 700.

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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Vladimir Videscu
Hello again everyone.

First of all, I want to address a thank you for your responses. They have
been unexpectedly numerous and have clarified some aspects of my inquiries.

The read-cache idea is very sound, mainly because by using it this way
Seagate would not have to create a special set of instructions for
installing and using the HDD.

My final question would be :

Seeing as the HDD only has a SATA connector, this would mean that the SSD
part already has a memory control device that regulates access to that
sector, whether it is a plain read-cache or not. This would imply that
FreeBSD could communicate with the HDD normally, through the SATA
connector, just like any regular HDD.

Based on that sequence of thought, and the fact that on the System
Requirements page of FreeBSD it says :
*
   *   *4.4.1.* What kind of hard drives does FreeBSD support?
 FreeBSD supports EIDE, SATA [...],

am I right to assume that there should be no incompatibility or conflict
between the OS and the  drive ?

Thank you in advance, V.
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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Polytropon
On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 20:19:25 +0300, Vladimir Videscu wrote:
 Seeing as the HDD only has a SATA connector, this would mean that the SSD
 part already has a memory control device that regulates access to that
 sector, whether it is a plain read-cache or not. This would imply that
 FreeBSD could communicate with the HDD normally, through the SATA
 connector, just like any regular HDD.
 
 Based on that sequence of thought, and the fact that on the System
 Requirements page of FreeBSD it says :
 *
*   *4.4.1.* What kind of hard drives does FreeBSD support?
  FreeBSD supports EIDE, SATA [...],
 
 am I right to assume that there should be no incompatibility or conflict
 between the OS and the  drive ?

I don't think you'll experience any problems. According to the
documentation on the Seagate web page (which I mentioned in my
previous message), the drive talks to the system like any
other SATA drive. The fact that it uses an internally controlled
SSD for caching (including management of that disk by the disk's
firmware!) does not make any difference to the operating system.
Even the 512/4k sectoring would be no problem.

You're going to install FreeBSD as on any other hard disk. You
will then (hopefully) see a speed gain when in use. :-)



-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Wojciech Puchar


You're going to install FreeBSD as on any other hard disk. You
will then (hopefully) see a speed gain when in use. :-)

make sure noatime option is used in /etc/fstab

i use it everywhere, but with SSD cached disks it may be even more 
important. No idea what is that drive caching strategy, but if cache on 
read then it will continuously evict cached inodes.

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Re: FreeBSD on SSD

2012-07-28 Thread Wojciech Puchar

The read-cache idea is very sound, mainly because by using it this way Seagate 
would not have to create a special set of
instructions for installing and using the HDD.


I don't think that this drive cache is smart enough to really cache needed 
things and not flush that cache with useless data too often.


i personally would prefer that drive to show up as 8GB disk and 750 GB 
disk.


It would be easy to fit most of /usr in 8GB with even large set of 
software installed.


when out of space then use softlinks and move not very used things (eg. 
documentation, non-yours locales, examples, some linarly accessed big 
files etc.) to disk.



My final question would be :

Seeing as the HDD only has a SATA connector, this would mean that the SSD part 
already has a memory control device that regulates
access to that sector, whether it is a plain read-cache or not. This would 
imply that FreeBSD could communicate with the HDD
normally, through the SATA connector, just like any regular HDD.


indeed.

Such a drive is a good idea, but complete lack of documentation (how it 
operate) is not.


You have to guess how this SSD-cache works because it is not documented.

the other thing is erasing data. You want to sell that drive and clear 
your data by


dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/disk bs=1m

but does it clear SSD cache? i don't think so. Someone sophisticated 
enough would perform raw read of cache chips and get cached data, which 
can actually be the most important part (things you work on often).

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Waking system up from suspend-to-ram at specified time.

2012-07-28 Thread Piotr Czachur
Dear users,

Does FreeBSD support waking system up from S3 (suspend to RAM) state
at specified time? On Linux, it can be achieved using rtcwake command
that uses RTC support in kernel.

If it's not supported, maybe I can somehow enable waking from S3 using
BIOS autoresume option? It powers my box on from complete off, but
fails to wake it up from S3. What works for now is waking from S3
using Wake-on-LAN.

Cheers,
Piotrek
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acroread9 makes CPU spin (busy loop?)

2012-07-28 Thread Jens Schweikhardt
hello, world\n

I'm wondering if it's just here or if other people also observe that
acroread9 makes the CPU spin at 100% (one load point), as if in a busy
loop. This happens for me on 9-STABLE and 10-CURRENT alike (amd64), with
up-to-date ports tree. It has done this as long as I can remember. Maybe
there's something wrong with the way I compile my system and custom
kernel, and if so, I'd like to get to the bottom of it. The only
diagnostics I get are

   (process:33229): Gtk-WARNING **: Locale not supported by C library.
Using the fallback 'C' locale.

and dmesg says

   linux: pid 33229 (acroread): syscall inotify_init not implemented

Anybody know what's causing acroread to spin?

Regards,

Jens
-- 
Jens Schweikhardt http://www.schweikhardt.net/
SIGSIG -- signature too long (core dumped)
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Re: bsdinstall to jail aborted (9.0-RELEASE-p3, amd64)

2012-07-28 Thread Matthias Petermann
Hi Darren,

thanks for diving into the issue. I looked through the mentioned places in the 
bsdinstall code and understand it now. 

On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 17:24:48 +0400
Darren Baginski kick...@yandex.com wrote:
 I thing release/arch selection has to be a part of the installer, either 
 directly or via environment variables.

Yes, I think so too. I guess there usually no FTP directories created for patch 
level releases like 9.0-RELEASE-p3? Your proposal to introduce a new 
environment variable like TARGET makes sense. This could work like an override 
- when it is not set it can fall back to the default (using uname -r which 
makes sense for the installation media).

Should I file a PR or did you already?

Thanks,
Matthias

-- 
Matthias Petermann matth...@d2ux.net
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Re: acroread9 makes CPU spin (busy loop?)

2012-07-28 Thread Polytropon
On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 22:17:37 +0200, Jens Schweikhardt wrote:
 hello, world\n
 
 I'm wondering if it's just here or if other people also observe that
 acroread9 makes the CPU spin at 100% (one load point), as if in a busy
 loop. This happens for me on 9-STABLE and 10-CURRENT alike (amd64), with
 up-to-date ports tree. It has done this as long as I can remember. Maybe
 there's something wrong with the way I compile my system and custom
 kernel, and if so, I'd like to get to the bottom of it. The only
 diagnostics I get are
 
(process:33229): Gtk-WARNING **: Locale not supported by C library.
 Using the fallback 'C' locale.

That seems to be a result of sloppy programming. That message
is also printed by many modern Gtk applications.



 and dmesg says
 
linux: pid 33229 (acroread): syscall inotify_init not implemented

Same here, also seems to refer to acroread accessing a Linux
kernel call which FreeBSD's ABI does not implement.



 Anybody know what's causing acroread to spin?

No idea, but I can conform this on my home system too. It's
OS version 8.2-STABLE (from August 2011) i386, and I have
acroread9-9.4.2 and acroreadwrapper-0.0.20110529 installed.
The program is still responsive (as far as you can say this
for bloated programs). In top, the WCPU value increases until
it reaches 100.00%, and CPU utilization monitor shows a bar.
When the program is closed, everything goes back to normal.






-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: acroread9 makes CPU spin (busy loop?)

2012-07-28 Thread Wojciech Puchar


I'm wondering if it's just here or if other people also observe that
acroread9 makes the CPU spin at 100% (one load point), as if in a busy
loop. This happens for me on 9-STABLE and 10-CURRENT alike (amd64), with


not me - i use xpdf. Free, open source, much faster.
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