Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice?
Hi all - Our company has a product such that a small server is installed at each customer site. This server dials up to the Internet every night and exchanges some content with a central server in our data center. Total transaction takes about 5 minutes. Customers can have multiple sites. Our largets to date has three, but some potentials have several hundred. In the cases where the site does not have an existing Internet connection we currently use dialup via a major ISP. This works for now, but won't for the long haul for a couple of reasons: - they all are all sharing the same username and password (yes yes, I know...) - we're moving into canada and this ISP doesn't have many local numbers up there. - Dealing with local numbers and their somewhat frequent changing is a real headache. What I want is a modem pool with one local number (tied into an 800 number) where I can create as many username/password pairs as needed. I want that local number to never change :-) Now... to make it fun... - No, I can't install a dialup server in our corporate datacenter. - No, I can't setup a freebsd server in satellite office. That leaves me with an outsourced solution that needs to work with FreeBSD's PPP. Anyone know of anyone that does this sort of thing? Or an ISP that has a service geared towards this (our current one does not). Thanks! -philip ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice?
On Thursday 09 June 2005 10:38, Philip Hallstrom wrote: > Hi all - > Our company has a product such that a small server is installed at > each customer site. This server dials up to the Internet every night and > exchanges some content with a central server in our data center. Total > transaction takes about 5 minutes. > > Customers can have multiple sites. Our largets to date has three, but > some potentials have several hundred. > > In the cases where the site does not have an existing Internet connection > we currently use dialup via a major ISP. > > This works for now, but won't for the long haul for a couple of reasons: > > - they all are all sharing the same username and password (yes yes, I > know...) > > - we're moving into canada and this ISP doesn't have many local numbers up > there. > > - Dealing with local numbers and their somewhat frequent changing is a > real headache. > > What I want is a modem pool with one local number (tied into an 800 > number) where I can create as many username/password pairs as needed. I > want that local number to never change :-) > > Now... to make it fun... > > - No, I can't install a dialup server in our corporate datacenter. > - No, I can't setup a freebsd server in satellite office. > > That leaves me with an outsourced solution that needs to work with > FreeBSD's PPP. > > Anyone know of anyone that does this sort of thing? Or an ISP that has a > service geared towards this (our current one does not). > > Thanks! > > -philip You may not like the price but the local phone company likely provides this service. -Mike ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice?
We can also provide this sort of thing for you, but it won't be anywhere near as cheap as the single ISP account you're using. We have to allow enough lines for simultaneous connections. The good news is that it is overnight, and you are correctly staggering the connections, then it might not be a problem, but if we have to purchase an additional PRI line to handle the need, then that cost would be passed along. Give me a call: 314-436-1700 On Thu, 9 Jun 2005, Michael C. Shultz wrote: On Thursday 09 June 2005 10:38, Philip Hallstrom wrote: Hi all - Our company has a product such that a small server is installed at each customer site. This server dials up to the Internet every night and exchanges some content with a central server in our data center. Total transaction takes about 5 minutes. Customers can have multiple sites. Our largets to date has three, but some potentials have several hundred. In the cases where the site does not have an existing Internet connection we currently use dialup via a major ISP. This works for now, but won't for the long haul for a couple of reasons: - they all are all sharing the same username and password (yes yes, I know...) - we're moving into canada and this ISP doesn't have many local numbers up there. - Dealing with local numbers and their somewhat frequent changing is a real headache. What I want is a modem pool with one local number (tied into an 800 number) where I can create as many username/password pairs as needed. I want that local number to never change :-) Now... to make it fun... - No, I can't install a dialup server in our corporate datacenter. - No, I can't setup a freebsd server in satellite office. That leaves me with an outsourced solution that needs to work with FreeBSD's PPP. Anyone know of anyone that does this sort of thing? Or an ISP that has a service geared towards this (our current one does not). Thanks! -philip You may not like the price but the local phone company likely provides this service. -Mike ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice?
On June 9, 2005 03:20 pm, Tony Shadwick wrote: > We can also provide this sort of thing for you, but it won't be anywhere > near as cheap as the single ISP account you're using. We have to allow > enough lines for simultaneous connections. The good news is that it is > overnight, and you are correctly staggering the connections, then it might > not be a problem, but if we have to purchase an additional PRI line to > handle the need, then that cost would be passed along. > > Give me a call: 314-436-1700 I'm in Canada and looking for work (since the last company I worked for shrunk) and I would be willing to set up a dialup pool in Toronto for you with 800 service and whatever you want for cost plus a reasonable paycheck for myself. Of course, Tony would probably offer you a better price. If you are interested, e-mail me off list. Or, if anyone knows of available BSD/Solaris jobs let me know. Thanks. > On Thu, 9 Jun 2005, Michael C. Shultz wrote: > > On Thursday 09 June 2005 10:38, Philip Hallstrom wrote: > >> Hi all - > >>Our company has a product such that a small server is installed at > >> each customer site. This server dials up to the Internet every night > >> and exchanges some content with a central server in our data center. > >> Total transaction takes about 5 minutes. > >> > >> Customers can have multiple sites. Our largets to date has three, but > >> some potentials have several hundred. > >> > >> In the cases where the site does not have an existing Internet > >> connection we currently use dialup via a major ISP. > >> > >> This works for now, but won't for the long haul for a couple of reasons: > >> > >> - they all are all sharing the same username and password (yes yes, I > >> know...) > >> > >> - we're moving into canada and this ISP doesn't have many local numbers > >> up there. > >> > >> - Dealing with local numbers and their somewhat frequent changing is a > >> real headache. > >> > >> What I want is a modem pool with one local number (tied into an 800 > >> number) where I can create as many username/password pairs as needed. I > >> want that local number to never change :-) > >> > >> Now... to make it fun... > >> > >> - No, I can't install a dialup server in our corporate datacenter. > >> - No, I can't setup a freebsd server in satellite office. > >> > >> That leaves me with an outsourced solution that needs to work with > >> FreeBSD's PPP. > >> > >> Anyone know of anyone that does this sort of thing? Or an ISP that has > >> a service geared towards this (our current one does not). > >> > >> Thanks! > >> > >> -philip > > > > You may not like the price but the local phone company likely provides > > this service. > > > > -Mike > > ___ > > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > > "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > > ___ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" -- Ean Kingston E-Mail: ean AT hedron DOT org URL: http://www.hedron.org/ I am currently looking for work. If you need competent system/network administration please feel free to contact me directly. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
RE: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice?
>-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Philip >Hallstrom >Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2005 10:38 AM >To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org >Subject: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice? > > >Hi all - > Our company has a product such that a small server is >installed at >each customer site. This server dials up to the Internet every >night and >exchanges some content with a central server in our data center. Total >transaction takes about 5 minutes. > >Customers can have multiple sites. Our largets to date has three, but >some potentials have several hundred. > >In the cases where the site does not have an existing Internet >connection >we currently use dialup via a major ISP. > >This works for now, but won't for the long haul for a couple of reasons: > >- they all are all sharing the same username and password (yes yes, I >know...) > >- we're moving into canada and this ISP doesn't have many local >numbers up >there. > >- Dealing with local numbers and their somewhat frequent changing is a >real headache. > OK. Now then, am I assuming that if you go the 800 number route then that you will be billing the customers for the LD usage on that or are you going to eat it? >What I want is a modem pool with one local number (tied into an 800 >number) where I can create as many username/password pairs as >needed. I >want that local number to never change :-) > Totally unnecessary since your using an 800 number. If the local number changes you just repoint the 800 number to the new local number. The only drawback is if the site is in the same local calling area as the local number the 800 number is pointed to, if they call the 800 number you will still get charged LD. >Now... to make it fun... > >- No, I can't install a dialup server in our corporate datacenter. Why not? This is so calling out for you to run your own dialup server that it is unbelievable. >- No, I can't setup a freebsd server in satellite office. > >That leaves me with an outsourced solution that needs to work with >FreeBSD's PPP. > >Anyone know of anyone that does this sort of thing? Or an ISP >that has a >service geared towards this (our current one does not). > Most of the major telcos will do outsourced dialup. The problem is this: a) Unless you are handling the authentication, (like a real paper ISP would do) they are going to charge you for each individual account. I think the going rate is something like $5/month for a minimum of 50 accounts, or some such, plus LD costs, and that is what is going to kill you, because they will have to provision the 800 number, and they will certainly charge 15 or 20 cents a minute (we do) for the LD. b) If you do your own authentication you will need to run a couple radius servers, (very easy) which they will point to - but you will need to buy ports probably in blocks of 24 (since 24 is the minimum most outsourcers can point a single calling number to) Once again this is pretty spendy. The advantage of course is that you can run your own 800 number and get Sprint or someone to give you the usual 6 cents a minute LD rate. Please also note that since you are going the 800 number route, the dialup pool can be anywhere in North America as Canada calling LD charges are going to be so similar that your probably going to get a better LD rate if you combine all the calls under one plan, rather than going for a 800 number for customers located in the states, and an 800 number for customers located in canada. Frankly I think your really being business-stupid by ruling out a dialup server in your datacenter. If you program your remotes to call in under a staggered pattern rather than all of them at midnight, you can probably go to a ratio of 50-to-1 or even higher. If the data packet is small enough you probably could do all of them on a couple of POTS phone lines. All you need to do is pick up a used Portmaster, or Ascend Mux or even a Cisco AS2509 and hang external modems on it, setup your RADIUS servers, and your up and running. You could probably contract with a technician at whatever ISP your going to be using in Canada to set the entire thing up for you in 16 hours or so. Unless that is of course you cheap-out on your Canada ISP and get some large national ISP that doesen't know you from Adam. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
RE: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice?
> -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Philip Hallstrom > Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2005 1:38 PM > To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org > Subject: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice? > > Hi all - > Our company has a product such that a small server is > installed at each customer site. This server dials up to the > Internet every night and exchanges some content with a > central server in our data center. Total transaction takes > about 5 minutes. > > Customers can have multiple sites. Our largets to date has > three, but some potentials have several hundred. > > In the cases where the site does not have an existing > Internet connection we currently use dialup via a major ISP. > > This works for now, but won't for the long haul for a couple > of reasons: > > - they all are all sharing the same username and password (yes yes, I > know...) > > - we're moving into canada and this ISP doesn't have many > local numbers up there. > > - Dealing with local numbers and their somewhat frequent > changing is a real headache. > > What I want is a modem pool with one local number (tied into an 800 > number) where I can create as many username/password pairs as > needed. I want that local number to never change :-) > > Now... to make it fun... > > - No, I can't install a dialup server in our corporate datacenter. > - No, I can't setup a freebsd server in satellite office. > > That leaves me with an outsourced solution that needs to work > with FreeBSD's PPP. > > Anyone know of anyone that does this sort of thing? Or an > ISP that has a service geared towards this (our current one does not). Bell Canada can sell you *virtual* dial up ports, and provide you with a realm (@domain.com). They handle all the dial-up connections for you, and they handle all the bandwidth as well (on exception of the data that crosses into your data centre from the clients devices). All you need is a FBSD box running FreeRADIUS, as when the user dials in, they will only pass a RADIUS request to you, and your RADIUS server will allow/deny the login attempt. They have flexible plans as your needs grow. If you move, it still doesn't matter. Everything is on their end, on exception of your RADIUS server. So if you move, you inform them of the new IP for your RAD server, they redirect the requests for your realm to the new IP and voila, back in business again. So, technically, you can go cross border or wherever. The changes are minimal, and since you control the CPE equipment, you can prepare for changes in your data storage server (or cluster) IP address(es) on your client equipment any time. Saves you from having to handle changes, as well as takes the headache of managing RAS equipment off your shoulders. For instance, this is how AOL Canada provides country wide service, without having a single equipment room in the country. It's all virtually done, through the big Telco's, and the data simply flows via TCP/IP to their servers/equipment in the US. Steve > > Thanks! > > -philip > ___ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
RE: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice?
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Philip Hallstrom Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2005 10:38 AM To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice? Hi all - Our company has a product such that a small server is installed at each customer site. This server dials up to the Internet every night and exchanges some content with a central server in our data center. Total transaction takes about 5 minutes. Customers can have multiple sites. Our largets to date has three, but some potentials have several hundred. In the cases where the site does not have an existing Internet connection we currently use dialup via a major ISP. This works for now, but won't for the long haul for a couple of reasons: - they all are all sharing the same username and password (yes yes, I know...) - we're moving into canada and this ISP doesn't have many local numbers up there. - Dealing with local numbers and their somewhat frequent changing is a real headache. OK. Now then, am I assuming that if you go the 800 number route then that you will be billing the customers for the LD usage on that or are you going to eat it? What I want is a modem pool with one local number (tied into an 800 number) where I can create as many username/password pairs as needed. I want that local number to never change :-) Totally unnecessary since your using an 800 number. If the local number changes you just repoint the 800 number to the new local number. Mostly, but this way I can configure the local number first (1-xxx-xxx-) and then the 800 number so sites that allow long distance calls get billed for the call instead of us... saves a bit of money... Now... to make it fun... - No, I can't install a dialup server in our corporate datacenter. Why not? This is so calling out for you to run your own dialup server that it is unbelievable. Ah... I am glad I am not the only one who thinks that!!! :-) Believe me... I could write volumes on why this isn't going to happen. Well, it might, but only if I can show that outsourcing is going to cost zillions of dollars.. and that's not even getting to the paperwork process. I've tried before. 1.5 years later I haven't gotten any closer. - No, I can't setup a freebsd server in satellite office. That leaves me with an outsourced solution that needs to work with FreeBSD's PPP. Anyone know of anyone that does this sort of thing? Or an ISP that has a service geared towards this (our current one does not). Most of the major telcos will do outsourced dialup. The problem is this: [snip of solutions] The problem with these is they all require hardware to be placed somewhere... and if I was okay with that, I'd just put it in our office here so it's closer to me when it fails, but hte problem with that is our office loses power and it's just not designed for it. Frankly I think your really being business-stupid by ruling out a dialup server in your datacenter. Heh. I completely agree. I totally understand I'm going about this in the most inefficient way possible. *sigh* :-( If you program your remotes to call in under a staggered pattern rather than all of them at midnight, you can probably go to a ratio of 50-to-1 or even higher. If the data packet is small enough you probably could do all of them on a couple of POTS phone lines. Yep. We could. All you need to do is pick up a used Portmaster, or Ascend Mux or even a Cisco AS2509 and hang external modems on it, setup your RADIUS servers, and your up and running. Ah... and there's the trick :-) If I could do that, I would just do that and put it in corporate's data center :-) Thanks! -philip ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
RE: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice?
>-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Philip >Hallstrom >Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 9:58 AM >To: Ted Mittelstaedt >Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org >Subject: RE: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice? > > >>> -Original Message- >>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Philip >>> Hallstrom >>> Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2005 10:38 AM >>> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org >>> Subject: Outsourcing a modem pool for dialup? Any advice? >>> >>> >>> Hi all - >>> Our company has a product such that a small server is >installed at >>> each customer site. This server dials up to the Internet >every night >>> and exchanges some content with a central server in our data center. >>> Total transaction takes about 5 minutes. >>> >>> Customers can have multiple sites. Our largets to date has >three, but >>> some potentials have several hundred. >>> >>> In the cases where the site does not have an existing Internet >>> connection we currently use dialup via a major ISP. >>> >>> This works for now, but won't for the long haul for a couple of >>> reasons: >>> >>> - they all are all sharing the same username and password >(yes yes, I >>> know...) >>> >>> - we're moving into canada and this ISP doesn't have many >local numbers >>> up there. >>> >>> - Dealing with local numbers and their somewhat frequent >changing is a >>> real headache. >>> >> >> OK. Now then, am I assuming that if you go the 800 number route then >> that you will be billing the customers for the LD usage on >that or are >> you going to eat it? >> >>> What I want is a modem pool with one local number (tied into an 800 >>> number) where I can create as many username/password pairs >as needed. >>> I want that local number to never change :-) >>> >> >> Totally unnecessary since your using an 800 number. If the >local number >> changes you just repoint the 800 number to the new local number. > >Mostly, but this way I can configure the local number first >(1-xxx-xxx-) and then the 800 number so sites that allow >long distance >calls get billed for the call instead of us... saves a bit of money... > You cannot setup an 800 number to charge the caller. If you are thinking of using the 800 as a failover number in the config then you go right back the same problem, which is that if the outsourcer changes the phone number you are screwed. This is yet another reason for running your own pool. If you own your own local phone number it isn't going to change. >>> Now... to make it fun... >>> >>> - No, I can't install a dialup server in our corporate datacenter. >> >> Why not? This is so calling out for you to run your own >dialup server >> that it is unbelievable. > >Ah... I am glad I am not the only one who thinks that!!! :-) > >Believe me... I could write volumes on why this isn't going to happen. >Well, it might, but only if I can show that outsourcing is >going to cost >zillions of dollars.. and that's not even getting to the paperwork >process. I've tried before. 1.5 years later I haven't gotten >any closer. > Outsourcing will indeed cost a lot more than if you do it yourself. Not zillions, but certainly many thousands more a year if you pay someone to do it. My goodness, do your bosses think that the outsourcers do this for free, that there is some kind of economy of scale you take advantage of? Let me tell you a little secret - dialup outsourcers only sell their services to THREE types of customers. The first type are ISPs that are failures. The second type are ISP's that have their own modem pools in whatever service areas they are in, and are playing around with seeing if they can make money with national or expanded coverage. (very difficult for a small ISP without their own national network) The last type are corporations who either have too much money to waste, or have nobody competent working for them. In all 3 of these cases the customer isn't choosing outsourcing over doing it themselves, instead they are forced into outsourcing because no other choices are options for them. And the outsourcers know it and if your given a captive market, aren't you going to bleed them dry? Virtually everyone else in the business, if they have an option of running their own modem pool, either because they have the money, or because they have the competence, they
