Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-30 Thread David O'Brien
On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 11:03:17AM +0100, Bob Bishop wrote:
 Yes. You to have a statically linked /rescue/sh on board, so what's the
 point of /bin/sh being dynamic?

While you and I agree on this, the primary reason we went with a
dynamically linked root was for PAM and NSS support -- which are
dlopen'ed.  And thus requires using a shared libc.

-- 
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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-28 Thread Bob Bishop
Hi,

On 28 Apr 2012, at 04:12, David O'Brien wrote:

 On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:38:03PM +0100, Bob Bishop wrote:
 Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. /bin/sh
 is dynamically linked [etc]
 
 That seems like a bad mistake, because it would prevent even booting
 single-user if rtld/libraries are broken.
 
 When one enters single user they are prompted for which shell to use.
 If /bin/sh is broken due to being dynamic, '/rescue/sh' will likely still
 work.

Yes. You to have a statically linked /rescue/sh on board, so what's the point 
of /bin/sh being dynamic? The memory footprint really isn't an issue, and for 
my money the default shell ought to be bombproof.

--
Bob Bishop
r...@gid.co.uk




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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-28 Thread Tim Kientzle
On Apr 28, 2012, at 3:03 AM, Bob Bishop wrote:
 
 On 28 Apr 2012, at 04:12, David O'Brien wrote:
 
 On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:38:03PM +0100, Bob Bishop wrote:
 Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. /bin/sh
 is dynamically linked [etc]
 
 That seems like a bad mistake, because it would prevent even booting
 single-user if rtld/libraries are broken.
 
 When one enters single user they are prompted for which shell to use.
 If /bin/sh is broken due to being dynamic, '/rescue/sh' will likely still
 work.
 
 Yes. You to have a statically linked /rescue/sh on board, so what's the point 
 of /bin/sh being dynamic? The memory footprint really isn't an issue, and for 
 my money the default shell ought to be bombproof.

By default shell, I think you mean the shell loaded by default
in single user mode.  That shell could be /rescue/sh.

Single-user recovery does not require /bin/sh being static.

Tim

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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-27 Thread Konstantin Belousov
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 05:41:40PM +0400, Ruslan Ermilov wrote:
 On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:35:48PM +0300, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
  I think it is time to stop building the toolchain static. I was told that
  original reasoning for static linking was the fear of loosing the ability
  to recompile if some problem appears with rtld and any required dynamic
  library. Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. /bin/sh
  is dynamically linked, and statically linked make does not solve anything.
 
 
 r76801 | sobomax | 2001-05-18 13:05:56 +0400 (Fri, 18 May 2001) | 6 lines
 
 By default build make(1) as a static binary. It costs only 100k of additional
 disk space, buf provides measureable speed increase for make-intensive
 operations, such as pkg_version(1), `make world' and so on.
 
 MFC after:1 week
 
 
 
 Have things changed enough that the above is not true anymore?
 
  Patch below makes the dynamically linked toolchain a default, adding an
  WITHOUT_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN build-time option for real conservators.
  
  I did not looked in details why including bsd.own.mk makes NO_MAN
  non-functional. Please see the diffs for gnu/usr.bin/cc1*/Makefile.
 
 Because you include bsd.own.mk before NO_MAN is defined, and the way
 how .if works in make(1).

What is the 'right' thing to do then ?

Postpone the inclusion of bsd.own.mk after NO_MAN definition ? This makes
the .if $MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN to not work.

Or, continue to do what I have done, using 'MAN=' instead ?

N.B. I will commit the change, with defaults kept to build toolchain static,
just to avoid bikeshed.


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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-27 Thread Ruslan Ermilov
On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 11:58:59AM +0300, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
 On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 05:41:40PM +0400, Ruslan Ermilov wrote:
  On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:35:48PM +0300, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
[...]
   Patch below makes the dynamically linked toolchain a default, adding an
   WITHOUT_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN build-time option for real conservators.
   
   I did not looked in details why including bsd.own.mk makes NO_MAN
   non-functional. Please see the diffs for gnu/usr.bin/cc1*/Makefile.
  
  Because you include bsd.own.mk before NO_MAN is defined, and the way
  how .if works in make(1).
 
 What is the 'right' thing to do then ?
 
 Postpone the inclusion of bsd.own.mk after NO_MAN definition ? This makes
 the .if $MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN to not work.
 
 Or, continue to do what I have done, using 'MAN=' instead ?

Two ways, both are demonstrated by gnu/lib/libgcov/Makefile:

- Define NO_* before including bsd.own.mk so it sets the
  corresponding MK_* variable appropriately, and before testing
  the MK_*.  

- Remove NO_*, include bsd.own.mk, then set MK_MAN=no.

(The nearby gnu/lib/libssp/Makefile has a similar problem with
NO_PROFILE.)

 N.B. I will commit the change, with defaults kept to build toolchain static,
 just to avoid bikeshed.

I think this is the right approach.

Regarding your patch...

By placing SHARED_TOOLCHAIN to __DEFAULT_NO_OPTIONS list in
bsd.own.mk, you already had MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN set to no by
default, which preserves the current status quo of building
toolchain static.  But you misspelled
tools/build/options/WITH_STATIC_TOOLCHAIN, probably as the result
of iteratively modifying your change.  The option and this file
should be named WITH_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN, the opposite of the
default.  Anyway, checking that the resulting src.conf(5) manpage
sounds sensible is a good idea.  As for the contents of this file,
I wouldn't call ar/ranlib a librarian but rather a library
archives manager, as per POSIX.  Your diff also suggests that it
misses a newline at EOF.
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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-27 Thread Konstantin Belousov
On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 02:58:06PM +0400, Ruslan Ermilov wrote:
 Regarding your patch...
 
 By placing SHARED_TOOLCHAIN to __DEFAULT_NO_OPTIONS list in
 bsd.own.mk, you already had MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN set to no by
 default, which preserves the current status quo of building
 toolchain static.  But you misspelled
 tools/build/options/WITH_STATIC_TOOLCHAIN, probably as the result
 of iteratively modifying your change.  The option and this file
 should be named WITH_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN, the opposite of the
 default.  Anyway, checking that the resulting src.conf(5) manpage
 sounds sensible is a good idea.  As for the contents of this file,
 I wouldn't call ar/ranlib a librarian but rather a library
 archives manager, as per POSIX.  Your diff also suggests that it
 misses a newline at EOF.
Thank you for the suggestions.

Below is the variant that should handle all the commentary.

diff --git a/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ar/Makefile b/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ar/Makefile
index 464445e..6fe22c8 100644
--- a/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ar/Makefile
+++ b/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ar/Makefile
@@ -1,6 +1,7 @@
 # $FreeBSD$
 
 .include ../Makefile.inc0
+.include bsd.own.mk
 
 .PATH: ${SRCDIR}/binutils ${SRCDIR}/binutils/doc
 
@@ -16,7 +17,9 @@ CFLAGS+= -D_GNU_SOURCE
 CFLAGS+= -I${.CURDIR}/${RELTOP}/libbinutils
 CFLAGS+= -I${SRCDIR}/binutils
 CFLAGS+= -I${SRCDIR}/bfd
+.if ${MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN} == no
 NO_SHARED?= yes
+.endif
 DPADD= ${RELTOP}/libbinutils/libbinutils.a
 DPADD+=${RELTOP}/libbfd/libbfd.a
 DPADD+=${RELTOP}/libiberty/libiberty.a
diff --git a/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/as/Makefile b/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/as/Makefile
index bf8df81..5fef1f3 100644
--- a/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/as/Makefile
+++ b/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/as/Makefile
@@ -4,6 +4,7 @@
 # BINDIR
 .include ${.CURDIR}/../../Makefile.inc
 .include ${.CURDIR}/../Makefile.inc0
+.include bsd.own.mk
 
 .PATH: ${SRCDIR}/gas ${SRCDIR}/gas/config
 
@@ -79,7 +80,9 @@ CFLAGS+= -D_GNU_SOURCE
 CFLAGS+= -I${SRCDIR}/gas -I${SRCDIR}/bfd -I${SRCDIR}/gas/config -I${SRCDIR}
 CFLAGS+= -I${.CURDIR} -I${.CURDIR}/${TARGET_CPUARCH}-freebsd
 
+.if ${MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN} == no
 NO_SHARED?=yes
+.endif
 
 DPADD= ${RELTOP}/libbfd/libbfd.a
 DPADD+=${RELTOP}/libiberty/libiberty.a
diff --git a/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ld/Makefile b/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ld/Makefile
index d4420ed..ef19afa 100644
--- a/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ld/Makefile
+++ b/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ld/Makefile
@@ -1,6 +1,7 @@
 # $FreeBSD$
 
 .include ../Makefile.inc0
+.include bsd.own.mk
 
 .PATH: ${SRCDIR}/ld
 
@@ -34,7 +35,9 @@ CFLAGS+= -DBINDIR=\${BINDIR}\ 
-DTARGET_SYSTEM_ROOT=\${TOOLS_PREFIX}\
 CFLAGS+= -DTOOLBINDIR=\${TOOLS_PREFIX}/${BINDIR}/libexec\
 CFLAGS+= -D_GNU_SOURCE
 CFLAGS+= -I${SRCDIR}/ld -I${SRCDIR}/bfd
+.if ${MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN} == no
 NO_SHARED?= yes
+.endif
 DPADD= ${RELTOP}/libbfd/libbfd.a
 DPADD+=${RELTOP}/libiberty/libiberty.a
 LDADD= ${DPADD}
diff --git a/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ranlib/Makefile 
b/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ranlib/Makefile
index 8679375..052f9fe 100644
--- a/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ranlib/Makefile
+++ b/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/ranlib/Makefile
@@ -1,6 +1,7 @@
 # $FreeBSD$
 
 .include ../Makefile.inc0
+.include bsd.own.mk
 
 .PATH: ${SRCDIR}/binutils ${SRCDIR}/binutils/doc
 
@@ -16,7 +17,9 @@ CFLAGS+= -D_GNU_SOURCE
 CFLAGS+= -I${.CURDIR}/${RELTOP}/libbinutils
 CFLAGS+= -I${SRCDIR}/binutils
 CFLAGS+= -I${SRCDIR}/bfd
+.if ${MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN} == no
 NO_SHARED?= yes
+.endif
 DPADD= ${RELTOP}/libbinutils/libbinutils.a
 DPADD+=${RELTOP}/libbfd/libbfd.a
 DPADD+=${RELTOP}/libiberty/libiberty.a
diff --git a/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc/Makefile b/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc/Makefile
index 78c83a5..ba53565 100644
--- a/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc/Makefile
+++ b/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc/Makefile
@@ -9,7 +9,9 @@ PROG=   gcc
 MAN=   gcc.1
 SRCS+=  gccspec.c
 
+.if ${MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN} == no
 NO_SHARED?=yes
+.endif
 
 MLINKS=gcc.1 g++.1
 .if ${MK_CLANG_IS_CC} == no
diff --git a/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc1/Makefile b/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc1/Makefile
index c65acd2..7b1e343 100644
--- a/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc1/Makefile
+++ b/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc1/Makefile
@@ -1,14 +1,17 @@
 # $FreeBSD$
 
 .include ../Makefile.inc
+NO_MAN=
+.include bsd.own.mk
 
 .PATH: ${GCCDIR}
 
 PROG=  cc1
 SRCS=  main.c c-parser.c c-lang.c
 BINDIR=/usr/libexec
-NO_MAN=
+.if ${MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN} == no
 NO_SHARED?=yes
+.endif
 
 OBJS+=  ${PROG}-checksum.o
 DPADD= ${LIBBACKEND} ${LIBCPP} ${LIBDECNUMBER} ${LIBIBERTY}
diff --git a/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc1plus/Makefile b/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc1plus/Makefile
index 964d20f..dd3d524 100644
--- a/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc1plus/Makefile
+++ b/gnu/usr.bin/cc/cc1plus/Makefile
@@ -1,6 +1,8 @@
 # $FreeBSD$
 
 .include ../Makefile.inc
+NO_MAN=
+.include bsd.own.mk
 
 .PATH: ${GCCDIR}/cp ${GCCDIR}
 
@@ -13,8 +15,9 @@ SRCS+=main.c cp-lang.c c-opts.c call.c class.c cvt.c 
cxx-pretty-print.c \
cp-objcp-common.c cp-gimplify.c tree-mudflap.c
 
 BINDIR=/usr/libexec
-NO_MAN=
+.if ${MK_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN} == no
 NO_SHARED?=yes
+.endif
 
 

Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-27 Thread David O'Brien
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:38:03PM +0100, Bob Bishop wrote:
  Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. /bin/sh
  is dynamically linked [etc]
 
 That seems like a bad mistake, because it would prevent even booting
 single-user if rtld/libraries are broken.

When one enters single user they are prompted for which shell to use.
If /bin/sh is broken due to being dynamic, '/rescue/sh' will likely still
work.

-- 
-- David  (obr...@freebsd.org)
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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-27 Thread David O'Brien
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 07:52:01AM -0400, John Baldwin wrote:
 You could use /rescue/sh as your single-user shell.  Of course, that would 
 perhaps let you still be able to recompile things if you had a static 
 toolchain. :)

Having the toolchain static has saved me in exactly this way.
 
-- 
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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-26 Thread Bob Bishop
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi,

On 26 Apr 2012, at 10:35, Konstantin Belousov wrote:

 I think it is time to stop building the toolchain static. I was told that
 original reasoning for static linking was the fear of loosing the ability
 to recompile if some problem appears with rtld and any required dynamic
 library. Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. /bin/sh
 is dynamically linked [etc]

That seems like a bad mistake, because it would prevent even booting 
single-user if rtld/libraries are broken.

- --
Bob Bishop
r...@gid.co.uk




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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-26 Thread David Chisnall
On 26 Apr 2012, at 12:38, Bob Bishop wrote:

 Hi,
 
 On 26 Apr 2012, at 10:35, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
 
 I think it is time to stop building the toolchain static. I was told that
 original reasoning for static linking was the fear of loosing the ability
 to recompile if some problem appears with rtld and any required dynamic
 library. Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. /bin/sh
 is dynamically linked [etc]
 
 That seems like a bad mistake, because it would prevent even booting 
 single-user if rtld/libraries are broken.

That's what /rescue is for.  You will find statically linked tools there that 
are just about to repair a broken system (a static nc would also be nice...).

I did some benchmarks a little while ago, and there was, I think, about a 5% 
slowdown on buildworld with a dynamically linked clang vs a statically linked 
one on x86-64.  Ideally, I'd want the bootstrap compiler to be statically 
linked but the installed one to be dynamic.  

The advantage of dynamic linking is small now, but as we add more LLVM and 
clang-based tools to the base system (e.g. LLVM-based firewall JIT, clang-based 
indent replacement) we're going to see lots of simple tools being 5-10MB if we 
enforce static linking.  

We'll probably get a much bigger speed win from clangd (hopefully appearing in 
time for LLVM 3.2) avoiding the need to spawn a new process for every compiler 
invocation than we'll save from static linking.  

As to compiling things when rtld is broken... clang in the base system 
currently dynamically links to lib[std]c++, libgcc_s, libm and libc, it only 
statically links to the clang and LLVM libraries.

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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-26 Thread Erik Cederstrand
Den 26/04/2012 kl. 11.35 skrev Konstantin Belousov:

 I think it is time to stop building the toolchain static. I was told that
 original reasoning for static linking was the fear of loosing the ability
 to recompile if some problem appears with rtld and any required dynamic
 library. Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. /bin/sh
 is dynamically linked, and statically linked make does not solve anything.

What are the benefits, apart from using a bit less disk space overall?

Apparently, toolchain bits aren't considered important enough to be included in 
/rescue. Maybe they need to be, if the assumption currently is that the 
compiler will (almost) always work.

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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-26 Thread John Baldwin
On Thursday, April 26, 2012 7:38:03 am Bob Bishop wrote:
 Hi,
 
 On 26 Apr 2012, at 10:35, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
 
  I think it is time to stop building the toolchain static. I was told that
  original reasoning for static linking was the fear of loosing the ability
  to recompile if some problem appears with rtld and any required dynamic
  library. Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. 
/bin/sh
  is dynamically linked [etc]
 
 That seems like a bad mistake, because it would prevent even booting single-
user if rtld/libraries are broken.

You could use /rescue/sh as your single-user shell.  Of course, that would 
perhaps let you still be able to recompile things if you had a static 
toolchain. :)

-- 
John Baldwin
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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-26 Thread Chris Rees
Oops, just replied privately before:
On Apr 26, 2012 12:39 PM, Chris Rees utis...@gmail.com wrote:


 On Apr 26, 2012 10:36 AM, Konstantin Belousov kostik...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  I think it is time to stop building the toolchain static. I was told that
  original reasoning for static linking was the fear of loosing the ability
  to recompile if some problem appears with rtld and any required dynamic
  library. Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g.
 /bin/sh
  is dynamically linked, and statically linked make does not solve
 anything.
 
  Patch below makes the dynamically linked toolchain a default, adding an
  WITHOUT_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN build-time option for real conservators.

 Nice idea, but sh etc al are built statically as /rescue/sh.  Will we see
 /rescue/ar  etc?

 Chris

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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-26 Thread Diane Bruce
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 07:52:01AM -0400, John Baldwin wrote:
 On Thursday, April 26, 2012 7:38:03 am Bob Bishop wrote:
  Hi,
  
...
 
 You could use /rescue/sh as your single-user shell.  Of course, that would 
 perhaps let you still be able to recompile things if you had a static 
 toolchain. :)

Put a toolchain on a CD or memstick and use that instead? ;-)

*runs*

- Diane
-- 
- d...@freebsd.org d...@db.net http://www.db.net/~db
  Why leave money to our children if we don't leave them the Earth?
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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-26 Thread Ruslan Ermilov
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:35:48PM +0300, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
 I think it is time to stop building the toolchain static. I was told that
 original reasoning for static linking was the fear of loosing the ability
 to recompile if some problem appears with rtld and any required dynamic
 library. Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g. /bin/sh
 is dynamically linked, and statically linked make does not solve anything.


r76801 | sobomax | 2001-05-18 13:05:56 +0400 (Fri, 18 May 2001) | 6 lines

By default build make(1) as a static binary. It costs only 100k of additional
disk space, buf provides measureable speed increase for make-intensive
operations, such as pkg_version(1), `make world' and so on.

MFC after:  1 week



Have things changed enough that the above is not true anymore?

 Patch below makes the dynamically linked toolchain a default, adding an
 WITHOUT_SHARED_TOOLCHAIN build-time option for real conservators.
 
 I did not looked in details why including bsd.own.mk makes NO_MAN
 non-functional. Please see the diffs for gnu/usr.bin/cc1*/Makefile.

Because you include bsd.own.mk before NO_MAN is defined, and the way
how .if works in make(1).
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Re: [RFC] Un-staticise the toolchain

2012-04-26 Thread Chris Rees
On Apr 26, 2012 2:42 PM, Ruslan Ermilov r...@freebsd.org wrote:

 On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:35:48PM +0300, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
  I think it is time to stop building the toolchain static. I was told
that
  original reasoning for static linking was the fear of loosing the
ability
  to recompile if some problem appears with rtld and any required dynamic
  library. Apparently, current dependencies are much more spread, e.g.
/bin/sh
  is dynamically linked, and statically linked make does not solve
anything.

 
 r76801 | sobomax | 2001-05-18 13:05:56 +0400 (Fri, 18 May 2001) | 6 lines

 By default build make(1) as a static binary. It costs only 100k of
additional
 disk space, buf provides measureable speed increase for make-intensive
 operations, such as pkg_version(1), `make world' and so on.

 MFC after:  1 week

 

 Have things changed enough that the above is not true anymore?
Well, the most make(1)-intensive test I can think of is make index, so some
results from a quick test:

hydra# uname -a
FreeBSD hydra.bayofrum.net 9.0-RELEASE FreeBSD 9.0-RELEASE #7: Sun Apr 22
21:02:48 BST 2012 r...@hydra.bayofrum.net:/usr/obj/usr/src/sys/HYDRA
amd64

hydra# cd /usr/src/usr.bin/make  make NO_SHARED=yes  cp make
~/bin/make-static  /dev/null

hydra# rm make  make NO_SHARED=no  cp make ~/bin/make-dynamic 
/dev/null

hydra# file ~/bin/make-*
/home/chris/bin/make-dynamic: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1
(FreeBSD), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), for FreeBSD 9.0 (900044),
not stripped
/home/chris/bin/make-static:  ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1
(FreeBSD), statically linked, for FreeBSD 9.0 (900044), not stripped

hydra# cd /usr/ports  time make MAKE=~crees/bin/make-static index

Generating INDEX-9 - please wait.. Done.
729.770u 120.841s 7:45.10 182.8%920+2676k 5251+116484io 7750pf+0w

hydra# time make MAKE=~crees/bin/make-dynamic index

Generating INDEX-9 - please wait.. Done.
771.320u 133.540s 8:07.83 185.4%609+2918k 474+116484io 570pf+0w

We have a 10% slowdown (or 11% speedup, depending on your figures) when
using a dynamically loaded make.

Chris
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