Re: [Freeciv-Dev] compilers that aren't C99
On Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 8:55 PM, Brandon Van Every bvanev...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 3:08 PM, Marko Lindqvist cazf...@gmail.com wrote: I have been told that VisualStudio lacks several C99 features (and has incompatible implementation for some, I believe) simply because it's not even meant to be C compiler. It's an C++ compiler. I don't think meant to be is quite the right turn of phrase, since it is a C compiler. Rather, as noted in that wontfix notice, Microsoft feels that its customers are C++ centric. So they put their development resources into that, and not C99. I must admit, C++ having far more users than C is an argument with some weight. Especially in the game industry: C is done for some things, but C++ is the primary resume skill. You may not care about resume skills around here, but a lot of people feel that kind of justification is important for what projects they work on. I have wondered how Freeciv is strictly C might impede developer retention. One could argue that GNU is C centric, being obsessed with the ability to bring up programs on all systems, no matter how obscure. Also, most advanced languages that are not C++, like Scheme or Lisp or OCaml or whatnot, have a much easier time talking to C. Actually, GCC usually supports C++ features before they are implemented in Visual Studio. Take TR1 functionality for example. One thing it tradiotionally lagged behind was in code optimization, but even that has changed recently. -- Vasco Alexandre da Silva Costa PhD Student and Teaching Assistant at Department of Information Systems and Computer Science IST/Technical University of Lisbon ___ Freeciv-dev mailing list Freeciv-dev@gna.org https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/freeciv-dev
Re: [Freeciv-Dev] compilers that aren't C99
On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 5:52 PM, Vasco Alexandre da Silva Costa vasco.co...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 8:55 PM, Brandon Van Every bvanev...@gmail.com wrote: One could argue that GNU is C centric, being obsessed with the ability to bring up programs on all systems, no matter how obscure. Also, most advanced languages that are not C++, like Scheme or Lisp or OCaml or whatnot, have a much easier time talking to C. Actually, GCC usually supports C++ features before they are implemented in Visual Studio. By GNU I meant the Free Software Foundation. I think they are C centric, due to the tools they are trying to advance. Disagree? Cheers, Brandon Van Every ___ Freeciv-dev mailing list Freeciv-dev@gna.org https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/freeciv-dev
[Freeciv-Dev] compilers that aren't C99
I've got some of a Microsoft Visual Studio 2008 build of Freeciv working. I've run into an impediment, however: VC9 does not support variable length arrays. http://connect.microsoft.com/VisualStudio/feedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=333273 VLAs are part of the C99 standard, so you can say Microsoft is the bad guy here. My question is whether you're willing to support the bad guy's compiler. Or, put another way, compilers that aren't GCC and aren't C99. I could make all the needed changes, but there would be little point if they won't ever be accepted. Cheers, Brandon Van Every ___ Freeciv-dev mailing list Freeciv-dev@gna.org https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/freeciv-dev
Re: [Freeciv-Dev] compilers that aren't C99
We made the decision a few years ago to support some of the features of C99, with a check for each. Variable-length arrays was one of them, and a very useful one in a lot of the code it's used in. I don't think we should go back. -jason ___ Freeciv-dev mailing list Freeciv-dev@gna.org https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/freeciv-dev
Re: [Freeciv-Dev] compilers that aren't C99
2009/1/2 Brandon Van Every: I've got some of a Microsoft Visual Studio 2008 build of Freeciv working. I've run into an impediment, however: VC9 does not support variable length arrays. http://connect.microsoft.com/VisualStudio/feedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=333273 VLAs are part of the C99 standard, so you can say Microsoft is the bad guy here. My question is whether you're willing to support the bad guy's compiler. Or, put another way, compilers that aren't GCC and aren't C99. I could make all the needed changes, but there would be little point if they won't ever be accepted. I have been told that VisualStudio lacks several C99 features (and has incompatible implementation for some, I believe) simply because it's not even meant to be C compiler. It's an C++ compiler. - ML ___ Freeciv-dev mailing list Freeciv-dev@gna.org https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/freeciv-dev
Re: [Freeciv-Dev] compilers that aren't C99
On Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 3:08 PM, Marko Lindqvist cazf...@gmail.com wrote: I have been told that VisualStudio lacks several C99 features (and has incompatible implementation for some, I believe) simply because it's not even meant to be C compiler. It's an C++ compiler. I don't think meant to be is quite the right turn of phrase, since it is a C compiler. Rather, as noted in that wontfix notice, Microsoft feels that its customers are C++ centric. So they put their development resources into that, and not C99. I must admit, C++ having far more users than C is an argument with some weight. Especially in the game industry: C is done for some things, but C++ is the primary resume skill. You may not care about resume skills around here, but a lot of people feel that kind of justification is important for what projects they work on. I have wondered how Freeciv is strictly C might impede developer retention. One could argue that GNU is C centric, being obsessed with the ability to bring up programs on all systems, no matter how obscure. Also, most advanced languages that are not C++, like Scheme or Lisp or OCaml or whatnot, have a much easier time talking to C. Cheers, Brandon Van Every ___ Freeciv-dev mailing list Freeciv-dev@gna.org https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/freeciv-dev
