Re: [Freedos-devel] Freedos and lack of drivers

2011-09-19 Thread Alain Mouette
my 2cents:

I spent a lot of time with MicroCore Linux. It runs very well, and 
probably would run Dosemu. BUT the problemis that it is not a *real* 
Linux ditro in the sense that is does not install to a harddisk, it 
rather boots every time as if it was from a cdrom. There are a few 
tricks to include what you have bade into next boot, but it is complex 
and not automatable... So I abandoned it...

As for using memory, there is no problem using more than 66Mb of ram in 
Dosemu, it provides good memory drivers.

Alain

Em 18-09-2011 16:13, Rugxulo escreveu:
> Hi,
>
> 2011/9/18 Aitor Santamaría:
>>
>> 2011/9/13 Jim Hall:
>>> In DOS, it would be awesome to have true multitasking
>>
>> Pick the smallest Linux distribution that you know.
>
> These days that would probably be MicroCore (aka, TinyCore w/o X11)
> Linux. It's about a 7 MB .ISO download. I think the RAM usage is
> pretty low. I haven't tested DOSEMU, but I think nowadays you need
> Glibc 2.2, kernel 2.6, etc. (which it has, IIRC). So you can't just
> randomly pick any old Linux, sadly.
>
> http://distro.ibiblio.org/tinycorelinux/welcome.html
>
> Some people have suggested Debian in the past as a good stable
> starting point. But I remember DeLi 0.7.2 (uclibc-based) had a DOSEMU
> package, and that's been resurrected as ConnochaetOS (though I haven't
> tested it yet):
>
> http://www.connochaetos.org/wiki/
>
>> Remove X and anything about graphics.
>
> Yes but easier said than done.
>
>> Remove any Unix stuff,
>
> I guess you mean all the unnecessary POSIX tools. At least
> substituting Busybox should cover a good deal of it.
>
> The barebones stuff is kernel (vmlinuz), initrd.gz, and root system
> (/bin/sh) etc. (I think), and Gujin is a good boot loader (with DOS
> version), meant to replace Loadlin / Lilo.
>
>> Wouldn't it be great that you'd have several FreeDOSes running
>> simultaneously? (switch with Ctrl+Alt+Fn).
>
> Well, yes, that would be the whole point. But here's a naive question:
>   can a single DOSEMU session use more than 64 MB of memory? (Newer
> GCCs really eat a lot.)
>
>> You wouldn't have the problem of "modern hardware" (Linux does the
>> part), but then you have quite other disadvantages (I don't know how
>> good would be the drive mapping process that DOSEMU does. Would be
>> nice if DOSEMU scanned all the disks and mapped ALL partitions
>> automatically).
>
> Well, the only disadvantage isn't really one at all:  it's not perfect
> (but no DOS environment, or any OS, is). So there are bugs and
> incompatibilities, just like anything. But overall it works quite
> well.
>
>> In the meantime, yes, at least task switching would be great.
>
> Old-style real mode stuff should be easy to swap in and out of memory.
> (I remember some old swappers from 80xxx snippets, but I don't know
> how stable they were.) I imagine that it's when you start adding ten
> bazillion memory managers that things get complex.
>
> http://www.filegate.net/pdnasm/
>
> The real problem is trying to determine what apps you want to run.
> Personally I'd prefer DJGPP (cmdline, textmode) stuff and similar, but
> even that is probably a bit too complex for a simple memory swapper.
> Though of course DOSEMU handles DPMI fine.
>
> P.S. Actually at one time I wanted to build pcemu under (DOS) Minix
> 2.04 to be able to fake multitasking, but ACK didn't like the stock
> sources, and I never fiddled with it further.
>
> http://pcemu.sourceforge.net/
> http://www.minix3.org/previous-versions/Intel-2.0.4/
>
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Re: [Freedos-devel] Freedos and lack of drivers

2011-09-19 Thread Rugxulo
Hi,

On Mon, Sep 19, 2011 at 10:52 PM, Alain Mouette  wrote:
> my 2cents:
>
> I spent a lot of time with MicroCore Linux. It runs very well, and
> probably would run Dosemu. BUT the problemis that it is not a *real*
> Linux ditro in the sense that is does not install to a harddisk, it
> rather boots every time as if it was from a cdrom. There are a few
> tricks to include what you have bade into next boot, but it is complex
> and not automatable... So I abandoned it...

Hmmm. I read similar but never tried (yet). There are installation
instructions on the webpage, but again, it's not super simple and
easy.

PuppyLinux has .sfs files and optionally saves all your changes into a
separate file, but of course it's a much bigger distro (130 MB
nowadays). But it's easy to boot via "mini" Gujin via FreeDOS (I tried
it once) if you put vmlinuz + initrd.gz on the FAT partition first.
That's probably the easiest way (that I know of, so far) to run
DOSEMU, but again, not ideal since it uses more RAM and disk than I'd
like. (Heh, I'd rather not have to spend a year or two learning Linux
>From Scratch [LFS] just to make a "lite" Linux just to boot DOSEMU w/
FreeDOS.)

> As for using memory, there is no problem using more than 66Mb of ram in
> Dosemu, it provides good memory drivers.

Are you sure? IIRC, it starts out with only 20 MB DPMI available,
which is too low for latest DJGPP w/ GCC 4.6.1. I ended up copying +
editing ~/.dosemurc to increase to 64 MB (e.g. to rebuild Gautier's 3D
Engine w/ GNAT). Beyond that amount I didn't test.

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Re: [Freedos-devel] e-mail of September 19

2011-09-19 Thread jasse...@itelefonica.com.br
Decheng Fan wrote:

>Yes, I still want to do this. To try run in VM and if 
>it works fine then it should be fine on physical hardware.

 Not always, unfortunately. Nor in the other direction.


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