Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Hi Volkert, > By the way, the dosemu2 developers are also developing fdpp, a 64-bit DOS > kernel that aims to provide a DOS-compatible userspace and that can run in > Dosemu2. (Not sure if it always uses fdpp by default.) Since it's a 64-bit > process, I'm not sure how fdpp and dosemu2 handle the running of 16-bit > code without some kind of software emulation. As far as I remember, FDPP just does most of the DOS work on the Linux (or potentially Windows) host side of your reality. The DOS apps still run in the same good old 16/32 bit tasks as before, although you will more often be using an emulated CPU compared to classic DOSEMU now. I could claim that FDPP is a very elaborate change in the memory model when compiling a classic FreeDOS kernel, but I am sure that is a rather bad description. Also, FDPP got heavily tuned since the DOSEMU2 product cycle involves frequent testing of many features and compatibility etc. While DOSEMU2 tends to change quickly and sometimes in unexpected ways, it usually works better than classic DOSEMU. So if you are fine with updating your config or autoexec from time to time, or even sticking to package-maintained default versions of those, you should try it :-) Of course you can still run DOSEMU2 with classic FreeDOS kernels instead of FDPP. You can also still boot disk images containing other DOS etc. Note: If you use the cool "a Linux directory is presented as C: drive" boot style, you will now have to explicitly load a driver to gain write access. In the old DOSEMU, some automatic magic made it work "without". Cheers, Eric ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Yep, you pretty much described the dosemu2, which was already mentioned here. Itś a continuation of the old DOSEMU project. The original DOSEMU relied on the V8086 virtualization mode that was introduced in the 386 CPU, but V8086 mode isn't available in 64-bit (Long) mode. So instead, dosemu2 (optionally) leverages KVM, the hardware-assisted hypervisor in built into the Linux kernel, to virtualize a DOS environment. And yes, it can emulate Sound Blaster cards as well. By the way, the dosemu2 developers are also developing fdpp, a 64-bit DOS kernel that aims to provide a DOS-compatible userspace and that can run in Dosemu2. (Not sure if it always uses fdpp by default.) Since it's a 64-bit process, I'm not sure how fdpp and dosemu2 handle the running of 16-bit code without some kind of software emulation. But regardless, they run on Linux and leverage its virtualization features. On Wed, Mar 3, 2021 at 1:24 AM Liam Proven wrote: > On 3/1/2021 10:42 AM, Pablo Pessolani wrote: > > > > Hi Guys. > > I am working on several unikernels on Linux (not over QEMU, KVM, > XEN or any other emulator/hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the > virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. > > Would there be any interest in modifying freedos so that it can run > on Linux and its virtual devices instead of running on real hardware (as > User Mode Linux does) ? > > Are you aware of DOSemu? > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOSEMU > > V1 is in most distros' repositories. > > V2 is in development. > http://dosemu2.github.io/dosemu2/ > > Most DOSes run under it, and the Ubuntu version comes bundled with FreeDOS. > > It is in essence a FOSS version of Locus DOS/Merge, which I was using > in the late 1980s. > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merge_(software) > > -- > Liam Proven – Profile: https://about.me/liamproven > Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk – gMail/gTalk/gHangouts: lpro...@gmail.com > Twitter/Facebook/LinkedIn/Flickr: lproven – Skype: liamproven > UK: +44 7939-087884 – ČR (+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal): +420 702 829 053 > > > ___ > Freedos-devel mailing list > Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel > ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
On 3/2/2021 3:45 PM, Pablo Pessolani wrote: Thanks Ralf. I am not sure if you really want to do that... 😛 In general, this was a somewhat shorter reply along the lines that Tom mentioned... 😉 Ralf -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
On 3/1/2021 10:42 AM, Pablo Pessolani wrote: > > Hi Guys. > I am working on several unikernels on Linux (not over QEMU, KVM, XEN or > any other emulator/hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the > virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. > Would there be any interest in modifying freedos so that it can run on > Linux and its virtual devices instead of running on real hardware (as User > Mode Linux does) ? Are you aware of DOSemu? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOSEMU V1 is in most distros' repositories. V2 is in development. http://dosemu2.github.io/dosemu2/ Most DOSes run under it, and the Ubuntu version comes bundled with FreeDOS. It is in essence a FOSS version of Locus DOS/Merge, which I was using in the late 1980s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merge_(software) -- Liam Proven – Profile: https://about.me/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk – gMail/gTalk/gHangouts: lpro...@gmail.com Twitter/Facebook/LinkedIn/Flickr: lproven – Skype: liamproven UK: +44 7939-087884 – ČR (+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal): +420 702 829 053 ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Thanks Ralf. De: Ralf Quint Enviado: martes, 2 de marzo de 2021 18:28 Para: freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Asunto: Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel? On 3/1/2021 10:42 AM, Pablo Pessolani wrote: Hi Guys. I am working on several unikernels on Linux (not over QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. Would there be any interest in modifying freedos so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices instead of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? Regards. PAP Good luck. Ralf [https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif]<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=icon> Virus-free. www.avast.com<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=link> ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Thanks Tom. I have developed several DOS device drivers in 1990 decade and a ROM BIOS written in C. All that you say its true, the BIOS and it services you mentioned (INTxx) are used by DOS in a similar way that a paravirtulized OS does. This fact simplifies the migration of DOS to other platform. But, what happen with devices not supported by the BIOS, such as network interface cards? A device driver must be loaded by DOS to suppport it. Most Unikernels can run a single process in kernel-mode o privileged mode. A unikernel based on FreeDOS could have these same properties, but networking support is an unavoidable requirement. Regards. PAP De: tom ehlert Enviado: martes, 2 de marzo de 2021 19:01 Para: Technical discussion and questions for FreeDOS developers. Asunto: Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel? > Hi Guys. I am working on several unikernels on Linux (not over > QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/hypervisor) using Linux > system calls and the virtualization facilities offered by the > Linux kernel. Would there be any interest in modifying freedos > so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices instead > of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? it looks like you have not much of a clue what DOS does. it's not DOS that's making problems to your emulation, because DOS does so little. DOS doesn't run on 'real hardware'. It runs on anything that provides some - well documented - services behind INT13 (disk IO), INT10 (video), and INT15 for memory management (and some few more). beyond that, it provides very little support for anything. and all of it is only basic functionality; in particular of all the interesting things in INT10, only 'position cursor', 'print character at cusor' and 'print string at cursor' are used. so each application had to code it's own interrupt handler for serial communication memory management beyond 640k many more stuff I/O port stuff which are beyond kernels reach Soundblaster ! good luck with emulating that Tom ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
> Hi Guys. I am working on several unikernels on Linux (not over > QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/hypervisor) using Linux > system calls and the virtualization facilities offered by the > Linux kernel. Would there be any interest in modifying freedos > so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices instead > of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? it looks like you have not much of a clue what DOS does. it's not DOS that's making problems to your emulation, because DOS does so little. DOS doesn't run on 'real hardware'. It runs on anything that provides some - well documented - services behind INT13 (disk IO), INT10 (video), and INT15 for memory management (and some few more). beyond that, it provides very little support for anything. and all of it is only basic functionality; in particular of all the interesting things in INT10, only 'position cursor', 'print character at cusor' and 'print string at cursor' are used. so each application had to code it's own interrupt handler for serial communication memory management beyond 640k many more stuff I/O port stuff which are beyond kernels reach Soundblaster ! good luck with emulating that Tom ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
On 3/1/2021 10:42 AM, Pablo Pessolani wrote: Hi Guys. I am working on several unikernels on Linux (not over QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. Would there be any interest in modifying freedos so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices instead of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? Regards. PAP Good luck. Ralf -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Hello Pablo, Sorry, now I understand what you say. I also works on UML source code too. Yes, UML intercepts system calls through ptrace, but instead of calling the host kernel, it calls the UML kernel. Therefore, no host system call is excecuted by the application process running inside UML. Thanks, glad to have the misunderstanding cleared up. Regarding "unikernels" --- in the sense of "a single-tasking library operating system made specifically for running a single application in the cloud" (https://lwn.net/Articles/728682/) --- I guess the IBM PC booter games of old (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_PC_booter_games) will be much closer to the notion of "unikernel" (minus the "cloud"). Basically, on each PC booter game disk, instead of having a general OS kernel (e.g. MS-DOS) plus a separate game program that runs on top of the kernel, there will be just an "OS" that is specialized for running the game and nothing else. I am not sure how useful it might be to do something like this in the modern day --- maybe by turning the FreeDOS kernel into some sort of "library operating system" that can be used to create specialized "application OSes". But it is interesting to think about. Thank you! -- https://github.com/tkchia ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Hello Chia. Sorry, now I understand what you say. I also works on UML source code too. Yes, UML intercepts system calls through ptrace, but instead of calling the host kernel, it calls the UML kernel. Therefore, no host system call is excecuted by the application process running inside UML. Regards. PAP De: TK Chia Enviado: martes, 2 de marzo de 2021 12:04 Para: freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Asunto: Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel? Hello Pablo, >> User Mode Linux actually works more like dosemu than it may seem. UML >> runs as a normal application under a host Linux system, of course. But >> when you run, say, /bin/ls within a UML session, UML will indeed >> intercept the syscalls made by the /bin/ls and transform them into the >> correct requests to the underlying host Linux. So effectively /bin/ls's >> syscalls actually go to UML, not directly to the host system. There is > I am not comfused about UML, it is a true and complete Linux system that runs > over a Linux hosts. Instead interfacing with hardware devices, it uses > virtual devices provided by the Linux Host. > The example of "ls" doesn't work as you explain. Containers runs in this way. With all due respect, I have worked with the UML source code before, and I know whereof I speak. The UML home page --- not that hard to find --- also has presentations and papers that discuss how exactly UML virtualizes syscalls, Thank you! -- https://github.com/tkchia :: https://gitlab.com/tkchia ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Hello Pablo, User Mode Linux actually works more like dosemu than it may seem. UML runs as a normal application under a host Linux system, of course. But when you run, say, /bin/ls within a UML session, UML will indeed intercept the syscalls made by the /bin/ls and transform them into the correct requests to the underlying host Linux. So effectively /bin/ls's syscalls actually go to UML, not directly to the host system. There is I am not comfused about UML, it is a true and complete Linux system that runs over a Linux hosts. Instead interfacing with hardware devices, it uses virtual devices provided by the Linux Host. The example of "ls" doesn't work as you explain. Containers runs in this way. With all due respect, I have worked with the UML source code before, and I know whereof I speak. The UML home page --- not that hard to find --- also has presentations and papers that discuss how exactly UML virtualizes syscalls, Thank you! -- https://github.com/tkchia :: https://gitlab.com/tkchia ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Thanks Chia. I am not comfused about UML, it is a true and complete Linux system that runs over a Linux hosts. Instead interfacing with hardware devices, it uses virtual devices provided by the Linux Host. The example of "ls" doesn't work as you explain. Containers runs in this way. Regards. PAP De: TK Chia Enviado: martes, 2 de marzo de 2021 02:40 Para: freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Asunto: Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel? Good day Pablo, > Unikernels: they are minimal Library operating systems embeded with the > application code. They provide networking, filesystem and virtual devices > support. > I think that if Linux could be converted in a executable (User Mode Linux) or > in a library (LKL), FreeDOS may also be converted that way. I am pretty sure that is _not_ how UML works. It seems to me that you are conflating and confusing several concepts together. User Mode Linux actually works more like dosemu than it may seem. UML runs as a normal application under a host Linux system, of course. But when you run, say, /bin/ls within a UML session, UML will indeed intercept the syscalls made by the /bin/ls and transform them into the correct requests to the underlying host Linux. So effectively /bin/ls's syscalls actually go to UML, not directly to the host system. There is no need to compile /bin/ls to work with UML. What you are getting at is more like what Winelib does (https://wiki.winehq.org/Winelib_User%27s_Guide). Winelib's goal is to allow one to take the source code of a Windows program, and turn it into a program that runs natively on Linux. But you can only do this for Windows _applications_, not Windows itself. Winelib will most probably not allow you to turn Microsoft Windows's source code --- even assuming you have it --- into a Linux application. It can only help you turn programs that run _under_ Windows into Linux applications. The dosemu approach of allowing MS-DOS code to run on Linux, and the Winelib approach, will be quite different. Thank you! -- https://github.com/tkchia :: https://gitlab.com/tkchia ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Good day Pablo, Unikernels: they are minimal Library operating systems embeded with the application code. They provide networking, filesystem and virtual devices support. I think that if Linux could be converted in a executable (User Mode Linux) or in a library (LKL), FreeDOS may also be converted that way. I am pretty sure that is _not_ how UML works. It seems to me that you are conflating and confusing several concepts together. User Mode Linux actually works more like dosemu than it may seem. UML runs as a normal application under a host Linux system, of course. But when you run, say, /bin/ls within a UML session, UML will indeed intercept the syscalls made by the /bin/ls and transform them into the correct requests to the underlying host Linux. So effectively /bin/ls's syscalls actually go to UML, not directly to the host system. There is no need to compile /bin/ls to work with UML. What you are getting at is more like what Winelib does (https://wiki.winehq.org/Winelib_User%27s_Guide). Winelib's goal is to allow one to take the source code of a Windows program, and turn it into a program that runs natively on Linux. But you can only do this for Windows _applications_, not Windows itself. Winelib will most probably not allow you to turn Microsoft Windows's source code --- even assuming you have it --- into a Linux application. It can only help you turn programs that run _under_ Windows into Linux applications. The dosemu approach of allowing MS-DOS code to run on Linux, and the Winelib approach, will be quite different. Thank you! -- https://github.com/tkchia :: https://gitlab.com/tkchia ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
On Mon, 1 Mar 2021, Pablo Pessolani wrote: Thanks Geraldo. Dosemu: I think that with Dosemu, Linux "emulates" DOS system calls and environment. It doesn't run a DOS kernel in userspace. i.e. It intercepts DOS system calls and converts them to equivalent Linux system calls. dosemu actually does run a DOS kernel. I use that of PC DOS 7 in mine. It uses a shim to allow access to the local filesystem. -uso. ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Thanks Geraldo. Dosemu: I think that with Dosemu, Linux "emulates" DOS system calls and environment. It doesn't run a DOS kernel in userspace. i.e. It intercepts DOS system calls and converts them to equivalent Linux system calls. Unikernels: they are minimal Library operating systems embeded with the application code. They provide networking, filesystem and virtual devices support. I think that if Linux could be converted in a executable (User Mode Linux) or in a library (LKL), FreeDOS may also be converted that way. Regards. PAP. De: Geraldo Netto Enviado: lunes, 1 de marzo de 2021 17:37 Para: Technical discussion and questions for FreeDOS developers. Asunto: Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel? Hi Pablo/Eric/All, I guess there are many different strategies to handle it But maybe what you're looking for is a customized version of dosemu (http://www.dosemu.org)? It seems that usually, unikernels are some sort of "container" or application-oriented operating system (https://www.lisha.ufsc.br/pub/Frohlich_2001.pdf) in the sense that you embed a single application together with the kernel (single address space operating system with just enough drivers/infrastructure) Kind Regards, Geraldo Netto site: http://exdev.sf.net github: https://github.com/geraldo-netto linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/geraldonetto facebook: https://web.facebook.com/geraldo.netto.161 On Mon, 1 Mar 2021 at 20:28, Pablo Pessolani wrote: > > Thanks Eric. > I am not thinking in running binary DOS applications which use the real mode. > I am thinking in source code applications built (compiled) on linux but > instead of linked with libc library, they should be linked to a new "libdosc" > library which use the FreeDOS system calls and environment. > It would be a linux executable binary file. > Regards. > PAP > > > De: Eric Auer > Enviado: lunes, 1 de marzo de 2021 15:52 > Para: freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > > Asunto: Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel? > > > Hi PAP, > > I assume unikernel means replacing hardware I/O by > calls to a suitable hypervisor interface? In a way, > DOS already does that by using BIOS. So you could > make a BIOS-Unikernel and then run FreeDOS as app > on that. But how do you deal with the fact that a > DOS kernel and DOS apps will prefer a DOS memory > model with real mode compatible pointers, can the > hypervisor offer such spaces? > > Regards, Eric > > > > > Hi Guys. > > I am working on several unikernels on Linux > > (not over QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/ > > hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the > > virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. > > > Would there be any interest in modifying freedos > > so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices > > instead of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? > > Regards. > > PAP > > > > ___ > Freedos-devel mailing list > Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel > ___ > Freedos-devel mailing list > Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Hi Pablo/Eric/All, I guess there are many different strategies to handle it But maybe what you're looking for is a customized version of dosemu (http://www.dosemu.org)? It seems that usually, unikernels are some sort of "container" or application-oriented operating system (https://www.lisha.ufsc.br/pub/Frohlich_2001.pdf) in the sense that you embed a single application together with the kernel (single address space operating system with just enough drivers/infrastructure) Kind Regards, Geraldo Netto site: http://exdev.sf.net github: https://github.com/geraldo-netto linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/geraldonetto facebook: https://web.facebook.com/geraldo.netto.161 On Mon, 1 Mar 2021 at 20:28, Pablo Pessolani wrote: > > Thanks Eric. > I am not thinking in running binary DOS applications which use the real mode. > I am thinking in source code applications built (compiled) on linux but > instead of linked with libc library, they should be linked to a new "libdosc" > library which use the FreeDOS system calls and environment. > It would be a linux executable binary file. > Regards. > PAP > > > De: Eric Auer > Enviado: lunes, 1 de marzo de 2021 15:52 > Para: freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > > Asunto: Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel? > > > Hi PAP, > > I assume unikernel means replacing hardware I/O by > calls to a suitable hypervisor interface? In a way, > DOS already does that by using BIOS. So you could > make a BIOS-Unikernel and then run FreeDOS as app > on that. But how do you deal with the fact that a > DOS kernel and DOS apps will prefer a DOS memory > model with real mode compatible pointers, can the > hypervisor offer such spaces? > > Regards, Eric > > > > > Hi Guys. > > I am working on several unikernels on Linux > > (not over QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/ > > hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the > > virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. > > > Would there be any interest in modifying freedos > > so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices > > instead of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? > > Regards. > > PAP > > > > ___ > Freedos-devel mailing list > Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel > ___ > Freedos-devel mailing list > Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Thanks Eric. I am not thinking in running binary DOS applications which use the real mode. I am thinking in source code applications built (compiled) on linux but instead of linked with libc library, they should be linked to a new "libdosc" library which use the FreeDOS system calls and environment. It would be a linux executable binary file. Regards. PAP De: Eric Auer Enviado: lunes, 1 de marzo de 2021 15:52 Para: freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Asunto: Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel? Hi PAP, I assume unikernel means replacing hardware I/O by calls to a suitable hypervisor interface? In a way, DOS already does that by using BIOS. So you could make a BIOS-Unikernel and then run FreeDOS as app on that. But how do you deal with the fact that a DOS kernel and DOS apps will prefer a DOS memory model with real mode compatible pointers, can the hypervisor offer such spaces? Regards, Eric > Hi Guys. > I am working on several unikernels on Linux > (not over QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/ > hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the > virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. > Would there be any interest in modifying freedos > so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices > instead of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? > Regards. > PAP ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Re: [Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Hi PAP, I assume unikernel means replacing hardware I/O by calls to a suitable hypervisor interface? In a way, DOS already does that by using BIOS. So you could make a BIOS-Unikernel and then run FreeDOS as app on that. But how do you deal with the fact that a DOS kernel and DOS apps will prefer a DOS memory model with real mode compatible pointers, can the hypervisor offer such spaces? Regards, Eric > Hi Guys. > I am working on several unikernels on Linux > (not over QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/ > hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the > virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. > Would there be any interest in modifying freedos > so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices > instead of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? > Regards. > PAP ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
[Freedos-devel] FreeDOS as a unikernel?
Hi Guys. I am working on several unikernels on Linux (not over QEMU, KVM, XEN or any other emulator/hypervisor) using Linux system calls and the virtualization facilities offered by the Linux kernel. Would there be any interest in modifying freedos so that it can run on Linux and its virtual devices instead of running on real hardware (as User Mode Linux does) ? Regards. PAP ___ Freedos-devel mailing list Freedos-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
