Re: Reference compiler (was Re: [Freedos-kernel] Re: patch: inthndlr.c)
Steffen Kaiser wrote: On Mon, 10 May 2004, Bart Oldeman wrote: Hi Tom, You don't remember correctly. the kernel reference compiler has been for a long time TC 2.01 (which is free), and has been changed to OW because it generates better (smaller) code, and because it's free and open. Aitor remembers correctly -- he simply goes a few years further back than you and me. Before August '99 TC 2.01 couldn't be used. Watcom's been used as reference since Feb 2002. http://fd-doc.sourceforge.net/spec/spec.html Section "Programming Tools To Be Used" "Our reference standard for a C compiler will be Borland C 3.1. Our reference standard for Assembly will be Microsoft MASM. Borland C 3.1 was chosen as the reference standard because this is the compiler used to build the FreeDOS kernel. Microsoft MASM was chosen as the reference standard because of the free availability of MASM-compatible assemblers. The existing code base was also a deciding factor in choosing a reference standard." How about to change the reference compiler not only for the kernel, but for all the project? There had been a movement from MASM to NASM already, so this can be reflected here as well. This is missing some documentation as well, right? It would be helpful to have some port MASM --> NASM document. I know Jim can phrase the change of the reference tools so that Turbo C becomes a backup-solution, not to be turned down immediately. Arkady, how is your progress toward OW going? Did have you assembled a Mini-DOS-OW development environment, for instance? I just unpacked any ZIP, except that ones specifically marked as "Fortran". Bye, Oops. I meant to go through and update the fd-doc site a while ago. There's even a note about something like that on the SF site. The Spec is very out of date. It should have been updated long ago. I'm very embarrassed that I haven't done it yet. I'll get back on this, and start updating the fd-doc site. The original intent was to have the Spec reflect what people actually _use_ so that when a new developer comes into the project, he/she will know what tools to use when contributing to FreeDOS (such as OW for C compiler, etc.) When the Spec was first written, no open tools (suitable for 16bit deployment) were available. However, pretty much everyone on the FreeDOS lists had (or was already using) TurboC or Borland C, so TC/BC were listed as the standard. Same thing for assembly, except that's changed now too. -jh -- _ This email message has been automatically encrypted using ROT-26. --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by Sleepycat Software Learn developer strategies Cisco, Motorola, Ericsson & Lucent use to deliver higher performing products faster, at low TCO. http://www.sleepycat.com/telcomwpreg.php?From=osdnemail3 ___ Freedos-kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-kernel
Re: Reference compiler (was Re: [Freedos-kernel] Re: patch: inthndlr.c)
Hi! 10-Май-2004 16:01 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bart Oldeman) wrote to [EMAIL PROTECTED]: >> It works (compiles programs). I even already prepared ATTRIB edition, >> which compilable by TC/BC/OW, and delay its release only because wait, if I >> found some new ways to reduce RTL (by replacing some RTL functions) - >> currently ATTRIB.EXE after BC uses 3914 bytes, after OW 4044 bytes. BO> Oh yes, feel free to send me this to see where it can be reduced -- I BO> remember you asked a while ago. Yes, and I use your recomendation for replacing stdio by _dos_* functions. This is why executable is so small. In next (private) letter I send you current archive. --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by Sleepycat Software Learn developer strategies Cisco, Motorola, Ericsson & Lucent use to deliver higher performing products faster, at low TCO. http://www.sleepycat.com/telcomwpreg.php?From=osdnemail3 ___ Freedos-kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-kernel
Re: Reference compiler (was Re: [Freedos-kernel] Re: patch: inthndlr.c)
On Mon, 10 May 2004, Arkady V.Belousov wrote: > It works (compiles programs). I even already prepared ATTRIB edition, > which compilable by TC/BC/OW, and delay its release only because wait, if I > found some new ways to reduce RTL (by replacing some RTL functions) - > currently ATTRIB.EXE after BC uses 3914 bytes, after OW 4044 bytes. Oh yes, feel free to send me this to see where it can be reduced -- I remember you asked a while ago. The attrib 2.1 source I can see here uses fputs so that would be an obvious one to replace with one that just does a call to _dos_write if you don't need the buffering. Bart --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by Sleepycat Software Learn developer strategies Cisco, Motorola, Ericsson & Lucent use to deliver higher performing products faster, at low TCO. http://www.sleepycat.com/telcomwpreg.php?From=osdnemail3 ___ Freedos-kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-kernel
Re: Reference compiler (was Re: [Freedos-kernel] Re: patch: inthndlr.c)
Hi! 10-Май-2004 15:18 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steffen Kaiser) wrote to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: SK> Arkady, how is your progress toward OW going? It works (compiles programs). I even already prepared ATTRIB edition, which compilable by TC/BC/OW, and delay its release only because wait, if I found some new ways to reduce RTL (by replacing some RTL functions) - currently ATTRIB.EXE after BC uses 3914 bytes, after OW 4044 bytes. SK> Did have you assembled a Mini-DOS-OW development environment, for instance? Yes, 12,760,275 bytes of /LANG/WATCOM/ directory and some batch files to call wcc/wcl/wdis/wlib/wlink/wmake/wpp without modifying master PATH. Also, 14,573,653 bytes of help files (and WHELP) and 265396 bytes of dos4gw.exe. SK> I just unpacked any ZIP, except that ones specifically marked as "Fortran". If you wish, I specify which files included into my set. PS: After BC some MSish thing in OW astonish me: for example, in*/out* functions declared in conio.h (instead i86.h and, thus, in dos.h); instead conio.h:gotoxy() I should use graph.h:_settextposition() (and almost all other functions started by underscore)... And MSish division to WCC/WPP/WCL also doesn't makes me happy. Also, OW makes shorter code (and even faster: BriefLZ usage example works 5.22 sec instead 8.19 for BC), but it includes much-much more with RTL. And OPTION EL,VFR for wlink helps not much. :( --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by Sleepycat Software Learn developer strategies Cisco, Motorola, Ericsson & Lucent use to deliver higher performing products faster, at low TCO. http://www.sleepycat.com/telcomwpreg.php?From=osdnemail3 ___ Freedos-kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-kernel
Re: Reference compiler (was Re: [Freedos-kernel] Re: patch: inthndlr.c)
Steffen Kaiser escribió: How about to change the reference compiler not only for the kernel, but for all the project? There had been a movement from MASM to NASM already, so this can be reflected here as well. This is missing some documentation as well, right? It would be helpful to have some port MASM --> NASM document. I know Jim can phrase the change of the reference tools so that Turbo C becomes a backup-solution, not to be turned down immediately. I vote for it. Perhaps it could be a question of mentioning the two, with preference for OW (but being clear that the other is ok too). Same for MASM/NASM Aitor --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by Sleepycat Software Learn developer strategies Cisco, Motorola, Ericsson & Lucent use to deliver higher performing products faster, at low TCO. http://www.sleepycat.com/telcomwpreg.php?From=osdnemail3 ___ Freedos-kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-kernel
Re: Reference compiler (was Re: [Freedos-kernel] Re: patch: inthndlr.c)
On Mon, 10 May 2004, tom ehlert wrote: Hello Tom, to read and to care for are two things, right --> therefore: > Now - what use has a spec, if noone cares the slighest about it ? That's why I suggested to update it to the current, in order to give it more substance. And to reflect the actual state. For me, it's an over-all documentation, a newbe hits first to graps general ideas from. --> And both things will merge again ;-) And I also care about MASM->NASM and BC->OW docs, in order to make the change more smooth for people like me that have no <> available. Bye, -- Steffen Kaiser --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by Sleepycat Software Learn developer strategies Cisco, Motorola, Ericsson & Lucent use to deliver higher performing products faster, at low TCO. http://www.sleepycat.com/telcomwpreg.php?From=osdnemail3 ___ Freedos-kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-kernel
Re: Reference compiler (was Re: [Freedos-kernel] Re: patch: inthndlr.c)
Hello Steffen, > http://fd-doc.sourceforge.net/spec/spec.html > Section "Programming Tools To Be Used" > "Our reference standard for a C compiler will be Borland C 3.1. Our > reference standard for Assembly will be Microsoft MASM. Borland C 3.1 was > chosen as the reference standard because this is the compiler used to > build the FreeDOS kernel. Microsoft MASM was chosen as the reference > standard because of the free availability of MASM-compatible assemblers. Actually, I can read myself ;) since I entered the project (2001), there was no MASM sources anywhere, and no BC 3.01 in the kernel, and it BC xx wouldn't have worked after my HMA additions. Now - what use has a spec, if noone cares the slighest about it ? what use has a spec, if it hasn't been updated since 1995 ? is it something like the bible, or should it be something reflecting (intended) reality ? I prefer the latter - and won't care about any outdated specs. tom --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by Sleepycat Software Learn developer strategies Cisco, Motorola, Ericsson & Lucent use to deliver higher performing products faster, at low TCO. http://www.sleepycat.com/telcomwpreg.php?From=osdnemail3 ___ Freedos-kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-kernel
Reference compiler (was Re: [Freedos-kernel] Re: patch: inthndlr.c)
On Mon, 10 May 2004, Bart Oldeman wrote: > Hi Tom, > > > You don't remember correctly. > > the kernel reference compiler has been for a long time TC 2.01 (which > > is free), and has been changed to OW because it generates better > > (smaller) code, and because it's free and open. > > Aitor remembers correctly -- he simply goes a few years further back than > you and me. Before August '99 TC 2.01 couldn't be used. Watcom's been > used as reference since Feb 2002. http://fd-doc.sourceforge.net/spec/spec.html Section "Programming Tools To Be Used" "Our reference standard for a C compiler will be Borland C 3.1. Our reference standard for Assembly will be Microsoft MASM. Borland C 3.1 was chosen as the reference standard because this is the compiler used to build the FreeDOS kernel. Microsoft MASM was chosen as the reference standard because of the free availability of MASM-compatible assemblers. The existing code base was also a deciding factor in choosing a reference standard." How about to change the reference compiler not only for the kernel, but for all the project? There had been a movement from MASM to NASM already, so this can be reflected here as well. This is missing some documentation as well, right? It would be helpful to have some port MASM --> NASM document. I know Jim can phrase the change of the reference tools so that Turbo C becomes a backup-solution, not to be turned down immediately. Arkady, how is your progress toward OW going? Did have you assembled a Mini-DOS-OW development environment, for instance? I just unpacked any ZIP, except that ones specifically marked as "Fortran". Bye, -- Steffen Kaiser --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by Sleepycat Software Learn developer strategies Cisco, Motorola, Ericsson & Lucent use to deliver higher performing products faster, at low TCO. http://www.sleepycat.com/telcomwpreg.php?From=osdnemail3 ___ Freedos-kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-kernel
