Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
On Fri, 31 Mar 2006, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 12:33:28 EST, gboyce said: In which case the person needs to remove the hard drive, and put it into a different system for the modifications (or mirroring). Time constraints. The amount of time needed to pop in a disk and hit reboot is (or should be, in this case) a lot shorter than the amount of time it takes to pull a rack-mount box out and pop the lid and play with the drives. And if your server has a lockable faceplate like most Dell rack-mounts, that can add a lot to the challenge right there (as it stops any quick "snarf a hot-swap drive and run" scheme). For the most part, if an attacker has physical access to the hardware itself, you just lose. Almost, but not quite right. If the attacker has physical access *for long enough*, you lose. I wasn't quite clear enough I think. By "Physical Access to the hardware", I meant unencoumbered physical access. If a system is in a locked rack, safe, or has a locking case then it is indeed much more difficult. Good point about the time though. Even an unlocked rack mount server without hot swappable drives will take some time to unrack and disassemble in order to ge the drives out and back in again. -- Greg ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 12:33:28 EST, gboyce said: > In which case the person needs to remove the hard drive, and put it into a > different system for the modifications (or mirroring). Time constraints. The amount of time needed to pop in a disk and hit reboot is (or should be, in this case) a lot shorter than the amount of time it takes to pull a rack-mount box out and pop the lid and play with the drives. And if your server has a lockable faceplate like most Dell rack-mounts, that can add a lot to the challenge right there (as it stops any quick "snarf a hot-swap drive and run" scheme). > For the most part, if an attacker has physical access to the hardware > itself, you just lose. Almost, but not quite right. If the attacker has physical access *for long enough*, you lose. Even the specs for a GSA Class 5 security container (usually referred to as a "crypto safe"), which is the highest level, only specify entry protection of 10 man-minutes forced entry, 20 man-hours surreptitious entry, and 30 man-minutes covert entry, with specified man-portable tools. "Forced entry" means "We don't care *how* much noise the drills and explosives and torches make", while "covert" means "without making noise", and "surreptitious" means "without leaving noticable marks when you're done". And of course, the testing is done by an expert locksmith with special expertise in this sort of attack The reason this is so is because if the safe will hold for 30 minutes, then you just need a Marine with live ammo and instructions to shoot first walk by every 15 minutes, or get there in 5 minutes after the alarms go off pgpdJ8Xz2QSVP.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
On Fri, 31 Mar 2006, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 09:21:13 EST, Michael Holstein said: Trivial to defeat. Just boot in to single user mode with these kernel options: single init=/bin/bash Again .. only due to initial misconfiguration. Nobody should allow alternate switches to be passed to the kernel at boot .. either by password-protecting the bootloader, or via firmware (as with OpenBoot). Of course, if you're that paranoid, you *did* configure whatever the machine uses for a BIOS to only boot off the intended hard drive, right? ;) In which case the person needs to remove the hard drive, and put it into a different system for the modifications (or mirroring). For the most part, if an attacker has physical access to the hardware itself, you just lose. -- Greg ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 09:21:13 EST, Michael Holstein said: > > Trivial to defeat. Just boot in to single user mode with these kernel > > options: > > single init=/bin/bash > > Again .. only due to initial misconfiguration. > > Nobody should allow alternate switches to be passed to the kernel at > boot .. either by password-protecting the bootloader, or via firmware > (as with OpenBoot). Of course, if you're that paranoid, you *did* configure whatever the machine uses for a BIOS to only boot off the intended hard drive, right? ;) (It's amazing how many boxes I've found that forget that step, so a CD and enough time to hit the RESET button are enough to get you in. And if you have any smarts at all, you don't even need to hang around at the console after you hit reset. It's not that hard to get a Knoppix to start an sshd. :) pgpia4rq9XJY2.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
Trivial to defeat. Just boot in to single user mode with these kernel options: single init=/bin/bash Again .. only due to initial misconfiguration. Nobody should allow alternate switches to be passed to the kernel at boot .. either by password-protecting the bootloader, or via firmware (as with OpenBoot). /mike. ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Yo Kerry! On Fri, 31 Mar 2006, Kerry Thompson wrote: > Most *nix systems these days require you to enter the root password before > giving you a shell in single user mode. Trivial to defeat. Just boot in to single user mode with these kernel options: single init=/bin/bash The nothing runs off the root partition execpt a nice bash shell for you. RGDS GARY - --- Gary E. Miller Rellim 20340 Empire Blvd, Suite E-3, Bend, OR 97701 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel:+1(541)382-8588 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFELJIR8KZibdeR3qURAmXpAKDFcFOwsZnVA0U85kxYw4aaddLbowCglg++ PhNU9qTtH2pKR/qlljirKig= =OpFG -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
spam said: > > Isn't it easier to boot into single user mode and reset the password? It > doesn't require you to load the live CD which is one less step. > Most *nix systems these days require you to enter the root password before giving you a shell in single user mode. I guess its a security feature, although if you're standing in front of the machine then its contents are fully accessible to you, on the basis that you can boot from CD or remove the drive manually. Kerry -- Kerry Thompson http://www.crypt.gen.nz ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
Michael Holstein wrote: > Easiest way to reset a lost UNIX password is boot from a "live CD" > (eg: knoppix) .. mount the / partition of your hard drive (eg: mnt -t > ext2 /dev/hda1 /mnt) then do "chroot /mnt" and execute "passwd root" > from in there. Isn't it easier to boot into single user mode and reset the password? It doesn't require you to load the live CD which is one less step. Ben ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
Michael Holstein wrote: Isn't it easier to boot into single user mode and reset the password? It doesn't require you to load the live CD which is one less step. depends on if they setup 'console' as insecure or not in /etc/ttys. Setuid script on /tmp? Given that /tmp isn't mounted with correct flags of course, And given that you're really the legitimate root on the machine. Otherwise it's social engineering and race conditions. But for a legitimate root, just boot -s on a cd, mount the / of the boot disk in rw and change the pw. And if you're not the legitimate root, do you really expect us to tell you how? White hats won't beacause it's wrong, black hats wont's because it's not funny, and gray hats won't because it's not intresting. -- // hdw ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
Isn't it easier to boot into single user mode and reset the password? It doesn't require you to load the live CD which is one less step. depends on if they setup 'console' as insecure or not in /etc/ttys. ~Mike. ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [Full-disclosure] Root password change
if you're chrooted under /tmp (as it sounds from your email) you're out of luck, unless you have a way to escape the chroot due to a misconfiguration of that environment in the first place. Easiest way to reset a lost UNIX password is boot from a "live CD" (eg: knoppix) .. mount the / partition of your hard drive (eg: mnt -t ext2 /dev/hda1 /mnt) then do "chroot /mnt" and execute "passwd root" from in there. Then exit the chroot, umount /mnt, and reboot. Viola' Cheers, Michael Holstein CISSP GCIA Cleveland State University Mockbee, Tom wrote: I am logged in as a regular user but have root permission in the tmp directory through a different shell. I am stuck as to what is my next move to be able to change the root users password to one I know. Any help? Tom ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
[Full-disclosure] Root password change
I am logged in as a regular user but have root permission in the tmp directory through a different shell. I am stuck as to what is my next move to be able to change the root users password to one I know. Any help? Tom ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
