Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Nick Jacobsen wrote: it seems to me the perfect chance for a countersuite... cause at least as far as I know, most state's definition of computer crime would include installing software on a machine withough the owners permission. or knowlege.. and since that is what SunnComm's protection is doing... According to the report, the software shows an EULA before the system is modified, so there is user consent. By the way, the subject line is misleading. SunnComm doesn't sue because of the shift key description (the company isn't *that* stupid), but because of the removal instructions for the Trojan Horse. These instructions could be indeed illegal to publish in the United States and other countries because they are specifically designed to circumvent an effective measure for restricting copies. ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Appel even worse then linux. because of it's print-to-pdf out of any application your able to change the permission on any PDF (including copy-permission ;-) cheerio -- Jeremiah Cornelius wrote: Apple and Linux are 'circumvention devices'! *Disclaimer* This message is for the addressee only and may contain confidential or privileged information. You must delete and not use it if you are not the intended recipient. It may not be secure or error-free. All e-mail communications to and from the Julius Baer Group may be monitored. Processing of incoming e-mails cannot be guaranteed. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender. This message is for information purposes only. All liability of the Julius Baer Group and its entities for any damages resulting from e-mail use is excluded. US persons are kindly requested to read the important legal information presented after clicking here: http://www.juliusbaer.com/maildisclaimer ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
RE: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Okay... So according to the law it's illegal to remove the program if later you decide to not agree to the EULA? (Which I'm sure it says that the terms can be changed at any time within it) That sure doesn't seem kosher to me... I feel that you should be able to remove/disable whatever on your computer. According to this logic... Using Ad-Aware is illegal because it removes spyware from your system without their non-existent uninstall interface! Oh, and you're also not allowed to know what the file/driver name of the program that they've installed is either? Nice! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:full-disclosure- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Florian Weimer Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 23:52 To: Nick Jacobsen Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m Nick Jacobsen wrote: it seems to me the perfect chance for a countersuite... cause at least as far as I know, most state's definition of computer crime would include installing software on a machine withough the owners permission. or knowlege.. and since that is what SunnComm's protection is doing... According to the report, the software shows an EULA before the system is modified, so there is user consent. By the way, the subject line is misleading. SunnComm doesn't sue because of the shift key description (the company isn't *that* stupid), but because of the removal instructions for the Trojan Horse. These instructions could be indeed illegal to publish in the United States and other countries because they are specifically designed to circumvent an effective measure for restricting copies. ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Florian Weimer wrote: By the way, the subject line is misleading. SunnComm doesn't sue because of the shift key description (the company isn't *that* stupid), but because of the removal instructions for the Trojan Horse. These instructions could be indeed illegal to publish in the United States and other countries because they are specifically designed to circumvent an effective measure for restricting copies. as would use of a recovery disk set (supplied with most pcs) as it would almost as a side effect remove any trojans :) ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Okay... So according to the law it's illegal to remove the program if later you decide to not agree to the EULA? (Which I'm sure it says that the terms can be changed at any time within it) That sure doesn't seem kosher to me... I feel that you should be able to remove/disable whatever on your computer. According to this logic... Using Ad-Aware is illegal because it removes spyware from your system without their non-existent uninstall interface! Oh, and you're also not allowed to know what the file/driver name of the program that they've installed is either? Nice! Hi Poof, Odds are the copy-protection-related drivers can be removed via Windows' Add/Remove Programs control panel applet -- rendering your 'protected' media a defacto coaster until you accept the EULA a second time. C ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Did any one sue Sharpie when it was found that a black magic marker would defeat Sony copy protection? - Original Message - From: Adam Dyga [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 6:09 PM Subject: Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m Dnia pi 10. padziernika 2003 00:08, Jeremiah Cornelius napisa: | Ahhh... The wildest, satirical speculations on FullDisclosure come to | fruition in a court of law. Let the games begin! | | http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/33322.html | SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m | By Tony Smith | Posted: 09/10/2003 at 20:47 GMT | | | SunnComm has threatened Princeton PhD student Alex Halderman with the | Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) for exposing a key weakness in the | company's latest CD copy protection technology, MediaMax CD3. | How stupid they are, didn't they think of other than Windows operating systems that don't have something like Autorun feature? -- Greets adeon ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
RE: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
I'm not a legal expert, but IIRC, Brown vs. Rural Telephone Company ruled that it was not a violation of any copyright to publish information that belonged to another company...although the issues are slightly different here, I think the same basis could apply here if SunComm were to suggest that the information published by the student was breaking some type of intellectual property rights or such. ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
On Fri, Oct 10, 2003 at 10:19:03AM -0400, Jonathan A. Zdziarski said: I'm not a legal expert, but IIRC, Brown vs. Rural Telephone Company ruled that it was not a violation of any copyright to publish information that belonged to another company...although the issues are You missed the passage of new copyright law, I.E. the DMCA. -- Shawn McMahon | Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, EIV Consulting| that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any UNIX and Linux| hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe, to assure http://www.eiv.com| the survival and the success of liberty. - JFK pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
RE: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
In order to install the software you have to accept their EULA which says it is installing software to access the media. Did you not read the article? Mark Bassett Network Administrator World media company Omaha.com 402-898-2079 -Original Message- From: Nick Jacobsen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 6:40 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m it seems to me the perfect chance for a countersuite... cause at least as far as I know, most state's definition of computer crime would include installing software on a machine withough the owners permission. or knowlege.. and since that is what SunnComm's protection is doing... Nick Jacobsen (Ethics) [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
It seems SunnComm has reconsidered their position: http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/archives/2003/10/10/news/8797.shtml They claim they don't want to hurt research but I think they know they can't win. -- Patrick Dolan UNT Computing and Information Technology Center PGP ID: E5571154 Primary key fingerprint: 5681 25E4 6BE6 298E 9CF0 6F8D B13B 2456 E557 1154 ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Patrick Dolan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It seems SunnComm has reconsidered their position: http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/archives/2003/10/10/news/8797.shtml Good thing. Can you imagine the implications a successful Shift key suit might have on future use of the miscreant Delete key? Horrors. Regards, Mary Landesman Antivirus About.com Guide http://antivirus.about.com ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
RE: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Here's the SunnComm press release: SunnComm CEO Says Princeton Report Critical of its MediaMax CD Copy Management Technology Contains Erroneous Assumptions and Conclusions http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/031009/95573_1.html -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeremiah Cornelius Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 6:09 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Ahhh... The wildest, satirical speculations on FullDisclosure come to fruition in a court of law. Let the games begin! ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
Dnia pi 10. padziernika 2003 00:08, Jeremiah Cornelius napisa: | Ahhh... The wildest, satirical speculations on FullDisclosure come to | fruition in a court of law. Let the games begin! | | http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/33322.html | SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m | By Tony Smith | Posted: 09/10/2003 at 20:47 GMT | | | SunnComm has threatened Princeton PhD student Alex Halderman with the | Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) for exposing a key weakness in the | company's latest CD copy protection technology, MediaMax CD3. | How stupid they are, didn't they think of other than Windows operating systems that don't have something like Autorun feature? -- Greets adeon ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
it seems to me the perfect chance for a countersuite... cause at least as far as I know, most state's definition of computer crime would include installing software on a machine withough the owners permission. or knowlege.. and since that is what SunnComm's protection is doing... Nick Jacobsen (Ethics) [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Re: [Full-Disclosure] SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Thursday 09 October 2003 16:09, Adam Dyga wrote: Dnia pi 10. padziernika 2003 00:08, Jeremiah Cornelius napisa: | Ahhh... The wildest, satirical speculations on FullDisclosure come to | fruition in a court of law. Let the games begin! | | http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/33322.html | SunnComm to sue 'Shift key' student for $10m | By Tony Smith | Posted: 09/10/2003 at 20:47 GMT | | | SunnComm has threatened Princeton PhD student Alex Halderman with the | Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) for exposing a key weakness in | the company's latest CD copy protection technology, MediaMax CD3. How stupid they are, didn't they think of other than Windows operating systems that don't have something like Autorun feature? Apple and Linux are 'circumvention devices'! -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE/hfpxJi2cv3XsiSARAtG7AJ9wvdU+nyTZM12mL1mMJSPwTywfCgCgtJtz udqwxXIOp87/oKVKM6HmXU8= =6fje -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
