Re: more from Johns Hopkins

1998-09-03 Thread Ray E. Harrell

Subject:
Re: more from Johns Hopkins
   Date:
Thu, 03 Sep 1998 01:02:11 -0700
   From:
"Ray E. Harrell" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 References:
1

Jay Hanson wrote:

 IMHO, it's mostly a problem of psychological denial -- with a healthy dose
 of vested interest to lock it in place.

REH:
I agree up to a point.

Jay continues:
The first step would be for people to admit the problems
real (even some members of this list won't).

REH:
For one of those who might seem resistant, I would say
that to me the issue is not whether something should be
done but whether there is something to put in the place of
the kinds of work activities that destroy the environment and
stimulate pollution.

I have suggested that the traditional Greek solution is not a
bad one.  Begin with developing the perceptions through the
Arts and make work fit the goals of individual and group
psycho-physical development.  My cynicism about that has
to do with individuals in power being willing to give up and
negotiate the world that is to come.I suspect there will be
wars over whose favorite image of an ideal future will predominate.
Both the stressed environment and a rise in plagues will likely
provide the tools for tyrants to stress people into nonsensical,
manipulatible directions.

Jay continues:

 The second step would be to admit that the
 consumer society must now end.

REH
As Thomas pointed out, the idea of work is important.
Don't pay people for doing nothing.  Pay them for doing
something that is useful in the elevation of human and
individual consciousness.Develop programs for the
changeover and instead of consuming iron, consume
esthetic products that delight and develop.

Jay

 If we could overcome denial, we might have a chance.  But I see it as the
 "alcoholic" syndrome: the alcoholic can't overcome denial until he is lying
 in the gutter drowning in his own puke.

REH
If we are addicted to anything, it is the anesthetized physical
and emotional patterning that has been necessary to live the
last 250 years in the West.  There have been many strategies
developed to help people survive the Industrial Era.

I meet them in my performance classes.  Working with the powerfully
talented, the great exercises of the Western Theater rip the skin
from their eyes and the painful memories from their histories.   Most of
them are not mature enough to handle such flooding and leave to go
back to the simplicities of the Auto plant or the computer program, no
matter how gentle or sensitive the teacher.

(But, as you point out, their  jobs are going to have to change.   Why
can't we be "human" like the Dutch and program job change into
the life pattern as a worthy goal and provide the money for the
training?)

Or they are afraid of specific physical terms that their religions
categorized as "dirty", a taboo strengthened  in order to escape
the previous sexual diseases that killed most of Europe.(If you
think teaching ecology is difficult you should try teaching children
a logical and healthy response to their pleasure.)

Although sexuality  is suspect, paradoxically it is the only "allowed"
complete human pleasure.   The Pleasure Principle, the bodies most
accurate measure of success or failure,  teaches the child.  Adults
inaccurately classify childish pleasure in growth as "sexual."   That
way they can encapsulate the wholeness of pleasure in the fragment
of sexuality  and prove that the rest of life is a struggle and should
expect little other than profit.

Even among the former Communists, (good 19th century scientists)  this
has been turned to a puritanical rigidity that is almost afraid of the feel
of a lengthening muscle other than a penis.   The 19th century model
of healthy work is a contracting muscle pulled to a "toned" hardness.
The penis, on the other hand, is a contradiction to their model of how
work happens in the body.As stated earlier, their model is one of
shortening (contraction) and rigidity with the natural flow of pleasurable
energy through the muscles being hardened like bone.   This 19th
century medical "work" model has been discarded in the dance,
Olympic and professional sports worlds because it causes injuries as
tight rigid muscles are easily damaged.

But the puritanical streak in regular science is still abroad in the non sports

and non artistic  world and it causes amazing physical problems as people
encounter the real issues of loss of home, identity and money in a new world.
(I would refer you to Nicholas Tinbergen's acceptance speech of the Nobel
Prize when he exhaustingly analyses this in his discussion of human postural
patterns through the Alexander Technique.)

But pleasure is required for many non-polluting professions as an indicator
of growth.   The Arts demand it and those who can't break the programming
crash

Re: more from Johns Hopkins

1998-09-03 Thread Eva Durant

 
 Even among the former Communists, (good 19th century scientists)  this
 has been turned to a puritanical rigidity 


If you mean Marx et al, you're wrong. The most picked up
and ridiculed of their ideas  by contemporaries were 
those on free love, which they developed from the
french utopian socialists if I remember correctly.

Eva



 
 REH
 
 
 
 
 




Re: more from Johns Hopkins

1998-09-03 Thread Jay Hanson

From: Ray E. Harrell [EMAIL PROTECTED]

I have suggested that the traditional Greek solution is not a
bad one.  Begin with developing the perceptions through the
Arts and make work fit the goals of individual and group
psycho-physical development.  My cynicism about that has

This would be an ideal direction.  Shift personal satisfaction from the
consumption of commodities to the arts.  [ I agree with the rest of your
points too Ray. ]

I am cynical too.  In his new book, THE FUTURE IN PLAIN SIGHT, Linden has
really done a great job of describing the consumer society.  He makes the
connection between reason, the irrational, and religion.  Moreover, he tells
us why the system can't change:

"The consumer society thrives on its own discontent.  This is what makes the
system so supremely resilient and adaptable.  Unfortunately, a system that
transforms all attempts to change it into consumer interest loses the
ability to recognize danger and adapt.  If every public expression of fear,
anger, or outrage is assimilated as a market opportunity, the system can not
change."
[p. 260]

Linden sees nine different reasons society is likely to collapse early this
coming century.  Significantly, none of Linden's reasons are based on
Meadow's, Tainter's, Prigogine's, or Campbell's work.

It's a good book: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0684811332

Jay -- www.dieoff.org