RE: [Futurework] Are they going mad?
Ray, If something illegal happened in Florida (other than that practiced by the Florida Supreme Court) then it should be prosecuted and the miscreants should My interest is what might be called professional environmentalism goes back a long way to a radio show I did on DDT where I found the chemical to be most effective, the safest, and the cheapest (most important) pesticide we had invented. This roused such unscientific and somewhat paranoid criticism that I really examined the whole thing - including all the proceedings of the panel that eventually banned it. This led to a paper I did in 1973. It didnt harm birds, raptors, and animals. It saved umpteen million lives. Yet, environmental fanatics got it banned which antic provided the large chemical companies with huge profits. Since then, there have been a continuing series of scares, most based on nothing much. You mustnt accept so easily the so-called dangers that accompany Global Warming. If you are worried about the increase in disease and the heat as well as the problem that we can't help with the magnetic poles effect on the Ozone perhaps you will tell us how we are going to tackle them. I should say that those bloody GW computers come up with every kind of dire future one could wish for including drought and torrential rain storms. So, whatever happens can be blamed on GW. If we were to adopt Kyoto completely, it would make little difference. However, the increase in atmospheric CO2 can make a difference in growing things. They do much better in carbon dioxide rich atmospheres. Much more important is are your projects going well? Harry Henry George School of Social Science of Los Angeles Box 655 Tujunga CA 91042 Tel: 818 352-4141--Fax: 818 353-2242 http://haledward.home.comcast.net From: Ray Evans Harrell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 02, 2004 7:45 PM To: Harry Pollard; 'Keith Hudson'; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Futurework] Are they going mad? Harry, I think both sides blew itin Florida but I don't think the votes were counted and the thousands who were illegally removed from the roles could have voted either way but it was a Republican administration that accomplished it and so I think they should pay. As for Iraq. If someone breaks into your house and then uses the excuse that they are already there as a reason for staying...well it is a very old American game that goes back to the beginning of the Republic. I think the only thing that GWB might avoid in all this is a trial for war crimes. I'm not sure that I want to collaborate in that. I don't have enough information. Maybe this new Special Prosecutor will break something loose. You said nothing about the appalling environmental policies. I hope we agree that policies that were carefully worked out over years with plenty of public airing should not be simply revoked. I have said nothing about the end of Clinton environmental fiats. That wasn't good either. But the clean air and water statutes and allowing old plants to not upgrade to the newest pollution standards is disgusting. And as for global warming? I'm a genuine environmental conservative. Science may prove that we have nothing to do with it but if we might, I would want to err on the prudent and try to take care of both the weather, the increase in disease and the heat as well as the problem that we can't help with the magnetic poles effect on the Ozone. Prepare and plan. That is my answer for what you can't solve and also my answer for a market that is brutal and barbaric at best. Arnold? He doesn't look so happy these days. There are those who were happy that Bush inherited the burst bubble. He gets the credit for all of that joblessness. Also you should talk to the employees who have had their salaries cut by 1/5th just so the company won't hire a cheap incompetent youngster. Down here in the ranks they are not complaining about powerful unions but impotent ones who don't have the power to make difference. As for anyone fixing it? Expedience is a powerful tool. I remember when Reagan's tax program hurt so many of us. He blamed it on the Democrats letting him do it. That is some way to govern. There is not easy way. There is just integrity and it is in short supply. If you don't have that then vote intelligence. If you don't have that you are in trouble. REH --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.558 / Virus Database: 350 - Release Date: 1/2/2004 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.558 / Virus Database: 350 - Release Date: 1/2/2004 ___ Futurework mailing list [EMAIL
Re: [Futurework] Are they going mad?
Harry Pollard wrote: Ray, You say: You have defended this administration, I just assume that you are one with their agenda and language. I fear you assume too much. I have set people straight on the Florida election. For example, such nonsense as the Supreme Court elected Bush They did it 5 to 4. And the reason was eggregiously offensive: On Dec. 12, the United States Supreme Court, by a vote of 5 to 4 along partisan lines, stopped all further recounts and thereby elected George W. Bush the 43rd President of The United States. Associate Justice Antonin Scalia said that a continued vote recount threatened irreparable harm to the petitioner [i.e., George W. Bush], and to the country, by casting a cloud upon what he claims to be the legitimacy of his election. (The Making of the President, 2000. by Garry Wills, NYT Book Review, 01Apr01, p.9) Did you hear that: Questioning the legitimacy of Bush's election threatens to do harm to both the country and to Mr. Bush, by raising questions about the legitimacy of his election in people's minds. But, of course, the Supreme Court did not elect Bush. It dependd on many things. The Supreme Court would not even have had an opportunity to vote if Nadir had gone all-out for Gore (or even just recused himself from the election). Maybe if Gore had embraced Clinton in his campaign, even Nadir would not have had any effect on the election. But as it turned out, the straw that broke the camel's back may have been the Supreme Court vote. \brad mccormick is bruited, and I unbruit it (theres a coin). Also, Ive said that the moment we entered Iraq, we have to change our thinking to look for positives that can arise from it. There is too much of a Hate Bush attitude from otherwise intelligent people. The torrent of invective launched at him is almost beyond belief. [snip] Maybe it's almost beyond your belief. What baffles me is how Bush is continuing to get away with the stuff he and his fellow travellers are doing to America and to the world. As I've said previously, Osama bin Laden could hardly have hand-picked a better U.S. President, since anybody who was more helpful to AlQaeda and its allies in the White House surely *would* have been impeached for treason. Bush is for bin Laden et al. like the invisible hand is to capitalists: it helps them get what they want without them having to take responsibility for it. Cyclops: Who put my eye out? Odysseus: Nobody put your eye out! Cyclops' friends: Who hurt you, friend? Cyclops: Nobody hurt me! Cyclops friends think: Well apparently our friend screamed for no reason. He must be OK after all \brad mcormick -- Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works (Matt 5:16) Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. (1 Thes 5:21) ![%THINK;[SGML+APL]] Brad McCormick, Ed.D. / [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Visit my website == http://www.users.cloud9.net/~bradmcc/ ___ Futurework mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://fes.uwaterloo.ca/mailman/listinfo/futurework
Re: [Futurework] Are they going mad?
Harry, I think both sides blew itin Florida but I don't think the votes were counted and the thousands who were illegally removed from the roles could have voted either way but it was a Republican administration that accomplished it and so I think they should pay. As for Iraq. If someone breaks into your house and then uses the excuse that they are already there as a reason for staying...well it is a very old American game that goes back to the beginning of the Republic. I think the only thing that GWB might avoid in all this is a trial for war crimes. I'm not sure that I want to collaborate in that. I don't have enough information. Maybe this new Special Prosecutor will break something loose. You said nothing about the appalling environmental policies. I hope we agree that policies that were carefully worked out over years with plenty of public airing should not be simply revoked. I have said nothing about the end of Clinton environmental fiats. That wasn't good either. But the clean air and water statutes and allowing old plants to not upgrade to the newest pollution standards is disgusting. And as for global warming? I'm a genuine environmental conservative. Science may prove that we have nothing to do with it but if we might, I would want to err on the prudent and try to take care of both the weather, the increase in disease and the heat as well as the problem that we can't help with the magnetic poles effect on the Ozone. Prepare and plan. That is my answer for what you can't solve and also my answer for a market that is brutal and barbaric at best. Arnold? He doesn't look so happy these days. There are those who were happy that Bush inherited the burst bubble. He gets the credit for all of that joblessness. Also you should talk to the employees who have had their salaries cut by 1/5th just so the company won't hire a cheap incompetent youngster. Down here in the ranks they are not complaining about powerful unions but impotent ones who don't have the power to make difference. As for anyone fixing it? Expedience is a powerful tool. I remember when Reagan's tax program hurt so many of us. He blamed it on the Democrats letting him do it. That is some way to govern. There is not easy way. There is just integrity and it is in short supply. If you don't have that then vote intelligence. If you don't have that you are in trouble. REH - Original Message - From: Harry Pollard To: 'Ray Evans Harrell' ; 'Keith Hudson' ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 02, 2004 10:05 PM Subject: RE: [Futurework] Are they going mad? Ray, You say: You have defended this administration, I just assume that you are one with their agenda and language. I fear you assume too much. I have set people straight on the Florida election. For example, such nonsense as the Supreme Court elected Bush is bruited, and I unbruit it (theres a coin). Also, Ive said that the moment we entered Iraq, we have to change our thinking to look for positives that can arise from it. There is too much of a Hate Bush attitude from otherwise intelligent people. The torrent of invective launched at him is almost beyond belief. However, Ive been criticizing the Bush spending spree since before 9/11. I agreed with George Will that the steel tariff imposition was the lowest point of his administration. I hardly agree with any of his domestic policies, but then the Democrats have nothing to offer. In fact, neither of them has a clue to what is going wrong or what will makes things better. The Republicans grasp at he straw of a better looking economy. The Democrats look the other way, or close their eyes. However, what is disconcerting is that none of them know why things went wrong, or why things may improve (or not). The ignorance is appalling. Of course that makes setting us at each others throats a very appealing ploy. It prevents thought the most dangerous threat to the politician. I am impressed by the way Bush has recovered from a somewhat shaky start in which his opponents tore him to pieces at every opportunity. Also, by the way he has been resolute in his Mid-East policy. I suspect that the Saudis will become glad of US friendship, Iran will join us in putting Iraq together again already there are signs. Syria has become pussy-like with 100,000 American troops on its doorstep (though Israel could clean them off easily enough if it became necessary. Egypt is mostly in our camp. Libya is showing an attractive lack of pugnacity. North Korea is part of a six nation meeting. They are exhibiting their usual truculence, which is to be expected, but the situation looks promising. Hey! Bush the diplomat seems to be doing all right. I like Arnold. I think he might be able get a little
RE: [Futurework] Are they going mad?
Ray, You say: You have defended this administration, I just assume that you are one with their agenda and language. I fear you assume too much. I have set people straight on the Florida election. For example, such nonsense as the Supreme Court elected Bush is bruited, and I unbruit it (theres a coin). Also, Ive said that the moment we entered Iraq, we have to change our thinking to look for positives that can arise from it. There is too much of a Hate Bush attitude from otherwise intelligent people. The torrent of invective launched at him is almost beyond belief. However, Ive been criticizing the Bush spending spree since before 9/11. I agreed with George Will that the steel tariff imposition was the lowest point of his administration. I hardly agree with any of his domestic policies, but then the Democrats have nothing to offer. In fact, neither of them has a clue to what is going wrong or what will makes things better. The Republicans grasp at he straw of a better looking economy. The Democrats look the other way, or close their eyes. However, what is disconcerting is that none of them know why things went wrong, or why things may improve (or not). The ignorance is appalling. Of course that makes setting us at each others throats a very appealing ploy. It prevents thought the most dangerous threat to the politician. I am impressed by the way Bush has recovered from a somewhat shaky start in which his opponents tore him to pieces at every opportunity. Also, by the way he has been resolute in his Mid-East policy. I suspect that the Saudis will become glad of US friendship, Iran will join us in putting Iraq together again already there are signs. Syria has become pussy-like with 100,000 American troops on its doorstep (though Israel could clean them off easily enough if it became necessary. Egypt is mostly in our camp. Libya is showing an attractive lack of pugnacity. North Korea is part of a six nation meeting. They are exhibiting their usual truculence, which is to be expected, but the situation looks promising. Hey! Bush the diplomat seems to be doing all right. I like Arnold. I think he might be able get a little repair work accomplished in California. But he has inherited a $38 billion deficit in a situation where the deficit is increasing by $8 billion a year. To remind you, Davis managed to turn a $12 billion surplus into a $38 billion deficit in four years. Not to mention the long term electricity contract he negotiated at the top possible price. The legislature is an absolute shower both sides. They have gerrymandered security and neither side believes in anything except acquiring perks before their term limit hits them. Arnie might manage it. I know of no-one else who could. Harry *** Henry George School of Social Science of Los Angeles Box 655 Tujunga CA 91042 Tel: 818 352-4141--Fax: 818 353-2242 http://haledward.home.comcast.net From: Ray Evans Harrell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2003 8:32 PM To: Harry Pollard; 'Keith Hudson'; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Futurework] Are they going mad? The whole is no more the state than the individual is preternaturally uncooperative. I work in mega forms you seem to be talking the mini-forms that accomplish some things but not the big things. As for Chalk and Cheese that is cute but the current administration constantly uses compassionate, cooperative and socially redeeming language while providing no such thing. You have defended this administration, I just assume that you are one with their agenda and language. So why call me strange for simply reversing the energy? You can't admire GWB and Arnold and then turn around and say that you are for rent. They aren't. REH - Original Message - From: Harry Pollard To: 'Ray Evans Harrell' ; 'Keith Hudson' ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2003 8:23 PM Subject: RE: [Futurework] Are they going mad? Ray, It is likely that everyone across the work rewards those who contribute to them and punishes those that harm them. Americans can spend their money anyway they like. Meantime, you continue tomix chalk and cheese. You take various examples of government intervention and call it a cutthroat world, even though the various classical people you mention were against such government intervention. I have no idea how your mind can somehow link government intervention with no government intervention, but you keep doing it. Worse, you seem unaware you are doing it. Cutthroat competition, Law of the Jungle and similar phrases have been used for a long time by protectionist capitalists and the 57 varieties of socialists (you'll remember Heinz soup). The capitalists know that market competition cuts their profits so they are against
