Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
On 05/03/2012 09:50, James E. Therrault mjrtas...@gmail.com wrote: Back in the ancient computer days, I had a H/P Deskwriter that only had CMY (single cartridge) and it was the cat's butt then. Color work was not brilliant but I never had a bit of trouble with it. Later, I upgraded to a newer CMYK unit and it gave me nothing but grief! So much so that I vowed to never use another H/P product ever. And I haven't. In theory, CMY should produce perfect colors including black and it does so in traditional subtractive photographic processes just as RGB works in the additive processes. But it does not in the print process where every color media needs a black kicker to really make it work. JT (Who remembers many years in the photography and printing biz...) I wonder if you've got me beat? I have 46 years in the photo/printing biz from an apprentice at 16 through letterpress (Heidelbergs and Glockners), Litho (Heidelbergs and Fuji) to densitometer controlled limited edition printing for the Fine Art Trade Guild. Switched to prepress and management with Dainippon galley cameras, drum scanners and final film planning - then switched to study with an MA (now an MSc) in Digital Imaging at the London Institute. I also had a Deskwriter - a 510 model with black only and upgraded that to an A3 Epson 1200 with 6 colour printing. The subtractive CMY model in photography is not comparable with the CMYK print process as it uses continuous tone and specially coated materials to give it a much wider gamut of colours - print processes use plain paper and the tones have to be generated by dots to fool the human eye. Also the CMY inks for printing were never really perfected due to the wide choice and quality of papers and methods like gravure and web and the difficulty of printing heavy wet on wet areas - drying time was a big bug to printers thus the 100% black with maybe a ?% tint of C, M or Y or all three to produce a 'rich black'. I've never come across a CMY inkjet printer but obviously they must exist if you had one - they perhaps didn't last long as less colours seem to contribute less to the final image in inkjet even with the coated paper. Epson have some models which utilise 2 greys and black to produce better quality monochrome - not unusual as high quality BW printing of photographic books also used duotone and tritone. If only I could justify buying one. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CMYK_color_model Pete -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
Il giorno 5-03-2012 9:01, Peter Devlin ha scritto: In colour mode all the printers I have come across use the CMYK colorspace to print - the K is the generated black - and all the cartridges are used. I have never seen or heard of one which uses CMY only to print in color. Some cheaper printers have just a CMY cartridge, so the black is always created by blending the colours together. Nasty. ;-) I don't know if they're still produced, but my father bought such a printer (Canon) many years ago. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
On Mar 5, 2012, at 2:06 AM, Valter Prahlad wrote: Il giorno 5-03-2012 9:01, Peter Devlin ha scritto: In colour mode all the printers I have come across use the CMYK colorspace to print - the K is the generated black - and all the cartridges are used. I have never seen or heard of one which uses CMY only to print in color. Some cheaper printers have just a CMY cartridge, so the black is always created by blending the colours together. Nasty. ;-) I don't know if they're still produced, but my father bought such a printer (Canon) many years ago. Back in the ancient computer days, I had a H/P Deskwriter that only had CMY (single cartridge) and it was the cat's butt then. Color work was not brilliant but I never had a bit of trouble with it. Later, I upgraded to a newer CMYK unit and it gave me nothing but grief! So much so that I vowed to never use another H/P product ever. And I haven't. In theory, CMY should produce perfect colors including black and it does so in traditional subtractive photographic processes just as RGB works in the additive processes. But it does not in the print process where every color media needs a black kicker to really make it work. JT (Who remembers many years in the photography and printing biz...) -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
What program are you trying to get the halftone image to print from? Photoshop on it's own has some capabilities in this area, and if you are going to do a lot of images, and or you want more control on the finished look, you might consider Andromeda's Screens filter/plug-in for Photoshop, it gives you a great deal of control on the size of the halftone dots, the pattern, the threshold level, and more. The filter is great, but it's not cheap. From: Valter Prahlad valter.prah...@fastwebnet.it To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Monday, March 5, 2012 12:06 AM Subject: Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW Il giorno 5-03-2012 9:01, Peter Devlin ha scritto: In colour mode all the printers I have come across use the CMYK colorspace to print - the K is the generated black - and all the cartridges are used. I have never seen or heard of one which uses CMY only to print in color. Some cheaper printers have just a CMY cartridge, so the black is always created by blending the colours together. Nasty. ;-) I don't know if they're still produced, but my father bought such a printer (Canon) many years ago. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
FIRST let me thank all who replied both on list and off list. I will look in to the several suggestions as soon as I can, but I did want to get this out: Yes, my hp printer C-4180 All in one, does have a GREY-SCALE selection, and I did experiment with it long ago using a color pix and expecting it would print in-- what else-- Grey scales of some 256 shades, but NO, it printed in all black or all white the very reason I have appealed to the list for assistance. BTW: I do NOT find any instruction in HELP to print in BW! So as I say, I gave it up. To Santa, was the sample you sent me printed using ONLY THE BLACK INK CART? I bet it was all colors making fake black -- HOW DO YOU KNOW FOR SURE? You do know that if you print using all three colors you get FAKE BLACK! In my case, the color cart is DOA, dry as a rock, maybe that should be DAR, BUT IT has to be in the printer to get the Black cart to work. JML --- On Fri, 3/2/12, Jonas Lopez jonaslo...@yahoo.com wrote: From: Jonas Lopez jonaslo...@yahoo.com Subject: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW To: G3 G5 List g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Date: Friday, March 2, 2012, 5:12 PM From time to time I want to print in BW. Get the effect of aging in old photographs, or make your pictures look classic and use the black-and-white effect, etc. I run G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW, NOT INTEL. Any ideeas I do NOT have photoshop. A site letting me up load the pix and dl it back in halftone would work just fine. Thanks. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
On 04/03/2012 03:03, Jonas Lopez jonaslo...@yahoo.com wrote: You do know that if you print using all three colors you get FAKE BLACK! I am not very sure what you mean there - RGB images like those viewed on a computer have no black at all - black is not in the spectrum. It's only when images are sent to print that a black is generated by the conversion to CMYK. The appearance of black in RGB has the channel levels 0.0.0 whilst white is 256.256.256 levels of RGB. Black is added because when printing 100% of CMY is not only a poor effort at black it is also a serious waste of colour ink when a solid black will look better - thus UCR was developed. Basically - unless you are working in CMYK there never is a genuine black... Pete -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
At 6:26 PM + 3/4/2012, Peter Devlin wrote: You do know that if you print using all three colors you get FAKE BLACK! I am not very sure what you mean there - RGB images like those viewed on a computer have no black at all - black is not in the spectrum. It's only when images are sent to print that a black is generated by the conversion to CMYK. The appearance of black in RGB has the channel levels 0.0.0 whilst white is 256.256.256 levels of RGB. Black is added because when printing 100% of CMY is not only a poor effort at black it is also a serious waste of colour ink when a solid black will look better - thus UCR was developed. Basically - unless you are working in CMYK there never is a genuine black... Some printers have two modes - grayscale and color. In color mode they use only the color cartridges, blending as needed to create grays and blacks. In grayscale mode they use only the black cartridge... Typically blended grays and blacks look muddy, aka fake black. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
On 03/03/2012 03:34, Jonas Lopez jonaslo...@yahoo.com wrote: G'day Santa, Yes, iPhoto has in the EDIT mode a BW button, BUT THIS IS FAKE! Let me tell you why. All it does is print ALL COLORS and BLACK making a FAKE BLACK AND WHITE PIX. Not that it matters, but with the house in foreclosure, cancer, job loss, pregnant, and brother being deported, we can not spend a penny to buy a color cart, but I wanted to print using ONLY THE BLACK INK - NO COLOR FILL INS == This I have already done, it is ALL BLACK OR ALL WHITE, on a scale of 0 to 9 it is a 1 or 2. Years ago we had newspapers printing using ONLY BLACK INK, which is all I have to work with NO COLOR AT ALL, so now you see how this is fake --- not using a halftone screen This could give a 7 or 8! Any other sources for a REAL screen? Regards JML == --- On Fri, 3/2/12, Brian Christmas ozsa...@gmail.com wrote: From: Brian Christmas ozsa...@gmail.com Subject: Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Date: Friday, March 2, 2012, 5:51 PM On 03/03/2012, at 12:12 PM, Jonas Lopez wrote: From time to time I want to print in BW. Get the effect of aging in old photographs, or make your pictures look classic and use the black-and-white effect, etc. I run G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW, NOT INTEL. Any ideeas I do NOT have photoshop. A site letting me up load the pix and dl it back in halftone would work just fine. Thanks. G'day Jonas I think you're looking for greyscale printing - newspapers did indeed use a low res BW halftone screen - about 80 lines per inch I think and black ink only which gave the appearance of tone to the human eye by varying the size/distance between dots. This was analogue imaging though and digital is very different but your image editor should have the ability to convert an image to greyscale - 256 levels of grey calculated from the RGB channel values - and your printer dialogue should have the option to print in greyscale only - I have three printers and I know that at least two have this option. Pete -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
On 03/03/2012, at 2:34 PM, Jonas Lopez wrote: G'day Santa, Yes, iPhoto has in the EDIT mode a BW button, BUT THIS IS FAKE! Let me tell you why. All it does is print ALL COLORS and BLACK making a FAKE BLACK AND WHITE PIX. Not that it matters, but with the house in foreclosure, cancer, job loss, pregnant, and brother being deported, we can not spend a penny to buy a color cart, but I wanted to print using ONLY THE BLACK INK - NO COLOR FILL INS == This I have already done, it is ALL BLACK OR ALL WHITE, on a scale of 0 to 9 it is a 1 or 2. Years ago we had newspapers printing using ONLY BLACK INK, which is all I have to work with NO COLOR AT ALL, so now you see how this is fake --- not using a halftone screen This could give a 7 or 8! Any other sources for a REAL screen? Regards JML G'day Jonas I think GraphicConverter will do what you want. I'll send some off list screen shots of settings. (It's free as in Shareware) Regards Santa -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
You can run GIMP on PPC. A quick search and you will be in business. Eric From: Jonas Lopez jonaslo...@yahoo.com To: G3 G5 List g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Friday, March 2, 2012 7:12 PM Subject: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW From time to time I want to print in BW. Get the effect of aging in old photographs, or make your pictures look classic and use the black-and-white effect, etc. I run G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW, NOT INTEL. Any ideeas I do NOT have photoshop. A site letting me up load the pix and dl it back in halftone would work just fine. Thanks. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
On 03/03/2012, at 12:12 PM, Jonas Lopez wrote: From time to time I want to print in BW. Get the effect of aging in old photographs, or make your pictures look classic and use the black-and-white effect, etc. I run G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW, NOT INTEL. Any ideeas I do NOT have photoshop. A site letting me up load the pix and dl it back in halftone would work just fine. Thanks. G'day Jonas iPhoto has, and has for some time now, an edit menu, one aspect of which allows you to change pictures to BW or Sepia. I don't know what version you can run under 10.4 or 10.5. Regards Santa -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
G'day Santa, Yes, iPhoto has in the EDIT mode a BW button, BUT THIS IS FAKE! Let me tell you why. All it does is print ALL COLORS and BLACK making a FAKE BLACK AND WHITE PIX. Not that it matters, but with the house in foreclosure, cancer, job loss, pregnant, and brother being deported, we can not spend a penny to buy a color cart, but I wanted to print using ONLY THE BLACK INK - NO COLOR FILL INS == This I have already done, it is ALL BLACK OR ALL WHITE, on a scale of 0 to 9 it is a 1 or 2. Years ago we had newspapers printing using ONLY BLACK INK, which is all I have to work with NO COLOR AT ALL, so now you see how this is fake --- not using a halftone screen This could give a 7 or 8! Any other sources for a REAL screen? Regards JML == --- On Fri, 3/2/12, Brian Christmas ozsa...@gmail.com wrote: From: Brian Christmas ozsa...@gmail.com Subject: Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Date: Friday, March 2, 2012, 5:51 PM On 03/03/2012, at 12:12 PM, Jonas Lopez wrote: From time to time I want to print in BW. Get the effect of aging in old photographs, or make your pictures look classic and use the black-and-white effect, etc. I run G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW, NOT INTEL. Any ideeas I do NOT have photoshop. A site letting me up load the pix and dl it back in halftone would work just fine. Thanks. G'day Jonas iPhoto has, and has for some time now, an edit menu, one aspect of which allows you to change pictures to BW or Sepia. I don't know what version you can run under 10.4 or 10.5. Regards Santa -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW
At 5:12 PM -0800 3/2/2012, Jonas Lopez wrote: From time to time I want to print in BW. Get the effect of aging in old photographs, or make your pictures look classic and use the black-and-white effect, etc. I run G4 10.4 or 10.5 looking for way to halftone a picture to print in BW, NOT INTEL. GraphicConverter, Gimp, iPhoto, Color It!, Photo Deluxe, etc. If you just want simple bw, then there's probably an option in the print dialog under the ColorSync tab for bw etc. (depends on the printer's driver). - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
