Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Ales Hvezda wrote: [snip] Probably parenthesis mismatch in /sw/etc/gEDA/system-gschemrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) Failed to read init scm file [(null)/gschem.scm] Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Loading schematic [/Users/hamster/untitled_1.sch] Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Tried to get an invalid color: 7 Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Tried to get an invalid color: 7 ERROR: Unbound variable: press-key I don't run OSX and I don't really know anything about the fink packages, but does the file gschem-darkbg exist either in /sw/etc/gEDA/ or somewhere under /sw/share/gEDA/ ? It's in /sw/etc/gEDA -dave If it does exist, one thought would be to either copy or symlink it into the other location. doesn't help ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Steven Ball wrote: /sw/etc/gEDA/gschem-darkbg exists, but you bring up a good point. The older, working version of the geda-bundle uses: (define gedadata (getenv GEDADATA)) (define gedadatarc (getenv GEDADATARC)) (load (string-append gedadatarc /gschem-darkbg)) ; dark background The newer version uses (load (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) I see from the CVS logs that the configs and etc were refactored a while ago. Perhaps gEDA can't figure out the base path correctly? That sure smells like what is going on. -dave ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Thursday 27 September 2007 03:33:23 Steven Ball wrote: /sw/etc/gEDA/gschem-darkbg exists, but you bring up a good point. The older, working version of the geda-bundle uses: (define gedadata (getenv GEDADATA)) (define gedadatarc (getenv GEDADATARC)) (load (string-append gedadatarc /gschem-darkbg)) ; dark background The newer version uses (load (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) I see from the CVS logs that the configs and etc were refactored a while ago. Perhaps gEDA can't figure out the base path correctly? How does the build-path geda-rc-path get evaluated? As for the old one, I can't find any environment variables called 'GEDADATA' or etc, so I am unsure how that even gets set up. Please run gschem with the following lines in your gafrc: (display (string-append gEDA data directory: geda-data-path \n)) (display (string-append gEDA RC file directory: geda-rc-path \n)) Both these are defined by libgeda from the options passed to the configure script at build time (libgeda/src/g_register.c, g_register_libgeda_vars(), line 108). My suspicion is that there has a been a packaging error, and that either GEDADATADIR or GEDARCDIR has not been correctly set during the build. If GEDARCDIR is _not_ set, then it defaults to the value of GEDADATADIR. Specifically, I suspect that libgeda and gschem have been compiled with GEDADATADIR or GEDARCDIR set differently, which will result in gschem's Scheme code being placed somewhere other than where libgeda will be able to find it. Please refer this problem to the maintainer(s) of the Fink packages. Regards, Peter signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: ngspice simulation with microcontrollers
Andy Peters wrote: On Sep 26, 2007, at 5:05 PM, Dan McMahill wrote: That can get you closer. You probably don't want to build a complete model for a microcontroller in verilog to the point of being able to run the same firmware image as the real hardware, but you probably could. I've written functional simulation for various digital logic in the past (vhdl, but applies to verilog too). It was just enough code to excercise the IO, and it was simple to write commands to do writes and reads then watch as the stuff responded. Made a great tool for debugging since the schematic used for simulation was the same as that used for pcb design. Now, if the simulator could couple IBIS models and synchronize the digital and analog simulations - that would be sweet! gene ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: Arc to line connections?
I am trying to draw connections to pads with arcs, so that I can use the puller. (The normal -- not global -- puller only works with arc/line intersections, right?) The manual says I can just switch tools in the middle of a trace using the right keys (F2/F3 in the lesstif HID). This works when going from a straight line to an arc, but when I try switching from arc to line it does not work properly. It switches to the line tool, but cancels the current trace, so that I have to manually click on the same point again. When I'm using a fine grid setting, it can be quite difficult to make sure I hit the same point. Am I doing something wrong, or is this a bug? I'm using the lesstif interface and the latest release (20070912). Of course, I also don't feel like I have a good handle on the puller tool yet. Any tips on how to use it properly? I gater the idea is mostly to reduce trace lengths by using truly straight paths, rather than confining everything to 45-deg increments. Of course, I can use all-direction lines for that, so the main advantage of the puller seems to be in avoiding sharp corners. Are most folks out there still using 45-deg lines, or are we starting to transition to ugly boards with lines going every which way? Professional boards seem to use only 45-deg increments -- just judging by what I see when I open up computers and consumer products. -- Randall ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: Exposed copper -- still need to make a pad?
I need to make an exposed area of copper (no soldermask), to act as a heat radiator. Last time I checked, the answer was to create a big SMD pad. Is this still a limitation? It sure would be nice to be able to draw arbitrary polygons and set a flag on them to clear soldermask. -- Randall ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Exposed copper -- still need to make a pad?
On Sep 27, 2007, at 9:28 AM, Randall Nortman wrote: I need to make an exposed area of copper (no soldermask), to act as a heat radiator. Why no soldermask? I'll bet its infrared emissivity is better than copper's, making a better radiator. In space, the radiator tape we use has a thin layer of teflon over the metal for this reason. Last time I checked, the answer was to create a big SMD pad. Is this still a limitation? It sure would be nice to be able to draw arbitrary polygons and set a flag on them to clear soldermask. -- Randall ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: FW: Settings/Auto Update
I am running gEDA under Fedora Core 6. Every once in awhile I allow the auto update to update gschem. This all works fine except that it always overwrites my settings files(symbol locations, custom attributes). Is there any way to do the auto update w/o having your settings files blown away(other than copying the files before the update)? _ Discover the new Windows Vista http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vistamkt=en-USform=QBRE ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Exposed copper -- still need to make a pad?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:44:36AM -0600, John Doty wrote: On Sep 27, 2007, at 9:28 AM, Randall Nortman wrote: I need to make an exposed area of copper (no soldermask), to act as a heat radiator. Why no soldermask? I'll bet its infrared emissivity is better than copper's, making a better radiator. In space, the radiator tape we use has a thin layer of teflon over the metal for this reason. As sayeth the datasheet, so do-eth the designer! In fact, any exposed copper is going to be covered in shiny silver stuff (tin/lead/silver, depending on process) during board fab. Would that not have pretty darned good emissivity? It would certainly have better conductivity, which is important when you're not designing for vacuum. I suspect that most of my cooling is going to be from conduction to air and subsequent convection (natural convection; no fan), though a big chunk of it will be radiation. (I did say heat radiator in my post -- probably heat sink would have been more appropriate.) -- Randall ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: FW: Settings/Auto Update
On Thursday 27 September 2007 17:06:07 Mike Hansen wrote: I am running gEDA under Fedora Core 6. Every once in awhile I allow the auto update to update gschem. This all works fine except that it always overwrites my settings files(symbol locations, custom attributes). Is there any way to do the auto update w/o having your settings files blown away(other than copying the files before the update)? I recommend using a .gafrc and .gschemrc in your home directory. Regards, Peter signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Peter TB Brett wrote: Please run gschem with the following lines in your gafrc: (display (string-append gEDA data directory: geda-data-path \n)) /sw/share/gEDA (display (string-append gEDA RC file directory: geda-rc-path \n)) /sw/etc/gEDA -dave ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Exposed copper -- still need to make a pad?
On Thursday 27 September 2007 17:06:49 Randall Nortman wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:44:36AM -0600, John Doty wrote: On Sep 27, 2007, at 9:28 AM, Randall Nortman wrote: I need to make an exposed area of copper (no soldermask), to act as a heat radiator. Why no soldermask? I'll bet its infrared emissivity is better than copper's, making a better radiator. In space, the radiator tape we use has a thin layer of teflon over the metal for this reason. As sayeth the datasheet, so do-eth the designer! In fact, any exposed copper is going to be covered in shiny silver stuff (tin/lead/silver, depending on process) during board fab. What, not gold? Peter signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Exposed copper -- still need to make a pad?
On Sep 27, 2007, at 10:06 AM, Randall Nortman wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:44:36AM -0600, John Doty wrote: On Sep 27, 2007, at 9:28 AM, Randall Nortman wrote: I need to make an exposed area of copper (no soldermask), to act as a heat radiator. Why no soldermask? I'll bet its infrared emissivity is better than copper's, making a better radiator. In space, the radiator tape we use has a thin layer of teflon over the metal for this reason. As sayeth the datasheet, so do-eth the designer! As sayeth the physics, so doeth this designer! Datasheets are extremely valuable, but understanding what's going on behind the curtain is also important. Datasheets aren't the last word in a real application. In fact, any exposed copper is going to be covered in shiny silver stuff (tin/lead/silver, depending on process) during board fab. Would that not have pretty darned good emissivity? Nope. Shiny means low emissivity. Black means high emissivity. Most plastics are pretty black in the infrared, but most metals are even shinier there than in the visible. It would certainly have better conductivity, which is important when you're not designing for vacuum. Conductivity is important when you're spreading the heat out. But a thin film of plastic over the metal is very little barrier to heat flow in the thin direction. A reflective surface is a real barrier to radiation, however. That's why we put aluminum over the plastic film to make a blanket. I suspect that most of my cooling is going to be from conduction to air and subsequent convection (natural convection; no fan), though a big chunk of it will be radiation. Won't get a lot of radiation from bare metal. (I did say heat radiator in my post -- probably heat sink would have been more appropriate.) -- Randall ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Exposed copper -- still need to make a pad?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 05:37:18PM +0100, Peter TB Brett wrote: On Thursday 27 September 2007 17:06:49 Randall Nortman wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:44:36AM -0600, John Doty wrote: On Sep 27, 2007, at 9:28 AM, Randall Nortman wrote: I need to make an exposed area of copper (no soldermask), to act as a heat radiator. Why no soldermask? I'll bet its infrared emissivity is better than copper's, making a better radiator. In space, the radiator tape we use has a thin layer of teflon over the metal for this reason. As sayeth the datasheet, so do-eth the designer! In fact, any exposed copper is going to be covered in shiny silver stuff (tin/lead/silver, depending on process) during board fab. What, not gold? Gold has even lower infrared emissivity than silver or copper. OTOH, your radiator has to get quite hot to carry away much heat by infrared radiation. Presumably you have some airflow, either passive (convection) or active (fan-driven). Then you want exposed metal, and its emissivity doesn't matter much. - Larry ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Thursday 27 September 2007 17:26:34 Dave N6NZ wrote: Peter TB Brett wrote: Please run gschem with the following lines in your gafrc: (display (string-append gEDA data directory: geda-data-path \n)) /sw/share/gEDA (display (string-append gEDA RC file directory: geda-rc-path \n)) /sw/etc/gEDA Thanks -- as I thought, they've separated the system configuration files from the regular scripts. Correct me if I'm wrong: 1. /sw/etc/gEDA/gschem-darkbg exists. 2. geda-rc-path is equal to /sw/etc/gEDA. 3. (load (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) appears to fail[1]. If so, that is extremely odd, and I can't work out why it might be the case... can you please stick this expression in your gafrc and see what it outputs? (display (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) We'll get to the bottom of this! Peter [1] The (not particularly complicated) definition of the build-path function is given in geda.scm. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Exposed copper -- still need to make a pad?
On Sep 27, 2007, at 10:41 AM, Larry Doolittle wrote: OTOH, your radiator has to get quite hot to carry away much heat by infrared radiation. Presumably you have some airflow, either passive (convection) or active (fan-driven). Then you want exposed metal, and its emissivity doesn't matter much. You'd be surprised at how much gets carried away by radiation. For things like resistors, 2X derating relative to natural convection is generally sufficient in a vacuum. But if you calculate the thermal resistance of a thin plastic film over metal, you'll find it's negligible. John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Sep 27, 2007, at 10:26 AM, Dave N6NZ wrote: Peter TB Brett wrote: Please run gschem with the following lines in your gafrc: (display (string-append gEDA data directory: geda-data-path \n)) /sw/share/gEDA (display (string-append gEDA RC file directory: geda-rc-path \n)) /sw/etc/gEDA For reference, my working Fink gschem gives the same. And please include Charles Lepple in this thread: he's the packager, but he doesn't monitor the gEDA forums. John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Sep 27, 2007, at 10:50 AM, Peter TB Brett wrote: (display (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) For reference, my working installation sensibly gives: /sw/etc/gEDA/gschem-darkbg John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
1. /sw/etc/gEDA/gschem-darkbg exists. Yes, it exists 2. geda-rc-path is equal to /sw/etc/gEDA. Yes: gEDA data directory: /sw/share/gEDA gEDA RC file directory: /sw/etc/gEDA 3. (load (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) appears to fail[1]. Yes. If so, that is extremely odd, and I can't work out why it might be the case... can you please stick this expression in your gafrc and see what it outputs? (display (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) Probably parenthesis mismatch in /sw/etc/gEDA/system-gschemrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) It would almost seem that the build-path stuff is borked somehow. I changed the line to read: (load /sw/etc/gEDA/gschem-darkbg) ; dark background And it loaded the background, at least. Bombed again at: Probably parenthesis mismatch in /sw/etc/gEDA/system-gschemrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] default-attrib-positions.scm) We'll get to the bottom of this! Peter [1] The (not particularly complicated) definition of the build-path function is given in geda.scm. I don't see a 'geda.scm' anywhere: plutonium:/sw root# find . | grep geda.scm ./share/doc/geda-doc/wiki/geda_scm.html ./share/gEDA/scheme/gnet-geda.scm Maybe I am missing something? Regardless, my older, working version on my other mac lacks this file as well, so maybe not. Thanks a bunch for your help debugging this. -Steve ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Probably parenthesis mismatch in /sw/etc/gEDA/system-gschemrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) This sounds like a guile problem. Please report your version of guile. Stuart ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Guile 1.6.7 On Thu, 27 Sep 2007 13:55:11 -0400 (EDT), Stuart Brorson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Probably parenthesis mismatch in /sw/etc/gEDA/system-gschemrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) This sounds like a guile problem. Please report your version of guile. Stuart ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Arc to line connections?
The manual says I can just switch tools in the middle of a trace using the right keys (F2/F3 in the lesstif HID). This works when going from a straight line to an arc, but when I try switching from arc to line it does not work properly. Whenever you switch tools or layers, you always click on the LAST point, then switch tools. So, you should be finishing up the arc, starting a new arc, switching that to a line, and drawing the line. I gather the idea is mostly to reduce trace lengths by using truly straight paths, It's to make the board look pretty, nothing else really. However, if you're also using the teardrop tool, the puller gives you more room on that initial segment on which to put the teardrop. Of course, I can use all-direction lines for that, so the main advantage of the puller seems to be in avoiding sharp corners. I originally wrote it to help with BGA breakouts, because sometimes you can get two arcs between pads where two 45-degree corners won't fit. Professional boards seem to use only 45-deg increments -- just judging by what I see when I open up computers and consumer products. Professional boards used to have lines going in all directions, because they were more reliable to fab and offered better signal quality. These days it doesn't matter as much, and the autorouters are good at routing 45's. However, the new topological autorouters won't be limited to 45's any more, so we may start seeing more any-way lines. Besides, look at your motherboard in your PC. The autorouters seem to care more about matched trace lengths than how pretty it is; traces on my MB wiggle all over the place to keep trace lengths consistent across busses. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Guile 1.6.7 Should be OK. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Exposed copper -- still need to make a pad?
Last time I checked, the answer was to create a big SMD pad. Is this still a limitation? Yup, no change in pcb for that. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Sep 27, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Stuart Brorson wrote: Probably parenthesis mismatch in /sw/etc/gEDA/system-gschemrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) This sounds like a guile problem. Please report your version of guile. I have both 1.6.7 (guile16) and 1.8.2 (guile18). I presume Charles' package installs against 1.8 in that case. So I think, Stuart, you're on to something. Dave, try removing your geda-bundle, installing guile18, and then reinstall geda-bundle. Guile makes those back ends easy, but its forward and backward incompatibilities sure have been a PITA... John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Peter TB Brett wrote: On Thursday 27 September 2007 17:26:34 Dave N6NZ wrote: Peter TB Brett wrote: Please run gschem with the following lines in your gafrc: (display (string-append gEDA data directory: geda-data-path \n)) /sw/share/gEDA (display (string-append gEDA RC file directory: geda-rc-path \n)) /sw/etc/gEDA Thanks -- as I thought, they've separated the system configuration files from the regular scripts. Correct me if I'm wrong: 1. /sw/etc/gEDA/gschem-darkbg exists. yes 2. geda-rc-path is equal to /sw/etc/gEDA. yes 3. (load (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) appears to fail[1]. yes If so, that is extremely odd, and I can't work out why it might be the case... can you please stick this expression in your gafrc and see what it outputs? (display (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) chokes! methinks perhaps a lower level error? prompt:~ dave$ gschem gEDA/gschem version 1.2.0.20070902 gEDA/gschem comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; see COPYING for more details. This is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it under certain conditions; please see the COPYING file for more details. gEDA data directory: /sw/share/gEDA gEDA RC file directory: /sw/etc/gEDA Probably parenthesis mismatch in /Users/dave/gafrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) Probably parenthesis mismatch in /sw/etc/gEDA/system-gschemrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) Failed to read init scm file [(null)/gschem.scm] Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Loading schematic [/Users/dave/untitled_1.sch] Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Tried to get an invalid color: 7 Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Tried to get an invalid color: 7 We'll get to the bottom of this! Peter [1] The (not particularly complicated) definition of the build-path function is given in geda.scm. Which you would expect live where? prompt:/sw dave$ find . -name geda.scm -print prompt:/sw dave$ !! -dave ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Sep 27, 2007, at 12:31 PM, Dave N6NZ wrote: Peter TB Brett wrote: On Thursday 27 September 2007 17:26:34 Dave N6NZ wrote: Peter TB Brett wrote: Please run gschem with the following lines in your gafrc: (display (string-append gEDA data directory: geda-data-path \n)) /sw/share/gEDA (display (string-append gEDA RC file directory: geda-rc- path \n)) /sw/etc/gEDA Thanks -- as I thought, they've separated the system configuration files from the regular scripts. Correct me if I'm wrong: 1. /sw/etc/gEDA/gschem-darkbg exists. yes 2. geda-rc-path is equal to /sw/etc/gEDA. yes 3. (load (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) appears to fail [1]. yes If so, that is extremely odd, and I can't work out why it might be the case... can you please stick this expression in your gafrc and see what it outputs? (display (build-path geda-rc-path gschem-darkbg)) chokes! methinks perhaps a lower level error? prompt:~ dave$ gschem gEDA/gschem version 1.2.0.20070902 gEDA/gschem comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; see COPYING for more details. This is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it under certain conditions; please see the COPYING file for more details. gEDA data directory: /sw/share/gEDA gEDA RC file directory: /sw/etc/gEDA Probably parenthesis mismatch in /Users/dave/gafrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem- darkbg)) Probably parenthesis mismatch in /sw/etc/gEDA/system-gschemrc Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (build-path geda-rc-path gschem- darkbg)) Failed to read init scm file [(null)/gschem.scm] Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Loading schematic [/Users/dave/untitled_1.sch] Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Tried to get an invalid color: 7 Tried to get an invalid color: 0 Tried to get an invalid color: 7 We'll get to the bottom of this! Peter [1] The (not particularly complicated) definition of the build- path function is given in geda.scm. Which you would expect live where? /sw/share/gEDA/scheme/ But if it isn't there, the bomb out starts with: Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] geda.scm) prompt:/sw dave$ find . -name geda.scm -print prompt:/sw dave$ !! -dave ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
John Doty wrote: [1] The (not particularly complicated) definition of the build-path function is given in geda.scm. Which you would expect live where? /sw/share/gEDA/scheme/ But if it isn't there, the bomb out starts with: Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] geda.scm) Well, not for me. /sw/share/gEDA/scheme/geda.scm does not exist. -dave ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:18 PM, Dave N6NZ wrote: John Doty wrote: [1] The (not particularly complicated) definition of the build-path function is given in geda.scm. Which you would expect live where? /sw/share/gEDA/scheme/ But if it isn't there, the bomb out starts with: Most recently read form: ([EMAIL PROTECTED] geda.scm) Well, not for me. /sw/share/gEDA/scheme/geda.scm does not exist. Have you tried installing guile18, and then reinstalling geda-bundle? I really suspect the Guile compatibility issues are biting you here. There are some hoops the installer needs to jump through depending on which version of Guile you have, and Fink handles this differently from other free software distros. And I'm having no problem with guile18. John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Arc to line connections?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 02:01:44PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote: The manual says I can just switch tools in the middle of a trace using the right keys (F2/F3 in the lesstif HID). This works when going from a straight line to an arc, but when I try switching from arc to line it does not work properly. Whenever you switch tools or layers, you always click on the LAST point, then switch tools. So, you should be finishing up the arc, starting a new arc, switching that to a line, and drawing the line. Yup, that's what I've been doing. Just to test, I started a new blank board and it worked just fine. So I started turning things off in the settings menu until I narrowed it down to Auto-enforce DRC clearance. If that is enabled, I cannot go from arc to line (but I can go from line to arc). If it is disabled, everything works just fine. However, the new topological autorouters won't be limited to 45's any more, so we may start seeing more any-way lines. Speaking of which, as I was playing with all-direction lines, I noticed that they do not enforce clearance properly. They will enforce clearance of pads, but not other traces. It happily lets me come too close to another trace with an all-direction line, and even to touch it. If I then run a DRC check (or just redraw the rat's nest) it complains about the touching copper. While I'm complaining about quirks -- here's another couple that I noticed. One I seem to be able to reproduce reliably: Set up two netlist-connected pads that aren't connected by traces yet. Start drawing a trace (45-degree) at one of the pads, connect it to the other, then hit 'U' to undo that last segmen, without ending the drawing operation. For me, it will indeed undo the segment, but the start point of the current segment (that I'm in the middle of drawing) will stay on the pad I just connected, instead of reverting to the previous starting point. (So that pad actually ends up unconnected, since it just undid the segment that connected to it, but the start point of the current segment is wrong.) It works fine if I undo before I contact another pad. I have also noticed, but cannot reliably reproduce yet, that it sometimes spontaneously inserts vias at the endpoints of segments of my traces, also possibly associated with undo operations. I might be fat-fingering the U key? I dunno, but it happened to me several times today. -- Randall ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:26 PM, John Doty wrote: Have you tried installing guile18, and then reinstalling geda-bundle? I really suspect the Guile compatibility issues are biting you here. There are some hoops the installer needs to jump through depending on which version of Guile you have, and Fink handles this differently from other free software distros. And I'm having no problem with guile18. The binary packages built for OS X depend on guile16 being installed. Maybe I should try building from source and see what happens. -Steve ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Arc to line connections?
So I started turning things off in the settings menu until I narrowed it down to Auto-enforce DRC clearance. For reference, I never use that setting. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Build from source is what worked for me. On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:45 PM, Steven Ball wrote: On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:26 PM, John Doty wrote: Have you tried installing guile18, and then reinstalling geda-bundle? I really suspect the Guile compatibility issues are biting you here. There are some hoops the installer needs to jump through depending on which version of Guile you have, and Fink handles this differently from other free software distros. And I'm having no problem with guile18. The binary packages built for OS X depend on guile16 being installed. Maybe I should try building from source and see what happens. -Steve ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
On Sep 27, 2007, at 12:47 PM, John Doty wrote: Build from source is what worked for me. Same here. -a On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:45 PM, Steven Ball wrote: On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:26 PM, John Doty wrote: Have you tried installing guile18, and then reinstalling geda- bundle? I really suspect the Guile compatibility issues are biting you here. There are some hoops the installer needs to jump through depending on which version of Guile you have, and Fink handles this differently from other free software distros. And I'm having no problem with guile18. The binary packages built for OS X depend on guile16 being installed. Maybe I should try building from source and see what happens. -Steve ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: Auto-enforce DRC clearance (was Arc to line connections)
[Apologies if this goes to the list twice; I sent it out the first time from the wrong address, so I think the list software will block that copy.] On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 03:47:18PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote: So I started turning things off in the settings menu until I narrowed it down to Auto-enforce DRC clearance. For reference, I never use that setting. I find it invaluable, as it tells me in real time exactly how close I can bring my trace to things it's not supposed to touch. I like to pack things quite tightly. Without auto-enforce, I'd be constantly running the DRC checker and re-drawing traces. It seems like it would be quite tedious. -- Randall ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Auto-enforce DRC clearance (was Arc to line connections)
On 9/27/07, Randall Nortman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [Apologies if this goes to the list twice; I sent it out the first time from the wrong address, so I think the list software will block that copy.] On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 03:47:18PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote: So I started turning things off in the settings menu until I narrowed it down to Auto-enforce DRC clearance. For reference, I never use that setting. I find it invaluable, as it tells me in real time exactly how close I can bring my trace to things it's not supposed to touch. I like to pack things quite tightly. Without auto-enforce, I'd be constantly running the DRC checker and re-drawing traces. It seems like it would be quite tedious. I find it invaluable as well. I also like the Crosshair shows DRC clearance option. Those options make it much quicker to layout dense traces. (* jcl *) -- http://www.luciani.org ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Auto-enforce DRC clearance (was Arc to line connections)
I find it invaluable, as it tells me in real time exactly how close I can bring my trace to things it's not supposed to touch. Try Crosshair shows DRC clearance. That's what I use, or I just measure using Ctrl-M. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: ngspice simulation with microcontrollers
Andy Peters wrote: On Sep 26, 2007, at 5:05 PM, Dan McMahill wrote: That can get you closer. You probably don't want to build a complete model for a microcontroller in verilog to the point of being able to run the same firmware image as the real hardware, but you probably could. While it's a pretty simple processor, I've simulated designs with Xilinx Picoblaze processors including the firmware. worked well enough. Anything more complex could get slow and ugly. That's promising. I'm thinking of just a bit of code that gives a bitwise accurate model of the datastream, matching to the timing of the analog model in gnucap as test benches do in logic models. Just to test out your combination of sigma delta front end quantizer and numerical filter together, for instance. for sensorless motor control and such. John Griessen -- Ecosensory Austin TX ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Probably parenthesis mismatch error on OS X
Built from source, no issues now. I guess there is an issue with the binary package, then. Thanks all for your help! -Steve On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:47 PM, John Doty wrote: Build from source is what worked for me. On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:45 PM, Steven Ball wrote: On Sep 27, 2007, at 1:26 PM, John Doty wrote: Have you tried installing guile18, and then reinstalling geda- bundle? I really suspect the Guile compatibility issues are biting you here. There are some hoops the installer needs to jump through depending on which version of Guile you have, and Fink handles this differently from other free software distros. And I'm having no problem with guile18. The binary packages built for OS X depend on guile16 being installed. Maybe I should try building from source and see what happens. -Steve ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: buzzing board
I got the new parts today. Redux: Adding 100uF electrolytic, swapping in 10u 25v 1206 ceramic did NOT get rid of the buzzing, just reduced it a little. Swapping in 10u 16v 1206 tantalum with the 100u DID get rid of the buzzing, both the low pitch and high. There's still 80mV P-P spikes on the line[*] at 8.3KHz (line refresh rate) but that's 6X better than the 500mV ripple it used to have. Lesson: for heavy-noisy loads at audible frequencies, you need sufficient non-ceramic decoupling before (or instead of) the ceramics. [*] http://www.delorie.com/electronics/alarmclock/ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: buzzing board
Put them sideways. Then you can put two Tants. in the one footprint. Assuming there is enough metal at the edge of the bottom, there has been in the past. There isn't. The metal is narrower than the cap. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: buzzing board
On Thursday 27 September 2007 08:09:34 pm DJ Delorie wrote: to reduce the peaks even more you may double up your tants if that is possible with your parts/layout. Not really. I can double up ceramics because the metal goes all the way around, but for the tants the metal is only on the bottom. Plus, I'm already putting 1206 caps on 0805 footprints. It just barely fits. Put them sideways. Then you can put two Tants. in the one footprint. Assuming there is enough metal at the edge of the bottom, there has been in the past. We, the Willing; Lead by the Unknowing; Are doing the impossible for the Ungrateful. We have done so much, for so long, with so little. We are now qualified to do anything, with nothing, forever. - Preface to Murphy's Laws. :-) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: ngspice simulation with microcontrollers
On Wednesday 26 September 2007, John Doty wrote: On Sep 25, 2007, at 1:03 AM, Amos Tibaldi wrote: Hello, I write this mail in order to obtain help if possible for the use of the ngspice simulator. How can I simulate the behaviour of a microcontroller that is present in the schematic of a circuit with ngspice? Basically, you can't. What I do in these situations is substitute voltage sources for the microcontroller output pins and generate PWL stimuli for them. Put probes where the inputs would be, .PRINT those voltages, and use an AWK or C program to extract bits from the recorded voltages. Of course, that's a one-way data flow: if you really want the microcontroller to participate, you can't do it that way. What I think you want is very difficult, and likely impractical. That's one way. Given the tools we have, the only way that works. Amos, I am curious what you want to accomplish. Do you want a complete simulation of a system containining a microprocessor? If so, Spice, or anything Spice-like, is not for you. Do you want to simulate the analog portion of a circuit that connects to a pin on the micro? That's what John's approach will do. What are you using for a model of the micro? With our tools, the only one we have is John's approach. With some commercial products, an IBIS model might be the answer. In the netlist there is a row starting for example with U3 but I don't know how to implement its behaviour in a way that the ngspice simulation considers it. I have seen in the gEDA Suite GUI that there is a row with written Chip programs that has leafs verilog .v files. May be that is the way? But in such a case how can I inform ngspice to use the verilog listing? Perhaps you want a digital Verilog simulator instead? How about Icarus Verilog? Perhaps Al will chime in about gnucap: I suppose you could write some sort of plugin that allows the program you'd run in the microcontroller to interact in an event-driven way with an analog sim. For now, it's the same as Spice. The plugin system is developed enough now to allow more people to get involved with development. I see plugins coming to do things like other languages, and other kinds of models. Eventually, I see plugins that will do things like Verilog-AMS behavioral models, interface to Icarus Verilog, interface to GHDL, interface to octave, IBIS, etc.. That's not ready yet. You could write a plugin to do something very specific, but it isn't practical yet. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: buzzing board
Copper Tape! :-P Inside joke, Copper Tape seems to be the duct tape of my place. On 9/28/07, DJ Delorie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: to reduce the peaks even more you may double up your tants if that is possible with your parts/layout. Not really. I can double up ceramics because the metal goes all the way around, but for the tants the metal is only on the bottom. Plus, I'm already putting 1206 caps on 0805 footprints. It just barely fits. The oled has a fairly long flex on it, about 4 inches, so I can only hope that the chip has its own decoupling caps nearby it if it's that critical. The +12v supply is only for the LEDs themselves, not the logic. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
