Re: [Gendergap] Pimp
Hi everyone, I'm sorry that my first post on the gender-gap list is a little mean. I'm a wikipedia-fr admin, active member of Wikimédia France chapter and a member of the OTRS team. Yet, since I've joined gender-gap a week early, I receive more mails from this list than all the other lists together. I'm also not a native English speaker, which means every mail takes me a little longer of my time. I thought the goal of this list was to discuss about women on wikimedia projects and how to attract new ones. I don't think it is useful to point out every single piece of sexism from en-wikipedia, in articles and discussion pages, for that. Or start http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Gender_gap/en-wikipedia. I could point out sexism comments from fr-wikipedia every day, but I'm really not sure it is a constructive thing to do. To come back to Madam vs Pimp, I think you either should start the discussion there : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Sexology_and_sexuality, or stop asking permission to create articles. If it bothers someone, she will ask for a fusion. Caroline (User:Léna) 2011/12/25 Sarah Stierch sarah.stie...@gmail.com Hi everyone, I'm doing a bit of fiddling with some articles related to sexuality and came across an article about a madam [[Polly Adler]]. The word madam was linked to [[pimp]]. While the article opens mentioning that a woman who runs a brothel is called a madam, it's an extremely male dominated article and focuses on the violent and sordid world of being a pimp, for lack of better words. I, frankly, would *love* to see madam have it's own article. Perhaps we should discuss it on the pimp page or just BE BOLD. (I don't have time to start a well fleshed out madam article, but, I'd be interested in perhaps collaborating with others to do it.) Thoughts? -Sarah -- Sarah Stierch Consulting -- Historical, cultural, new media artistic research advising. http://www.sarahstierch.com ___ Gendergap mailing list Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap ___ Gendergap mailing list Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap
Re: [Gendergap] Pimp
*I must say, you are the first person to openly complain, and if others feel strongly about it I can cease sharing content that I think needs urgent help or peer review. * Well, I second Caroline. I already said this in Foundation-l but again: I don't think that delete pictures of Wikipe-tan, remove a vagina from the article with the same name or create a article for a female pimp (only to mention a few cases I remember now) are the way we will solve gender gap. So yes, please stop post this here, or use the wikiEN-lhttps://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-lmailing list. And Sarah, this If you don't like you can sign the digest mode sounds rude to me, as if you are inviting her to leave. (I'm not a english native, but that is how appears to me) _ *Béria Lima* Wikimedia Portugal http://wikimedia.pt (351) 963 953 042 *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho. http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos* On 25 December 2011 17:03, Sarah Stierch sarah.stie...@gmail.com wrote: Caroline, I apologize if my occasional posting of an interesting article in English Wikipedia has been a burden, deterrent, or has went against the goal of this mailing list for you. Since I have joined, it has been something we have been doing, and the past month or so the list has been rather quiet compared to other times in the past. In the past, when we have shared articles of questionable matter, subject, sexism, or other issues, we've had great success of working together or independently to improve those articles, and often those improvements have been done by women who are on this list, which is very cool. I of course urge folks in any language to share content, however, with most Wikipedia mailing lists, systematic language bias does exist, as many are in English, though I know that was not the main point of your post. Thanks for the suggestions. I'll probably start out discussing it on the talk page of the article and also the project page. Again, I apologize if my own interests in article improvement in English Wikipedia have deterred or went against the mission of this mailing list. I must say, you are the first person to openly complain, and if others feel strongly about it I can cease sharing content that I think needs urgent help or peer review. As you did state, we could be pointing out issues of sexism all the time, however, sometimes I feel there are things of interest to the broader community, or something that might interest someone. (And while it has mainly been me lately, if you explore the history of the mailing list it's usually not just me flooding up your mailbox =) ) I also must add, my sharing of articles of interest and concern have wielded nothing but positive on.Wiki improvement of these subjects, which for me, means the closing of the gender gap in a different manner - one more subject area related to women or women's history which is covered in a more equal and respectful manner. We also offer, as you probably know, a digest mode, so, if this list is too busy for you (I think we are rather minimal these days, compared to lists such as internal-l and foundation-l) that might be something to consider. I'm glad you have joined and chosen to participate, and I am really sorry if my posts have been intruding. Sarah *Sarah Stierch* Wikimedia Foundation Community Fellow Support the sharing of free knowledge around the world: donate todayhttp://wikimediafoundation.org/w/index.php?title=WMFJA085/en/USutm_source=WMdonateutm_medium=sidebarutm_campaign=20110130SB003language=enuselang=encountry=USreferrer=http%3A%2F%2Fwikimediafoundation.org%2Fwiki%2FHome On 12/25/11 5:59 AM, Caroline Becker wrote: Hi everyone, I'm sorry that my first post on the gender-gap list is a little mean. I'm a wikipedia-fr admin, active member of Wikimédia France chapter and a member of the OTRS team. Yet, since I've joined gender-gap a week early, I receive more mails from this list than all the other lists together. I'm also not a native English speaker, which means every mail takes me a little longer of my time. I thought the goal of this list was to discuss about women on wikimedia projects and how to attract new ones. I don't think it is useful to point out every single piece of sexism from en-wikipedia, in articles and discussion pages, for that. Or start http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Gender_gap/en-wikipedia. I could point out sexism comments from fr-wikipedia every day, but I'm really not sure it is a constructive thing to do. To come back to Madam vs Pimp, I think you either should start the discussion there : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Sexology_and_sexuality, or stop asking permission to create articles. If it bothers someone, she will ask for a fusion. Caroline (User:Léna) 2011/12/25 Sarah
Re: [Gendergap] Pimp
Beria - I never asked Caroline to leave the mailing list. I was merely making a suggestion. For example, when I became overwhelmed by the traffic on Foundation-L, I went to digest with it. A mere suggestion is not a request for anyone to leave. It's a shame that my posts have been so bothersome for the list, I never knew that I was only making things worse, or not helping at all. Sarah On 12/25/11 10:32 AM, Béria Lima wrote: /I must say, you are the first person to openly complain, and if others feel strongly about it I can cease sharing content that I think needs urgent help or peer review. / Well, I second Caroline. I already said this in Foundation-l but again: I don't think that delete pictures of Wikipe-tan, remove a vagina from the article with the same name or create a article for a female pimp (only to mention a few cases I remember now) are the way we will solve gender gap. So yes, please stop post this here, or use the wikiEN-l https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l mailing list. And Sarah, this If you don't like you can sign the digest mode sounds rude to me, as if you are inviting her to leave. (I'm not a english native, but that is how appears to me) _ /Béria Lima/ Wikimedia Portugal http://wikimedia.pt (351) 963 953 042 /Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho. http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos/ On 25 December 2011 17:03, Sarah Stierch sarah.stie...@gmail.com mailto:sarah.stie...@gmail.com wrote: Caroline, I apologize if my occasional posting of an interesting article in English Wikipedia has been a burden, deterrent, or has went against the goal of this mailing list for you. Since I have joined, it has been something we have been doing, and the past month or so the list has been rather quiet compared to other times in the past. In the past, when we have shared articles of questionable matter, subject, sexism, or other issues, we've had great success of working together or independently to improve those articles, and often those improvements have been done by women who are on this list, which is very cool. I of course urge folks in any language to share content, however, with most Wikipedia mailing lists, systematic language bias does exist, as many are in English, though I know that was not the main point of your post. Thanks for the suggestions. I'll probably start out discussing it on the talk page of the article and also the project page. Again, I apologize if my own interests in article improvement in English Wikipedia have deterred or went against the mission of this mailing list. I must say, you are the first person to openly complain, and if others feel strongly about it I can cease sharing content that I think needs urgent help or peer review. As you did state, we could be pointing out issues of sexism all the time, however, sometimes I feel there are things of interest to the broader community, or something that might interest someone. (And while it has mainly been me lately, if you explore the history of the mailing list it's usually not just me flooding up your mailbox =) ) I also must add, my sharing of articles of interest and concern have wielded nothing but positive on.Wiki improvement of these subjects, which for me, means the closing of the gender gap in a different manner - one more subject area related to women or women's history which is covered in a more equal and respectful manner. We also offer, as you probably know, a digest mode, so, if this list is too busy for you (I think we are rather minimal these days, compared to lists such as internal-l and foundation-l) that might be something to consider. I'm glad you have joined and chosen to participate, and I am really sorry if my posts have been intruding. Sarah /Sarah Stierch/ Wikimedia Foundation Community Fellow Support the sharing of free knowledge around the world: donate today http://wikimediafoundation.org/w/index.php?title=WMFJA085/en/USutm_source=WMdonateutm_medium=sidebarutm_campaign=20110130SB003language=enuselang=encountry=USreferrer=http%3A%2F%2Fwikimediafoundation.org%2Fwiki%2FHome On 12/25/11 5:59 AM, Caroline Becker wrote: Hi everyone, I'm sorry that my first post on the gender-gap list is a little mean. I'm a wikipedia-fr admin, active member of Wikimédia France chapter and a member of the OTRS team. Yet, since I've joined gender-gap a week early, I receive more mails from this list than all the other lists together. I'm also not a native English speaker, which means every mail takes me a little longer of my time. I thought the goal of this list was to discuss about women on wikimedia
[Gendergap] Pimp
Hi everyone, I'm doing a bit of fiddling with some articles related to sexuality and came across an article about a madam [[Polly Adler]]. The word madam was linked to [[pimp]]. While the article opens mentioning that a woman who runs a brothel is called a madam, it's an extremely male dominated article and focuses on the violent and sordid world of being a pimp, for lack of better words. I, frankly, would /love/ to see madam have it's own article. Perhaps we should discuss it on the pimp page or just BE BOLD. (I don't have time to start a well fleshed out madam article, but, I'd be interested in perhaps collaborating with others to do it.) Thoughts? -Sarah -- Sarah Stierch Consulting -- Historical, cultural, new media artistic research advising. http://www.sarahstierch.com ___ Gendergap mailing list Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap
