Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-16 Thread Emily Monroe 
>
> I think a number of people here can relate to this sentiment. When I was a
> child, one of my bedrooms was white with pink roses. I hated it so much, I
> slept in a closet..literally, by choice. As a teenager I was raised by my
> father and teal and black were the shades of choice. To this very day I wear
> black most days and I prefer "fuchsia" over pink.  But, I must admit, I love
> the smell of roses.
>
> I don't believe any of us want an uber-femme Wikipedia to be a tool to
> encourage contributors. I do really like the idea of expanding on skin
> options, and I do think the option of having a "user friendly" look can help
> improve contributions [snip]
>

My point exactly!

From,
Emily


On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 6:39 PM, Sarah Stierch wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 7:25 PM, Emily Monroe wrote:
>
>>
>> I find I'm not really girly girly all that much. Pink and purple used to
>> be my absolute favorite colors, for example, but now "Pretty much shade of
>> blue" fills a slot above them. Of course, at least in America, blue=baby
>> boy, know what I mean?
>>
>> What I'm trying to say is, sometimes somebody who's comfortable with being
>> a woman isn't always going to fulfill the "fluff, rainbow, unicorns, and
>> sparkles!" stereotypical of how a woman should act. I don't want a backlash
>> in response to this sort of concern severe enough that I feel uncomfortable
>> editing.
>>
>>
> I think a number of people here can relate to this sentiment. When I was a
> child, one of my bedrooms was white with pink roses. I hated it so much, I
> slept in a closet..literally, by choice. As a teenager I was raised by my
> father and teal and black were the shades of choice. To this very day I wear
> black most days and I prefer "fuchsia" over pink.  But, I must admit, I love
> the smell of roses.
>
> I don't believe any of us want an uber-femme Wikipedia to be a tool to
> encourage contributors. I do really like the idea of expanding on skin
> options, and I do think the option of having a "user friendly" look can help
> improve contributions (just like the visual editor..which I have missed a
> demo of..twice).
>
> In a fantasy world it'd be really neat to demo different skins and user
> experiences with women of all ages - usability studies (like we do at the
> Archives of American Art with researchers of all ages and experience
> levels). I suppose that will be the only way we'll know if aesthetics,
> functionality and usability matter when it comes to women contributing to
> Wikipedia.
>
> -Sarah
> (and yeah I like unicorns..)
>
> --
> GLAMWIKI Partnership Ambassador for Wikimedia 
> Wikipedian-in-Residence, Archives of American 
> Art
> and
> Sarah Stierch Consulting
> *Historical, cultural & artistic research & advising.*
> --
> http://www.sarahstierch.com/
>
>
> ___
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> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap
>
>
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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-15 Thread Sarah Stierch 
On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 7:25 PM, Emily Monroe wrote:

>
> I find I'm not really girly girly all that much. Pink and purple used to be
> my absolute favorite colors, for example, but now "Pretty much shade of
> blue" fills a slot above them. Of course, at least in America, blue=baby
> boy, know what I mean?
>
> What I'm trying to say is, sometimes somebody who's comfortable with being
> a woman isn't always going to fulfill the "fluff, rainbow, unicorns, and
> sparkles!" stereotypical of how a woman should act. I don't want a backlash
> in response to this sort of concern severe enough that I feel uncomfortable
> editing.
>
>
I think a number of people here can relate to this sentiment. When I was a
child, one of my bedrooms was white with pink roses. I hated it so much, I
slept in a closet..literally, by choice. As a teenager I was raised by my
father and teal and black were the shades of choice. To this very day I wear
black most days and I prefer "fuchsia" over pink.  But, I must admit, I love
the smell of roses.

I don't believe any of us want an uber-femme Wikipedia to be a tool to
encourage contributors. I do really like the idea of expanding on skin
options, and I do think the option of having a "user friendly" look can help
improve contributions (just like the visual editor..which I have missed a
demo of..twice).

In a fantasy world it'd be really neat to demo different skins and user
experiences with women of all ages - usability studies (like we do at the
Archives of American Art with researchers of all ages and experience
levels). I suppose that will be the only way we'll know if aesthetics,
functionality and usability matter when it comes to women contributing to
Wikipedia.

-Sarah
(and yeah I like unicorns..)

-- 
GLAMWIKI Partnership Ambassador for Wikimedia 
Wikipedian-in-Residence, Archives of American
Art
and
Sarah Stierch Consulting
*Historical, cultural & artistic research & advising.*
--
http://www.sarahstierch.com/
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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-15 Thread Emily Monroe 
>
> As one of the females in the male-dominated wiki world, I have sometimes
> felt that I've had to put my girliness aside in order to be taken seriously.
> I also feel that there is a backlash against girly pink userpages and the
> like on wiki projects and that generalizations are made about people based
> on their username or userpage and not on their contributions to the wiki.
>

I find I'm not really girly girly all that much. Pink and purple used to be
my absolute favorite colors, for example, but now "Pretty much shade of
blue" fills a slot above them. Of course, at least in America, blue=baby
boy, know what I mean?

What I'm trying to say is, sometimes somebody who's comfortable with being a
woman isn't always going to fulfill the "fluff, rainbow, unicorns, and
sparkles!" stereotypical of how a woman should act. I don't want a backlash
in response to this sort of concern severe enough that I feel uncomfortable
editing.

From,
Emily


On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 5:00 PM, Nicole Willson
wrote:

> As a wikiHowian, I can speak to this a bit. Although I can't speak for
> Jack, I have my own aversions to purple girly welcome messages and I think
> this reasoning is seen on other wiki projects.
>
> On wikiHow we have struggled to have professional looking welcome messages.
> I think the worst of it was one that had a picture of a bunny and said
> "follow the bunny to wikiHow" or something like that. So, I think that view
> may have (at least for me) trickled down  even to welcome messages that are
> a "girly" color", since I am concerned that girliness and even just girly
> colors will cause wikiHow to be taken less seriously as a project.
>
> The funny thing, however, is that one of the "girlier" welcome messages
> I've seen (pastel background, '<3') is one that was created by a male
> wikiHowian and no one seems to have any problem with it so far that I know
> of.
>
> As one of the females in the male-dominated wiki world, I have sometimes
> felt that I've had to put my girliness aside in order to be taken seriously.
> I also feel that there is a backlash against girly pink userpages and the
> like on wiki projects and that generalizations are made about people based
> on their username or userpage and not on their contributions to the wiki.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 4:08 PM, Sue Gardner wrote:
>
>> On 14 September 2011 10:03, Michael J. Lowrey 
>> wrote:
>> > On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 10:41 AM, Sarah Stierch <
>> sarah.stie...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> I do like this though (scroll down to badges), not the portraits..but
>> the
>> >> round badges. I'd love to see something like this developed for
>> Wikipedia.
>> >> I'd have them on my tumblr, etc.
>> >>
>> >> http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Wikifashion:Contributors_Needed
>> >
>> > Really I find them loathsome in the extreme; very Facebooky.
>>
>>
>> S funny: everyone is different, and that is fine.
>>
>> I remember Jack Herrick seeming flustered and a little embarrassed one
>> day by a purple girly welcome message on WikiHow. But I loved the
>> purple girly welcome message, personally :-)
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Sue
>>
>> ___
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>>
>
>
>
> --
> "Only the shallow know themselves." - Oscar Wilde
>
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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-15 Thread Nicole Willson 
As a wikiHowian, I can speak to this a bit. Although I can't speak for Jack,
I have my own aversions to purple girly welcome messages and I think this
reasoning is seen on other wiki projects.

On wikiHow we have struggled to have professional looking welcome messages.
I think the worst of it was one that had a picture of a bunny and said
"follow the bunny to wikiHow" or something like that. So, I think that view
may have (at least for me) trickled down  even to welcome messages that are
a "girly" color", since I am concerned that girliness and even just girly
colors will cause wikiHow to be taken less seriously as a project.

The funny thing, however, is that one of the "girlier" welcome messages I've
seen (pastel background, '<3') is one that was created by a male wikiHowian
and no one seems to have any problem with it so far that I know of.

As one of the females in the male-dominated wiki world, I have sometimes
felt that I've had to put my girliness aside in order to be taken seriously.
I also feel that there is a backlash against girly pink userpages and the
like on wiki projects and that generalizations are made about people based
on their username or userpage and not on their contributions to the wiki.


On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 4:08 PM, Sue Gardner  wrote:

> On 14 September 2011 10:03, Michael J. Lowrey 
> wrote:
> > On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 10:41 AM, Sarah Stierch 
> wrote:
> >> I do like this though (scroll down to badges), not the portraits..but
> the
> >> round badges. I'd love to see something like this developed for
> Wikipedia.
> >> I'd have them on my tumblr, etc.
> >>
> >> http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Wikifashion:Contributors_Needed
> >
> > Really I find them loathsome in the extreme; very Facebooky.
>
>
> S funny: everyone is different, and that is fine.
>
> I remember Jack Herrick seeming flustered and a little embarrassed one
> day by a purple girly welcome message on WikiHow. But I loved the
> purple girly welcome message, personally :-)
>
> Thanks,
> Sue
>
> ___
> Gendergap mailing list
> Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap
>



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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-14 Thread Daniel and Elizabeth Case 

http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/fashion/students-startup-weaves-a-web-that-keeps-growing-20110914-1k9hi.html


  ''If you look at Wikipedia, a lot of the [fashion] designer or brand pages do 
not have a lot of information on them, and Wikipedia does not really focus on 
images, so you will not ever find the new collections or [fashion] look books 
on there,'' she says. 

  ''At the moment, there is no central database for fashion, a location where a 
girl can find the latest look book for Marc Jacobs or the first collection for 
Chanel. Either they are not there or they are on a host of different websites, 
so we want 
  to create all of that in one place.''
  Sarah Stierch says:

  ...uh..it's called Style.com and it's the greatest fashion website, ever, and 
has been for almost ten years. (Always makes me laugh that people in the 
fashion world forget men are as into fashion as much as women are, too!) 

  And I comment:

  Given my experience with Wikipedia's fashion coverage, I think I can speak to 
this with some authority.

  We did create a little external-link template for style.com: 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Style.com_collection, that can be used as 
you would use the Facebook, Twitter or MySpace templates. It's, as Sarah says, 
an excellent resource.

  I don't mind the idea of the look-book thing-we could and should arguably 
have articles on notable designers' biannual collections, and there would thus 
inevitably be associated Commons categories, which would serve as look books.

  What we'd need-and this, it seems to me, is where wikifashion is failing-is 
someone who can take those pictures with a decent enough camera and can get 
access to the shows. Someone with some professional experience as a fashion 
photographer (cue Steely Dan's "Peg", from the now-deleted "Songs about 
fashion" category: "When the shutter falls / You see it all in 3-D / It's your 
favorite foreign movie ..."), in other words.

  The problem, though, is that these people are not usually open to 
freely-licensing their work. And even, I suppose, a Wikipedian with the skill 
set might not necessarily be welcome at a fashion show, not if it was known 
that they were going to create images that would undermine the commercial value 
of the work of every other photographer there.

  But, then again, we did get people into sporting events eventually, so I'm 
sure we'll eventually get someone into a fashion show or two.

  Daniel Case

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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-14 Thread Brandon Harris 


On 9/14/11 8:41 AM, Sarah Stierch wrote:

>
> I really like the layout and such of the website  

I am on record in a number of places expressing my love for their skin 
design.  I don't necessarily like the color scheme but the skin layout 
is top-notch.

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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-14 Thread Sue Gardner 
On 14 September 2011 10:03, Michael J. Lowrey  wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 10:41 AM, Sarah Stierch  
> wrote:
>> I do like this though (scroll down to badges), not the portraits..but the
>> round badges. I'd love to see something like this developed for Wikipedia.
>> I'd have them on my tumblr, etc.
>>
>> http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Wikifashion:Contributors_Needed
>
> Really I find them loathsome in the extreme; very Facebooky.


S funny: everyone is different, and that is fine.

I remember Jack Herrick seeming flustered and a little embarrassed one
day by a purple girly welcome message on WikiHow. But I loved the
purple girly welcome message, personally :-)

Thanks,
Sue

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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-14 Thread Michael J. Lowrey 
On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 10:41 AM, Sarah Stierch  wrote:
> I do like this though (scroll down to badges), not the portraits..but the
> round badges. I'd love to see something like this developed for Wikipedia.
> I'd have them on my tumblr, etc.
>
> http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Wikifashion:Contributors_Needed

Really I find them loathsome in the extreme; very Facebooky.

-- 
Michael J. "Orange Mike" Lowrey

"When I get a little money I buy books; and if any is left, I buy food
and clothes."
     --  Desiderius Erasmus

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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-14 Thread Nicole Willson 
My one issue with fashion wiki is the licensing. It's a copyrighted wiki:

*(a) Unless otherwise indicated, My Lemmings Pty Ltd reserves all copyright
in the Content and design of wikifashion.com. (b) My Lemmings Pty Ltd owns
all such copyright or uses it under licence or applicable law to Users of
Users of wikifashion.com. (c) Other than for the purposes of and subject to
the conditions prescribed under the Copyright Act 1968 (Cth) (or any other
applicable legislation throughout the world), or as otherwise provided for
in this copyright notice, no part of any Content may in any form or by any
means (including framing, screen scraping, electronic, mechanical,
microcopying, photocopying or recording) be reproduced, adapted, stored in a
retrieval system or transmitted without the prior written permission of My
Lemmings Pty Ltd. (d) My Lemmings Pty Ltd is the owner of several trade
marks which appear on its Website. Unauthorised use of these trade marks
will infringe our intellectual property rights. (e) My Lemmings Pty Ltd
reserves all other rights in Content and wikifashion.com.*
*
*
*-*
http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Wikifashion:Terms_of_Service#9..09Copyright_in_Content
*
*
I have asked about this on Quora where I know the wikiFashion founders are
active in answering questions and have never gotten an answer.

A similar area where Wikipedia is lacking is cosmetics and I don't mean in
terms of how to create makeup looks or pictures of every shade of nail
polish, but general information on cosmetics companies like Cover Girl and
Maybelline. I think there needs to more information on the history of each
company as well as criticisms. In addition, those articles are lacking in
citations.

On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 11:41 AM, Sarah Stierch wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 11:07 AM, Fred Bauder wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/fashion/students-startup-weaves-a-web-that-keeps-growing-20110914-1k9hi.html
>>
>
> *''If you look at Wikipedia, a lot of the [fashion] designer or brand
> pages do not have a lot of information on them, and Wikipedia does not
> really focus on images, so you will not ever find the new collections or
> [fashion] look books on there,'' she says.
>
> ''At the moment, there is no central database for fashion, a location where
> a girl can find the latest look book for Marc Jacobs or the first collection
> for Chanel. Either they are not there or they are on a host of different
> websites, so we want to create all of that in one place.''*
> *
> *...uh..it's called Style.com and it's the greatest fashion website, *ever
> *, and has been for almost ten years. (Always makes me laugh that people
> in the fashion world forget men are as into fashion as much as women are,
> too!)
>
>
>>
>> http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Main_Page
>>
>
> I really like the layout and such of the website. I do think it's kind of
> interesting, that for a fashion website, they don't have any copyright data
> for the photographs they are using (most are copyrighted), fair use
> mentions, etc. After reading a few pages in the Designer category... (and as
> someone recovering from a career in the fashion industry) it's a mix of
> preachy bias content about how amazing certain designers are (Yes, Karl
> Lagerfeld is awesome, I have to admit), small time or no-name designers who
> write their own articles and upload photos of their designs, etc, or cut and
> paste unsourced content. The website started in 2008 and most articles have
> under 8 edits and lack special mark up. It is promotional enough, they also
> have one paid advert and is not a non-profit org ;)
>
> Perhaps this is what people want? ;)
>
> I suppose I'm being debbie downer (as usual) but, I tend to look at female
> dominated Wiki's and see what makes them different, with a critical eye, to
> see what *we* are doing right and wrong, and vice versa.
>
> I do like this though (scroll down to badges), not the portraits..but the
> round badges. I'd love to see something like this developed for Wikipedia.
> I'd have them on my tumblr, etc.
>
> http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Wikifashion:Contributors_Needed
>
>
>
> Sarah
>
>
> --
> GLAMWIKI Partnership Ambassador for Wikimedia 
> Wikipedian-in-Residence, Archives of American 
> Art
> and
> Sarah Stierch Consulting
> *Historical, cultural & artistic research & advising.*
> --
> http://www.sarahstierch.com/
>
>
> ___
> Gendergap mailing list
> Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap
>
>


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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-14 Thread Sarah Stierch 
On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 11:07 AM, Fred Bauder wrote:

>
>
> http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/fashion/students-startup-weaves-a-web-that-keeps-growing-20110914-1k9hi.html
>

*''If you look at Wikipedia, a lot of the [fashion] designer or brand pages
do not have a lot of information on them, and Wikipedia does not really
focus on images, so you will not ever find the new collections or [fashion]
look books on there,'' she says.

''At the moment, there is no central database for fashion, a location where
a girl can find the latest look book for Marc Jacobs or the first collection
for Chanel. Either they are not there or they are on a host of different
websites, so we want to create all of that in one place.''*
*
*...uh..it's called Style.com and it's the greatest fashion website, *ever*,
and has been for almost ten years. (Always makes me laugh that people in the
fashion world forget men are as into fashion as much as women are, too!)


>
> http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Main_Page
>

I really like the layout and such of the website. I do think it's kind of
interesting, that for a fashion website, they don't have any copyright data
for the photographs they are using (most are copyrighted), fair use
mentions, etc. After reading a few pages in the Designer category... (and as
someone recovering from a career in the fashion industry) it's a mix of
preachy bias content about how amazing certain designers are (Yes, Karl
Lagerfeld is awesome, I have to admit), small time or no-name designers who
write their own articles and upload photos of their designs, etc, or cut and
paste unsourced content. The website started in 2008 and most articles have
under 8 edits and lack special mark up. It is promotional enough, they also
have one paid advert and is not a non-profit org ;)

Perhaps this is what people want? ;)

I suppose I'm being debbie downer (as usual) but, I tend to look at female
dominated Wiki's and see what makes them different, with a critical eye, to
see what *we* are doing right and wrong, and vice versa.

I do like this though (scroll down to badges), not the portraits..but the
round badges. I'd love to see something like this developed for Wikipedia.
I'd have them on my tumblr, etc.

http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Wikifashion:Contributors_Needed



Sarah


-- 
GLAMWIKI Partnership Ambassador for Wikimedia 
Wikipedian-in-Residence, Archives of American
Art
and
Sarah Stierch Consulting
*Historical, cultural & artistic research & advising.*
--
http://www.sarahstierch.com/
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Re: [Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-14 Thread Michael J. Lowrey 
On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 10:07 AM, Fred Bauder  wrote:
>
> http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/fashion/students-startup-weaves-a-web-that-keeps-growing-20110914-1k9hi.html
>
> http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Main_Page
>
> https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/w/index.php?title=Wikifashion&action=edit&redlink=1
>
> https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/w/index.php?title=Madeline_Veenstra&action=edit&redlink=1


??

What's the point of all this?

-- 
Michael J. "Orange Mike" Lowrey

"When I get a little money I buy books; and if any is left, I buy food
and clothes."
     --  Desiderius Erasmus

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[Gendergap] Wikifashion

2011-09-14 Thread Fred Bauder 

http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/fashion/students-startup-weaves-a-web-that-keeps-growing-20110914-1k9hi.html

http://wikifashion.com/wiki/Main_Page

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/w/index.php?title=Wikifashion&action=edit&redlink=1

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/w/index.php?title=Madeline_Veenstra&action=edit&redlink=1

Fred


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