Re: [VOTE] Accept Cassandra into the Incubator
On 26-Dec-08, at 3:31 PM, Torsten Curdt wrote: [ ] +1 Accept Cassandra as a new podling [ ] -1 Do not accept the new podling (provide reason, please) -1 (binding). I will even give reasons because it is Christmas; a. See Martijn's concern. b. Running vote over Christmas when *many* people are busy with other things. c. I would like to see a proposal with more meat in it. Some history, more elaboration on the various topics that the template provides... Just a different perspective: a) I agree with the concern but as Martijn expressed, I'm not sure it should be a real concern for the vote. If the project dies, so be it. But clearly a few individuals seem to care so why not giving them a chance? b) +1 on this one, it could just be balanced by setting a longer than usual voting time frame. c) I agree although some feedback has been provided on the ML, it could be nice to bring back some of that in the proposal. Some thoughts from this end: I also have the feeling that the proposal could benefit from some more meat. The timing around Christmas indeed was not very helpful either. But what really concerns me a bit is the question whether people really want to/can work together. It seems like the fork / The word fork does not appear in the proposal, but at the very top of the proposal it says it started at Facebook. I just read the proposal and a few emails today so I don't know anything about the project but that immediately says to me there is some disparity. If it's a fork that's fine, but that's something pretty important to leave out of the proposal. non-fork debate already left some scars and I am not eager to invest time when people can't get along even to begin with. Maybe my Avalon alarm is set a little too sensitive but for now I only vote +0. Ian, since you are the one driving this... would you mind working with the project team on improving the proposal? ...and then consider a re-submit? cheers ...and Merry Christmas -- Torsten - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org Thanks, Jason -- Jason van Zyl Founder, Apache Maven jason at sonatype dot com -- We all have problems. How we deal with them is a measure of our worth. -- Unknown - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [VOTE] Accept Cassandra into the Incubator
I consider this to be a high-risk project, and agree with Martjin's concerns, but do not consider this a bar to entering incubation. The *reason* Cassandra wants to enter incubation is to address these weaknesses. +1 -Brian On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 2:01 PM, Ian Holsman li...@holsman.net wrote: Dear Incubator PMC, There has been some discussion around the Cassandra proposal, and we would now like to officially propose Cassandra to the Incubator for consideration.. Please vote on accepting Cassandra project for incubation. The full Cassandra proposal is available at the end of this message and as a wiki page at http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/Cassandra. We ask the Incubator PMC to sponsor the Cassandra podling, with Brian as the Champion, and Torsten, Matthieu, and Ian volunteering to mentor as well. The vote is open for the next 72 hours and only votes from the Incubator PMC are binding. [ ] +1 Accept Cassandra as a new podling [ ] -1 Do not accept the new podling (provide reason, please) = Abstract = Cassandra is a distributed storage system for managing structured/unstructured data while providing reliability at a massive scale. = Background = Development of Cassandra started in Facebook in June 2007. It started of a system to solve the Inbox Search problem and since then has matured to solve various storage problems associated with structured/unstructured data. = Rationale = Cassandra is a distributed storage system for managing structured data that is designed to scale to a very large size across many commodity servers, with no single point of failure. The philosophy behind the design of the storage portion of Cassandra is that it be able to satisfy the requirements of applications that demand storage of large amounts of structured data. Reliability at massive scale is a very big challenge. Outages in the service can have significant negative impact. Hence Cassandra aims to run on top of an infrastructure of hundreds of nodes (possibly spread across different datacenters). At this scale, small and large components fail continuously; the way Cassandra manages the persistent state in the face of these failures drives the reliability and scalability of the software systems relying on this service. = Initial Source = Intial Source can be obtained from the following site - http://the-cassandra-project.googlecode.com/svn/branches/development/. The mailing list is currently maintained at the same site. We will move it over to Apache once this proposal has been accepted. = Source and Intellectual Property Submission Plan = = External Dependencies = * All dependencies have Apache compatible licenses. Dependencies are log4j, Thrift, Apache Commons. = Cryptography = * None = Committers = * Avinash Lakshman * Prashant Malik * Kannan Muthukkaruppan * Jiansheng Huang * Dan Dumitriu = Current Status = == Meritocracy == * Though initial development was done at Facebook, Cassandra was intended to be released as an open source project from its inception. Environment will lend itself to support meritocracy at all times. == Community == * Folks who are actively considering deploying/prototyping Cassandra in their respective organizations. == Core Developers == * Avinash Lakshman * Prashant Malik * Kannan Muthukkaruppan == License == * The Cassandra codebase is Apache 2.0 licensed, and currently hosted at Google Code. = Known Risks/Avoiding the Warning Signs = == Orphaned Products == * Cassandra is already deployed within Facebook and many other organizations are actively moving to deploy this in production. Original developers are and will actively stay involved and hence there is no realistic chance of it getting orphaned. == Homogenous Developers == * The current list of committers includes developers from different companies. The committers are geographically distributed across the U.S. == Reliance on Salaried Developers == * Yes. But don't expect this to be a risk of any nature. == Relationships with Other Apache Products == * The Cassandra project is 'similar' to hbase/HDFS in concept, but Cassandra is more geared for Online web site usage than batch. It also doesn't have a single point of failure, which makes it interesting as well. * Cassandra makes use of the Thrift project. == An excessive fascination with the Apache brand == * Cassandra has already attracted a stable base of users. There are at least 3 companies who are planning to use Cassandra in production as far as we know. The reasons for joining Apache are not to advertise the project, but rather to demonstrate the commitment to open source by divorcing the trunk from any one corporation and pursuing further integration with other Apache projects. = Required Resources = == Mailing lists == Once the project is approved, the following mailing lists will be used for discussion. * cassandra-u...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [VOTE] Accept Cassandra into the Incubator
I'd like to see some plan on dealing with the fork/community stuff. We *know* it is a problem, and I'd like to see how this is being addressed in the proposal. In my opinion that is the crux to this proposal. Just going Apache is not going to solve problems. The feather is not a magic wand you can wave around and make problems disappear. What will happen when the original coders won't come with the project? What when they do and then disappear *again*? How will you get the folks on board that don't want to come over? Martijn On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 6:13 PM, Brian McCallister bri...@skife.org wrote: I consider this to be a high-risk project, and agree with Martjin's concerns, but do not consider this a bar to entering incubation. The *reason* Cassandra wants to enter incubation is to address these weaknesses. +1 -Brian On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 2:01 PM, Ian Holsman li...@holsman.net wrote: Dear Incubator PMC, There has been some discussion around the Cassandra proposal, and we would now like to officially propose Cassandra to the Incubator for consideration.. Please vote on accepting Cassandra project for incubation. The full Cassandra proposal is available at the end of this message and as a wiki page at http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/Cassandra. We ask the Incubator PMC to sponsor the Cassandra podling, with Brian as the Champion, and Torsten, Matthieu, and Ian volunteering to mentor as well. The vote is open for the next 72 hours and only votes from the Incubator PMC are binding. [ ] +1 Accept Cassandra as a new podling [ ] -1 Do not accept the new podling (provide reason, please) = Abstract = Cassandra is a distributed storage system for managing structured/unstructured data while providing reliability at a massive scale. = Background = Development of Cassandra started in Facebook in June 2007. It started of a system to solve the Inbox Search problem and since then has matured to solve various storage problems associated with structured/unstructured data. = Rationale = Cassandra is a distributed storage system for managing structured data that is designed to scale to a very large size across many commodity servers, with no single point of failure. The philosophy behind the design of the storage portion of Cassandra is that it be able to satisfy the requirements of applications that demand storage of large amounts of structured data. Reliability at massive scale is a very big challenge. Outages in the service can have significant negative impact. Hence Cassandra aims to run on top of an infrastructure of hundreds of nodes (possibly spread across different datacenters). At this scale, small and large components fail continuously; the way Cassandra manages the persistent state in the face of these failures drives the reliability and scalability of the software systems relying on this service. = Initial Source = Intial Source can be obtained from the following site - http://the-cassandra-project.googlecode.com/svn/branches/development/. The mailing list is currently maintained at the same site. We will move it over to Apache once this proposal has been accepted. = Source and Intellectual Property Submission Plan = = External Dependencies = * All dependencies have Apache compatible licenses. Dependencies are log4j, Thrift, Apache Commons. = Cryptography = * None = Committers = * Avinash Lakshman * Prashant Malik * Kannan Muthukkaruppan * Jiansheng Huang * Dan Dumitriu = Current Status = == Meritocracy == * Though initial development was done at Facebook, Cassandra was intended to be released as an open source project from its inception. Environment will lend itself to support meritocracy at all times. == Community == * Folks who are actively considering deploying/prototyping Cassandra in their respective organizations. == Core Developers == * Avinash Lakshman * Prashant Malik * Kannan Muthukkaruppan == License == * The Cassandra codebase is Apache 2.0 licensed, and currently hosted at Google Code. = Known Risks/Avoiding the Warning Signs = == Orphaned Products == * Cassandra is already deployed within Facebook and many other organizations are actively moving to deploy this in production. Original developers are and will actively stay involved and hence there is no realistic chance of it getting orphaned. == Homogenous Developers == * The current list of committers includes developers from different companies. The committers are geographically distributed across the U.S. == Reliance on Salaried Developers == * Yes. But don't expect this to be a risk of any nature. == Relationships with Other Apache Products == * The Cassandra project is 'similar' to hbase/HDFS in concept, but Cassandra is more geared for Online web site usage than batch. It also doesn't have a single point of failure, which makes it interesting as well. * Cassandra makes use of the Thrift project. == An excessive
Re: [VOTE] Accept Cassandra into the Incubator
On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 11:26 AM, Martijn Dashorst martijn.dasho...@gmail.com wrote: I'd like to see some plan on dealing with the fork/community stuff. We *know* it is a problem, and I'd like to see how this is being addressed in the proposal. In my opinion that is the crux to this proposal. Just going Apache is not going to solve problems. The feather is not a magic wand you can wave around and make problems disappear. What will happen when the original coders won't come with the project? What when they do and then disappear *again*? How will you get the folks on board that don't want to come over? The fork was something proposed by Ian because there was no clear path for folks to become involved with Cassandra. The folks working on it at Facebook didn't want to see a fork, and proposed entering incubation in order to structure opening up development. Avinash and the others on the proposal *are* the core contributors, there is no fork, and hopefully there will be no need to. No one expects to wave a feather over the code and have a vibrant developer community appear, but you *can* wave a wand and have a set of expectations appear, which is what Cassandra is trying to do. The plan: follow the normal apache process. Folks contribute good stuff, the folks involved recognize this and make the contributor a committer, useful code continues to come into existence, rinse-repeat. The plan is no different than any apache project. -Brian Martijn On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 6:13 PM, Brian McCallister bri...@skife.org wrote: I consider this to be a high-risk project, and agree with Martjin's concerns, but do not consider this a bar to entering incubation. The *reason* Cassandra wants to enter incubation is to address these weaknesses. +1 -Brian On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 2:01 PM, Ian Holsman li...@holsman.net wrote: Dear Incubator PMC, There has been some discussion around the Cassandra proposal, and we would now like to officially propose Cassandra to the Incubator for consideration.. Please vote on accepting Cassandra project for incubation. The full Cassandra proposal is available at the end of this message and as a wiki page at http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/Cassandra. We ask the Incubator PMC to sponsor the Cassandra podling, with Brian as the Champion, and Torsten, Matthieu, and Ian volunteering to mentor as well. The vote is open for the next 72 hours and only votes from the Incubator PMC are binding. [ ] +1 Accept Cassandra as a new podling [ ] -1 Do not accept the new podling (provide reason, please) = Abstract = Cassandra is a distributed storage system for managing structured/unstructured data while providing reliability at a massive scale. = Background = Development of Cassandra started in Facebook in June 2007. It started of a system to solve the Inbox Search problem and since then has matured to solve various storage problems associated with structured/unstructured data. = Rationale = Cassandra is a distributed storage system for managing structured data that is designed to scale to a very large size across many commodity servers, with no single point of failure. The philosophy behind the design of the storage portion of Cassandra is that it be able to satisfy the requirements of applications that demand storage of large amounts of structured data. Reliability at massive scale is a very big challenge. Outages in the service can have significant negative impact. Hence Cassandra aims to run on top of an infrastructure of hundreds of nodes (possibly spread across different datacenters). At this scale, small and large components fail continuously; the way Cassandra manages the persistent state in the face of these failures drives the reliability and scalability of the software systems relying on this service. = Initial Source = Intial Source can be obtained from the following site - http://the-cassandra-project.googlecode.com/svn/branches/development/. The mailing list is currently maintained at the same site. We will move it over to Apache once this proposal has been accepted. = Source and Intellectual Property Submission Plan = = External Dependencies = * All dependencies have Apache compatible licenses. Dependencies are log4j, Thrift, Apache Commons. = Cryptography = * None = Committers = * Avinash Lakshman * Prashant Malik * Kannan Muthukkaruppan * Jiansheng Huang * Dan Dumitriu = Current Status = == Meritocracy == * Though initial development was done at Facebook, Cassandra was intended to be released as an open source project from its inception. Environment will lend itself to support meritocracy at all times. == Community == * Folks who are actively considering deploying/prototyping Cassandra in their respective organizations. == Core Developers == * Avinash Lakshman * Prashant Malik * Kannan Muthukkaruppan == License == * The Cassandra codebase is Apache 2.0 licensed, and
Re: [VOTE] Accept Cassandra into the Incubator
On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 11:26 AM, Martijn Dashorst martijn.dasho...@gmail.com wrote: I'd like to see some plan on dealing with the fork/community stuff. We *know* it is a problem, and I'd like to see how this is being addressed in the proposal. In my opinion that is the crux to this proposal. Just going Apache is not going to solve problems. Actually, it is a huge first step. Right now there is no path for non-FB employees to contribute. Second step is to encourage non-FB (or other FB folks) folks to contribute. Third step is to make them committers. Fourth step is to have the whole crowd get beers together at the next apachecon. Fifth step is GOTO 2. :-) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Apache Maestro
On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:13 PM, Jean-Baptiste Onofré j...@nanthrax.net wrote: The AutoDeploy scope is not the same as the Lokahi one. AutoDeploy is an whole environment updater, covering JEE resources (JDBC DataSource, JMS queue/topic, JMS connection factory, JNDI name space binding, share lib support, EAR/WAR deployment with classloader policy, configuration files, etc), and this, in the same manner whatever the underlying application server used (JBoss, Weblogic, Websphere). AutoDeploy can use Lokahi to support Tomcat for exemple. Ok, I would still be very positive to folding those into a single project, if at all possible (stretch your imagination)... Cheers Niclas - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Apache Maestro
For sure, AutoDeploy will use Lokahi to support Tomcat but, for now, I think it's better to have to different project as the usage and scope are not the same at all. For exemple, ServiceMix heavily uses Geronimo parts and ActiveMQ but it's not the same project. I will discuss with Lokahi people to understand what is exactly the roadmap and define is interaction are possible between AutoDeploy and Lokahi. Regards JB On Sunday 28 December 2008 - 14:58, Niclas Hedhman wrote: On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:13 PM, Jean-Baptiste Onofré j...@nanthrax.net wrote: The AutoDeploy scope is not the same as the Lokahi one. AutoDeploy is an whole environment updater, covering JEE resources (JDBC DataSource, JMS queue/topic, JMS connection factory, JNDI name space binding, share lib support, EAR/WAR deployment with classloader policy, configuration files, etc), and this, in the same manner whatever the underlying application server used (JBoss, Weblogic, Websphere). AutoDeploy can use Lokahi to support Tomcat for exemple. Ok, I would still be very positive to folding those into a single project, if at all possible (stretch your imagination)... Cheers Niclas -- Jean-Baptiste Onofré (Nanthrax) BuildProcess/AutoDeploy Project Leader http://buildprocess.sourceforge.net j...@nanthrax.net PGP : 17D4F086 - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
