Re: [PROPOSAL] Experiment: VXQuery PPMC Release Voting

[Marvin Humphrey]

On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 4:31 PM, Dave Fisher  wrote:
> So we vote to make Till an IPMC member and then we have a proposal to allow
> VXQuery to have a non-Apache Member cast the only IPMC binding VOTE on a
> release.

If VXQuery can't be trusted, why do you support graduation[1]?

> Here is my proposal - see if invoking the old experiment (making a pdling
> PPMC member into an IPMC member) has the expected and proven effect.

Good plan.  That's what we tried first.  It was a dud[2].

Marvin Humphrey

[1] http://s.apache.org/0HG
[2] http://s.apache.org/D38

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Incubator Committer++

[Marvin Humphrey]

On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Dave Fisher  wrote:
> What you are calling IP Auditors is really one example of "Incubator
> Committer" - there are two kinds of Committer roles that have been
> discussed, but there are others.
>
> - IP / Release auditors.
> - Shepherds.

The name "Incubator committer" is taken: that's what we call people who have
commit rights to the Incubator website and Subversion repository -- i.e. just
about everybody around here.

I suggest a working title of "Incubator Committer++".

> When IPMC members and Apache Members identify people who are "getting it" in
> a podling and they are either committers and PPMC members (ICLA and Apache
> account is the minimum) they can ask the IPMC to vote on them in private as
> Incubator Committers. This will encourage such people to help other
> podlings. This is just like a normal PMC.

What I like most about this proposal is that it isolates Incubator-specific
merit and articulates an ideal to aspire towards.  I also like that you can
only get to be an "Incubator Committer++" through actions which take place
within the context of the Incubator.

> The IPMC can recognize further merit and make them IPMC members.

The problem is that there is still significant resistance within the IPMC to
electing contributors from active podlings.  You're just not going to get many
warm bodies this way.

> This can be a way to
> make a VOTE binding. It can start non-binding, but as an Incubator Committer
> it is more visible.

I see.  Since release votes are not binding, the distinction between committer
and Committer++ is only symbolic: the title "Incubator Committer++" offers
recognition but no reward.

The proposal thus replicates the Incubator's big flaw:

The Incubator has a fundamental structural flaw: it lacks a mechanism to
reward merit earned by individual podling contributors.

Why bother becoming an "Incubator Committer++" if it's just a name?  And if
you're a Mentor, why bother nominating people for an empty honor?

Is there any incentive you'd be willing to attach to the "Incubator
Committer++" role in order to make it more attractive?  The obvious candidate
is a binding release vote limited to one's own podling -- add that and I'm on
board.  Unfortunately, my sense is that you're determined to withhold that
privilege because you fear it will be abused[1].  Any other ideas?

> Rather than inventing new structure for edge case communities we should be
> working to make sure that podlings gain an understanding of the few, but
> important expectations that the Foundation has for its Communities.

Doesn't this proposal invent a new structure, though?  That's not a
deal-killer for me, but adding complexity is something which other people have
spoken out against.

Anyway, what goals do you hope to achieve?  I'm skeptical, but I might be able
to support the proposal so long as you're willing to try something else if it
doesn't work.  At least it's incremental, reversible and harmless aside from
the opportunity costs.

Marvin Humphrey

[1] http://s.apache.org/tZn

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[RESULT][VOTE] Retire the Provisionr podling

[Andrei Savu]

The VOTE passed with 3 +1 binding votes from the following IPMC members:

Roman Shaposhnik
Tom White
Bertrand Delacretaz

I will take care of the retirement steps and reply to this email when done:
http://incubator.apache.org/guides/retirement.html#steps-to-retirement

Thanks,

Andrei Savu

Re: [VOTE] Release HDT version 0.0.1.incubating (RC1)

[Rahul Sharma]

We still require 2 more votes from the IPMC.

Mentors @Chris @Suresh will you be able to checkout the release ?

regards,
Rahul


On Wed, Nov 20, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Rahul Sharma  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I would like to call for a vote for Apache Hadoop Development Tools
> (incubating), version 0.0.1.incubating. The vote has happened of the dev
> mailing list and the community has approved the second release
> candidate(RC1) for Apache Hadoop Development Tools (incubating), version
> 0.0.1.incubating.The release has Zookeper and HDFS features from the
> *hadoop-eclipse-merge* codebase. The issues raised for RC0 have been
> addressed in this release.
>
> 1 IPMC votes have already been cast:
>   Roman Shaposhnik (mentor)
>
> Please vote on releasing this package as Apache Hadoop Development Tools
> 0.0.1.incubating.
>
> [ ] +1 Release this package as Apache HDT 0.0.1.incubating
> [ ]  0 I don't feel strongly about it, but I'm okay with the release
> [ ] -1 Do not release this package because...
>
> PPMC Vote thread :
> http://apache.markmail.org/message/bbdedy4bprhwngew
>
> Vote Result :
> http://apache.markmail.org/message/nq4pylp73n5n6wyn
>
> Source and binary files:
> http://people.apache.org/~rsharma/hdt-0.0.1.incubating-rc1/
>
> The tag to be voted upon:
>
> https://git-wip-us.apache.org/repos/asf?p=incubator-hdt.git;a=commit;h=0627220f5181bfe698fdc71209ca66864068b352
>
> KEYS file:
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/hdt/KEYS
>
> Some guideline to verify release can be found at :
> http://apache.markmail.org/message/qj3srhvozapbwmq6
>
> regards,
> Rahul
>

Re: Release vote thresholds

[Marvin Humphrey]

On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 4:20 PM, Dave Fisher  wrote:

> I am not sure that this is a step in the correct direction.

Dave, I'm sure you realize that your opposition is deeply disapointing to a
number of us, when we seem so close.

I will work with you to see if we can build what you are currently calling the
"Incubator Committer" solution into something which can achieve consensus.
It is not necessarily going to be easy to get that proposal as close as this
one has come, but let's try.

Marvin Humphrey

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Re: [PROPOSAL] Experiment: VXQuery PPMC Release Voting

[Dave Fisher]

So we vote to make Till an IPMC member and then we have a proposal to allow 
VXQuery to have a non-Apache Member cast the only IPMC binding VOTE on a 
release.

Sorry, but that is one step too many. Here is my proposal - see if invoking the 
old experiment (making a pdling PPMC member into an IPMC member) has the 
expected and proven effect.

Regards,
Dave

On Nov 22, 2013, at 10:15 AM, Marvin Humphrey wrote:

> The possibility of an experiment with making PPMC votes binding on incubating
> releases under some conditions has been discussed at length in recent threads
> on general@incubator.  I propose that we vote on the following language to run
> the experiment with VXQuery as a test podling:
> 
>The following additional rules for voting on incubating releases shall
>apply to the VXQuery PPMC, whose membership is tracked on the VXQuery
>podling status page at
>.
> 
>*   PPMC votes are binding for every release except the first.
>*   One IPMC vote is required for each release after the first.
> 
> Note that VXQuery has already had its first incubating release approved by
> vote of the IPMC.
> 
> It is my view that the position taken by ASF Board member Roy Fielding in a
> recent message to general@incubator[1] indicates that the Incubator PMC has
> the necessary authority to enact this proposal.
> 
> Marvin Humphrey
> 
> [1] http://s.apache.org/yPX
> 
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[DISCUSS] Re: [VOTE] Release Apache Knox-0.3.1-incubating RC3

[Dave Fisher]

How many +1 IPMC Binding Votes did you have from your Mentors?

Putting this information clearly in the thread is very helpful.

Regards,
Dave

On Nov 20, 2013, at 8:09 AM, larry mccay wrote:

> Hello All,
> 
> This is a call for a vote on Apache Knox Gateway 0.3.1 incubating.
> 
> A vote was held on developer mailing list and it passed with 3 +1's, and 0
> -1's or +0's and now
> requires a vote on general@incubator.apache.org.
> 
> The [VOTE] thread can be found at:
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-knox-dev/201311.mbox/%3CCACRbFyjgLrCSahhtWWHK-%3DaeQFM4Oegbe3fQjs-RV2-TAnhdxA%40mail.gmail.com%3E
> 
> The release candidate is a zip archive of the sources in:
> https://git-wip-us.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator-knox.git
> Branch v0.3.1 (git checkout -b v0.3.1)
> 
> Tag:
> https://git-wip-us.apache.org/repos/asf?p=incubator-knox.git;a=tag;h=5a907022dbc2b0a8534de47fe7b8c871c4f075f9
> 
> Source archive zip file and signature are available from:
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/knox/knox-incubating-0.3.1/knox-incubating-0.3.1-src.zip
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/knox/knox-incubating-0.3.1/knox-incubating-0.3.1-src.zip.asc
> 
> Checksums of the source archive:
>  SHA1:   04bb11360f57c0431c30cfb181e3199868fe6053
> 
> The KEYS file can be found at:
> 
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/knox/knox-incubating-0.3.1/KEYS
> 
> The release changes file can be found at:
> 
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/knox/knox-incubating-0.3.1/CHANGES
> 
> The release has been signed with key (587C089B):
>  http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x82F9C371587C089B
> 
> Vote will be open for 72 hours.
> 
> thanks,
> 
> --larry
> 
> Larry McCay


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Re: Release vote thresholds

[Dave Fisher]

On Nov 22, 2013, at 1:09 AM, ant elder wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 6:09 PM, Marvin Humphrey  
> wrote:
>> On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 12:33 AM, ant elder  wrote:
>>> On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 1:53 AM, Marvin Humphrey 
>>> wrote:
>>> I think this is getting too hung up on vetting releases is the be all and
>>> end all of PMC membership when really there are other just as if not more
>>> important things.
>> 
>> Let's say we strike that bullet point from the proposal.  It seems like we're
>> making good progress, because that moves us closer to *both* you and Dave
>> Fisher.  The remaining question is whether we can arrive at an agreement in
>> terms of how many IPMC votes it takes to get a release approved.
>> 
>> Ant, you proposed a minimum of one IPMC vote for each release:
>> 
>>http://s.apache.org/CHS
>> 
>>How about simply changing the rules for Incubator releases so that they
>>don't require at least three binding votes, but instead make it at least
>>three votes only one of which must be binding. That would mean there would
>>still be the element of oversight that a mentor vote gives but avoids all
>>the problems with not having three mentors.
>> 
>> Dave responded with this critique:
>> 
>>http://s.apache.org/MSZ
>> 
>>I don't think this is prudent, having only one binding vote is too low a
>>check. We at the ASF have a responsibility to the public.  I want to be
>>certain that no one steam rolls the process. Just the fact that there are
>>edge cases means we need to be careful.
>> 
>> This formulation was conceived to address both of your concerns:
>> 
>>*   PPMC votes are binding for every release except the first.
>>*   One IPMC vote is required for each release after the first.
>> 
>> Ant, can you accept the elevated requirement for the first vote?  If we only
>> have to muster that many IPMC members once per podling, I think it's much 
>> more
>> doable.
>> 
> 
> Sure, its a step in the right direction. I do think we could still do
> more but that would be a good start.

I am not sure that this is a step in the correct direction.

Regards,
Dave

> 
>   ...ant
> 
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Re: [VOTE] Release Apache Knox-0.3.1-incubating RC3

[Alan Gates]

+1.  Looked over the LICENSE, NOTICE, and DISCLAIMER files.  Checked the 
signatures on the source release.  Did mvn install on the package to make sure 
it built.  

Alan.

On Nov 20, 2013, at 8:09 AM, larry mccay wrote:

> Hello All,
> 
> This is a call for a vote on Apache Knox Gateway 0.3.1 incubating.
> 
> A vote was held on developer mailing list and it passed with 3 +1's, and 0
> -1's or +0's and now
> requires a vote on general@incubator.apache.org.
> 
> The [VOTE] thread can be found at:
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-knox-dev/201311.mbox/%3CCACRbFyjgLrCSahhtWWHK-%3DaeQFM4Oegbe3fQjs-RV2-TAnhdxA%40mail.gmail.com%3E
> 
> The release candidate is a zip archive of the sources in:
> https://git-wip-us.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator-knox.git
> Branch v0.3.1 (git checkout -b v0.3.1)
> 
> Tag:
> https://git-wip-us.apache.org/repos/asf?p=incubator-knox.git;a=tag;h=5a907022dbc2b0a8534de47fe7b8c871c4f075f9
> 
> Source archive zip file and signature are available from:
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/knox/knox-incubating-0.3.1/knox-incubating-0.3.1-src.zip
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/knox/knox-incubating-0.3.1/knox-incubating-0.3.1-src.zip.asc
> 
> Checksums of the source archive:
>  SHA1:   04bb11360f57c0431c30cfb181e3199868fe6053
> 
> The KEYS file can be found at:
> 
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/knox/knox-incubating-0.3.1/KEYS
> 
> The release changes file can be found at:
> 
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/knox/knox-incubating-0.3.1/CHANGES
> 
> The release has been signed with key (587C089B):
>  http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x82F9C371587C089B
> 
> Vote will be open for 72 hours.
> 
> thanks,
> 
> --larry
> 
> Larry McCay


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[RESULT][VOTE] helix-0.6.2-incubating

[Kanak Biscuitwala]

Hi:

Closing the vote since it has passed 72 hours.

Here is the result:

+1: 3 (binding)
Patrick Hunt
Olivier Lamy
Mahadev Konar

-1: 0

The vote has passed, thanks a lot to everyone for voting, Thanks to the
mentors for all the support!

Cheers,
The Helix Team


> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2013 12:42:47 -0800
> Subject: Re: [VOTE] helix-0.6.2-incubating
> From: maha...@hortonworks.com
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
>
> +1 for the release.
> Mahadev Konar
> Hortonworks Inc.
> http://hortonworks.com/
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 8:45 PM, kishore g  wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> We are short of 1 binding vote. Appreciate if any one can review.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Kishore G
>> On Nov 18, 2013 6:51 PM, "Kanak Biscuitwala"  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> This is to call for a vote on releasing the following candidate as Apache
>>> Helix 0.6.2-incubating. This is the first release candidate of our third
>>> release at Apache.
>>>
>>> Apache Helix is a generic cluster management framework that makes it easy
>>> to build partitioned and replicated, fault tolerant and scalable
>>> distributed systems.
>>>
>>> Release notes:
>>>
>>> http://helix.incubator.apache.org/site-releases/0.6.2-incubating-site/releasenotes/release-0.6.2-incubating.html
>>>
>>> Our vote thread on helix-dev:
>>> http://markmail.org/message/f2odmc7ga2i5qqmh
>>>
>>> The following IPMC members have voted +1
>>> Patrick Hunt
>>> Olivier Lamy
>>>
>>> Release artifacts:
>>> https://repository.apache.org/content/repositories/orgapachehelix-138
>>>
>>> Distribution:
>>> * binaries:
>>>
>>> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/helix/0.6.2-incubating/binaries/
>>> * sources:
>>>
>>> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/helix/0.6.2-incubating/src/
>>>
>>> The 0.6.2-incubating release tag
>>>
>>> https://git-wip-us.apache.org/repos/asf?p=incubator-helix.git;a=tag;h=74efd57c9f7bcb54cb6007dd34646722d6133340
>>>
>>> KEYS file available here:
>>> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/helix/KEYS
>>>
>>> Please vote on the release. The vote will be open for 72 hours.
>>>
>>> [+1]
>>> [0]
>>> [-1]
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> The Apache Helix Team
>>> -
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>>>
>>>
>
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Re: [VOTE] helix-0.6.2-incubating

[Mahadev Konar]

+1 for the release.
Mahadev Konar
Hortonworks Inc.
http://hortonworks.com/


On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 8:45 PM, kishore g  wrote:
> Hello,
>
> We are short of 1 binding vote. Appreciate if any one can review.
>
> Thanks,
> Kishore G
> On Nov 18, 2013 6:51 PM, "Kanak Biscuitwala"  wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> This is to call for a vote on releasing the following candidate as Apache
>> Helix 0.6.2-incubating. This is the first release candidate of our third
>> release at Apache.
>>
>> Apache Helix is a generic cluster management framework that makes it easy
>> to build partitioned and replicated, fault tolerant and scalable
>> distributed systems.
>>
>> Release notes:
>>
>> http://helix.incubator.apache.org/site-releases/0.6.2-incubating-site/releasenotes/release-0.6.2-incubating.html
>>
>> Our vote thread on helix-dev:
>> http://markmail.org/message/f2odmc7ga2i5qqmh
>>
>> The following IPMC members have voted +1
>> Patrick Hunt
>> Olivier Lamy
>>
>> Release artifacts:
>> https://repository.apache.org/content/repositories/orgapachehelix-138
>>
>> Distribution:
>> * binaries:
>>
>> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/helix/0.6.2-incubating/binaries/
>> * sources:
>>
>> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/helix/0.6.2-incubating/src/
>>
>> The 0.6.2-incubating release tag
>>
>> https://git-wip-us.apache.org/repos/asf?p=incubator-helix.git;a=tag;h=74efd57c9f7bcb54cb6007dd34646722d6133340
>>
>> KEYS file available here:
>> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/incubator/helix/KEYS
>>
>> Please vote on the release. The vote will be open for 72 hours.
>>
>> [+1]
>> [0]
>> [-1]
>>
>> Thanks,
>> The Apache Helix Team
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
>>
>>

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Re: [IP CLEARANCE] for UIMA-DUCC

[Craig L Russell]

I can vouch that the grant was dated 2012-12-11 and is on file.

Craig

On Nov 22, 2013, at 10:33 AM, Marvin Humphrey wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Marshall Schor  wrote:
>> Dear Incubator, Please check this IP-Clearance form (see
>> http://incubator.staging.apache.org/ip-clearance/uima-ducc.html ).
> 
> The form looks to be in order.
> 
> Marvin Humphrey
> 
> -
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> 

Craig L Russell
Secretary, Apache Software Foundation
c...@apache.org http://db.apache.org/jdo











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Re: [IP CLEARANCE] for UIMA-DUCC

[Marvin Humphrey]

On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Marshall Schor  wrote:
> Dear Incubator, Please check this IP-Clearance form (see
> http://incubator.staging.apache.org/ip-clearance/uima-ducc.html ).

The form looks to be in order.

Marvin Humphrey

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[PROPOSAL] Experiment: VXQuery PPMC Release Voting

[Marvin Humphrey]

The possibility of an experiment with making PPMC votes binding on incubating
releases under some conditions has been discussed at length in recent threads
on general@incubator.  I propose that we vote on the following language to run
the experiment with VXQuery as a test podling:

The following additional rules for voting on incubating releases shall
apply to the VXQuery PPMC, whose membership is tracked on the VXQuery
podling status page at
.

*   PPMC votes are binding for every release except the first.
*   One IPMC vote is required for each release after the first.

Note that VXQuery has already had its first incubating release approved by
vote of the IPMC.

It is my view that the position taken by ASF Board member Roy Fielding in a
recent message to general@incubator[1] indicates that the Incubator PMC has
the necessary authority to enact this proposal.

Marvin Humphrey

[1] http://s.apache.org/yPX

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Incubator PMC/Board report for Dec 2013 ([ppmc])

[Marvin]

Dear podling,

This email was sent by an automated system on behalf of the Apache Incubator 
PMC.
It is an initial reminder to give you plenty of time to prepare your quarterly
board report.

The board meeting is scheduled for Wed, 18 December 2013, 10:30:00:00 PST. The 
report 
for your podling will form a part of the Incubator PMC report. The Incubator 
PMC 
requires your report to be submitted 2 weeks before the board meeting, to allow 
sufficient time for review and submission (Wed, Dec 4th).

Please submit your report with sufficient time to allow the incubator PMC, and 
subsequently board members to review and digest. Again, the very latest you 
should submit your report is 2 weeks prior to the board meeting.

Thanks,

The Apache Incubator PMC

Submitting your Report
--

Your report should contain the following:

 * Your project name
 * A brief description of your project, which assumes no knowledge of the 
project
   or necessarily of its field
 * A list of the three most important issues to address in the move towards 
   graduation.
 * Any issues that the Incubator PMC or ASF Board might wish/need to be aware of
 * How has the community developed since the last report
 * How has the project developed since the last report.
 
This should be appended to the Incubator Wiki page at:

  http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/December2013

Note: This manually populated. You may need to wait a little before this page is
  created from a template.

Mentors
---
Mentors should review reports for their project(s) and sign them off on the 
Incubator wiki page. Signing off reports shows that you are following the 
project - projects that are not signed may raise alarms for the Incubator PMC.

Incubator PMC


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Incubator PMC/Board report for Dec 2013 ([ppmc])

[Marvin]

Dear podling,

This email was sent by an automated system on behalf of the Apache Incubator 
PMC.
It is an initial reminder to give you plenty of time to prepare your quarterly
board report.

The board meeting is scheduled for Wed, 18 December 2013, 10:30:00:00 PST. The 
report 
for your podling will form a part of the Incubator PMC report. The Incubator 
PMC 
requires your report to be submitted 2 weeks before the board meeting, to allow 
sufficient time for review and submission (Wed, Dec 4th).

Please submit your report with sufficient time to allow the incubator PMC, and 
subsequently board members to review and digest. Again, the very latest you 
should submit your report is 2 weeks prior to the board meeting.

Thanks,

The Apache Incubator PMC

Submitting your Report
--

Your report should contain the following:

 * Your project name
 * A brief description of your project, which assumes no knowledge of the 
project
   or necessarily of its field
 * A list of the three most important issues to address in the move towards 
   graduation.
 * Any issues that the Incubator PMC or ASF Board might wish/need to be aware of
 * How has the community developed since the last report
 * How has the project developed since the last report.
 
This should be appended to the Incubator Wiki page at:

  http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/December2013

Note: This manually populated. You may need to wait a little before this page is
  created from a template.

Mentors
---
Mentors should review reports for their project(s) and sign them off on the 
Incubator wiki page. Signing off reports shows that you are following the 
project - projects that are not signed may raise alarms for the Incubator PMC.

Incubator PMC


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Re: Release vote thresholds

[ant elder]

On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 6:09 PM, Marvin Humphrey  wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 12:33 AM, ant elder  wrote:
>> On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 1:53 AM, Marvin Humphrey 
>> wrote:
>> I think this is getting too hung up on vetting releases is the be all and
>> end all of PMC membership when really there are other just as if not more
>> important things.
>
> Let's say we strike that bullet point from the proposal.  It seems like we're
> making good progress, because that moves us closer to *both* you and Dave
> Fisher.  The remaining question is whether we can arrive at an agreement in
> terms of how many IPMC votes it takes to get a release approved.
>
> Ant, you proposed a minimum of one IPMC vote for each release:
>
> http://s.apache.org/CHS
>
> How about simply changing the rules for Incubator releases so that they
> don't require at least three binding votes, but instead make it at least
> three votes only one of which must be binding. That would mean there would
> still be the element of oversight that a mentor vote gives but avoids all
> the problems with not having three mentors.
>
> Dave responded with this critique:
>
> http://s.apache.org/MSZ
>
> I don't think this is prudent, having only one binding vote is too low a
> check. We at the ASF have a responsibility to the public.  I want to be
> certain that no one steam rolls the process. Just the fact that there are
> edge cases means we need to be careful.
>
> This formulation was conceived to address both of your concerns:
>
> *   PPMC votes are binding for every release except the first.
> *   One IPMC vote is required for each release after the first.
>
> Ant, can you accept the elevated requirement for the first vote?  If we only
> have to muster that many IPMC members once per podling, I think it's much more
> doable.
>

Sure, its a step in the right direction. I do think we could still do
more but that would be a good start.

   ...ant

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