Re: Incubator proposal template
I think Joe hit the nail on the head. Its the mentors that help to guide a project. If the mentors don't get it the project is off to a shaky start. On May 29, 2010, at 5:05 PM, Joe Schaefer wrote: > Frankly the whole idea seems misdirected at incoming projects, > when it should be directed at incoming mentors. Projects aren't > expected to grok the Apache Way when they arrive here, they're > supposed to learn about it over their tenure in the incubator. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Incubator proposal template
On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 2:05 PM, Joe Schaefer wrote: > > > - Original Message > >> From: Upayavira >> To: general@incubator.apache.org >> Sent: Sat, May 29, 2010 4:58:21 PM >> Subject: Re: Incubator proposal template >> >> On Sat, 2010-05-29 at 08:08 -0700, Joe Schaefer wrote: >> I really don't see the upshot, because after a while >> people will mostly be "plagarizing" the earlier answers >> of others. > >> I'd prefer the questions were positively framed, rather than 'how are >> you going to avoid this pitfall', but I do get the fact that they're >> likely to soon enough be re-arrangements of previous attempts. > > Frankly the whole idea seems misdirected at incoming projects, > when it should be directed at incoming mentors. Projects aren't > expected to grok the Apache Way when they arrive here, they're > supposed to learn about it over their tenure in the incubator. Very much agree on this! Turning proposals into open essays about the apache way is a waste of the potential project's time -- they either don't know anything, or the proposal is being written by their champion anyways. I would much rather focus on how we can improve the interaction, and number of active mentors with incubating projects, than to add another question to the proposal template. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Incubator proposal template
On 29/05/2010 13:55, Tim Williams wrote: I wonder why the proposal template doesn't explicitly ask the proposers about their belief in the Apache Way? When I'm reviewing proposals I am looking for this in the proposal as a whole. There are plenty of places where this shows through, e.g: Rationale Explains why this project needs to exist and why should it be adopted by Apache. This is the right place for discursive material. Meritocracy ... This is the right place to demonstrate that this process is understood by the proposers. ... Community Candidates should start with a community and have the potential to grow and renew this community by attracting new users and developers. Explain how the proposal fits this vision. Alignment Describe why Apache is a good match for the proposal. A Excessive Fascination with the Apache Brand Concerns have been raised in the past that some projects appear to have been proposed just to generate positive publicity for the proposers. This is the right place to convince everyone that is not the case. Ross It asks about fascination with the Apache Brand and touch on it a bit in the Alignment section. But being that one could easily be fascinated by a brand from the outside even while not agreeing with their internal philosophies/methodologies (e.g. Apple), I wonder why we wouldn't want some explicit discussion of this. Since the Apache Way is a bit of an amorphous thing, the section wouldn't really be a litmus test so much as a way to ensure that they've fully considered the implications of being a part of Apache. Just curious... Thanks, --tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Incubator proposal template
- Original Message > From: Upayavira > To: general@incubator.apache.org > Sent: Sat, May 29, 2010 4:58:21 PM > Subject: Re: Incubator proposal template > > On Sat, 2010-05-29 at 08:08 -0700, Joe Schaefer wrote: > I really don't see the upshot, because after a while > people will mostly be "plagarizing" the earlier answers > of others. > I'd prefer the questions were positively framed, rather than 'how are > you going to avoid this pitfall', but I do get the fact that they're > likely to soon enough be re-arrangements of previous attempts. Frankly the whole idea seems misdirected at incoming projects, when it should be directed at incoming mentors. Projects aren't expected to grok the Apache Way when they arrive here, they're supposed to learn about it over their tenure in the incubator. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Incubator proposal template
On Sat, 2010-05-29 at 08:08 -0700, Joe Schaefer wrote: > I really don't see the upshot, because after a while > people will mostly be "plagarizing" the earlier answers > of others. I'd prefer the questions were positively framed, rather than 'how are you going to avoid this pitfall', but I do get the fact that they're likely to soon enough be re-arrangements of previous attempts. Upayavira > - Original Message > > From: Tim Williams > > To: general@incubator.apache.org > > Sent: Sat, May 29, 2010 11:01:02 AM > > Subject: Re: Incubator proposal template > > > > On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 10:42 AM, Sanjiva Weerawarana > < > > ymailto="mailto:sanj...@opensource.lk"; > > href="mailto:sanj...@opensource.lk";>sanj...@opensource.lk> wrote: > > > > Do you seriously expect any answer other than "yay of course" to such a > > > > question?? > > Hi Sanjiva, > Yes, as I'd expect the question to be > > open-ended.. "Why do you think > the Apache Way is a good fit for your > > project?" (or somesuch) In the > answer, we'd hope to learn if they "get" > > it. We'd also be sure that, > to a certain extent, they'd researched and > > come to terms with its > elusive nature. So, yeah, it was a sincere > > question... > > --tim > > - > To > > unsubscribe, e-mail: > > ymailto="mailto:general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org"; > > href="mailto:general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org";>general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For > > additional commands, e-mail: > > ymailto="mailto:general-h...@incubator.apache.org"; > > href="mailto:general-h...@incubator.apache.org";>general-h...@incubator.apache.org > > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Incubator proposal template
I really don't see the upshot, because after a while people will mostly be "plagarizing" the earlier answers of others. - Original Message > From: Tim Williams > To: general@incubator.apache.org > Sent: Sat, May 29, 2010 11:01:02 AM > Subject: Re: Incubator proposal template > > On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 10:42 AM, Sanjiva Weerawarana < > ymailto="mailto:sanj...@opensource.lk"; > href="mailto:sanj...@opensource.lk";>sanj...@opensource.lk> wrote: > > Do you seriously expect any answer other than "yay of course" to such a > > question?? Hi Sanjiva, Yes, as I'd expect the question to be > open-ended.. "Why do you think the Apache Way is a good fit for your > project?" (or somesuch) In the answer, we'd hope to learn if they "get" > it. We'd also be sure that, to a certain extent, they'd researched and > come to terms with its elusive nature. So, yeah, it was a sincere > question... --tim - To > unsubscribe, e-mail: > ymailto="mailto:general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org"; > href="mailto:general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org";>general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For > additional commands, e-mail: > ymailto="mailto:general-h...@incubator.apache.org"; > href="mailto:general-h...@incubator.apache.org";>general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Incubator proposal template
On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 10:42 AM, Sanjiva Weerawarana wrote: > Do you seriously expect any answer other than "yay of course" to such a > question?? Hi Sanjiva, Yes, as I'd expect the question to be open-ended.. "Why do you think the Apache Way is a good fit for your project?" (or somesuch) In the answer, we'd hope to learn if they "get" it. We'd also be sure that, to a certain extent, they'd researched and come to terms with its elusive nature. So, yeah, it was a sincere question... --tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Incubator proposal template
Do you seriously expect any answer other than "yay of course" to such a question?? Sanjiva. On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 6:25 PM, Tim Williams wrote: > I wonder why the proposal template doesn't explicitly ask the > proposers about their belief in the Apache Way? It asks about > fascination with the Apache Brand and touch on it a bit in the > Alignment section. But being that one could easily be fascinated by a > brand from the outside even while not agreeing with their internal > philosophies/methodologies (e.g. Apple), I wonder why we wouldn't want > some explicit discussion of this. Since the Apache Way is a bit of an > amorphous thing, the section wouldn't really be a litmus test so much > as a way to ensure that they've fully considered the implications of > being a part of Apache. Just curious... > > Thanks, > --tim > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > > -- Sanjiva Weerawarana, Ph.D. Founder, Director & Chief Scientist; Lanka Software Foundation; http://www.opensource.lk/ Founder, Chairman & CEO; WSO2, Inc.; http://www.wso2.com/ Member; Apache Software Foundation; http://www.apache.org/ Director; Sahana Software Foundation; http://www.sahanafoundation.org/ Visiting Lecturer; University of Moratuwa; http://www.cse.mrt.ac.lk/ Blog: http://sanjiva.weerawarana.org/
Incubator proposal template
I wonder why the proposal template doesn't explicitly ask the proposers about their belief in the Apache Way? It asks about fascination with the Apache Brand and touch on it a bit in the Alignment section. But being that one could easily be fascinated by a brand from the outside even while not agreeing with their internal philosophies/methodologies (e.g. Apple), I wonder why we wouldn't want some explicit discussion of this. Since the Apache Way is a bit of an amorphous thing, the section wouldn't really be a litmus test so much as a way to ensure that they've fully considered the implications of being a part of Apache. Just curious... Thanks, --tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
