Re: [gentoo-dev] Gentoo Council Reminder for June 25
Am Montag, den 22.06.2009, 15:18 -0400 schrieb Thomas Anderson: > (This is late because I was traveling and dev-zero is/was on devaway.) > > This is your friendly reminder! Same bat time (typically the 2nd & 4th > Thursdays at 2000 UTC / 1600 EST), same bat channel (#gentoo-council @ > irc.freenode.net) ! > > If you have something you'd wish for us to chat about, maybe even vote > on, let us know! Simply reply to this e-mail for the whole Gentoo dev > list to see. > > For more info on the Gentoo Council, feel free to browse our homepage: > http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/council/ > > > Attached is the preliminary meeting agenda. Agenda looks fine, thanks Thomas for taking it over but I simply didn't have time to do it before I left for my holidays. Cheers, Tiziano -- Tiziano Müller Gentoo Linux Developer, Council Member Areas of responsibility: Samba, PostgreSQL, CPP, Python, sysadmin, GLEP Editor E-Mail : dev-z...@gentoo.org GnuPG FP : F327 283A E769 2E36 18D5 4DE2 1B05 6A63 AE9C 1E30 signature.asc Description: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
On Wednesday, 24. June 2009 17:48:38 Doug Goldstein wrote: > I wanted to take this time to encourage everyone who can vote in this > year's council elections. This is your chance to affect the technical > development for Gentoo for the coming year and I encourage you to take > it. Cardoe said it very nicely and since he actively encouraged to vote for tanderson, I'd like to add a bit... I think it would be in the best interest of both Exherbo and Gentoo to elect gentoofan23, betelgeuse, dev-zero, peper, calchan and dertobi123 to the Gentoo Council. All of them have a good understanding of both Gentoo and Exherbo (no wonder with some of them working on Exherbo, too) and would be ideal candidates to get the best of both distros and deepen a cooperation and common understanding between both. This strengthening bridge of understanding can be seen in dev- zero's move to appoint ciaranm as his proxy for today's council meeting. While the other candidates certainly have great merits, they tend to only see one side and concentrate too much on Gentoo alone. May a great council be elected! Best regards, Wulf signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
[gentoo-dev] [gsoc-status] portage backend for PackageKit (2)
Hi, Here I come again with another gsoc update. Nearly weekly (10 days) but still better than nothing ;) Last time, I was talking about an ebuild for packagekit soon. Actually, packagekit is not useful without a pretty frontend. I am using gnome-packagekit but packagekit and gnome-packagekit moved to policykit-0.92 and gnome-policykit-0.92 which are new. Policykit-0.92 is masked in the tree (thanks mrpouet) but gnome-policykit is nowhere at the moment. So as I'm not able to add gnome-policykit. Ebuilds are going to wait. A probable fix will be to add packagekit masked in the tree and gnome-packagekit with gnome-policykit in gnome-overlay. We will see. So, where is portage support in packagekit ? We know have a support for all functionalities. Even repository management with layman api. By the way, with zmedico, we were talking about a possible merge of layman in portage (ie. have a repository management system directly in portage). It could be done maybe at the end of the gsoc or even after. Now, I'm working on having a clean and best as possible portage management with packagekit. For example, packagekit is having a filter system which help user to filter showed content (mostly when searching something). Some filters proposed by packagekit can't be added now because portage/ebuilds don't support them but they could be good adds for Gentoo ebuilds. I will speak about them in a further email. They are not needed for my gsoc because that's clearly not key features but for further developments, that would be great to have them. So, next developments are going to improve integration for search-* and get-* functions. Basically, every non-critical functions. That will be done by discussing portage needs and adding messages / errors specific to portage if needed. After that, install-* and update-* functions will have to be improved. That will surely be a bigger work. Thanks for reading. Mounir
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 12:30 AM, Wulf C. Krueger wrote: > between both. This strengthening bridge of understanding can be seen in dev- > zero's move to appoint ciaranm as his proxy for today's council meeting. > Sorry to rain on your parade, but with ciaranm's consistent history, allowing him to participate in Gentoo's discussions itself is a privilege of patience on the part of the Gentoo community. Allowing him to proxy in a council meeting is both disallowed (non-gentoo devs cannot be on the council), and reflects badly on the candidate in question (dev-zero). -- ~Nirbheek Chauhan
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
On Fri, 26 Jun 2009 01:20:09 +0530 Nirbheek Chauhan wrote: > Allowing him to proxy in a council meeting is both disallowed > (non-gentoo devs cannot be on the council) Please point to the rule that says that a non-developer cannot be on the Council, and please point to the rule that says that a Council member cannot appoint a non-developer as their proxy. I see no mention of either in GLEP 39, which only restricts voting of Council members to developers, and only restricts proxies to not having one person with multiple votes. -- Ciaran McCreesh signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
Nirbheek Chauhan wrote: > On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 12:30 AM, Wulf C. Krueger wrote: >> between both. This strengthening bridge of understanding can be seen in dev- >> zero's move to appoint ciaranm as his proxy for today's council meeting. >> > > Sorry to rain on your parade, but with ciaranm's consistent history, > allowing him to participate in Gentoo's discussions itself is a > privilege of patience on the part of the Gentoo community. > I would believe that recent history would show the opposite. There seem to be a group of developers at which the mere mention of ciaranm results in setting them off. Regardless of the technical merits of a solution they seem more interested in just derailing anything that might have anything to do with ciaramn. I realise that ciaranm has had a nasty past. But recently I haven't see anything. I for one hope that this continues and that other members of the community take a look at themselves before spouting about the evils of ciaramn. > Allowing him to proxy in a council meeting is both disallowed > (non-gentoo devs cannot be on the council), and reflects badly on the > candidate in question (dev-zero). > Not shared by everyone. > > -- > ~Nirbheek Chauhan > >
[gentoo-dev] Please use "eselect news" items!
Hi all, As a user, I'd like to encourage developers to make use of news items (eselect news) for important changes. I find them much more noticeable than elog messages (which, while I have set them up so they get emailed to me, I admit I don't always read). I think they're also easier to go back and re-read later (not everyone knows how to dig out old elog messages). 2 recent changes I would suggest having news items for are the libpcre .la files issue, because it often doesn't get noticed until later when builds fail, and the masking of the "kdeprefix" use flag as this is a fairly major change and I think it's useful for users to know why these changes are being made. Another case is that prior to it's masking, the "kdeprefix" use flag was deprecated, with only an elog message on every kde package to notify users, resulting in users who have their elog messages emailed to them receiving a very large number of emails all with the same content - I would also suggest news items in such cases in future. Thanks to all the developers who worked to bring us this long awaited feature - I think it's brilliant, so please use it! AllenJB
[gentoo-dev] Re: 2009 Council Elections
Alistair Bush posted 4a43e30e.4090...@gentoo.org, excerpted below, on Fri, 26 Jun 2009 08:50:22 +1200: > I realise that ciaranm has had a nasty past. But recently I haven't see > anything. I for one hope that this continues and that other members of > the community take a look at themselves before spouting about the evils > of ciaramn. Agreed. Still, it did raise my eyebrows to see him mentioned as a proxy. While he has a good point that it doesn't seem to be in the rules, IMO it's simply too divisive at present. Maybe in five years or a decade... now's not the time (again, IMO). Similarly: >> While the other candidates certainly have great merits, they tend >> to only see one side and concentrate too much on Gentoo alone. Being open to cooperation is one thing. But when it makes a difference, Gentoo council members /should/ be primarily concerned with Gentoo. with cooperation with others important, but definitely secondary to the well- being of Gentoo. After all, it's the /Gentoo/ council, not the /community/ council. Were I voting (I'm not), I'd vote on what I saw as the merits of individual members in regard to Gentoo, preferably without regard to Exherbo or other community involvement, tho now that it's specifically posted, I'd likely count that as a minor negative for all but one, choosing one where it'd be a minor positive, as I see no problem with having a single person who can present issues for another part of the community, but again, it's not the Exherbo council, it's the Gentoo council, and IMO it should behave as it's labeled. Dual allegiances aren't a big issue in themselves if they're spread out enough, but weighed as heavily toward one external entity as suggested here isn't a good thing at all IMO. But if that's what gets voted in, well, I guess the devs have spoken, as I suppose they have if all those candidates now get ranked below reopen_nominations. -- Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs. "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master -- and if you use the program, he is your master." Richard Stallman
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
Ciaran McCreesh wrote: > On Fri, 26 Jun 2009 01:20:09 +0530 > Nirbheek Chauhan wrote: > >> Allowing him to proxy in a council meeting is both disallowed >> (non-gentoo devs cannot be on the council) >> > > Please point to the rule that says that a non-developer cannot be on > the Council, and please point to the rule that says that a Council > member cannot appoint a non-developer as their proxy. I see no mention > of either in GLEP 39, which only restricts voting of Council members to > developers, and only restricts proxies to not having one person with > multiple votes. > > Please be quiet.
Re: [gentoo-dev] Illegal news item name
On Sat, Jun 20, 2009 at 1:58 PM, Ulrich Mueller wrote: >> On Sat, 20 Jun 2009, Vlastimil Babka wrote: > >> it was brought up by ulm that the news item >> '2009-04-18-java-config-wrapper-0.16' has an illegal name because it >> contains a dot. > > I stumbled upon this when I experimented with news to e-mail > forwarding, where there are some limitations for the characters > allowed in headers. Of course everything can be filtered, but things > would be easier if we could stick to the GLEP 42 specification > (namely "a"-"z", "0"-"9", "+", "-", and "_"). > >> The question is what to do now, rename it? Users will then see it >> again, and I don't know if there are even worse consequences. > >> Betelgeuse suggested also commit hook that would check filenames. > > Infra, would this be possible? Only files with names > -mm-dd-shortname.lang.txt and -mm-dd-shortname.lang.txt.asc > (for detached signature) should be allowed, and character set as > mentioned above. Write a script that checks filenames and give it to Robin (and make sure it doesn't suck). These types of things tend to get done faster when you just say "here is the script to do X drop it into place plz." > > Ulrich > >
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
On Fri, June 26, 2009 03:13, Andrew D Kirch wrote: > Please be quiet. why ?, maillists is imho made to be used in non silent mode else one could aswell argue to close it down -- xpoint
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 1:27 AM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: > > On Fri, 26 Jun 2009 01:20:09 +0530 > Nirbheek Chauhan wrote: > > Allowing him to proxy in a council meeting is both disallowed > > (non-gentoo devs cannot be on the council) > > Please point to the rule that says that a non-developer cannot be on > the Council, and please point to the rule that says that a Council > member cannot appoint a non-developer as their proxy. I see no mention > of either in GLEP 39, which only restricts voting of Council members to > developers, and only restricts proxies to not having one person with > multiple votes. > Oh so you'll argue semantics now? The spirit of the rule is excessively clear. No non-gentoo-developer can be a member of council -- permanent, temporary, or proxy. If a council member can't find a gentoo developer to be their proxy, that says a lot about the council member. In any case, discussing this with you is completely m00t given my past experiences with discussions with you. -- ~Nirbheek Chauhan
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:20 AM, Alistair Bush wrote: > > Sorry to rain on your parade, but with ciaranm's consistent history, > > allowing him to participate in Gentoo's discussions itself is a > > privilege of patience on the part of the Gentoo community. > > > > I would believe that recent history would show the opposite. Recent "history" does not change the nature of a person, nor does it rebuild the bridges they have burnt. > There seem > to be a group of developers at which the mere mention of ciaranm results > in setting them off. So you expect us to just ignore all his past problems and give him a fresh start everytime someone mentions him? Do you really expect us to not take a persons well-known history into account when dealing with them? This is at best unrealistic and at worst trollish. > Regardless of the technical merits of a solution > they seem more interested in just derailing anything that might have > anything to do with ciaramn. > What the hell does this discussion have to do with technical merits of any solution? Please don't attempt a validity by association[1]. > I realise that ciaranm has had a nasty past. But recently I haven't see > anything. Having witnessed Ciaran playing nice for a while before getting back to vitriolic attacks several times before, I take all this with a record-shatteringly-massive grain of salt. I would like to see good behavior for much longer before bringing my guard down. I keep an open and forgiving mind, but not so much that my brains fall out and get eaten by zombies. 1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_fallacy -- ~Nirbheek Chauhan
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
On Fri, 26 Jun 2009 08:50:22 +1200 Alistair Bush wrote: > I would believe that recent history would show the opposite. There > seem to be a group of developers at which the mere mention of ciaranm > results in setting them off. Regardless of the technical merits of a > solution they seem more interested in just derailing anything that > might have anything to do with ciaramn. Correct. When he was booted off the project the last time, I breathed again and picked up my waning interest in Gentoo and it has thrived since. > I realise that ciaranm has had a nasty past. But recently I haven't > see anything. I for one hope that this continues and that other > members of the community take a look at themselves before spouting > about the evils of ciaramn. I have come to know Ciaran as an elitist little twerp and he is one of a few people in the world I wouldn't want to meet, or wouldn't know what I'd do to if I did meet him. It's really that bad, yes. The man brought it all on himself for the nasty things he did in the past and should publicly apologise for each and every time he offended someone in a web-e-vised 20 hour sorry-a-thon before[1] he is allowed back to do more than voice his opinion on Gentoo-held media. Thank you kindly, jer [1] Which isn't going to happen.
Re: [gentoo-dev] 2009 Council Elections
Nirbheek Chauhan wrote: > On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 1:27 AM, Ciaran McCreesh > wrote: >> On Fri, 26 Jun 2009 01:20:09 +0530 >> Nirbheek Chauhan wrote: >>> Allowing him to proxy in a council meeting is both disallowed >>> (non-gentoo devs cannot be on the council) >> Please point to the rule that says that a non-developer cannot be on >> the Council, and please point to the rule that says that a Council >> member cannot appoint a non-developer as their proxy. I see no mention >> of either in GLEP 39, which only restricts voting of Council members to >> developers, and only restricts proxies to not having one person with >> multiple votes. >> > > Oh so you'll argue semantics now? The spirit of the rule is > excessively clear. No non-gentoo-developer can be a member of council > -- permanent, temporary, or proxy. > > If a council member can't find a gentoo developer to be their proxy, > that says a lot about the council member. > > In any case, discussing this with you is completely m00t given my past > experiences with discussions with you. > > > -- > ~Nirbheek Chauhan > Actually, please read GLEP 39 and you will see that it doesn't restrict council members to developers only. Basically under the current rules I think it's technically right to be proxied by anyone. If you don't think being proxied by non developers is wise, don't vote for those council members next time. If we want to restrict the council to developers only, we should think about modifying GLEP 39 (which should be done via a vote among developers as that's they way 39 was agreed upon). Regards, Petteri signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
