Re: [gentoo-dev] man pages: build or copy?

2016-07-10 Thread Neil Bothwick 
On Sun, 10 Jul 2016 08:37:57 +0200, Michał Górny wrote:

> > I've created an ebuild for net-misc/zerotier [1]. This has a BDEP on
> > app-text/ronn, the build system uses it to create the man pages. The
> > trouble is that ronn is a Ruby program and pulls in a shedload of
> > dependencies, just to install man pages.
> > 
> > It seems to me to make more sense to put pre-built man pages in
> > ${FILESDIR}/${PV} and copy them with doman. Is this considered the
> > correct or acceptable way to deal with this?
> > 
> > 1) https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=588324  
> 
> If they are quite static (i.e. don't have important content that
> depends on USE flags etc.), generate them, put in a tarball somewhere
> (you can ask a proxy committer to host it for you), then fetch them via
> SRC_URI.

Thanks for that suggestion. I've done it that way with a tarball on
Github.


-- 
Neil Bothwick


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Re: [gentoo-dev] man pages: build or copy?

2016-07-10 Thread Michał Górny 
On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 14:54:56 +0100
Neil Bothwick  wrote:

> I've created an ebuild for net-misc/zerotier [1]. This has a BDEP on
> app-text/ronn, the build system uses it to create the man pages. The
> trouble is that ronn is a Ruby program and pulls in a shedload of
> dependencies, just to install man pages.
> 
> It seems to me to make more sense to put pre-built man pages in
> ${FILESDIR}/${PV} and copy them with doman. Is this considered the
> correct or acceptable way to deal with this?
> 
> 1) https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=588324

If they are quite static (i.e. don't have important content that
depends on USE flags etc.), generate them, put in a tarball somewhere
(you can ask a proxy committer to host it for you), then fetch them via
SRC_URI.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny



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Re: [gentoo-dev] man pages: build or copy?

2016-07-09 Thread Gordon Pettey 
On Sat, Jul 9, 2016 at 5:24 PM, Neil Bothwick  wrote:

> On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 10:13:13 -0400, Michael Orlitzky wrote:
>
> > On 07/09/2016 09:54 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:
> > > I've created an ebuild for net-misc/zerotier [1]. This has a BDEP on
> > > app-text/ronn, the build system uses it to create the man pages. The
> > > trouble is that ronn is a Ruby program and pulls in a shedload of
> > > dependencies, just to install man pages.
> >
> > Ruby packages (besides dev-lang/ruby itself) install quickly, like perl
> > packages, so this isn't a *huge* deal. They can also be removed
> > afterwards with a depclean.
>
> That's when it really hurt, installing on a system without ruby itself.
> That's when I looked at alternatives.
>
> > > It seems to me to make more sense to put pre-built man pages in
> > > ${FILESDIR}/${PV} and copy them with doman. Is this considered the
> > > correct or acceptable way to deal with this?
> >
> > It's up to you. If they release a new version every day, it's going to
> > get real annoying to regenerate the man pages each time. Also keep an
> > eye on the size of the man pages. We have a soft limit of "a few
> > kilobytes" for things in FILESDIR,
>
> There's only three of them, totally 15kB uncompressed.


Having recently been annoyed by a package that for some reason depends on a
command-line web browser to build documentation, I'd really appreciate the
pre-built-without-oddball-dependencies variety :) (And ZeroTier looks like
something interesting I might find some use for)

Re: [gentoo-dev] man pages: build or copy?

2016-07-09 Thread Neil Bothwick 
On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 16:32:58 +0200, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote:

> > It seems to me to make more sense to put pre-built man pages in
> > ${FILESDIR}/${PV} and copy them with doman. Is this considered the
> > correct or acceptable way to deal with this?  
> 
> In dev-libs/nanomsg, I've hidden building the docs behind the "doc"
> USE flag. nanomsg builds it docs with AsciiDoc, which also pulls in
> ruby and a bunch of stuff.

use.desc says doc is for extra documentation. These are basic man pages
that are more or less needed to use the software.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

One-seventh of life is spent on Monday.


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Re: [gentoo-dev] man pages: build or copy?

2016-07-09 Thread Neil Bothwick 
On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 10:13:13 -0400, Michael Orlitzky wrote:

> On 07/09/2016 09:54 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:
> > I've created an ebuild for net-misc/zerotier [1]. This has a BDEP on
> > app-text/ronn, the build system uses it to create the man pages. The
> > trouble is that ronn is a Ruby program and pulls in a shedload of
> > dependencies, just to install man pages.  
> 
> Ruby packages (besides dev-lang/ruby itself) install quickly, like perl
> packages, so this isn't a *huge* deal. They can also be removed
> afterwards with a depclean.

That's when it really hurt, installing on a system without ruby itself.
That's when I looked at alternatives.

> > It seems to me to make more sense to put pre-built man pages in
> > ${FILESDIR}/${PV} and copy them with doman. Is this considered the
> > correct or acceptable way to deal with this?  
> 
> It's up to you. If they release a new version every day, it's going to
> get real annoying to regenerate the man pages each time. Also keep an
> eye on the size of the man pages. We have a soft limit of "a few
> kilobytes" for things in FILESDIR,

There's only three of them, totally 15kB uncompressed.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Nothing is illegal if one hundred businessmen decide to do it.


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Re: [gentoo-dev] man pages: build or copy?

2016-07-09 Thread Dirkjan Ochtman 
On Sat, Jul 9, 2016 at 3:54 PM, Neil Bothwick  wrote:
> I've created an ebuild for net-misc/zerotier [1]. This has a BDEP on
> app-text/ronn, the build system uses it to create the man pages. The
> trouble is that ronn is a Ruby program and pulls in a shedload of
> dependencies, just to install man pages.
>
> It seems to me to make more sense to put pre-built man pages in
> ${FILESDIR}/${PV} and copy them with doman. Is this considered the
> correct or acceptable way to deal with this?

In dev-libs/nanomsg, I've hidden building the docs behind the "doc"
USE flag. nanomsg builds it docs with AsciiDoc, which also pulls in
ruby and a bunch of stuff. Personally, I don't care that much about
the ruby packages, but on my servers, I don't generally even need ruby
itself, so I'd rather not install it. Since this grants the user the
choice of how to use your package, it seems in line with Gentoo's
principles.

Cheers,

Dirkjan

Re: [gentoo-dev] man pages: build or copy?

2016-07-09 Thread Michael Orlitzky 
On 07/09/2016 09:54 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:
> I've created an ebuild for net-misc/zerotier [1]. This has a BDEP on
> app-text/ronn, the build system uses it to create the man pages. The
> trouble is that ronn is a Ruby program and pulls in a shedload of
> dependencies, just to install man pages.

Ruby packages (besides dev-lang/ruby itself) install quickly, like perl
packages, so this isn't a *huge* deal. They can also be removed
afterwards with a depclean.


> It seems to me to make more sense to put pre-built man pages in
> ${FILESDIR}/${PV} and copy them with doman. Is this considered the
> correct or acceptable way to deal with this?

It's up to you. If they release a new version every day, it's going to
get real annoying to regenerate the man pages each time. Also keep an
eye on the size of the man pages. We have a soft limit of "a few
kilobytes" for things in FILESDIR, which may mean you'd have to upload
the man pages somewhere else and include that in SRC_URI. Doing so makes
the regeneration process even more annoying.

Nevertheless, I've had to pre-build man pages for a few packages myself.