Re: [gentoo-user] Re: I don't understand Perl. What do I do after an update?
On Donnerstag 22 Juli 2010, cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: > Alan McKinnon wrote: > > On Wednesday 21 July 2010 23:14:35 cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: > > > > This is a painful process. It's enough to drive a sysadmin to drink > > > > or (god forbid), to Windows. Portage can't help as the ebuild > > > > doesn't know what you have installed. So you must run a script to go > > > > and dig out all this crap for you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All I can say is, every day I get down on my knees and offer thanks > > > > that perl is not slotted. > > > > > > But portage should be sensible enough to either run this for you, or > > > stop emerging -- I had a lot of trouble during the last update where I > > > kept getting errors and I emerged a couple of them before I knew I had > > > to run perl-cleaner. > > > > You haven't thought this through and haven't consider how portage knows > > what to do. > > > > Portage doesn't do it because portage can't. > > You want portage to do it != portage can do it. > > > > Consider this: > > > > [I] dev-lang/perl > > > > Installed versions: 5.12.1-r1(23:11:24 21/07/10)(berkdb gdbm -build > > - > > > > debug -doc -ithreads) > > > > [I] dev-perl/DateManip > > > > Installed versions: 5.56(19:39:11 17/07/10)(-test) > > > > When I upgraded perl to 5.12.1-r1, DateManip was not upgraded. Why not? > > because it's version number did not change and that is the ONLY thing > > portage considers. DateManip depends on perl, not on > > =perl-whatever-I-used-to-have > > > > So portage does not know of the link between these two things and cannot > > take them into account. Portage won't be expanded anytime soon either - > > you saw how long it took for perl-cleaner to run, must portage go > > through something like that with every emerge? > > > > Similarly, one could say portage should detect rev-dep breakage. > > Surprise! It doesn't. revdep-rebuild does that (comparable to > > perl-cleaner) and you know how long that takes to run. > > > > So you wasted some time with an upgrade. Well that's a shame. But we > > don't care much, especially if you don't read the elog messages. If you > > feel that portage should does this automagically, and have a plan to > > make it run REAL quick, and have proven, workable, debugged, solid, > > stable patches, then I'm sure Zac would be very happy indeed to hear > > from you. > > > > In the meantime, read the elog messages. > > But I could not read the elog messages, you can either read them with elogv or have portage send them per email whereever you want. So you can read them, while emerging other stuff.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: I don't understand Perl. What do I do after an update?
Alan McKinnon wrote: > On Wednesday 21 July 2010 23:14:35 cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: > > > This is a painful process. It's enough to drive a sysadmin to drink or > > > (god forbid), to Windows. Portage can't help as the ebuild doesn't know > > > what you have installed. So you must run a script to go and dig out all > > > this crap for you. > > > > > > > > > > > > All I can say is, every day I get down on my knees and offer thanks that > > > perl is not slotted. > > > > But portage should be sensible enough to either run this for you, or > > stop emerging -- I had a lot of trouble during the last update where I > > kept getting errors and I emerged a couple of them before I knew I had > > to run perl-cleaner. > > You haven't thought this through and haven't consider how portage knows what > to do. > > Portage doesn't do it because portage can't. > You want portage to do it != portage can do it. > > Consider this: > > [I] dev-lang/perl > Installed versions: 5.12.1-r1(23:11:24 21/07/10)(berkdb gdbm -build - > debug -doc -ithreads) > > [I] dev-perl/DateManip > Installed versions: 5.56(19:39:11 17/07/10)(-test) > > > When I upgraded perl to 5.12.1-r1, DateManip was not upgraded. Why not? > because it's version number did not change and that is the ONLY thing portage > considers. DateManip depends on perl, not on =perl-whatever-I-used-to-have > > So portage does not know of the link between these two things and cannot take > them into account. Portage won't be expanded anytime soon either - you saw > how > long it took for perl-cleaner to run, must portage go through something like > that with every emerge? > > Similarly, one could say portage should detect rev-dep breakage. Surprise! It > doesn't. revdep-rebuild does that (comparable to perl-cleaner) and you know > how long that takes to run. > > So you wasted some time with an upgrade. Well that's a shame. But we don't > care much, especially if you don't read the elog messages. If you feel that > portage should does this automagically, and have a plan to make it run REAL > quick, and have proven, workable, debugged, solid, stable patches, then I'm > sure Zac would be very happy indeed to hear from you. > > In the meantime, read the elog messages. But I could not read the elog messages, the emerge was going on, till I got the first error and I didn't realize that portage had upgraded perl -- the only thing I would like portage to do is to know that something must be run and stop so I can do this. You could have a list of packages which require a stop after emerging or something. I am thinking out loud here, but this is what I am trying to say. -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici cov...@ccs.covici.com
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: I don't understand Perl. What do I do after an update?
On Wednesday 21 July 2010 23:14:35 cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: > > This is a painful process. It's enough to drive a sysadmin to drink or > > (god forbid), to Windows. Portage can't help as the ebuild doesn't know > > what you have installed. So you must run a script to go and dig out all > > this crap for you. > > > > > > > > All I can say is, every day I get down on my knees and offer thanks that > > perl is not slotted. > > But portage should be sensible enough to either run this for you, or > stop emerging -- I had a lot of trouble during the last update where I > kept getting errors and I emerged a couple of them before I knew I had > to run perl-cleaner. You haven't thought this through and haven't consider how portage knows what to do. Portage doesn't do it because portage can't. You want portage to do it != portage can do it. Consider this: [I] dev-lang/perl Installed versions: 5.12.1-r1(23:11:24 21/07/10)(berkdb gdbm -build - debug -doc -ithreads) [I] dev-perl/DateManip Installed versions: 5.56(19:39:11 17/07/10)(-test) When I upgraded perl to 5.12.1-r1, DateManip was not upgraded. Why not? because it's version number did not change and that is the ONLY thing portage considers. DateManip depends on perl, not on =perl-whatever-I-used-to-have So portage does not know of the link between these two things and cannot take them into account. Portage won't be expanded anytime soon either - you saw how long it took for perl-cleaner to run, must portage go through something like that with every emerge? Similarly, one could say portage should detect rev-dep breakage. Surprise! It doesn't. revdep-rebuild does that (comparable to perl-cleaner) and you know how long that takes to run. So you wasted some time with an upgrade. Well that's a shame. But we don't care much, especially if you don't read the elog messages. If you feel that portage should does this automagically, and have a plan to make it run REAL quick, and have proven, workable, debugged, solid, stable patches, then I'm sure Zac would be very happy indeed to hear from you. In the meantime, read the elog messages. -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: I don't understand Perl. What do I do after an update?
Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On Wednesday 21 July 2010 20:33:42 Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
> > On 07/21/2010 08:34 PM, Willie Wong wrote:
> > > On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 08:04:54PM +0300, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
> > >> Portage recently updated Perl from 5.10.1 to 5.12.1 (and later -r1).
> > >> However, a crapload of files still remain in
> > >> /usr/lib/perl5/{site_perl,vendor_perl}/5.10.1. I found out the hard way
> > >> after trying to emerge openoffice (and everyone knows how painful that
> > >> one is):
> > >>
> > >> What is the user required to do after updating Perl? elogv doesn't tell
> > >> me anything about upgrading.
> > >
> > > There's this neat little script called perl-cleaner
> > >
> > > http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/perl/perl-cleaner.xml
> >
> > Thanks. How do I call the script? I don't have any idea what perl
> > modules or ph files are (or why I need them). What do I need to do?
>
> Short version:
> You run
>
> perl-cleaner --modules
>
> and it just does it.
>
> Long version:
> perl comes out the box as an interpreter and some base functionality. The
> community provides a brazillion useful modules for all sort of things. Like
> eg
> Date. Need to do some Date manipulation? No need to write the disgusting code
> yourself to work with Dates, someone else already did it. Just install a
> module.
>
> The trouble is that modules are often written in perl itself and closely tied
> to the version of perl used. If you upgrade perl, you must also rebuild all
> the modules tied to it, they don't just migrate.
>
> This is a painful process. It's enough to drive a sysadmin to drink or (god
> forbid), to Windows. Portage can't help as the ebuild doesn't know what you
> have installed. So you must run a script to go and dig out all this crap for
> you.
>
> All I can say is, every day I get down on my knees and offer thanks that perl
> is not slotted.
But portage should be sensible enough to either run this for you, or
stop emerging -- I had a lot of trouble during the last update where I
kept getting errors and I emerged a couple of them before I knew I had
to run perl-cleaner.
--
Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is:
How do
you spend it?
John Covici
cov...@ccs.covici.com
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: I don't understand Perl. What do I do after an update?
On 07/21/2010 07:14 PM, Blackdream W wrote: > perl-cleaner --all It's better to do perl-cleaner -p --all before to watch what can happen.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: I don't understand Perl. What do I do after an update?
On Wednesday 21 July 2010 20:33:42 Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
> On 07/21/2010 08:34 PM, Willie Wong wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 08:04:54PM +0300, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
> >> Portage recently updated Perl from 5.10.1 to 5.12.1 (and later -r1).
> >> However, a crapload of files still remain in
> >> /usr/lib/perl5/{site_perl,vendor_perl}/5.10.1. I found out the hard way
> >> after trying to emerge openoffice (and everyone knows how painful that
> >> one is):
> >>
> >> What is the user required to do after updating Perl? elogv doesn't tell
> >> me anything about upgrading.
> >
> > There's this neat little script called perl-cleaner
> >
> > http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/perl/perl-cleaner.xml
>
> Thanks. How do I call the script? I don't have any idea what perl
> modules or ph files are (or why I need them). What do I need to do?
Short version:
You run
perl-cleaner --modules
and it just does it.
Long version:
perl comes out the box as an interpreter and some base functionality. The
community provides a brazillion useful modules for all sort of things. Like eg
Date. Need to do some Date manipulation? No need to write the disgusting code
yourself to work with Dates, someone else already did it. Just install a
module.
The trouble is that modules are often written in perl itself and closely tied
to the version of perl used. If you upgrade perl, you must also rebuild all
the modules tied to it, they don't just migrate.
This is a painful process. It's enough to drive a sysadmin to drink or (god
forbid), to Windows. Portage can't help as the ebuild doesn't know what you
have installed. So you must run a script to go and dig out all this crap for
you.
All I can say is, every day I get down on my knees and offer thanks that perl
is not slotted.
--
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: I don't understand Perl. What do I do after an update?
perl-cleaner --all
2010/7/22 Nikos Chantziaras
> On 07/21/2010 08:34 PM, Willie Wong wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 08:04:54PM +0300, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
>>
>>> Portage recently updated Perl from 5.10.1 to 5.12.1 (and later -r1).
>>> However, a crapload of files still remain in
>>> /usr/lib/perl5/{site_perl,vendor_perl}/5.10.1. I found out the hard way
>>> after trying to emerge openoffice (and everyone knows how painful that
>>> one is):
>>>
>>> What is the user required to do after updating Perl? elogv doesn't tell
>>> me anything about upgrading.
>>>
>>
>> There's this neat little script called perl-cleaner
>>
>> http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/perl/perl-cleaner.xml
>>
>
> Thanks. How do I call the script? I don't have any idea what perl modules
> or ph files are (or why I need them). What do I need to do?
>
>
>
[gentoo-user] Re: I don't understand Perl. What do I do after an update?
On 07/21/2010 08:34 PM, Willie Wong wrote:
On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 08:04:54PM +0300, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
Portage recently updated Perl from 5.10.1 to 5.12.1 (and later -r1).
However, a crapload of files still remain in
/usr/lib/perl5/{site_perl,vendor_perl}/5.10.1. I found out the hard way
after trying to emerge openoffice (and everyone knows how painful that
one is):
What is the user required to do after updating Perl? elogv doesn't tell
me anything about upgrading.
There's this neat little script called perl-cleaner
http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/perl/perl-cleaner.xml
Thanks. How do I call the script? I don't have any idea what perl
modules or ph files are (or why I need them). What do I need to do?
